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Re: Readable hack:




> Brian Thomas writes:
>
>        Hey all, 
>
>        I would like to passby everyone an idea that I am 
>        working on -- development of the "READABLE" hack.
>
>        Main Idea -- books for players
>
>        One thing, I think, that will go a long way to improving th e
>        atmosphere of the game is to create code that will support the
>        development of non-magical reading material, which for lack of 
>        a better (singular) word I will refer to as "books". 
>
>        As of the current code, the only non-magical books are those 
>        specifically created on maps. Why not have several types of 
>        (general and specific) information be available in shops and/or
>        monster treasure hoards? Examples of things that I would 
>        put into books:
>
> (numerous example books removed)
>
>        Clearly some of this information is already available in the spoiler.
>        But, with the ability of a given server maintainer to have different
>        archetypes/gods/spells/etc, the spoiler can sometimes be useless. A
>        vehicle through which to impart *server specific* information is also
>        needed. But that wouldnt even be the main value of such a system, 
>        the enchancement to the atmosphere of the game (I think) is the main
>        point.
>

 Also, there is some information that really should be documented within the
game but is not (like how improvement scrolls work).  You shouldn't need be
reading outside docs on that, but it is cleary too complicated for someone
to really figure it out on their own.

> 
>        Susequent Idea -- modification of the writing skill. 
>
>        I would like to propose that the writing skill be expanded to 
>        allow players to write messages/keep notes in "books". This 
>        would be (err, actually, "is") very easy to do. 
>        
>        Secondarily, I can't see why players should be able to write if 
>        they cant read! I propose that the Literacy skil be required 
>        for a player to use "writing".

 IT seems reasonable.  Actually, you could probably write if you are not
literate, just the end result would be gibberish (game could take whta is
written and randomize it.  This idea could be expanded - a skill check on
writing and literacy is made, and depending on if it is made/how successful
the roll was, it determines the output.  If the person just barely fails,
perhaps every 5 character is randomized or transposed with another one, etc.)

>
>        Susequent Idea -- modification of the literacy skill. 
>
>        I would like to further propose that the literacy skill be modified.
>        Why allow players to read books if they arent literate! Ditto 
>        for spellbooks. 

 PRoblem with this for normal books is that it then becomes a trivial issue
for someone to create a 'literate' character who reads books.  For
spellbooks, this doesn't do any good, but for normal books, this would work,
since all it contains is generic information.
>
>        I would further propose that reading skill be adopted. If a 
>        player's literacy level is less than the level of the book (I 
>        wont explain how that's assigned) and/or the level of the 
>        spell/prayer in the book, then they get the "gibberish" message.

 Like I said above, how close the roll is could determine how much gibberish
the person gets.  However, this would require that some standard formula be
made, and/or only one attempt could be made (if you get different partial
messages each time, eventually you could put the information together).

 Probably a better idea for different levels would be the idea that they are
a foreign language (perhaps have some field where language is determined).
Perhaps for these different languages, different character sets could be
made.

 I seem to remember that ultima IV or ultima V did something like this - it
used its own character set for signs and stuff.  Same coudl be done in
crossfire, just that if you know the language (Determined by skill level),
you get it in normal characters.

>Matt Cortes writes:
>
>I don't know if anyone has ever played it.  But there was an old game on 
>the Sega Genesis called Fatal Labrynth.  It was a random RPG game, each 
>time you go through it, it was different here and there..  its actually 
>alot like crossfire in a few ways.  Anyway, it had a feature I thought 
>was pretty neat.  Each time you killed a specific creature, say blue 
>slime.. You would gain in knowledge on how that creature reacts, etc.  
>I'm thinking maybe we could add the ability to have knowledge on each 
>creature's moves, attacks, etc.  The more knowledge you have on the 
>creature, the better modifiers you get on Dex, Str, Int, etc for each 
>move you do against that creature.  These books you purpose could also 
>increase the players knowledge the first time the book is read for each 
>of the creatures in there, then the book could be refered to later on for 
>things such as best protection spells/items to use, best spells, weaknesses, 
>max HP, etc for each creature listed in that book.
>

 I know the moria did the same thing.  I am not sure how it implemented it,
but I guess that it pretty much stored how many of each type of monster you
killed, and depending on that number, would tell you varying amounts of data
about it.

 You actually didn't get to attack it any better, but you just knew what it
did.

 The problem I see with getting bonuses (to hit, etc) in crossfire is that
each time you attacked something, it would need to check and see if you have
extra informatin about this monster, and that you should then get some
benefit.

 The other problem is where to store this information.  Number of monsters
is hardly static (the way such a method should probably be done is invisible
objects in the players inventory that contain monster and how many killed.)

>
>Good points.  And instead of having to write new books per server, why 
>not make the books call upon the different variables set for each server?
>Example:
>      The Dread's weaknesses are <call dread_weak_var>, his max hitpts is 
><call dread_HP_var>.
>

 Nice idea.  I do see 2 problems:  IT could get pretty time consuming.  If
such a system was done, a standard naming convention would need to be done
(something like arch name:variable name).  But this would add a bit of code.

 I don't really like adding that idea just for books - something like that
should probably also be added to message parsing them (ie, you talk to
someone, and he would respond in a similar fashion.)

 Also, the other problem would be one of the following 2:  1) either those
values are filled in when the book is created, which means it could be out
of date if archetypes are changed, or 2) The content of the book actually
changes (read it once, and it says that dreads have 1500 hp.  Save the game,
come back at some later time, and your book now says dreads have 2000 hp.
That would be a bit strange

>
>In another message, Brian writes:
>        This brings up a "tangential" idea I had. For those of you
>        out there who played "nethack", remember the "magic marker"?
>
>        I thought I might make something like that. It would 
>        allow the player to inscribe a permanent message on the 
>        floor/wall/etc. The way to code this would be to create a 
>        invisible, unique "talk" object where the player was standing.
>        In this way, even though the map had been re-loaded, the 
>        players message would still be there to be read. The only 
>        problems I see w/ this are the 1) stability of the unique
>        objects code and 2) the number of unique messages that might
>        build up over time. Will this cause problems?
> 
>

 OF course, the rune of marking allows something similar to this, but it
isn't permanent (ie, when map resets, it disappears).

 In terms of number of messages, each time the map is saved or loaded, a
check could be made, and there is some chance that a written object
disappears.  This would then come to an equilibrium at some point on number
of messages.

 unique item code is something that I should probably look at - there is a
lot of potential uses for it (written messages above, safety deposity boxes
for storing stuff, etc).  Someone just brought up the thought of allowing
permanent influences by players, and unique items is probably the way to do
it.

 Also, I believe in some message, the idea that all of the above would need
a new object type.  I fail to see a reason why all of the above couldn't be
implemenet in the existing old scroll and old book format (ie, non spell
scroll and non spell book).

 In terms of filling with random information, if you ahve a book with
auto_apply set (or some other flag), then it automatically fills it with
random information (and flag gets cleared.)  IT seems like a waste to use a
non object type when all of the above is so similar to how existing
books/scrolls work.

 --Mark