works now. i threw out the home directories, and booted them both again. maybe last time i hadn't booted the most recent kernel, that would be an "oops", and would fit with what you said jeremy. thanks guys. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20141019/2f8dab03/attachment.html>