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Re: (ASCEND) high density access server (fwd)
I think we should migrate this to list@inet-access.net and/or
isp-tech@isp-tech.com since this is becomming a general HD NAS discussion.
We'd get a broader base there.
Once upon a time Tim Basher shaped the electrons to say...
>> We are looking into high density access server like MAX TNT, USR Total
>> control for dialup service (V.90 connection primarily).
>Here are the high density remote access concentrators I have heard of.
>Advanced Computer Communications (ACC) -
> Tigris
<URL:http://www.acc.com/internet/products/remote_access_concentrat.html>
I've heard a few good things, but a LOT of negative comments about the SW.
However, the problems may have been teething issues. Overall there just
isn't a lot of talk about these units.
>Ascend Communications -
> MAX TNT
<URL:http://www.ascend.com/3218.html>
Well, enough is said about the TNT here already - being ascend-users and
all.
>Bay Networks -
> 5000 MSX
<URL:http://business5.baynetworks.com/MainBody.asp?f60763197823b069cf485716927e8f83b461c5cb154d2596146e242bcafb869420254e844c543625=&FFCCMD_Eae6ac34f761679a1d14458419aca1945ab0434d8a88089e5b3fcb0511a6dd4a09555b98c1ec0c08077b3dca637985aea4aad63dae4e23b91e6b8180edfe5de49fd3b42d888aeba4a4a8a70=>
(Oh, don't you love sites that use M$ ASP and have stupid URL's like this?)
Specifically the Versalar 5000 access switch and Versalar 5399 remote access
concentrator module.
Some issues - can't do a T3 - 576 modems in a chassis, can't do 'multi-
shelf' like a TNT to make up for density deficencies. They've been saying
higher density cards are coming for quite some time now. Also, they are
their own modem house, and therefore have run into unique compatibility
issues. They licensed the K56flex code from Rockwell, but they use a
different DSP platform. So their internal modem group (what was Penril)
does the porting and code changes. That means they tend to lag other vendors
in getting support for new protocols like K56flex and V.90. This is the
only one to offer a choice between K56flex and X2 - but that is rapidly
becoming moot with V.90. Also, it doesn't do any advanced routing natively.
You need to buy a router blade to do OSPF for example - lowering your modem
count. Systems like the Tigris, TNT, PM-4, etc just do it as par for the
course.
>Cisco Systems -
> AS5800
<URL:http://www.cisco.com/warp/public/728/AS5x00/AS5800/>
The thing with this is they want you to buy a Router Shelf - based on the
7206, an Access Shelf - the AS5800 itself, and, if you like distributed
management, the 3640 System Controller - based on the 3600 series route
chassis. One router sheld and system controller can handle multiple
access shelves. But it is still a high up front investment. Many of
the features contained in a single unit from other vendors are offloaded
to the different shelves, IMHO reducing the features of the AS5800 itself.
Generation one of the AS5800 isn't that high in density. But the CT3 card
is either out now or very close, and a doubling in modem density (from 72
per MICA card to 144 per) has been announced. I've seen this unit (I've
seen all of these units actually) and it is pretty damn big compared to
the others. It's actually rack density is lower than others like the PM-4
or 3Com HiPer Access. Also, in conversations with Cisco people, I learned
that the chassis can't scale beyond 2 CT3 interfaces. I was told "You
MIGHT get three in, but we would not recommend it." Being in the same
generation as the PM-4, and with the latter having a 2nd gen stated plan
of 3 CT3 in a smaller footprint, and bandwith for 3 T3 PER SLOT, it seems
like the AS5800 isn't designed for a long life and growth like the other
newer products we are starting to see. I have heard rumors of Cisco
working on their own ATM backplane access server based on acquired
technology, perhaps that will be their answer.
>Lucent Technologies (was Livingston) -
> PortMaster 4
<URL:http://www.livingston.com/marketing/products/pm4_series.html>
I think I said enough on this here recently.
>3Com (was U.S. Robotics) -
> Total Control Multiservice Access Platform
Specifically the HiPer Access platform, not the older NetServer TC.
<URL:http://www.3com.com/solutions/svprovider/products/rac/hiper.html>
Drawbacks - No OSPF - promised for 2 years, still pending. Lots of user
complaints over the new OS (the old NetServer used a licensed ComOS, the
new OS changed commands around quite a bit and some features people were
used to are gone). 1/2 T3 - no T3 capabilities at all, and it would take
a doubling of modem density to have the ports required. This in a chassis
that is already seven times the density of the original cards it used.
With the HiPer being fairly new, I don't see this happening real soon.
Still, last I ran the figures, it is the second densest product out there
(after PM-4) as far as rack space goes. And I will give 3Com(USR) credit
for likely having the most universally compatible server modem code on
the market - when it comes to connecting with junk modems, they lead.
I also have some issues with how 3Com is treating their customers, which
I expressed in a recent rant on a couple of lists.
Others:
Assured Access - X1600
<URL:http://www.assuredaccess.com/products/x1600fr.html>
This is the largest member of their family - X600 and X1000 are also
available. 6, 10, and 16 slots - similar to the Tigris family. Personally
I don't care for the mix-n-match 'build your server' approach. You have a
number of modules to put together to make a server - unlike say the TNT or
PM-4 where a couple of basic modules gets you going. I'm sure some will
like it - that's just my religion. On the plus side they do have CT3
support, but the chassis is quite large so the rack density isn't high
with modems. They are rather new (startup) which does have a plus side -
by all reports they fawn over customers, sending engineers out to install
units, etc. Obviously they are looking to build a name for themselves
to get a good foothold. And, for the most part, people I've seen report
on these units say they work well.
Nortel (formerly Aptis) - CVX-1800
<URL:http://www.nortel.com/pcn/aptis/cvx1800.html>
Actually, Nortel makes you DL PDF - the Aptis site is still there and
has it more readily accessable.
<URL:http://www.aptis.com/p-cvx1800.html>
I consider the CVX-1800 to be the best competitor to the PM-4. It
has a 5.8Gbps aggregate througput on the backplane, a high modem density,
good feature set - and like Livingston was acquired by Lucent, Aptis was
acquired by Nortel. So the backing companies have similar strengths. It
is however a new product, and I haven't talked to people acutally using it.
My understanding it Aptis was mostly ex-Cascade and ex-Shiva people, and
the processing in the CVX seems to have some family ties to the Cascade
distributed design. But I suppose that could be coincidence too. This
is a product I've been keeping an eye on, and listening for comments on,
but there don't seem to be many.
Also, Nortel and Bay just completed their merger. The Bay units have an
established market - and I'm sure they were working on a next-gen unit
for post-5000 era. What will happen to the CVX-1800? Remember the Cascade
units were better HW than the TNT - but they were axed. I suspect that
won't happen here, Nortel has just released a CVX SS7 gateway for use with
the CVX-1800. So it seems like they are committed to support, but they may
focus on selling to LECs and not ISPs.
These are just my off the cuff comments meant to hit a few points and
maybe engender some more discussion. I don't claim this to be a complete
list of the products, just those that I can think of off hand. I also
don't claim these products all do what their marketing docs claim they
do. ;-)
-MZ
--
<URL:mailto:megazone@megazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me..
Join ISP/C Internet Service Providers' Consortium <URL:http://www.ispc.org/>
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