From woodbrian77 at gmail.com  Sat May  3 11:27:02 2014
From: woodbrian77 at gmail.com (Brian Wood)
Date: Sat, 3 May 2014 11:27:02 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Wireless working now on laptop
Message-ID: <CABWFOjswKjoTJNdYr2Wv6kpAqnpkRgPTc3ayp-6FdzuMVdOG7Q@mail.gmail.com>

It took a while for them to get out here, and it took over
3 hours for the tech to get things working once here,
but the problem I had a few weeks ago has gone away.
The only thing is I'm renting a modem and plan to buy one
shortly so it's possible to hit a problem again, but will have
to wait and see.

I have a Qwest Actiontec pk5000 modem for sale now.

Also have an Acer 4740-7552 laptop for sale.  The battery
only lasts about 30 minutes and one of the hinges is broken.
When the hinge broke, it broke through part of the exterior.
I put a piece of duct tape over that to keep dust out.
It has Intel I5 and 4G of DDR3 memory.  $170 obo.

-- 
Brian
Ebenezer Enterprises -  ?But I say to you who hear, love your
enemies, do good to those who hate you'  Luke 6:27
http://webEbenezer.net
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From ryanjcole at me.com  Sat May  3 11:42:44 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Sat, 03 May 2014 11:42:44 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Wireless working now on laptop
In-Reply-To: <CABWFOjswKjoTJNdYr2Wv6kpAqnpkRgPTc3ayp-6FdzuMVdOG7Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABWFOjswKjoTJNdYr2Wv6kpAqnpkRgPTc3ayp-6FdzuMVdOG7Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <EB4B2B61-70C4-4C4E-8D26-4A4D90DBC7AA@me.com>

I?d still rent the DSL modem and get your own firewall in the middle.

Run the Firewall as a DMZ and handle all your security/IP addressing from the firewall.


On May 3, 2014, at 11:27, Brian Wood <woodbrian77 at gmail.com> wrote:

> It took a while for them to get out here, and it took over
> 3 hours for the tech to get things working once here, 
> but the problem I had a few weeks ago has gone away.  
> The only thing is I'm renting a modem and plan to buy one 
> shortly so it's possible to hit a problem again, but will have
> to wait and see.
> 
> I have a Qwest Actiontec pk5000 modem for sale now.
> 
> Also have an Acer 4740-7552 laptop for sale.  The battery
> only lasts about 30 minutes and one of the hinges is broken.
> When the hinge broke, it broke through part of the exterior.
> I put a piece of duct tape over that to keep dust out.   
> It has Intel I5 and 4G of DDR3 memory.  $170 obo.
> 
> -- 
> Brian
> Ebenezer Enterprises -  ?But I say to you who hear, love your 
> enemies, do good to those who hate you'  Luke 6:27
> http://webEbenezer.net
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From woodbrian77 at gmail.com  Sat May  3 13:58:30 2014
From: woodbrian77 at gmail.com (Brian Wood)
Date: Sat, 3 May 2014 18:58:30 +0000
Subject: [tclug-list] Cheap Android
Message-ID: <CABWFOjup1Sk6gc8U5iBYPz1WYp-5uqX2a42J-ORGYURFN=5mvg@mail.gmail.com>

http://www.amazon.com/PCD-Chaser-Prepaid-Android-Virgin/dp/B0087T0XA8

Chaser phone for $30 or best offer.


-- 
Brian
Ebenezer Enterprises - In G-d we trust.
http://webEbenezer.net
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sat May  3 17:12:56 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sat, 3 May 2014 17:12:56 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Cheap Android
In-Reply-To: <CABWFOjup1Sk6gc8U5iBYPz1WYp-5uqX2a42J-ORGYURFN=5mvg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABWFOjup1Sk6gc8U5iBYPz1WYp-5uqX2a42J-ORGYURFN=5mvg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405031704440.19832@cockerel.yaron.org>

This isn't a "Cheap Android". This is a "Cheap, ancient and horrible 
Android".

To begin with, it uses Android 2.3, which was released in 2010. That means 
a whole lot of stuff will just not work. It also implies the hardware is 
phenominally outdated. Actually, nevermind implying, the specs are right 
there. It's a tiny, tiny phone (3.2" screen) with an ancient CPU and 
barely any RAM.

This is the kind of phone that makes people hate Android because they 
think this is what the experience is like. It's like if you wanted to know 
what Windows 8 is like, so you got an 8-year-old laptop with a 20gb 
harddrive and 1gig of RAM and Windows XP and then complained it's slow, 
has not diskspace and no modern software will run on it.


On Sat, 3 May 2014, Brian Wood wrote:

> 
> http://www.amazon.com/PCD-Chaser-Prepaid-Android-Virgin/dp/B0087T0XA8
> 
> Chaser phone for $30 or best offer.
> 
> 
> --
> Brian
> Ebenezer Enterprises - In G-d we trust.
> http://webEbenezer.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

From ryanjcole at me.com  Sat May  3 18:01:21 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Sat, 03 May 2014 18:01:21 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Cheap Android
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405031704440.19832@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <CABWFOjup1Sk6gc8U5iBYPz1WYp-5uqX2a42J-ORGYURFN=5mvg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405031704440.19832@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <10C68C09-591B-47BD-AA49-522BC0862286@me.com>

Well, ?cheap? isn?t a bad word to describe it. :)


On May 3, 2014, at 17:12, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:

> This isn't a "Cheap Android". This is a "Cheap, ancient and horrible Android".
> 
> To begin with, it uses Android 2.3, which was released in 2010. That means a whole lot of stuff will just not work. It also implies the hardware is phenominally outdated. Actually, nevermind implying, the specs are right there. It's a tiny, tiny phone (3.2" screen) with an ancient CPU and barely any RAM.
> 
> This is the kind of phone that makes people hate Android because they think this is what the experience is like. It's like if you wanted to know what Windows 8 is like, so you got an 8-year-old laptop with a 20gb harddrive and 1gig of RAM and Windows XP and then complained it's slow, has not diskspace and no modern software will run on it.
> 
> 
> On Sat, 3 May 2014, Brian Wood wrote:
> 
>> http://www.amazon.com/PCD-Chaser-Prepaid-Android-Virgin/dp/B0087T0XA8
>> Chaser phone for $30 or best offer.
>> --
>> Brian
>> Ebenezer Enterprises - In G-d we trust.
>> http://webEbenezer.net
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sat May  3 19:04:00 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sat, 3 May 2014 19:04:00 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Cheap Android
In-Reply-To: <10C68C09-591B-47BD-AA49-522BC0862286@me.com>
References: <CABWFOjup1Sk6gc8U5iBYPz1WYp-5uqX2a42J-ORGYURFN=5mvg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405031704440.19832@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <10C68C09-591B-47BD-AA49-522BC0862286@me.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405031903460.12604@cockerel.yaron.org>

Heh, true. I'm just saying that "Cheap Android" is incompete at best.

On Sat, 3 May 2014, Ryan Coleman wrote:

> Well, ?cheap? isn?t a bad word to describe it. :)
>
>
> On May 3, 2014, at 17:12, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:
>
>> This isn't a "Cheap Android". This is a "Cheap, ancient and horrible Android".
>>
>> To begin with, it uses Android 2.3, which was released in 2010. That means a whole lot of stuff will just not work. It also implies the hardware is phenominally outdated. Actually, nevermind implying, the specs are right there. It's a tiny, tiny phone (3.2" screen) with an ancient CPU and barely any RAM.
>>
>> This is the kind of phone that makes people hate Android because they think this is what the experience is like. It's like if you wanted to know what Windows 8 is like, so you got an 8-year-old laptop with a 20gb harddrive and 1gig of RAM and Windows XP and then complained it's slow, has not diskspace and no modern software will run on it.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 3 May 2014, Brian Wood wrote:
>>
>>> http://www.amazon.com/PCD-Chaser-Prepaid-Android-Virgin/dp/B0087T0XA8
>>> Chaser phone for $30 or best offer.
>>> --
>>> Brian
>>> Ebenezer Enterprises - In G-d we trust.
>>> http://webEbenezer.net
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

From ryanjcole at me.com  Sun May  4 15:13:59 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2014 15:13:59 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Best platform for mail server
Message-ID: <9AC0B640-4437-4495-A81B-C0316E50D63E@me.com>

I?ve been a FreeBSD guy for over a decade - I love the platform but I?m curious as to what people might recommend for the following needs:

IMAP, SMTP and LDAP mail server (presently I?m using Dovecot and Postfix)

I would prefer something that?s pretty simple configuration for LDAP authentication (FreeBSD is not that simple to set up for base system needs) that will also create new users and folders as needed from the LDAP data.

I?m only looking to move one domain over to the new system.

Ideas? Running in VMware ESXi 5.1 so even a pre-built OVA would be great.

Thanks,
Ryan

From ryanjcole at me.com  Sun May  4 15:18:19 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2014 15:18:19 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Best platform for mail server
In-Reply-To: <9AC0B640-4437-4495-A81B-C0316E50D63E@me.com>
References: <9AC0B640-4437-4495-A81B-C0316E50D63E@me.com>
Message-ID: <78EA8237-503D-455D-AE1D-EF93E1535EBC@me.com>

Oh and I already have the LDAP server running - so it would query a LAN-hosted server.


On May 4, 2014, at 15:13, Ryan Coleman <ryanjcole at me.com> wrote:

> I?ve been a FreeBSD guy for over a decade - I love the platform but I?m curious as to what people might recommend for the following needs:
> 
> IMAP, SMTP and LDAP mail server (presently I?m using Dovecot and Postfix)
> 
> I would prefer something that?s pretty simple configuration for LDAP authentication (FreeBSD is not that simple to set up for base system needs) that will also create new users and folders as needed from the LDAP data.
> 
> I?m only looking to move one domain over to the new system.
> 
> Ideas? Running in VMware ESXi 5.1 so even a pre-built OVA would be great.
> 
> Thanks,
> Ryan
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Sun May  4 16:16:48 2014
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Sun, 4 May 2014 16:16:48 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Best platform for mail server
In-Reply-To: <78EA8237-503D-455D-AE1D-EF93E1535EBC@me.com>
References: <9AC0B640-4437-4495-A81B-C0316E50D63E@me.com>
 <78EA8237-503D-455D-AE1D-EF93E1535EBC@me.com>
Message-ID: <CAOZLdJUq1-6eET0JhzbZMRBfvT7GjwRvjeO0fMsuCOh5b09=-A@mail.gmail.com>

There's a lot of value in using what you know, so if you know FreeBSD
maybe that's your answer.  Personally for OS I prefer Ubuntu or
Debian.  My mail stack is similar to your current setup - Postfix,
Dovecot, SpamAssassin, and Roundcube for webmail.  Ubuntu does a nice
job of tying Postfix and Dovecot together for shared account lists out
of the box.  I'm actually using a PostgreSQL database for mine, but
LDAP is simple too - you'd just define whatever LDAP search returns
valid users/mailboxes.

From ryanjcole at me.com  Sun May  4 16:20:13 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2014 16:20:13 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Best platform for mail server
In-Reply-To: <EA3E8CDB-C001-45D6-8A91-7FBED1755067@cwis.biz>
References: <9AC0B640-4437-4495-A81B-C0316E50D63E@me.com>
 <78EA8237-503D-455D-AE1D-EF93E1535EBC@me.com>
 <CAOZLdJUq1-6eET0JhzbZMRBfvT7GjwRvjeO0fMsuCOh5b09=-A@mail.gmail.com>
 <EA3E8CDB-C001-45D6-8A91-7FBED1755067@cwis.biz>
Message-ID: <2CC9C17B-67F9-4E0D-8B97-1BFB9C15DC51@me.com>

It?s more a case of needing to make sure it handles folder creation and management right. At the moment the mail server won?t create folders, even with generic rights, on the first connection and I have to create each user manually. Then again, this server is sunsetting soon but not until I have the replacement box running


Now that I send this message it took upgrading to fBSD 10.0-RELEASE to get Postfix to even compile correctly (it was barfing on a user ID that supposedly existed but wasn?t really there previously).

On May 4, 2014, at 16:19, Ryan Coleman <ryan.coleman at cwis.biz> wrote:

> It?s more a case of needing to make sure it handles folder creation and management right. At the moment the mail server won?t create folders, even with generic rights, on the first connection and I have to create each user manually. Then again, this server is sunsetting soon but not until I have the replacement box running
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On May 4, 2014, at 16:16, Tony Yarusso <tonyyarusso at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> There's a lot of value in using what you know, so if you know FreeBSD
>> maybe that's your answer.  Personally for OS I prefer Ubuntu or
>> Debian.  My mail stack is similar to your current setup - Postfix,
>> Dovecot, SpamAssassin, and Roundcube for webmail.  Ubuntu does a nice
>> job of tying Postfix and Dovecot together for shared account lists out
>> of the box.  I'm actually using a PostgreSQL database for mine, but
>> LDAP is simple too - you'd just define whatever LDAP search returns
>> valid users/mailboxes.
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 


From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May  4 16:35:31 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 4 May 2014 16:35:31 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Best platform for mail server
In-Reply-To: <9AC0B640-4437-4495-A81B-C0316E50D63E@me.com>
References: <9AC0B640-4437-4495-A81B-C0316E50D63E@me.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405041633220.16731@cockerel.yaron.org>

Postfix+dovecot+SpamAssassin+procmail on Ubuntu server for me. But I'm 
really the only person who uses this system, despite having 10+ domains 
and over 1000 aliases... last time I managed a commercial mail server it 
was running Sendmail and I don't think ANYone wants to see THAT again.

I have SquirrelMail on a different machine for webmail, but I haven't used 
that in years.

On Sun, 4 May 2014, Ryan Coleman wrote:

> I?ve been a FreeBSD guy for over a decade - I love the platform but I?m curious as to what people might recommend for the following needs:
>
> IMAP, SMTP and LDAP mail server (presently I?m using Dovecot and Postfix)
>
> I would prefer something that?s pretty simple configuration for LDAP authentication (FreeBSD is not that simple to set up for base system needs) that will also create new users and folders as needed from the LDAP data.
>
> I?m only looking to move one domain over to the new system.
>
> Ideas? Running in VMware ESXi 5.1 so even a pre-built OVA would be great.
>
> Thanks,
> Ryan
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

From rsinland at gvtel.com  Tue May  6 17:34:42 2014
From: rsinland at gvtel.com (Robert Sinland)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2014 17:34:42 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Shuttle Omninas  KD20
Message-ID: <53696382.7080103@gvtel.com>

This is a sort of Linux related topic as this NAS device runs an 
embedded Linux OS.
I recently got a good deal on one of these on ebay and popped in one 1 
terrabyte drive which the machine formatted and away we went quite nicely :)
I later added a second drive of the same size and tried to build a raid 
using the devices web interface.  During this process the second drive 
failed.
Now when I try to log in to do any configuration the unit takes me to a 
configuration wizard that want me to select a new raid arrangement.  All 
well and good,
except that the "busy" indicator on the web page never goes away and it 
wont let me select any of the options.  I have been googling for a few 
days looking for some command line solution to this with no luck. I'm 
just throwing this out there in case one of you had any ideas.
I have added in another good drive, removed all drives etc to no avail 
so far.
Thanks for any ideas :)
Rob

From tlunde at gmail.com  Tue May  6 18:36:02 2014
From: tlunde at gmail.com (T L)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2014 18:36:02 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Shuttle Omninas KD20
In-Reply-To: <53696382.7080103@gvtel.com>
References: <53696382.7080103@gvtel.com>
Message-ID: <CAE0VmCycdxL3QoYbkzTgFUhO8M98gPt=PuPJy-vygFWEGX-eqw@mail.gmail.com>

Pulling the drives & sticking them in a PC might let you talk to the
drive(s). I think that it is likely that the box is using the mdraid
software raid system, which nearly any distribution will support.

Good luck.

Thomas
On May 6, 2014 5:52 PM, "Robert Sinland" <rsinland at gvtel.com> wrote:

> This is a sort of Linux related topic as this NAS device runs an embedded
> Linux OS.
> I recently got a good deal on one of these on ebay and popped in one 1
> terrabyte drive which the machine formatted and away we went quite nicely :)
> I later added a second drive of the same size and tried to build a raid
> using the devices web interface.  During this process the second drive
> failed.
> Now when I try to log in to do any configuration the unit takes me to a
> configuration wizard that want me to select a new raid arrangement.  All
> well and good,
> except that the "busy" indicator on the web page never goes away and it
> wont let me select any of the options.  I have been googling for a few days
> looking for some command line solution to this with no luck. I'm just
> throwing this out there in case one of you had any ideas.
> I have added in another good drive, removed all drives etc to no avail so
> far.
> Thanks for any ideas :)
> Rob
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From rsinland at gvtel.com  Tue May  6 18:49:11 2014
From: rsinland at gvtel.com (Robert Sinland)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2014 18:49:11 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Shuttle Omninas KD20
In-Reply-To: <CAE0VmCycdxL3QoYbkzTgFUhO8M98gPt=PuPJy-vygFWEGX-eqw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <53696382.7080103@gvtel.com>
 <CAE0VmCycdxL3QoYbkzTgFUhO8M98gPt=PuPJy-vygFWEGX-eqw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <536974F7.6020503@gvtel.com>

On 05/06/2014 06:36 PM, T L wrote:
>
> Pulling the drives & sticking them in a PC might let you talk to the 
> drive(s). I think that it is likely that the box is using the mdraid 
> software raid system, which nearly any distribution will support.
>
> Good luck.
>
> Thomas
>
>
I had tried the freezer trick ( I learned that here lol) with no luck.  
I also tried hooking the bad drive to another PC.  It still played dead
I had emailed the tech support at shuttle just before posting to this 
list and much to my surprise they actually emailed me a solution to the 
problem.  I just had to do a firmware update in such a way as to bypass 
the web interface and it's all good here now:)
Thanks for your ideas though, i was starting to pull my hair out over this:)

  Rob

From woodbrian77 at gmail.com  Wed May  7 11:32:59 2014
From: woodbrian77 at gmail.com (Brian Wood)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2014 11:32:59 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Cheap phone
Message-ID: <CABWFOjuiVV7p8Eq17evbrOviD6L5dFyh97EkpdKqTJUADnemzA@mail.gmail.com>

http://www.amazon.com/PCD-Chaser-Prepaid-Android-Virgin/dp/B0087T0XA8

$25 obo.

-- 
Brian
Ebenezer Enterprises - Heavenly code.
http://webEbenezer.net
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From chapinjeff at gmail.com  Wed May  7 11:34:59 2014
From: chapinjeff at gmail.com (Jeff Chapin)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2014 11:34:59 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Cheap phone
In-Reply-To: <CABWFOjuiVV7p8Eq17evbrOviD6L5dFyh97EkpdKqTJUADnemzA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABWFOjuiVV7p8Eq17evbrOviD6L5dFyh97EkpdKqTJUADnemzA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJt84+NRDkqJi7TpAAXqSdzpAxojQ1-sf86q26FQ9j5Y_dCuKA@mail.gmail.com>

Could you at least limit your spam to one thread per item?


On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 11:32 AM, Brian Wood <woodbrian77 at gmail.com> wrote:

> http://www.amazon.com/PCD-Chaser-Prepaid-Android-Virgin/dp/B0087T0XA8
>
> $25 obo.
>
> --
> Brian
> Ebenezer Enterprises - Heavenly code.
> http://webEbenezer.net
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>


-- 
Jeff Chapin
President, CedarLug, retired
President, UNIPC, "I'll get around to it"
President, UNI Scuba Club
Senator, NISG, retired
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From ryanjcole at me.com  Wed May  7 12:47:33 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 12:47:33 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Cheap phone
In-Reply-To: <CAJt84+NRDkqJi7TpAAXqSdzpAxojQ1-sf86q26FQ9j5Y_dCuKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABWFOjuiVV7p8Eq17evbrOviD6L5dFyh97EkpdKqTJUADnemzA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJt84+NRDkqJi7TpAAXqSdzpAxojQ1-sf86q26FQ9j5Y_dCuKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2C68AEC8-09E7-4947-964C-22B4EB8CD7C8@me.com>

Nah, that would covered governed netiquette.


On May 7, 2014, at 11:34, Jeff Chapin <chapinjeff at gmail.com> wrote:

> Could you at least limit your spam to one thread per item?
> 
> 
> On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 11:32 AM, Brian Wood <woodbrian77 at gmail.com> wrote:
> http://www.amazon.com/PCD-Chaser-Prepaid-Android-Virgin/dp/B0087T0XA8
> 
> $25 obo.  
> 
> -- 
> Brian
> Ebenezer Enterprises - Heavenly code.
> http://webEbenezer.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Jeff Chapin
> President, CedarLug, retired
> President, UNIPC, "I'll get around to it"
> President, UNI Scuba Club
> Senator, NISG, retired
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From marc at e-skinner.net  Wed May  7 17:22:48 2014
From: marc at e-skinner.net (Marc Skinner)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 17:22:48 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] FS - CoolerMaster CM Stacker case
Message-ID: <536AB238.5050501@e-skinner.net>

Its about 7 years old, but only ever had one motherboard/system in it, 
so its not all broken etc.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/other/display/coolermaster-cmstacker.html

Anyone interested in it?

No PS, but has a hard drive chassis with fan, and 4 additional case fans.


Looking for $40.

From marc at e-skinner.net  Wed May  7 20:53:49 2014
From: marc at e-skinner.net (Marc Skinner)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 20:53:49 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] FS - MB, Memory and CPU
Message-ID: <536AE3AD.6060704@e-skinner.net>

Quantity 1 ($125) - HP Pavilion Quad Core (Q9300) with 8Gb ram, DVD RW,2 
WD drives sata, 160gb and 120gb, 350W PS, no OS.

Quantity 1 ($30) - 500 W Cooler Master PS

Quantity 2 ($15) - 350 W PS

Quantity 2 ($100 each) - MSI 880G-E45 MB with 16GB DDR3 Patriot Sector 3 
Memory - no CPU

Quantity 1 ($40) - BIOSTAR A770E3 MB with AMD X4, w/ stock AMD cooler 
fan - no memory

Quantity 1 ($40) - ECS-GeoForce6100SM-M2 (HT2000) MB with AMD X2 4000+, 
w/ stock AMD cooler fan and 2 x 2Gb Patriot GSeries DDR2 800Mhz memory

Quantity 2 ($15 each) - Maxtor MaxLine Plus II 250Gb Sata hard disk


All motherboards have run as file servers, never over-clock and in a 
smoke free, temperature controlled room.

From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Thu May  8 11:07:56 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 11:07:56 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] best file system for sharing USB drive between Linux
	and OS X
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

My son has a new MacBook Pro and I want to put some files on an external 
USB drive for him.  The MacBook has two USB 3.0 ports and I have a Seagate 
3 TB drive with USB 3.0.  The Seagate comes formatted with "fuseblk" 
(according to "df -T"), which seems to mean NTFS.

That mostly works but I've had occasional serious problems with data loss 
that I think might be caused by failure of the USB connection (e.g., my 
littlest kid yanks the cord out) or system crashes.  Thus, I would prefer 
to use a journaling file system, but I'm not sure which is best.

I am using Ubuntu, FWIW.

In this case, I'll be putting files on the drive and giving it to my son, 
so it is more important that the file system works well with Mac OS X than 
with Linux.  It looks like HFS+ can be used with Ubuntu using the package 
hfsprogs, but I get the impression that it is limited and might only 
create non-journaling versions of HFS+.

Any advice?  Is there another journaling file system that would work with 
a new OS X box, but that I can create via Linux?  It looks like we can get 
ext2/3/4 to work on OS X only by adding a $40 proprietary program, and I 
don't know how well that would actually work.

I could try to borrow a Mac and do it that way, but then I'd have go 
figure out in the Mac how to format an external drive for HFS+.  I'd also 
have to find a Mac to borrow, which might be difficult.

Mike

From tclug at freakzilla.com  Thu May  8 11:21:42 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 11:21:42 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] best file system for sharing USB drive between
 Linux and OS X
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>

If it was a smaller drive I'd say fat32... I never had a problem using 
hfs+ on Linux (also Ubuntu) or NTFS on OS X and Linux. This is one of 
those things where there's no "perfect" answer, sadly. I'd say Linux is 
slightly more flexible, so go with thatever's easier for OS X to do.


On Thu, 8 May 2014, Mike Miller wrote:

> My son has a new MacBook Pro and I want to put some files on an external USB 
> drive for him.  The MacBook has two USB 3.0 ports and I have a Seagate 3 TB 
> drive with USB 3.0.  The Seagate comes formatted with "fuseblk" (according to 
> "df -T"), which seems to mean NTFS.
>
> That mostly works but I've had occasional serious problems with data loss 
> that I think might be caused by failure of the USB connection (e.g., my 
> littlest kid yanks the cord out) or system crashes.  Thus, I would prefer to 
> use a journaling file system, but I'm not sure which is best.
>
> I am using Ubuntu, FWIW.
>
> In this case, I'll be putting files on the drive and giving it to my son, so 
> it is more important that the file system works well with Mac OS X than with 
> Linux.  It looks like HFS+ can be used with Ubuntu using the package 
> hfsprogs, but I get the impression that it is limited and might only create 
> non-journaling versions of HFS+.
>
> Any advice?  Is there another journaling file system that would work with a 
> new OS X box, but that I can create via Linux?  It looks like we can get 
> ext2/3/4 to work on OS X only by adding a $40 proprietary program, and I 
> don't know how well that would actually work.
>
> I could try to borrow a Mac and do it that way, but then I'd have go figure 
> out in the Mac how to format an external drive for HFS+.  I'd also have to 
> find a Mac to borrow, which might be difficult.
>
> Mike
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

From chrome at real-time.com  Thu May  8 11:29:53 2014
From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 12:29:53 -0400
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
Message-ID: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>

What do people recommend for a DSL router these days?

Ideally, something that can be described to a person with limited technical
ability such that they can go down to Best Buy or the like and buy there.

Information about higher-end model that is more appropriate for technical
users is also welcome.

Just trying to get a survey of user experiences out there.

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com

From lkateley at kateley.com  Thu May  8 11:39:21 2014
From: lkateley at kateley.com (Linda Kateley)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2014 11:39:21 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>
Message-ID: <536BB339.9060704@kateley.com>

Just a fyi, i have gone through 2 zyxel modems. They work well in the 
beginning, but roll over when i have my kids and their friend over. In 
both cases it can take the load for about 6 months, then.. I have to 
reboot every day or so.. I have an actiontec q1000 now that i got on 
amazon, used for $40 and it has not seized up once since i got it, but i 
have only had it for about 3 months.. I have 13 yo twin boys and 
sometimes they have as many as 8 friends over... That's alot of traffic :)

lk


On 5/8/14, 11:29 AM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
> What do people recommend for a DSL router these days?
>
> Ideally, something that can be described to a person with limited technical
> ability such that they can go down to Best Buy or the like and buy there.
>
> Information about higher-end model that is more appropriate for technical
> users is also welcome.
>
> Just trying to get a survey of user experiences out there.
>


From tclug1 at whitleymott.net  Thu May  8 12:51:08 2014
From: tclug1 at whitleymott.net (gregrwm)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 12:51:08 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] phone number merge
Message-ID: <CAD+dB9BhvZA9NneZ_HEM3j5ABABJ7oxKqYXLTi8DQM74OMv9aw@mail.gmail.com>

android contacts provide a merged view of info from google contacts,
facebook friends, and linkedin connections.  anything available on
linux that does similarly?  ie not importing, but a merged view?

From jpschewe at mtu.net  Thu May  8 18:16:28 2014
From: jpschewe at mtu.net (Jon Schewe)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 18:16:28 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] best file system for sharing USB drive between
 Linux and OS X
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <CALpcnowj4dcJ3zbiRbOMwUzTLO4don9=modfSPQ9rshf9Jc+0Q@mail.gmail.com>

You might try exFAT although it's not journaling.


On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 11:21 AM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> If it was a smaller drive I'd say fat32... I never had a problem using
> hfs+ on Linux (also Ubuntu) or NTFS on OS X and Linux. This is one of those
> things where there's no "perfect" answer, sadly. I'd say Linux is slightly
> more flexible, so go with thatever's easier for OS X to do.
>
>
>
> On Thu, 8 May 2014, Mike Miller wrote:
>
>  My son has a new MacBook Pro and I want to put some files on an external
>> USB drive for him.  The MacBook has two USB 3.0 ports and I have a Seagate
>> 3 TB drive with USB 3.0.  The Seagate comes formatted with "fuseblk"
>> (according to "df -T"), which seems to mean NTFS.
>>
>> That mostly works but I've had occasional serious problems with data loss
>> that I think might be caused by failure of the USB connection (e.g., my
>> littlest kid yanks the cord out) or system crashes.  Thus, I would prefer
>> to use a journaling file system, but I'm not sure which is best.
>>
>> I am using Ubuntu, FWIW.
>>
>> In this case, I'll be putting files on the drive and giving it to my son,
>> so it is more important that the file system works well with Mac OS X than
>> with Linux.  It looks like HFS+ can be used with Ubuntu using the package
>> hfsprogs, but I get the impression that it is limited and might only create
>> non-journaling versions of HFS+.
>>
>> Any advice?  Is there another journaling file system that would work with
>> a new OS X box, but that I can create via Linux?  It looks like we can get
>> ext2/3/4 to work on OS X only by adding a $40 proprietary program, and I
>> don't know how well that would actually work.
>>
>> I could try to borrow a Mac and do it that way, but then I'd have go
>> figure out in the Mac how to format an external drive for HFS+.  I'd also
>> have to find a Mac to borrow, which might be difficult.
>>
>> Mike
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>


-- 
http://mtu.net/~jpschewe
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From tlunde at gmail.com  Thu May  8 18:23:00 2014
From: tlunde at gmail.com (T L)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 18:23:00 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] best file system for sharing USB drive between
 Linux and OS X
In-Reply-To: <CALpcnowj4dcJ3zbiRbOMwUzTLO4don9=modfSPQ9rshf9Jc+0Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CALpcnowj4dcJ3zbiRbOMwUzTLO4don9=modfSPQ9rshf9Jc+0Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAE0VmCz7Kj2traHSr4uY4HxCzCvFRR8Qn0ja+UTEx9RA2SfoNA@mail.gmail.com>

Due to patent issues, exfat is not well supported on Linux. See, e.g.:

http://askubuntu.com/questions/370398/how-to-get-a-drive-formatted-with-exfat-working

I'd use NTFS, myself. It is a journaling-capable filesystem:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS#Journaling

Write support varies on OS X versions, but Paragon makes a solid commercial
driver for it.

As someone else pointed out, FAT is an option. As long as you don't need
>4G files, it's not a terrible choice.

Thomas
On May 8, 2014 6:17 PM, "Jon Schewe" <jpschewe at mtu.net> wrote:

> You might try exFAT although it's not journaling.
>
>
> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 11:21 AM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>
>> If it was a smaller drive I'd say fat32... I never had a problem using
>> hfs+ on Linux (also Ubuntu) or NTFS on OS X and Linux. This is one of those
>> things where there's no "perfect" answer, sadly. I'd say Linux is slightly
>> more flexible, so go with thatever's easier for OS X to do.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, 8 May 2014, Mike Miller wrote:
>>
>>  My son has a new MacBook Pro and I want to put some files on an external
>>> USB drive for him.  The MacBook has two USB 3.0 ports and I have a Seagate
>>> 3 TB drive with USB 3.0.  The Seagate comes formatted with "fuseblk"
>>> (according to "df -T"), which seems to mean NTFS.
>>>
>>> That mostly works but I've had occasional serious problems with data
>>> loss that I think might be caused by failure of the USB connection (e.g.,
>>> my littlest kid yanks the cord out) or system crashes.  Thus, I would
>>> prefer to use a journaling file system, but I'm not sure which is best.
>>>
>>> I am using Ubuntu, FWIW.
>>>
>>> In this case, I'll be putting files on the drive and giving it to my
>>> son, so it is more important that the file system works well with Mac OS X
>>> than with Linux.  It looks like HFS+ can be used with Ubuntu using the
>>> package hfsprogs, but I get the impression that it is limited and might
>>> only create non-journaling versions of HFS+.
>>>
>>> Any advice?  Is there another journaling file system that would work
>>> with a new OS X box, but that I can create via Linux?  It looks like we can
>>> get ext2/3/4 to work on OS X only by adding a $40 proprietary program, and
>>> I don't know how well that would actually work.
>>>
>>> I could try to borrow a Mac and do it that way, but then I'd have go
>>> figure out in the Mac how to format an external drive for HFS+.  I'd also
>>> have to find a Mac to borrow, which might be difficult.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>>
>>>  _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> http://mtu.net/~jpschewe
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From andyzib at gmail.com  Thu May  8 21:08:01 2014
From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew S. Zbikowski)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 21:08:01 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] best file system for sharing USB drive between
 Linux and OS X
In-Reply-To: <CAE0VmCz7Kj2traHSr4uY4HxCzCvFRR8Qn0ja+UTEx9RA2SfoNA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CALpcnowj4dcJ3zbiRbOMwUzTLO4don9=modfSPQ9rshf9Jc+0Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAE0VmCz7Kj2traHSr4uY4HxCzCvFRR8Qn0ja+UTEx9RA2SfoNA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMh5oVqGqS5HoJwicUoBtpie-1aRzurdjFtsasfrJ8k-NmeTXA@mail.gmail.com>

Ext4 and Paragon Software's ExtFS for Mac OS might be your best bet.

http://www.paragon-drivers.com/extfs-mac/

I use Paragon's NTFS for Mac all the time and have never had a problem.


--
Andrew Zbikowski
http://andy.zibnet.us/
Some things humans were never meant to know. For everything else, there's
Google.
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Fri May  9 02:18:22 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 02:18:22 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] best file system for sharing USB drive between
 Linux and OS X
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405090215541.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Thu, 8 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:

> If it was a smaller drive I'd say fat32... I never had a problem using 
> hfs+ on Linux (also Ubuntu) or NTFS on OS X and Linux. This is one of 
> those things where there's no "perfect" answer, sadly. I'd say Linux is 
> slightly more flexible, so go with thatever's easier for OS X to do.

Well, HFS+ is easier for OS X, obviously.

Is it hard to format a 3 TB USB drive, currently NTFS, as HFS+ in Ubuntu? 
Have you done that?

Mike

From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Fri May  9 02:23:29 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 02:23:29 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] best file system for sharing USB drive between
 Linux and OS X
In-Reply-To: <CAMh5oVqGqS5HoJwicUoBtpie-1aRzurdjFtsasfrJ8k-NmeTXA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405081026500.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405081111090.3803@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CALpcnowj4dcJ3zbiRbOMwUzTLO4don9=modfSPQ9rshf9Jc+0Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAE0VmCz7Kj2traHSr4uY4HxCzCvFRR8Qn0ja+UTEx9RA2SfoNA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMh5oVqGqS5HoJwicUoBtpie-1aRzurdjFtsasfrJ8k-NmeTXA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405090218410.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Thu, 8 May 2014, Andrew S. Zbikowski wrote:

> Ext4 and Paragon Software's ExtFS for Mac OS might be your best bet.
>
> http://www.paragon-drivers.com/extfs-mac/
>
> I use Paragon's NTFS for Mac all the time and have never had a problem.


That is a tempting option.  It sounds like that software works very well 
for ext2/3/4.

The easiest thing for me would be to just give him the NTFS volume and the 
Paragon NTFS software ($20 for NTFS, but $40 for ext) and he should be 
good to go.  That has the advantage that it also works with Windows, 
making it easy for him to copy files from a computer in his workplace, if 
that situation ever comes up.

Mike

From pj.world at hotmail.com  Thu May  8 21:29:51 2014
From: pj.world at hotmail.com (paul g)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 21:29:51 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
Message-ID: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>

Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me they wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions on this?

Thanks,
 		 	   		  
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From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Fri May  9 15:10:10 2014
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 15:10:10 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <CAOZLdJWq+3aC6piFOpcFPd9bcyh-WA6bnc=gRm89xXe=c3xRCQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 9:29 PM, paul g <pj.world at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me they
> wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions on this?

That can be true, as they are frequently designed with poorly
ventilated cases and people install them in silly places, both causing
the equipment to overheat, which shortens the life.  If properly
ventilated / cooled, they should be fine, but the former case is
probably more common sadly.

From blutgens at gmail.com  Fri May  9 15:47:39 2014
From: blutgens at gmail.com (Ben)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 15:47:39 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <CAOZLdJWq+3aC6piFOpcFPd9bcyh-WA6bnc=gRm89xXe=c3xRCQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <CAOZLdJWq+3aC6piFOpcFPd9bcyh-WA6bnc=gRm89xXe=c3xRCQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANoiwe4CROxKyDUh8X3UHvtAX7aaFax6pA2ZK8ccyrCQ+DZOZA@mail.gmail.com>

Everything can wear out and/or fail.


On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 3:10 PM, Tony Yarusso <tonyyarusso at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 9:29 PM, paul g <pj.world at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me
> they
> > wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions on
> this?
>
> That can be true, as they are frequently designed with poorly
> ventilated cases and people install them in silly places, both causing
> the equipment to overheat, which shortens the life.  If properly
> ventilated / cooled, they should be fine, but the former case is
> probably more common sadly.
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>



-- 
Ben Lutgens
Linux / Unix System Administrator

Three of your friends throw up after eating chicken salad.  Do you think:
"I should find more robust friends" or "we should check that refrigerator"?
       -- Donald Becker, on vortex-bug, suspecting a network-wide problem
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Fri May  9 15:54:28 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 15:54:28 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405091550570.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Thu, 8 May 2014, paul g wrote:

> Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me 
> they wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions 
> on this?


Well, "wear out" sounds like a tire or a pair of jeans -- like the quality 
degrades over time -- but I doubt routers work that way.

On the other hand, I think what Tony was saying is that the probability of 
immediate failure might be increasing as time passes.

I wouldn't buy a new one unless my old one had failed.

Mike

From jus at krytosvirus.com  Fri May  9 16:05:53 2014
From: jus at krytosvirus.com (Justin Krejci)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2014 16:05:53 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] =?utf-8?q?Do_wireless_routers_wear_out=3F?=
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405091550570.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405091550570.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <287966e857bbdd2f55210e486f6c3d21@mail.usinternet.com>

 

Not just heating/ventilation but also the power supply. Random surges,
brownouts, etc. can add stress to those components.
I typically run my small electronics on a UPS: DSL router, wifi, VoIP
ATA, etc. I've found that they tend to last longer even if I am not
concerned about long battery run times, which I am typically not in my
home network environment. If I get 10 minutes, that is fine by me, I
just want the UPS to absorb most of the electrical fluctuations as much
as possible.

Funny heat related story (at least looking back it is funny now), I'd
come across an install technician who installed DSL service but never
peeled of the clear plastic sheet off the top of the DSL router, thereby
leaving all of the ventilation holes on top completely sealed. Every
single one of those he installed had failed within 6 months and needed
to get replaced. The funny part comes in where I decided to read the
"Quick Start Guide" PDF that comes with the router, there are like 3
basic steps listed with an extremely eye-catching WARNING at the top
that specifically says to peel off the plastic sheet prior to first use.
FAIL! 

On 09.05.2014 15:54, Mike Miller wrote: 

> On Thu, 8 May 2014, paul g wrote:
> 
>> Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me they wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions on this?
> 
> Well, "wear out" sounds like a tire or a pair of jeans -- like the quality 
> degrades over time -- but I doubt routers work that way.
> 
> On the other hand, I think what Tony was saying is that the probability of 
> immediate failure might be increasing as time passes.
> 
> I wouldn't buy a new one unless my old one had failed.
> 
> Mike
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list [1]

 

Links:
------
[1] http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
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From ryanjcole at me.com  Fri May  9 17:42:22 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2014 17:42:22 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <287966e857bbdd2f55210e486f6c3d21@mail.usinternet.com>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405091550570.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <287966e857bbdd2f55210e486f6c3d21@mail.usinternet.com>
Message-ID: <30D4B37D-8CD7-4647-8E4E-3CB6E6C67C28@me.com>


On May 9, 2014, at 16:05, Justin Krejci <jus at krytosvirus.com> wrote:

> Not just heating/ventilation but also the power supply. Random surges, brownouts, etc. can add stress to those components.
> I typically run my small electronics on a UPS: DSL router, wifi, VoIP ATA, etc. I've found that they tend to last longer even if I am not concerned about long battery run times, which I am typically not in my home network environment. If I get 10 minutes, that is fine by me, I just want the UPS to absorb most of the electrical fluctuations as much as possible.
> 
More to the point this is a great use for the ?surge protection only? ports on the UPS.

But they are susceptible to more than just wire power but also static power (think charged ions in the air or lightning).
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Fri May  9 18:18:13 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 18:18:13 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <CANoiwe4CROxKyDUh8X3UHvtAX7aaFax6pA2ZK8ccyrCQ+DZOZA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <CAOZLdJWq+3aC6piFOpcFPd9bcyh-WA6bnc=gRm89xXe=c3xRCQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANoiwe4CROxKyDUh8X3UHvtAX7aaFax6pA2ZK8ccyrCQ+DZOZA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405091817130.2920@cockerel.yaron.org>

On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 9:29 PM, paul g <pj.world at hotmail.com>
wrote:

> Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me 
> they wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions 
> on this?

I'm betting the phrase "Extended Warranty" was uttered shortly after.

From joel_cd at yahoo.com  Fri May  9 19:48:31 2014
From: joel_cd at yahoo.com (Joel Dick)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 17:48:31 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405091817130.2920@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <CAOZLdJWq+3aC6piFOpcFPd9bcyh-WA6bnc=gRm89xXe=c3xRCQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANoiwe4CROxKyDUh8X3UHvtAX7aaFax6pA2ZK8ccyrCQ+DZOZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405091817130.2920@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <1399682911.79415.YahooMailNeo@web125503.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

Hah, I had to laugh when I bit my tongue and paid extra for a coax cable at Radio Shack as it was convenient at the time and I was trying to make a purchase there once in a while to show some support.

I felt like I was slapped in the face when the guy at the register tried to offer me a "1 year extended warranty, for only 2 bucks". On a cable... a freaking cable... I just laughed and shook my head, I really should have just told him to cancel the sale on an already overpriced cable, but I guess I'm learning I might just have to let some things go, like radio shack in general.

Sorry to hijack the conversation, but yeah, I'm sure like everything, electronics will eventually fail. I just try to get the most lifetime out of mine before they're obsoleted (which seems to happen faster than the device fails).

-Joel


On Friday, May 9, 2014 6:18 PM, "tclug at freakzilla.com" <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
 
On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 9:29 PM, paul g <pj.world at hotmail.com>
wrote:

> Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me 
> they wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions 
> on this?

I'm betting the phrase "Extended Warranty" was uttered shortly after.

_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
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From ryanjcole at me.com  Fri May  9 21:07:06 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2014 21:07:06 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <1399682911.79415.YahooMailNeo@web125503.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <CAOZLdJWq+3aC6piFOpcFPd9bcyh-WA6bnc=gRm89xXe=c3xRCQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANoiwe4CROxKyDUh8X3UHvtAX7aaFax6pA2ZK8ccyrCQ+DZOZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405091817130.2920@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <1399682911.79415.YahooMailNeo@web125503.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9F0FF623-8BC2-43D0-B8BA-ADF501727DDB@me.com>

Eventually, yes, usually due to outside influences rather than old age but? hard drives fail more due to old age than outside influences.


On May 9, 2014, at 19:48, Joel Dick <joel_cd at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Hah, I had to laugh when I bit my tongue and paid extra for a coax cable at Radio Shack as it was convenient at the time and I was trying to make a purchase there once in a while to show some support.
> 
> I felt like I was slapped in the face when the guy at the register tried to offer me a "1 year extended warranty, for only 2 bucks". On a cable... a freaking cable... I just laughed and shook my head, I really should have just told him to cancel the sale on an already overpriced cable, but I guess I'm learning I might just have to let some things go, like radio shack in general.
> 
> Sorry to hijack the conversation, but yeah, I'm sure like everything, electronics will eventually fail. I just try to get the most lifetime out of mine before they're obsoleted (which seems to happen faster than the device fails).
> 
> -Joel
> 
> On Friday, May 9, 2014 6:18 PM, "tclug at freakzilla.com" <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 9:29 PM, paul g <pj.world at hotmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> > Some years ago when I bought my wireless router the salesperson told me 
> > they wear out after some time. Could I get your knowledge and opinions 
> > on this?
> 
> I'm betting the phrase "Extended Warranty" was uttered shortly after.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From cncole at earthlink.net  Sat May 10 01:28:49 2014
From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 01:28:49 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <9F0FF623-8BC2-43D0-B8BA-ADF501727DDB@me.com>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <CAOZLdJWq+3aC6piFOpcFPd9bcyh-WA6bnc=gRm89xXe=c3xRCQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANoiwe4CROxKyDUh8X3UHvtAX7aaFax6pA2ZK8ccyrCQ+DZOZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405091817130.2920@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <1399682911.79415.YahooMailNeo@web125503.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
 <9F0FF623-8BC2-43D0-B8BA-ADF501727DDB@me.com>
Message-ID: <0BDB529C68A2458591A0CF33D21724EE@d830a>

FYI, semiconductor devices don't have any built-in "wear" mechanism, BUT
their probability of failure increases as the 5th power of the delta T above
a nominal operating range.  I don't recall specific numbers, just the very
steep curve that encourages proper cooling.
 
Some protocol enhancements for streaming video in newer /g and /n routers
are likely a reason for me to "upgrade" an older router that "ain't broke".
The Amazon Fire installation notes indicate this might be an issue in my
case if I buy one.
 
 
Chuck
 


  _____  

From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
[mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Ryan Coleman
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2014 9:07 PM
To: TCLUG Mailing List
Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?


Eventually, yes, usually due to outside influences rather than old age but.
hard drives fail more due to old age than outside influences. 


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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sat May 10 03:56:58 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 03:56:58 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Do wireless routers wear out?
In-Reply-To: <287966e857bbdd2f55210e486f6c3d21@mail.usinternet.com>
References: <BAY168-W86DE24FF0D3D15E17036199480@phx.gbl>
 <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405091550570.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <287966e857bbdd2f55210e486f6c3d21@mail.usinternet.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405100355310.11630@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Fri, 9 May 2014, Justin Krejci wrote:

> Funny heat related story (at least looking back it is funny now), I'd 
> come across an install technician who installed DSL service but never 
> peeled of the clear plastic sheet off the top of the DSL router, thereby 
> leaving all of the ventilation holes on top completely sealed. Every 
> single one of those he installed had failed within 6 months and needed 
> to get replaced. The funny part comes in where I decided to read the 
> "Quick Start Guide" PDF that comes with the router, there are like 3 
> basic steps listed with an extremely eye-catching WARNING at the top 
> that specifically says to peel off the plastic sheet prior to first use. 
> FAIL!

Unbelievable.  I suppose he wasn't just trying to get more overtime.  You 
know about it, so he must have gotten caught.

Mike

From tclug1 at whitleymott.net  Sat May 10 08:12:22 2014
From: tclug1 at whitleymott.net (gregrwm)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 08:12:22 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
Message-ID: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>

ok you bashers, check me on this:

matches wanted:  messages syslog
matches not wanted:  anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz syslog.4.gz
pattern2:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
pattern2 match results:  messages syslog

so pattern2 works.  but is that pattern1 result a bug?
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From tclug1 at whitleymott.net  Sat May 10 12:22:16 2014
From: tclug1 at whitleymott.net (gregrwm)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 12:22:16 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
Message-ID: <CAD+dB9Cc7MLHjATCEJDhVAEqmWFbND1QqX719qHDBSiDBOGbZA@mail.gmail.com>

>
> pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
> pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz
> syslog.4.gz
>

s*s*g matches "syslog.2.g", then *.* fails to match "z".  no way to specify
shortest match afaik.
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From random at argle.org  Sat May 10 13:17:07 2014
From: random at argle.org (Daniel Taylor)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 13:17:07 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
In-Reply-To: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <536E6D23.8080403@argle.org>

(*\.*)
On 05/10/2014 08:12 AM, gregrwm wrote:
> ok you bashers, check me on this:
>
> matches wanted:  messages syslog
> matches not wanted:  anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
> pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
> pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz 
> syslog.4.gz
> pattern2:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
> pattern2 match results:  messages syslog
>
> so pattern2 works.  but is that pattern1 result a bug?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From tclug1 at whitleymott.net  Sat May 10 13:55:49 2014
From: tclug1 at whitleymott.net (gregrwm)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 13:55:49 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
Message-ID: <CAD+dB9ACFU7xQZeVTCTvm1ztt8RKO8cMGbziNti+tBkuyTDCOw@mail.gmail.com>

fair guess, but . isn't special in that context.  what i was missing was
s*s*g was matching right through syslog.2.g so !(*.*) couldn't eliminate
dots it couldn't see.  no way to specify shortest match for s*s*g afaik.
anyway a better pattern is *(messages|syslog)


On 10 May 2014 13:17, Daniel Taylor <random at argle.org> wrote:

>  (*\.*)
>
>
> On 05/10/2014 08:12 AM, gregrwm wrote:
>
>  ok you bashers, check me on this:
>
> matches wanted:  messages syslog
> matches not wanted:  anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
> pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>  pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz
> syslog.4.gz
>  pattern2:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
> pattern2 match results:  messages syslog
>
> so pattern2 works.  but is that pattern1 result a bug?
>
>
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From random at argle.org  Sat May 10 14:34:51 2014
From: random at argle.org (Daniel Taylor)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 14:34:51 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
In-Reply-To: <CAD+dB9ACFU7xQZeVTCTvm1ztt8RKO8cMGbziNti+tBkuyTDCOw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD+dB9ACFU7xQZeVTCTvm1ztt8RKO8cMGbziNti+tBkuyTDCOw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <536E7F5B.9050303@argle.org>

On 05/10/2014 01:55 PM, gregrwm wrote:
> fair guess, but . isn't special in that context. what i was missing 
> was s*s*g was matching right through syslog.2.g so !(*.*) couldn't 
> eliminate dots it couldn't see. no way to specify shortest match for 
> s*s*g afaik.  anyway a better pattern is *(messages|syslog)
>
I misread your OP and was thinking regex. My bad.
>
> On 10 May 2014 13:17, Daniel Taylor <random at argle.org 
> <mailto:random at argle.org>> wrote:
>
>     (*\.*)
>
>
>     On 05/10/2014 08:12 AM, gregrwm wrote:
>>     ok you bashers, check me on this:
>>
>>     matches wanted:  messages syslog
>>     matches not wanted:  anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
>>     pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>>     pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz
>>     syslog.4.gz
>>     pattern2:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
>>     pattern2 match results:  messages syslog
>>
>>     so pattern2 works.  but is that pattern1 result a bug?
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From harlan at bloomenterprises.org  Sat May 10 21:51:55 2014
From: harlan at bloomenterprises.org (Harlan H. Bloom)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 21:51:55 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <26485067.20.1399776298245.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
Message-ID: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>

Hello Everyone, 
I hope your weekend is going good, despite more rain tonight. Also, please wish a Happy Mother's Day to all the Moms in your life. 

Yes, i do have a real question. :) 

We are looking to replace my wife's laptop in the near future and are wondering what are the best consumer-class laptops on the market right now. I am not talking about the business product lines, but the product lines generally made for home use. We're more concerned with hardware problems than software environments or operating systems. It's getting more difficult to replace fans in laptops as I have less time these days. I've replaced fans in two computers in the past three years; the first fan I replaced is failing again. 

I realize this is off-topic. Yes, I do run Linux on my computers, and watch this list regularly even if I don't often comment on the topics. 

Thank you very much for your help, time and attention! 

Harlan... 
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From zedlan at invec.net  Sun May 11 08:14:31 2014
From: zedlan at invec.net (zedlan at invec.net)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 13:14:31 +0000
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
Message-ID: <W1307013637276271399814071@atl4webmail14>

 Harlan,

I bought my wife a $400 Acer at Microcenter. These days, $400 buys a more than adequate system. Whenever I buy a notebook, I purchase the extended warranty as well, since these devices are not as do-it-yourself friendly as servers and desktop systems, and they get bounced around.

FYI: http://linux-laptop.net/

Regards,
Jack

Microcenter notebook link:
http://www.microcenter.com/search/search_results.aspx?N=4294967288&sortby=pricelow&NTK=all&page=2&cat=Laptops/Notebooks-:-Laptops,-Netbooks-:-Computers-:-MicroCenter 


-----Original Message-----
From: Harlan H. Bloom [mailto:harlan at bloomenterprises.org]
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2014 10:51 PM
To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops

p { margin: 0; }Hello Everyone,
 I hope your weekend is going good, despite more rain tonight. Also, please wish a Happy Mother's Day to all the Moms in your life.

 Yes, i do have a real question. :)

 We are looking to replace my wife's laptop in the near future and are wondering what are the best consumer-class laptops on the market right now. I am not talking about the business product lines, but the product lines generally made for home use. We're more concerned with hardware problems than software environments or operating systems. It's getting more difficult to replace fans in laptops as I have less time these days. I've replaced fans in two computers in the past three years; the first fan I replaced is failing again.

 I realize this is off-topic. Yes, I do run Linux on my computers, and watch this list regularly even if I don't often comment on the topics.

Thank you very much for your help, time and attention!

Harlan...


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From me at bengentry.com  Sun May 11 08:16:27 2014
From: me at bengentry.com (Benjamin)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 08:16:27 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
Message-ID: <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>

Harlan,
     I would really need more info in order to give a good recomendation 
on what to buy. What is your budget range?
What will it be used for?
Are there any features it needs to have like say a touchscreen or 
ten-key numberpad?
What size?

Thanks,
Benjamin Gentry


On 05/10/2014 09:51 PM, Harlan H. Bloom wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
>   I hope your weekend is going good, despite more rain tonight. Also, 
> please wish a Happy Mother's Day to all the Moms in your life.
>
>   Yes, i do have a real question.  :)
>
>   We are looking to replace my wife's laptop in the near future and 
> are wondering what are the best consumer-class laptops on the market 
> right now.  I am not talking about the business product lines, but the 
> product lines generally made for home use.  We're more concerned with 
> hardware problems than software environments or operating systems.  
> It's getting more difficult to replace fans in laptops as I have less 
> time these days.  I've replaced fans in two computers in the past 
> three years; the first fan I replaced is failing again.
>
>   I realize this is off-topic.  Yes, I do run Linux on my computers, 
> and watch this list regularly even if I don't often comment on the topics.
>
> Thank you very much for your help, time and attention!
>
> Harlan...
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
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From kris.browne at gmail.com  Sun May 11 09:46:22 2014
From: kris.browne at gmail.com (Kris Browne)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 09:46:22 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
References: <26485067.20.1399776298245.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
Message-ID: <CACZjGuNVs1WaAn9huCT2js4o33wCA7gYHyTFbVKEUXYweFNGJQ@mail.gmail.com>

Harlan,
No matter which OS you plan to use on it, the MacBook Air family are just
about the best consumer laptops available, in terms of fit and finish
or reliability. While I live in Mac OS X, I have run Linux (and windows) on
several versions of them without issue.

On Saturday, May 10, 2014, Harlan H. Bloom <harlan at bloomenterprises.org>
wrote:

> Hello Everyone,
>   I hope your weekend is going good, despite more rain tonight.  Also,
> please wish a Happy Mother's Day to all the Moms in your life.
>
>   Yes, i do have a real question.  :)
>
>   We are looking to replace my wife's laptop in the near future and are
> wondering what are the best consumer-class laptops on the market right
> now.  I am not talking about the business product lines, but the product
> lines generally made for home use.  We're more concerned with hardware
> problems than software environments or operating systems.  It's getting
> more difficult to replace fans in laptops as I have less time these days.
> I've replaced fans in two computers in the past three years; the first fan
> I replaced is failing again.
>
>   I realize this is off-topic.  Yes, I do run Linux on my computers, and
> watch this list regularly even if I don't often comment on the topics.
>
> Thank you very much for your help, time and attention!
>
> Harlan...
>


-- 
(\(\
( -.-) Kris Browne
o_(")(") kris.browne at gmail.com
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From harlan at bloomenterprises.org  Sun May 11 20:03:31 2014
From: harlan at bloomenterprises.org (Harlan H. Bloom)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 20:03:31 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
Message-ID: <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>

Hi Benjamin, 
She currently has a 14 inch screen (measured diagonally) and would like to keep about the same form size. This means no 10 key on the right side. Mostly she uses her computer for web browsing, email, word processing and spreadsheets. She would like something faster than she has right now, or at least better response times. Her current computer has an AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 2.0 GHz cpu, 3GB RAM. I'm not worried about HD size since she isn't even close to filling the one she has now. The laptop is an HP. The second fan is dying, if not already dead. My current laptop, also an HP, I've had to replace the fan already, and it was less than two years old at the time. 

Again, we're looking for consumer systems that are reliable from a hardware perspective and don't need to be fixed very often, or at least until it needs replacing for 4 or 5 years down the road (preferred). Once I get an idea of what manufacturer's product lines are more reliable than the others, I can do specific task/machine sizing. 

For the PC-compatible laptops, who makes the most reliable consumer-class systems? Which of their product lines are more reliable? 

Budget: We're not rich, but we can afford something reasonably decent. 

Thanks again for everyone's help and comments! 

Harlan... 

----- Original Message -----

From: "Benjamin" <me at bengentry.com> 
To: "TCLUG Mailing List" <tclug-list at mn-linux.org> 
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2014 8:16:27 AM 
Subject: Re: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops 

Harlan, 
I would really need more info in order to give a good recomendation on what to buy. What is your budget range? 
What will it be used for? 
Are there any features it needs to have like say a touchscreen or ten-key numberpad? 

What size? 

Thanks, 
Benjamin Gentry 


On 05/10/2014 09:51 PM, Harlan H. Bloom wrote: 



Hello Everyone, 
I hope your weekend is going good, despite more rain tonight. Also, please wish a Happy Mother's Day to all the Moms in your life. 

Yes, i do have a real question. :) 

We are looking to replace my wife's laptop in the near future and are wondering what are the best consumer-class laptops on the market right now. I am not talking about the business product lines, but the product lines generally made for home use. We're more concerned with hardware problems than software environments or operating systems. It's getting more difficult to replace fans in laptops as I have less time these days. I've replaced fans in two computers in the past three years; the first fan I replaced is failing again. 

I realize this is off-topic. Yes, I do run Linux on my computers, and watch this list regularly even if I don't often comment on the topics. 

Thank you very much for your help, time and attention! 

Harlan... 


_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list at mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list 


_______________________________________________ 
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota 
tclug-list at mn-linux.org 
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list 

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From ryanjcole at me.com  Sun May 11 20:18:17 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 20:18:17 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
 <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
Message-ID: <A8A37F4B-3068-4A0D-BA60-614732C692DC@me.com>

In my experience? a computer that is used daily costs about $300-$400 per year of service.

Anything less might not last as long but sometimes there are computers that bust that and $100/year works. My mom?s $650 Dell is still doing her great (from 2008) and my dad?s $2100 Dell is beat to hell (from 2009).


On May 11, 2014, at 20:03, Harlan H. Bloom <harlan at bloomenterprises.org> wrote:

> Hi Benjamin,
>   She currently has a 14 inch screen (measured diagonally) and would like to keep about the same form size.  This means no 10 key on the right side.  Mostly she uses her computer for web browsing, email, word processing and spreadsheets.  She would like something faster than she has right now, or at least better response times.  Her current computer has an AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 2.0 GHz cpu, 3GB RAM.  I'm not worried about HD size since she isn't even close to filling the one she has now.  The laptop is an HP.  The second fan is dying, if not already dead.  My current laptop, also an HP, I've had to replace the fan already, and it was less than two years old at the time.
> 
>  Again, we're looking for consumer systems that are reliable from a hardware perspective and don't need to be fixed very often, or at least until it needs replacing for 4 or 5 years down the road (preferred).  Once I get an idea of what manufacturer's product lines are more reliable than the others, I can do specific task/machine sizing.
> 
>   For the PC-compatible laptops, who makes the most reliable consumer-class systems?  Which of their product lines are more reliable?
> 
>   Budget:  We're not rich, but we can afford something reasonably decent.
> 
> Thanks again for everyone's help and comments!
> 
> Harlan...
> 
> From: "Benjamin" <me at bengentry.com>
> To: "TCLUG Mailing List" <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2014 8:16:27 AM
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
> 
> Harlan,
>     I would really need more info in order to give a good recomendation on what to buy. What is your budget range?
> What will it be used for?
> Are there any features it needs to have like say a touchscreen or ten-key numberpad? 
> What size?
> 
> Thanks,
> Benjamin Gentry
> 
> 
> On 05/10/2014 09:51 PM, Harlan H. Bloom wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
>   I hope your weekend is going good, despite more rain tonight.  Also, please wish a Happy Mother's Day to all the Moms in your life.
> 
>   Yes, i do have a real question.  :)
> 
>   We are looking to replace my wife's laptop in the near future and are wondering what are the best consumer-class laptops on the market right now.  I am not talking about the business product lines, but the product lines generally made for home use.  We're more concerned with hardware problems than software environments or operating systems.  It's getting more difficult to replace fans in laptops as I have less time these days.  I've replaced fans in two computers in the past three years; the first fan I replaced is failing again.
> 
>   I realize this is off-topic.  Yes, I do run Linux on my computers, and watch this list regularly even if I don't often comment on the topics.
> 
> Thank you very much for your help, time and attention!
> 
> Harlan...
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From max at bernsteinforpresident.com  Mon May 12 07:48:25 2014
From: max at bernsteinforpresident.com (Max Shinn)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 07:48:25 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <A8A37F4B-3068-4A0D-BA60-614732C692DC@me.com>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
 <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <A8A37F4B-3068-4A0D-BA60-614732C692DC@me.com>
Message-ID: <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>

> In my experience? a computer that is used daily costs about $300-$400
> per year of service.

$300-$400/year of service?!  I'm currently running a 4+ year old
Dell that cost $500 new, and haven't put in a dime to repair it.  It
gets at least 4-5 hours of use per day.  I usually keep computers
around 5-6 years, and the only repairs I've ever had to do were
replacing a keyboard (on a ThinkPad) and a backlight (on an older
Dell).  

>   For the PC-compatible laptops, who makes the most reliable
> consumer-class systems?  Which of their product lines are more
> reliable?

I think I'm going to have to suggest ThinkPads just because the repairs
are so easy to do.  It's also one of the few laptops on the market
available without a glossy screen (if that is important to her).  It
also seems much better put together than the Dells I've had.

> Mostly she uses her computer for web browsing, email, word processing
> and spreadsheets.  She would like something faster than she has right
> now, or at least better response times.  Her current computer has an
> AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 2.0 GHz cpu, 3GB RAM.

Thanks for reminding me how much I love Bodhi/E17. ;)

-Max
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From marc at e-skinner.net  Mon May 12 08:20:46 2014
From: marc at e-skinner.net (Marc Skinner)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 08:20:46 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
 <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <A8A37F4B-3068-4A0D-BA60-614732C692DC@me.com>
 <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>
Message-ID: <5370CAAE.3090906@e-skinner.net>


I just recommended one of these to my mother in-law:

$329 or $379


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/hp-15-6-laptop-intel-core-i3-4gb-memory-750gb-hard-drive-sparkling-black/5154016.p?id=1219112462745&skuId=5154016&st=categoryid$pcmcat247400050000&cp=4&lp=3


or


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/toshiba-satellite-15-6-laptop-4gb-memory-750gb-hard-drive-satin-black/5546003.p?id=1219137665391&skuId=5546003&st=categoryid$pcmcat247400050000&cp=2&lp=7 


I have always had good luck with Dell as well for my other family 
members, but she needed one quick and couldn't wait for the 2 week build 
time that their website was stating.

ThinkPads are work horses and that is what I would recommend if you 
didn't mind spending more money.  I'm on my 8th one in 20 years and the 
only thing that has ever needed to be replaced is the battery and a 
single cooling fan which died in the fist 90 days.


Good luck!



On 05/12/2014 07:48 AM, Max Shinn wrote:
>> In my experience? a computer that is used daily costs about $300-$400
>> per year of service.
>
> $300-$400/year of service?!  I'm currently running a 4+ year old
> Dell that cost $500 new, and haven't put in a dime to repair it.  It
> gets at least 4-5 hours of use per day.  I usually keep computers
> around 5-6 years, and the only repairs I've ever had to do were
> replacing a keyboard (on a ThinkPad) and a backlight (on an older
> Dell).
>
>>    For the PC-compatible laptops, who makes the most reliable
>> consumer-class systems?  Which of their product lines are more
>> reliable?
>
> I think I'm going to have to suggest ThinkPads just because the repairs
> are so easy to do.  It's also one of the few laptops on the market
> available without a glossy screen (if that is important to her).  It
> also seems much better put together than the Dells I've had.
>
>> Mostly she uses her computer for web browsing, email, word processing
>> and spreadsheets.  She would like something faster than she has right
>> now, or at least better response times.  Her current computer has an
>> AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 2.0 GHz cpu, 3GB RAM.
>
> Thanks for reminding me how much I love Bodhi/E17. ;)
>
> -Max
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>


From jazzyflute at gmail.com  Mon May 12 08:27:39 2014
From: jazzyflute at gmail.com (Marc Thomas)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 08:27:39 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
 <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <A8A37F4B-3068-4A0D-BA60-614732C692DC@me.com> <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>
Message-ID: <CAMkrd9fQTLQrULHQZ4JvHJCn+6ZnXzVD3eZKPXTWCEkvPVONLA@mail.gmail.com>

Harlan,

There are tons of really good options to even more bad one. My
recommendation to everyone is not to be cheap. It may seem like a deal now,
but you will pay for it in a few years, either buy having to replace it
early, or spend money and time on repairs.

The Lenova Thinkpad line of laptops are generally of a higher quality than
most mainstream laptops and range in price from reasonable to expensive.
They are not my preferred laptop, but I know a lot of people that swear by
them. If your will to shell out a little extra money for some of the
sharpest looking, and most reliable laptops on the market, I would look at
the macbook air (11' and 13') and macbook pro (13', 15') laptops. Macbooks
are proven to have better hardware reliably than most any other laptop
manufacturer and their support (apple care) is by far the best in the
industry. Meaning if something goes wrong, they will often offer to just
give you a new/refurbished one if they can't fix it for you at your local
Apple store.

Another good brand to look at is System 76. Their laptops are solid and
pretty easy on the eyes. They come pre-loaded with Ubuntu Linux though they
can run Windows and Mac if you really want to go that route (hackintosh).
They give you some of the best performance bang for the buck at mid range
prices with high end specs. Their support team has a good track record as
far as actually helping with you call/email.


Hope that helps!


On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 7:48 AM, Max Shinn <max at bernsteinforpresident.com>wrote:

> > In my experience? a computer that is used daily costs about $300-$400
> > per year of service.
>
> $300-$400/year of service?!  I'm currently running a 4+ year old
> Dell that cost $500 new, and haven't put in a dime to repair it.  It
> gets at least 4-5 hours of use per day.  I usually keep computers
> around 5-6 years, and the only repairs I've ever had to do were
> replacing a keyboard (on a ThinkPad) and a backlight (on an older
> Dell).
>
> >   For the PC-compatible laptops, who makes the most reliable
> > consumer-class systems?  Which of their product lines are more
> > reliable?
>
> I think I'm going to have to suggest ThinkPads just because the repairs
> are so easy to do.  It's also one of the few laptops on the market
> available without a glossy screen (if that is important to her).  It
> also seems much better put together than the Dells I've had.
>
> > Mostly she uses her computer for web browsing, email, word processing
> > and spreadsheets.  She would like something faster than she has right
> > now, or at least better response times.  Her current computer has an
> > AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 2.0 GHz cpu, 3GB RAM.
>
> Thanks for reminding me how much I love Bodhi/E17. ;)
>
> -Max
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>


-- 
Website <http://mathomaste.ch>   :
Google+<https://plus.google.com/u/0/103260909450809151378/about>
 :   Twitter <https://twitter.com/mathomastech>   :
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From lkateley at kateley.com  Mon May 12 08:50:21 2014
From: lkateley at kateley.com (Linda Kateley)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 08:50:21 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <CAMkrd9fQTLQrULHQZ4JvHJCn+6ZnXzVD3eZKPXTWCEkvPVONLA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
 <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <A8A37F4B-3068-4A0D-BA60-614732C692DC@me.com>
 <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>
 <CAMkrd9fQTLQrULHQZ4JvHJCn+6ZnXzVD3eZKPXTWCEkvPVONLA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5370D19D.9090603@kateley.com>

I only buy macs for my own and family use. I know they aren't cheap, but 
the lack of hassle makes them worthwhile for me. I have 13 year old twin 
boys. I got them a second laptop, a nice dell laptop last year, they 
destroyed it within 2 months. They share the macbook ever since(2 plus 
years). I had to take their macbook in for repairs when they dropped it 
down the stairs. The drive was squealing loudly.. I took it in, they ran 
tests and i didn't pay a dime. It is still running fine.

My mac has 16gb of ram and I run all kinds of different os's in virtualbox.

I do have several x64 laptops, but i use them as test systems. I 
recently bought a toshiba laptop for less than $300. I am a big 
proponent of buying last years model. They always come down in price.

linda

On 5/12/14, 8:27 AM, Marc Thomas wrote:
> Harlan,
>
> There are tons of really good options to even more bad one. My 
> recommendation to everyone is not to be cheap. It may seem like a deal 
> now, but you will pay for it in a few years, either buy having to 
> replace it early, or spend money and time on repairs.
>
> The Lenova Thinkpad line of laptops are generally of a higher quality 
> than most mainstream laptops and range in price from reasonable to 
> expensive. They are not my preferred laptop, but I know a lot of 
> people that swear by them. If your will to shell out a little extra 
> money for some of the sharpest looking, and most reliable laptops on 
> the market, I would look at the macbook air (11' and 13') and macbook 
> pro (13', 15') laptops. Macbooks are proven to have better hardware 
> reliably than most any other laptop manufacturer and their support 
> (apple care) is by far the best in the industry. Meaning if something 
> goes wrong, they will often offer to just give you a new/refurbished 
> one if they can't fix it for you at your local Apple store.
>
> Another good brand to look at is System 76. Their laptops are solid 
> and pretty easy on the eyes. They come pre-loaded with Ubuntu Linux 
> though they can run Windows and Mac if you really want to go that 
> route (hackintosh). They give you some of the best performance bang 
> for the buck at mid range prices with high end specs. Their support 
> team has a good track record as far as actually helping with you 
> call/email.
>
>
> Hope that helps!
>
>
> On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 7:48 AM, Max Shinn 
> <max at bernsteinforpresident.com <mailto:max at bernsteinforpresident.com>> 
> wrote:
>
>     > In my experience... a computer that is used daily costs about
>     $300-$400
>     > per year of service.
>
>     $300-$400/year of service?!  I'm currently running a 4+ year old
>     Dell that cost $500 new, and haven't put in a dime to repair it.  It
>     gets at least 4-5 hours of use per day.  I usually keep computers
>     around 5-6 years, and the only repairs I've ever had to do were
>     replacing a keyboard (on a ThinkPad) and a backlight (on an older
>     Dell).
>
>     >   For the PC-compatible laptops, who makes the most reliable
>     > consumer-class systems?  Which of their product lines are more
>     > reliable?
>
>     I think I'm going to have to suggest ThinkPads just because the
>     repairs
>     are so easy to do.  It's also one of the few laptops on the market
>     available without a glossy screen (if that is important to her).  It
>     also seems much better put together than the Dells I've had.
>
>     > Mostly she uses her computer for web browsing, email, word
>     processing
>     > and spreadsheets.  She would like something faster than she has
>     right
>     > now, or at least better response times.  Her current computer has an
>     > AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 2.0 GHz cpu, 3GB RAM.
>
>     Thanks for reminding me how much I love Bodhi/E17. ;)
>
>     -Max
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>     tclug-list at mn-linux.org <mailto:tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
>     http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Website <http://mathomaste.ch>   : Google+ 
> <https://plus.google.com/u/0/103260909450809151378/about>   : Twitter 
> <https://twitter.com/mathomastech>  : GitHub 
> <https://github.com/mathomastech>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From sraun at fireopal.org  Mon May 12 11:18:07 2014
From: sraun at fireopal.org (Scott Raun)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 11:18:07 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
References: <26485067.20.1399776298245.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
Message-ID: <20140512161807.GE18809@fireopal.org>

On Sat, May 10, 2014 at 09:51:55PM -0500, Harlan H. Bloom wrote:
> We are looking to replace my wife's laptop in the near future and
> are wondering what are the best consumer-class laptops on the market
> right now. I am not talking about the business product lines, but
> the product lines generally made for home use. We're more concerned
> with hardware problems than software environments or operating
> systems. It's getting more difficult to replace fans in laptops as I
> have less time these days. I've replaced fans in two computers in
> the past three years; the first fan I replaced is failing again.

If I have a choice, I recommend IBM/Lenovo ThinkPads, or Dell
Latitudes.  Yes, the Latitudes are technically business class machines
- but they are _so_ much better made than their consumer laptops that
I find them well worth the extra money.

-- 
Scott Raun
sraun at fireopal.org

From woodbrian77 at gmail.com  Mon May 12 12:42:44 2014
From: woodbrian77 at gmail.com (Brian Wood)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 12:42:44 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Laptop problem
Message-ID: <CABWFOjv2mvb_37_vijT6yV4gq+5jyCcDkGmf=+GKB3D=zJKCrw@mail.gmail.com>

On some laptops I have to type the "Fn" and "F7" keys to get
a cursor/pointer to show up.  What's up with that?  Is there a
way to disable that?   If I hibernate and then start the computer,
I don't have to do that, but if I restart the computer I do.  Tia.

-- 
Brian
Ebenezer Enterprises - Me brushem teeth.
http://webEbenezer.net
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From sraun at fireopal.org  Mon May 12 13:04:47 2014
From: sraun at fireopal.org (Scott Raun)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 13:04:47 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Laptop problem
In-Reply-To: <CABWFOjv2mvb_37_vijT6yV4gq+5jyCcDkGmf=+GKB3D=zJKCrw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABWFOjv2mvb_37_vijT6yV4gq+5jyCcDkGmf=+GKB3D=zJKCrw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20140512180446.GB19891@fireopal.org>

On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 12:42:44PM -0500, Brian Wood wrote:
> On some laptops I have to type the "Fn" and "F7" keys to get
> a cursor/pointer to show up.  What's up with that?  Is there a
> way to disable that?   If I hibernate and then start the computer,
> I don't have to do that, but if I restart the computer I do.  Tia.

If that's the same thing as it is on my laptop, it's 'swap between LCD
panel and external monitor'.  Which means when it comes up the first
time, it thinks it should be using an external monitor.

Do you always start it in a docking station / port extender?

-- 
Scott Raun
sraun at fireopal.org

From chrome at real-time.com  Mon May 12 15:02:36 2014
From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 16:02:36 -0400
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <536BB339.9060704@kateley.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com> <536BB339.9060704@kateley.com>
Message-ID: <20140512200236.GJ408@real-time.com>

On 05/08 11:39 , Linda Kateley wrote:
> Just a fyi, i have gone through 2 zyxel modems. They work well in
> the beginning, but roll over when i have my kids and their friend
> over. In both cases it can take the load for about 6 months, then..
> I have to reboot every day or so.. I have an actiontec q1000 now
> that i got on amazon, used for $40 and it has not seized up once
> since i got it, but i have only had it for about 3 months.. I have
> 13 yo twin boys and sometimes they have as many as 8 friends over...
> That's alot of traffic :)

Thanks for the info Linda. Once upon a time Zyxel had a really good name..
that was over 15 years ago tho.

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com

From ryanjcole at me.com  Mon May 12 15:12:03 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 15:12:03 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Best consumer class laptops
In-Reply-To: <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>
References: <30912853.35.1399776711578.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <536F782B.2010509@bengentry.com>
 <30754110.303.1399856609369.JavaMail.harlan@star8>
 <A8A37F4B-3068-4A0D-BA60-614732C692DC@me.com> <20140512074825.73c49d00@Newton>
Message-ID: <27F916DD-2304-45E5-AA3B-F36765E23213@me.com>

I think my statement after that completely supported my stance:

If you are hard on computers you should spend more for something that will take the work. If you are only doing WP and surfing then you are fine with something cheaper. If you have history of dropping computers and don?t want to replace them every other year then don?t get a plastic-shelled computer.


On May 12, 2014, at 7:48, Max Shinn <max at bernsteinforpresident.com> wrote:

>> In my experience? a computer that is used daily costs about $300-$400
>> per year of service.
> 
> $300-$400/year of service?!  I'm currently running a 4+ year old
> Dell that cost $500 new, and haven't put in a dime to repair it.  It
> gets at least 4-5 hours of use per day.  I usually keep computers
> around 5-6 years, and the only repairs I've ever had to do were
> replacing a keyboard (on a ThinkPad) and a backlight (on an older
> Dell).  
> 
>>  For the PC-compatible laptops, who makes the most reliable
>> consumer-class systems?  Which of their product lines are more
>> reliable?
> 
> I think I'm going to have to suggest ThinkPads just because the repairs
> are so easy to do.  It's also one of the few laptops on the market
> available without a glossy screen (if that is important to her).  It
> also seems much better put together than the Dells I've had.
> 
>> Mostly she uses her computer for web browsing, email, word processing
>> and spreadsheets.  She would like something faster than she has right
>> now, or at least better response times.  Her current computer has an
>> AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 2.0 GHz cpu, 3GB RAM.
> 
> Thanks for reminding me how much I love Bodhi/E17. ;)
> 
> -Max
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From jus at krytosvirus.com  Mon May 12 16:03:58 2014
From: jus at krytosvirus.com (Justin Krejci)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 16:03:58 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
Message-ID: <8putwr1x04cdwkjhaldtbvx2.1399928637656@email.android.com>

I've had a ZyXEL DSL router for a while now. I've lots of devices, some wifi and some not, without experiencing issues. In fact it's never been rebooted since initial setup/configuration. There is plenty of Netflix, local multimedia streaming, general surfing, etc. on my home connection. At $dayjob we use a lot of ZyXEL products. In general they work well, including their standard ethernet wifi/router products the NBG4615 series.?

When dealing with Zhone brand DSL products a lot of headaches were experienced.

Early generation of Actiontec brand Qwest DSL equipment was terrible (a simple Nmap scan would lock them up) but these days they seem pretty decent.?



-------- Original message --------
From: Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom <chrome at real-time.com> 
Date:05/12/2014  3:02 PM  (GMT-06:00) 
To: TCLUG Mailing List <tclug-list at mn-linux.org> 
Subject: Re: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations 

On 05/08 11:39 , Linda Kateley wrote:
> Just a fyi, i have gone through 2 zyxel modems. They work well in
> the beginning, but roll over when i have my kids and their friend
> over. In both cases it can take the load for about 6 months, then..
> I have to reboot every day or so.. I have an actiontec q1000 now
> that i got on amazon, used for $40 and it has not seized up once
> since i got it, but i have only had it for about 3 months.. I have
> 13 yo twin boys and sometimes they have as many as 8 friends over...
> That's alot of traffic :)

Thanks for the info Linda. Once upon a time Zyxel had a really good name..
that was over 15 years ago tho.

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com
_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
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From lkateley at kateley.com  Tue May 13 08:33:24 2014
From: lkateley at kateley.com (Linda Kateley)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 08:33:24 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <20140512200236.GJ408@real-time.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>
 <536BB339.9060704@kateley.com> <20140512200236.GJ408@real-time.com>
Message-ID: <53721F24.6060803@kateley.com>

It could have been a one off..

I wish i could find one that was stable. My q1000 is flaky too, I think 
it might be the service though. About once a day I get really slow. I 
will run the qwest speedtest and will be down to 2.x mb(from 20). I run 
a business from my home and really wish I could find solid fast service. 
I tried comcast but they put stuff( didn't spend a lot of time looking 
at what they put) on my boxes. It made me feel ... yucky.  I pulled it 
out as soon as i found it.

linda


On 5/12/14, 3:02 PM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
> On 05/08 11:39 , Linda Kateley wrote:
>> Just a fyi, i have gone through 2 zyxel modems. They work well in
>> the beginning, but roll over when i have my kids and their friend
>> over. In both cases it can take the load for about 6 months, then..
>> I have to reboot every day or so.. I have an actiontec q1000 now
>> that i got on amazon, used for $40 and it has not seized up once
>> since i got it, but i have only had it for about 3 months.. I have
>> 13 yo twin boys and sometimes they have as many as 8 friends over...
>> That's alot of traffic :)
> Thanks for the info Linda. Once upon a time Zyxel had a really good name..
> that was over 15 years ago tho.
>


From tclug at beitsahour.net  Tue May 13 09:26:11 2014
From: tclug at beitsahour.net (Munir Nassar)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 09:26:11 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <53721F24.6060803@kateley.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com> <536BB339.9060704@kateley.com>
 <20140512200236.GJ408@real-time.com> <53721F24.6060803@kateley.com>
Message-ID: <CAMg8xavY7BFYNL2LSCX0wmhDVsr+Ju73SJDaXYSO_n=hcXvD9w@mail.gmail.com>

The problem with flaky routers is usually the limited amount of RAM
available to the routing table, my Actiontec M1000 has 14M available
and after some netflix streaming the router would routinely reboot or
lock up. I have since switched the router to transparent bridging mode
and do the PPPoE on my firewall and it has been rock solid 3 years
running now and supports multiple netflix streams.

In addition to the stability I also benefit from gaining access to an
additional IP address that would otherwise be wasted on the router and
I can do native IPv6 which my ISP supports.

On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 8:33 AM, Linda Kateley <lkateley at kateley.com> wrote:
> It could have been a one off..
>
> I wish i could find one that was stable. My q1000 is flaky too, I think it
> might be the service though. About once a day I get really slow. I will run
> the qwest speedtest and will be down to 2.x mb(from 20). I run a business
> from my home and really wish I could find solid fast service. I tried
> comcast but they put stuff( didn't spend a lot of time looking at what they
> put) on my boxes. It made me feel ... yucky.  I pulled it out as soon as i
> found it.
>
> linda
>
>
>
> On 5/12/14, 3:02 PM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
>>
>> On 05/08 11:39 , Linda Kateley wrote:
>>>
>>> Just a fyi, i have gone through 2 zyxel modems. They work well in
>>> the beginning, but roll over when i have my kids and their friend
>>> over. In both cases it can take the load for about 6 months, then..
>>> I have to reboot every day or so.. I have an actiontec q1000 now
>>> that i got on amazon, used for $40 and it has not seized up once
>>> since i got it, but i have only had it for about 3 months.. I have
>>> 13 yo twin boys and sometimes they have as many as 8 friends over...
>>> That's alot of traffic :)
>>
>> Thanks for the info Linda. Once upon a time Zyxel had a really good name..
>> that was over 15 years ago tho.
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

From tlunde at gmail.com  Tue May 13 10:56:29 2014
From: tlunde at gmail.com (T L)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 10:56:29 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <53721F24.6060803@kateley.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com> <536BB339.9060704@kateley.com>
 <20140512200236.GJ408@real-time.com> <53721F24.6060803@kateley.com>
Message-ID: <CAE0VmCzQpPGQAi5WwUOB6ukR2rraKrADLiOk+hEsc2Ues9tf0A@mail.gmail.com>

I had a pair of Zyxel routers that worked for 3-5 years before being
retired. Maybe the 330?

The Actiontec that CenturyLink provided with their 20/40 Mbit DSL service
in 2010 still works but I've always tried to keep the load (and heat) light
by keeping WiFi off and using an Apple TimeCapsule or Airport Express. Even
so, I have to reboot it every month or so. The connection degrades to a
crawl and then a reboot brings it back to life. The box reports fell speed
both before and after. I suspect a memory leak in the firmware.

I'm hoping that the Almond+ I ordered from Kickstarter turns up soon.

Thomas
 On May 13, 2014 9:33 AM, "Linda Kateley" <lkateley at kateley.com> wrote:

> It could have been a one off..
>
> I wish i could find one that was stable. My q1000 is flaky too, I think it
> might be the service though. About once a day I get really slow. I will run
> the qwest speedtest and will be down to 2.x mb(from 20). I run a business
> from my home and really wish I could find solid fast service. I tried
> comcast but they put stuff( didn't spend a lot of time looking at what they
> put) on my boxes. It made me feel ... yucky.  I pulled it out as soon as i
> found it.
>
> linda
>
>
> On 5/12/14, 3:02 PM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
>
>> On 05/08 11:39 , Linda Kateley wrote:
>>
>>> Just a fyi, i have gone through 2 zyxel modems. They work well in
>>> the beginning, but roll over when i have my kids and their friend
>>> over. In both cases it can take the load for about 6 months, then..
>>> I have to reboot every day or so.. I have an actiontec q1000 now
>>> that i got on amazon, used for $40 and it has not seized up once
>>> since i got it, but i have only had it for about 3 months.. I have
>>> 13 yo twin boys and sometimes they have as many as 8 friends over...
>>> That's alot of traffic :)
>>>
>> Thanks for the info Linda. Once upon a time Zyxel had a really good name..
>> that was over 15 years ago tho.
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From lkateley at kateley.com  Tue May 13 11:00:28 2014
From: lkateley at kateley.com (Linda Kateley)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 11:00:28 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <CAE0VmCzQpPGQAi5WwUOB6ukR2rraKrADLiOk+hEsc2Ues9tf0A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>
 <536BB339.9060704@kateley.com> <20140512200236.GJ408@real-time.com>
 <53721F24.6060803@kateley.com>
 <CAE0VmCzQpPGQAi5WwUOB6ukR2rraKrADLiOk+hEsc2Ues9tf0A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5372419C.4090500@kateley.com>

Let me know if your new one works!! would love to be stable.

lk


On 5/13/14, 10:56 AM, T L wrote:
>
> I had a pair of Zyxel routers that worked for 3-5 years before being 
> retired. Maybe the 330?
>
> The Actiontec that CenturyLink provided with their 20/40 Mbit DSL 
> service in 2010 still works but I've always tried to keep the load 
> (and heat) light by keeping WiFi off and using an Apple TimeCapsule or 
> Airport Express. Even so, I have to reboot it every month or so. The 
> connection degrades to a crawl and then a reboot brings it back to 
> life. The box reports fell speed both before and after. I suspect a 
> memory leak in the firmware.
>
> I'm hoping that the Almond+ I ordered from Kickstarter turns up soon.
>
> Thomas
>
> On May 13, 2014 9:33 AM, "Linda Kateley" <lkateley at kateley.com 
> <mailto:lkateley at kateley.com>> wrote:
>
>     It could have been a one off..
>
>     I wish i could find one that was stable. My q1000 is flaky too, I
>     think it might be the service though. About once a day I get
>     really slow. I will run the qwest speedtest and will be down to
>     2.x mb(from 20). I run a business from my home and really wish I
>     could find solid fast service. I tried comcast but they put stuff(
>     didn't spend a lot of time looking at what they put) on my boxes.
>     It made me feel ... yucky.  I pulled it out as soon as i found it.
>
>     linda
>
>
>     On 5/12/14, 3:02 PM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
>
>         On 05/08 11:39 , Linda Kateley wrote:
>
>             Just a fyi, i have gone through 2 zyxel modems. They work
>             well in
>             the beginning, but roll over when i have my kids and their
>             friend
>             over. In both cases it can take the load for about 6
>             months, then..
>             I have to reboot every day or so.. I have an actiontec
>             q1000 now
>             that i got on amazon, used for $40 and it has not seized
>             up once
>             since i got it, but i have only had it for about 3
>             months.. I have
>             13 yo twin boys and sometimes they have as many as 8
>             friends over...
>             That's alot of traffic :)
>
>         Thanks for the info Linda. Once upon a time Zyxel had a really
>         good name..
>         that was over 15 years ago tho.
>
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>     tclug-list at mn-linux.org <mailto:tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
>     http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From bbaptist at iexposure.com  Tue May 13 11:20:21 2014
From: bbaptist at iexposure.com (Bret Baptist)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 11:20:21 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>
Message-ID: <53724645.4010905@iexposure.com>


On 05/08/2014 11:29 AM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
> What do people recommend for a DSL router these days?
>
> Ideally, something that can be described to a person with limited technical
> ability such that they can go down to Best Buy or the like and buy there.
>
> Information about higher-end model that is more appropriate for technical
> users is also welcome.
>
> Just trying to get a survey of user experiences out there.

I purchased the D-Link DSL-520B at Microcenter awhile ago.  It has been 
by far the most stable that I have used with DSL.  I have had Zyxel, 
2Wire, Actiontec, and the old Cisco routers.  Recommended by me.

-- 
Bret Baptist
Senior Network Administrator
Internet Exposure
bbaptist at iexposure.com
(612) 676-1946 x117

Check out our blog: www.iexposure.com/blog
Follow us on Twitter: www.twitter.com/iexposure
Like us on Facebook www.facebook.com/iexposure
Connect on Linkedin: www.linkedin.com/company/internet-exposure

A Digital Agency Since 1995

From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Fri May 16 10:08:12 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 10:08:12 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
In-Reply-To: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405160928111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

This is about filename globbing, right?  First, for the parentheses to 
work, you need to have extended globbing turned on in the bash shell. 
This probably means that you have to turn it on in the script, if you are 
writing a script.  This is the command:

shopt -s extglob

More info:

http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/bash-extended-globbing

I did this so that I could test some patterns:

mkdir test
cd test
touch messages syslog anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz

Using echo or ls does basically the same thing:

echo !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)

echo !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)

I see the same thing that you see:

$ ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
messages  syslog  syslog.2.gz

$ ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
messages  syslog

I don't often use the !() syntax, so it's nice to be reminded of it.
So  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*) matches syslog.2.gz like this:

   !(*.)s  *  s  *       g   !(*.*)
        s  y  s  log.2.  g   z

So the g in the pattern is matching with the g in gz, not the g in log.

It's hard to say what you are shooting for here.  That is, what else do 
you want to match in addition to the two exact filenames?  If I just 
wanted the two filenames, I might do this:

{syslog,messages}

Mike


On Sat, 10 May 2014, gregrwm wrote:

> ok you bashers, check me on this:
>
> matches wanted:  messages syslog
> matches not wanted:  anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
> pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
> pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz syslog.4.gz
> pattern2:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
> pattern2 match results:  messages syslog
>
> so pattern2 works.  but is that pattern1 result a bug?
>

From blutgens at gmail.com  Fri May 16 10:27:32 2014
From: blutgens at gmail.com (Ben)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 10:27:32 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405160928111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405160928111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <CANoiwe6K6xOu+Pg_Pea_uJv9CCLsSfncKDuUjF0er=Jf7fOgMg@mail.gmail.com>

Try this "/var/log/{messages,syslog}.?"


On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 10:08 AM, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:

> This is about filename globbing, right?  First, for the parentheses to
> work, you need to have extended globbing turned on in the bash shell. This
> probably means that you have to turn it on in the script, if you are
> writing a script.  This is the command:
>
> shopt -s extglob
>
> More info:
>
> http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/bash-extended-globbing
>
> I did this so that I could test some patterns:
>
> mkdir test
> cd test
> touch messages syslog anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
>
> Using echo or ls does basically the same thing:
>
> echo !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
> ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>
> echo !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
> ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
>
> I see the same thing that you see:
>
> $ ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
> messages  syslog  syslog.2.gz
>
> $ ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
> messages  syslog
>
> I don't often use the !() syntax, so it's nice to be reminded of it.
> So  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*) matches syslog.2.gz like this:
>
>   !(*.)s  *  s  *       g   !(*.*)
>        s  y  s  log.2.  g   z
>
> So the g in the pattern is matching with the g in gz, not the g in log.
>
> It's hard to say what you are shooting for here.  That is, what else do
> you want to match in addition to the two exact filenames?  If I just wanted
> the two filenames, I might do this:
>
> {syslog,messages}
>
> Mike
>
>
> On Sat, 10 May 2014, gregrwm wrote:
>
>  ok you bashers, check me on this:
>>
>> matches wanted:  messages syslog
>> matches not wanted:  anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
>> pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>> pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz
>> syslog.4.gz
>> pattern2:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
>> pattern2 match results:  messages syslog
>>
>> so pattern2 works.  but is that pattern1 result a bug?
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>



-- 
Ben Lutgens
Linux / Unix System Administrator

Three of your friends throw up after eating chicken salad.  Do you think:
"I should find more robust friends" or "we should check that refrigerator"?
       -- Donald Becker, on vortex-bug, suspecting a network-wide problem
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Fri May 16 12:11:28 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 12:11:28 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
In-Reply-To: <CANoiwe6K6xOu+Pg_Pea_uJv9CCLsSfncKDuUjF0er=Jf7fOgMg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405160928111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <CANoiwe6K6xOu+Pg_Pea_uJv9CCLsSfncKDuUjF0er=Jf7fOgMg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405161211080.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

In order to achieve what?


On Fri, 16 May 2014, Ben wrote:

> Try this "/var/log/{messages,syslog}.?"
>
>
> On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 10:08 AM, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> This is about filename globbing, right?  First, for the parentheses to
>> work, you need to have extended globbing turned on in the bash shell. This
>> probably means that you have to turn it on in the script, if you are
>> writing a script.  This is the command:
>>
>> shopt -s extglob
>>
>> More info:
>>
>> http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/bash-extended-globbing
>>
>> I did this so that I could test some patterns:
>>
>> mkdir test
>> cd test
>> touch messages syslog anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
>>
>> Using echo or ls does basically the same thing:
>>
>> echo !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>> ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>>
>> echo !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
>> ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
>>
>> I see the same thing that you see:
>>
>> $ ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>> messages  syslog  syslog.2.gz
>>
>> $ ls !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
>> messages  syslog
>>
>> I don't often use the !() syntax, so it's nice to be reminded of it.
>> So  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*) matches syslog.2.gz like this:
>>
>>   !(*.)s  *  s  *       g   !(*.*)
>>        s  y  s  log.2.  g   z
>>
>> So the g in the pattern is matching with the g in gz, not the g in log.
>>
>> It's hard to say what you are shooting for here.  That is, what else do
>> you want to match in addition to the two exact filenames?  If I just wanted
>> the two filenames, I might do this:
>>
>> {syslog,messages}
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 10 May 2014, gregrwm wrote:
>>
>>  ok you bashers, check me on this:
>>>
>>> matches wanted:  messages syslog
>>> matches not wanted:  anaconda.syslog messages.1 syslog.1 syslog.2.gz
>>> pattern1:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*.*)
>>> pattern1 match results:  messages syslog syslog.2.gz syslog.3.gz
>>> syslog.4.gz
>>> pattern2:  !(*.)s*s*g!(*1|*z)
>>> pattern2 match results:  messages syslog
>>>
>>> so pattern2 works.  but is that pattern1 result a bug?
>>>
>>>  _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Ben Lutgens
> Linux / Unix System Administrator
>
> Three of your friends throw up after eating chicken salad.  Do you think:
> "I should find more robust friends" or "we should check that refrigerator"?
>       -- Donald Becker, on vortex-bug, suspecting a network-wide problem
>

From tclug1 at whitleymott.net  Fri May 16 13:57:50 2014
From: tclug1 at whitleymott.net (gregrwm)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 13:57:50 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405160928111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405160928111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <CAD+dB9CrhXvUDBMo+-YGk69hxHhzMiyXRiE4SWWMvPLMq6ZuHw@mail.gmail.com>

On 10 May 2014 13:55, gregrwm <tclug1 at whitleymott.net> wrote:

> ...no way to specify shortest match for s*s*g afaik.  anyway a better
> pattern is *(messages|syslog)
>

On 16 May 2014 10:08, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:

> ...It's hard to say what you are shooting for here.
>

sorry for not being more clear, my post above was meant as "SOLVED", albeit
i would be glad to learn a way to specify shortest match.
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sat May 17 02:28:15 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sat, 17 May 2014 02:28:15 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] match messages and syslog but not syslog.?.gz
In-Reply-To: <CAD+dB9CrhXvUDBMo+-YGk69hxHhzMiyXRiE4SWWMvPLMq6ZuHw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD+dB9BYSOvZ3b1+a3WzpqoExe8B-6uNLWonV7fz=Lvqpo7Ykw@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405160928111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
 <CAD+dB9CrhXvUDBMo+-YGk69hxHhzMiyXRiE4SWWMvPLMq6ZuHw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405170227111.19447@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Fri, 16 May 2014, gregrwm wrote:

> On 10 May 2014 13:55, gregrwm <tclug1 at whitleymott.net> wrote:
>
>> ...no way to specify shortest match for s*s*g afaik.  anyway a better
>> pattern is *(messages|syslog)
>>
>
> On 16 May 2014 10:08, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> ...It's hard to say what you are shooting for here.
>>
>
> sorry for not being more clear, my post above was meant as "SOLVED", albeit
> i would be glad to learn a way to specify shortest match.

I really only do this to learn things.  If I can solve a problem, that's 
good too, but the bigger problem I want to solve is that I don't know what 
I'm doing.  ;-)

Mike

From jpschewe at mtu.net  Sun May 18 10:11:33 2014
From: jpschewe at mtu.net (Jon Schewe)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 10:11:33 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Free old computers
Message-ID: <CALpcnoyDDcOKToQzz2K9bgaoWvH6PoZyrZuoFAjFBj5PL-BRPA@mail.gmail.com>

Free to anyone that's interested. Either will work reasonably well as a
router. Call 612-210-8818.

Compaq desk pro
pentium 2 450
256MB ram
4GB disk
19 CRT

Tower
Pentium 3 500
768 MB ram
4GB drive
promise sata card

-- 
http://mtu.net/~jpschewe
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 20:22:29 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 20:22:29 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>

Hi all,

Ok, so a while ago for some reason quotemarks in my terminal window have 
been replaced by weird characters. Like right now I'm running a cp -v, and 
the results look like this:

 	?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? -> 
?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?

Normally that used to be surrounded by single-quotes. Now it's that weird 
mess that I'm not even sure will display correctly in everyone else's 
email.


Pretty sure it's a locale setting but since I've never messed with that, I 
have no idea what to look for. Anyone?

From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 20:38:35 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 20:38:35 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>

Followup, naturally when I look at that email using OS X's built-in 
terminal, those look like wrapped-quotes. My xterm in Linux, though, just 
shows junk. So I'm assuming this is a unicode thing and I need to tell my 
Linux system to cut that out. Ideas?

On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Ok, so a while ago for some reason quotemarks in my terminal window have been 
> replaced by weird characters. Like right now I'm running a cp -v, and the 
> results look like this:
>
> 	?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? -> 
> ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>
> Normally that used to be surrounded by single-quotes. Now it's that weird 
> mess that I'm not even sure will display correctly in everyone else's email.
>
>
> Pretty sure it's a locale setting but since I've never messed with that, I 
> have no idea what to look for. Anyone?

From jake.vath at gmail.com  Sun May 18 20:43:49 2014
From: jake.vath at gmail.com (Jake Vath)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 20:43:49 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>

Do you have uxterm installed?
I thought uxterm had unicode support.

-> Jake
On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> Followup, naturally when I look at that email using OS X's built-in
> terminal, those look like wrapped-quotes. My xterm in Linux, though, just
> shows junk. So I'm assuming this is a unicode thing and I need to tell my
> Linux system to cut that out. Ideas?
>
> On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:
>
>  Hi all,
>>
>> Ok, so a while ago for some reason quotemarks in my terminal window have
>> been replaced by weird characters. Like right now I'm running a cp -v, and
>> the results look like this:
>>
>>         ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>> ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>>
>> Normally that used to be surrounded by single-quotes. Now it's that weird
>> mess that I'm not even sure will display correctly in everyone else's email.
>>
>>
>> Pretty sure it's a locale setting but since I've never messed with that,
>> I have no idea what to look for. Anyone?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 20:47:02 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 20:47:02 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>

I might, but I actually use aterm, and I'm not switching away from it 
because nothing else has all the cute nice features I want (:

Basically I want to tell the thing to stop with the unicode.

On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:

> 
> Do you have uxterm installed?
> I thought uxterm had unicode support.
> 
> -> Jake
> 
> On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>       Followup, naturally when I look at that email using OS X's
>       built-in terminal, those look like wrapped-quotes. My xterm in
>       Linux, though, just shows junk. So I'm assuming this is a
>       unicode thing and I need to tell my Linux system to cut that
>       out. Ideas?
>
>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:
>
>             Hi all,
>
>             Ok, so a while ago for some reason quotemarks in my
>             terminal window have been replaced by weird
>             characters. Like right now I'm running a cp -v, and
>             the results look like this:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>             ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>
>             Normally that used to be surrounded by
>             single-quotes. Now it's that weird mess that I'm not
>             even sure will display correctly in everyone else's
>             email.
> 
>
>             Pretty sure it's a locale setting but since I've
>             never messed with that, I have no idea what to look
>             for. Anyone?
> 
>
>       _______________________________________________
>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>

From jake.vath at gmail.com  Sun May 18 20:57:58 2014
From: jake.vath at gmail.com (Jake Vath)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 20:57:58 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>

Hmm, I have not done much with aterm.
What does the output of *locale* give you?

-> Jake

On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> I might, but I actually use aterm, and I'm not switching away from it
> because nothing else has all the cute nice features I want (:
>
> Basically I want to tell the thing to stop with the unicode.
>
> On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>
>> Do you have uxterm installed?
>> I thought uxterm had unicode support.
>>
>> -> Jake
>>
>> On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>       Followup, naturally when I look at that email using OS X's
>>       built-in terminal, those look like wrapped-quotes. My xterm in
>>       Linux, though, just shows junk. So I'm assuming this is a
>>       unicode thing and I need to tell my Linux system to cut that
>>       out. Ideas?
>>
>>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:
>>
>>             Hi all,
>>
>>             Ok, so a while ago for some reason quotemarks in my
>>             terminal window have been replaced by weird
>>             characters. Like right now I'm running a cp -v, and
>>             the results look like this:
>>
>>                     ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>>             ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>>
>>             Normally that used to be surrounded by
>>             single-quotes. Now it's that weird mess that I'm not
>>             even sure will display correctly in everyone else's
>>             email.
>>
>>
>>             Pretty sure it's a locale setting but since I've
>>             never messed with that, I have no idea what to look
>>             for. Anyone?
>>
>>
>>       _______________________________________________
>>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 21:04:35 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 21:04:35 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>

sterling at dragon:/home/sterling> locale
LANG=en_US.UTF-8
LANGUAGE=
LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_ALL=


(and yeah, it does work with uxterm).


On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:

> Hmm, I have not done much with aterm.
> What does the output of locale give you?
> 
> -> Jake
> 
> On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>       I might, but I actually use aterm, and I'm not switching away
>       from it because nothing else has all the cute nice features I
>       want (:
>
>       Basically I want to tell the thing to stop with the unicode.
>
>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
> 
>
>             Do you have uxterm installed?
>             I thought uxterm had unicode support.
>
>             -> Jake
>
>             On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>             wrote:
>             ? ? ? Followup, naturally when I look at that email
>             using OS X's
>             ? ? ? built-in terminal, those look like
>             wrapped-quotes. My xterm in
>             ? ? ? Linux, though, just shows junk. So I'm
>             assuming this is a
>             ? ? ? unicode thing and I need to tell my Linux
>             system to cut that
>             ? ? ? out. Ideas?
>
>             ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com
>             wrote:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Hi all,
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Ok, so a while ago for some reason
>             quotemarks in my
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? terminal window have been replaced by
>             weird
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? characters. Like right now I'm running a
>             cp -v, and
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? the results look like this:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Normally that used to be surrounded by
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? single-quotes. Now it's that weird mess
>             that I'm not
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? even sure will display correctly in
>             everyone else's
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? email.
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Pretty sure it's a locale setting but
>             since I've
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? never messed with that, I have no idea
>             what to look
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? for. Anyone?
> 
>
>             ? ? ?
>             _______________________________________________
>             ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>             Minnesota
>             ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>             ? ? ?
>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>
>       _______________________________________________
>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>

From jake.vath at gmail.com  Sun May 18 21:31:16 2014
From: jake.vath at gmail.com (Jake Vath)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 21:31:16 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>

The output of *locale *looks fine and I'm guessing your */etc/local.gen*and
*/etc/locale.alias* are set up correctly.
I'm not sure there is much you can do, as I couldn't find anything about
aterm's unicode support.

-> Jake




On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> sterling at dragon:/home/sterling> locale
> LANG=en_US.UTF-8
> LANGUAGE=
> LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
> LC_ALL=
>
>
> (and yeah, it does work with uxterm).
>
>
>
> On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>  Hmm, I have not done much with aterm.
>> What does the output of locale give you?
>>
>> -> Jake
>>
>> On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>       I might, but I actually use aterm, and I'm not switching away
>>       from it because nothing else has all the cute nice features I
>>       want (:
>>
>>       Basically I want to tell the thing to stop with the unicode.
>>
>>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>
>>             Do you have uxterm installed?
>>             I thought uxterm had unicode support.
>>
>>             -> Jake
>>
>>             On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>             wrote:
>>                   Followup, naturally when I look at that email
>>             using OS X's
>>                   built-in terminal, those look like
>>             wrapped-quotes. My xterm in
>>                   Linux, though, just shows junk. So I'm
>>             assuming this is a
>>                   unicode thing and I need to tell my Linux
>>             system to cut that
>>                   out. Ideas?
>>
>>                   On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com
>>             wrote:
>>
>>                         Hi all,
>>
>>                         Ok, so a while ago for some reason
>>             quotemarks in my
>>                         terminal window have been replaced by
>>             weird
>>                         characters. Like right now I'm running a
>>             cp -v, and
>>                         the results look like this:
>>
>>
>>             ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>>                         ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>>
>>                         Normally that used to be surrounded by
>>                         single-quotes. Now it's that weird mess
>>             that I'm not
>>                         even sure will display correctly in
>>             everyone else's
>>                         email.
>>
>>
>>                         Pretty sure it's a locale setting but
>>             since I've
>>                         never messed with that, I have no idea
>>             what to look
>>                         for. Anyone?
>>
>>
>>
>>             _______________________________________________
>>                   TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>             Minnesota
>>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>
>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>       _______________________________________________
>>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 21:46:17 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 21:46:17 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>

I'm not trying to get aterm to support unicode. Hmm. I wonder if I can 
remember what the pre-unicode locale used to be... iso-8859-1 was it?...

On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:

> The output of locale looks fine and I'm guessing your /etc/local.gen and
> /etc/locale.alias are set up correctly.
> I'm not sure there is much you can do, as I couldn't find anything about
> aterm's unicode support.
> 
> -> Jake
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>       sterling at dragon:/home/sterling> locale
>       LANG=en_US.UTF-8
>       LANGUAGE=
>       LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
>       LC_ALL=
> 
>
>       (and yeah, it does work with uxterm).
> 
>
>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>             Hmm, I have not done much with aterm.
>             What does the output of locale give you?
>
>             -> Jake
>
>             On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>             wrote:
>             ? ? ? I might, but I actually use aterm, and I'm not
>             switching away
>             ? ? ? from it because nothing else has all the cute
>             nice features I
>             ? ? ? want (:
>
>             ? ? ? Basically I want to tell the thing to stop
>             with the unicode.
>
>             ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Do you have uxterm installed?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? I thought uxterm had unicode support.
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? -> Jake
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM,
>             <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Followup, naturally when I look at
>             that email
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? using OS X's
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? built-in terminal, those look like
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? wrapped-quotes. My xterm in
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Linux, though, just shows junk. So
>             I'm
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? assuming this is a
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? unicode thing and I need to tell
>             my Linux
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? system to cut that
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? out. Ideas?
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014,
>             tclug at freakzilla.com
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hi all,
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Ok, so a while ago for some
>             reason
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? quotemarks in my
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? terminal window have been
>             replaced by
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? weird
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? characters. Like right now
>             I'm running a
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? cp -v, and
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? the results look like this:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Normally that used to be
>             surrounded by
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? single-quotes. Now it's that
>             weird mess
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? that I'm not
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? even sure will display
>             correctly in
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? everyone else's
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? email.
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Pretty sure it's a locale
>             setting but
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? since I've
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? never messed with that, I
>             have no idea
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? what to look
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? for. Anyone?
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             _______________________________________________
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List -
>             Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Minnesota
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>
>             ? ? ?
>             _______________________________________________
>             ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>             Minnesota
>             ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>             ? ? ?
>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
> 
>

From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 21:55:53 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 21:55:53 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182153190.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>

Yeah, this in .tcshrc seems to have worked:

 	setenv LC_CTYPE en_US.ISO-8859-1
 	setenv LANG en_US.ISO-8859-1


On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:

> I'm not trying to get aterm to support unicode. Hmm. I wonder if I can 
> remember what the pre-unicode locale used to be... iso-8859-1 was it?...
>
> On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>> The output of locale looks fine and I'm guessing your /etc/local.gen and
>> /etc/locale.alias are set up correctly.
>> I'm not sure there is much you can do, as I couldn't find anything about
>> aterm's unicode support.
>> 
>> -> Jake
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>       sterling at dragon:/home/sterling> locale
>>       LANG=en_US.UTF-8
>>       LANGUAGE=
>>       LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
>>       LC_ALL=
>> 
>>
>>       (and yeah, it does work with uxterm).
>> 
>>
>>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>             Hmm, I have not done much with aterm.
>>             What does the output of locale give you?
>>
>>             -> Jake
>>
>>             On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>             wrote:
>>             ? ? ? I might, but I actually use aterm, and I'm not
>>             switching away
>>             ? ? ? from it because nothing else has all the cute
>>             nice features I
>>             ? ? ? want (:
>>
>>             ? ? ? Basically I want to tell the thing to stop
>>             with the unicode.
>>
>>             ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>> 
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Do you have uxterm installed?
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? I thought uxterm had unicode support.
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? -> Jake
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM,
>>             <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Followup, naturally when I look at
>>             that email
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? using OS X's
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? built-in terminal, those look like
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? wrapped-quotes. My xterm in
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Linux, though, just shows junk. So
>>             I'm
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? assuming this is a
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? unicode thing and I need to tell
>>             my Linux
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? system to cut that
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? out. Ideas?
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014,
>>             tclug at freakzilla.com
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hi all,
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Ok, so a while ago for some
>>             reason
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? quotemarks in my
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? terminal window have been
>>             replaced by
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? weird
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? characters. Like right now
>>             I'm running a
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? cp -v, and
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? the results look like this:
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>>             ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Normally that used to be
>>             surrounded by
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? single-quotes. Now it's that
>>             weird mess
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? that I'm not
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? even sure will display
>>             correctly in
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? everyone else's
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? email.
>> 
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Pretty sure it's a locale
>>             setting but
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? since I've
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? never messed with that, I
>>             have no idea
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? what to look
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? for. Anyone?
>> 
>>
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ?
>>             _______________________________________________
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List -
>>             Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? Minnesota
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>>             ? ? ? ? ? ?
>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>> 
>> 
>>
>>             ? ? ?
>>             _______________________________________________
>>             ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>             Minnesota
>>             ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>             ? ? ?
>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>> 
>> 
>> 
>

From jake.vath at gmail.com  Sun May 18 21:57:52 2014
From: jake.vath at gmail.com (Jake Vath)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 21:57:52 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182153190.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182153190.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <CAMeWMmi942uj2J1CwrXYnkQUf8cOCrsSasW9npi1Xu-L4cfG4Q@mail.gmail.com>

So everything displays correctly now?

-> Jake
On May 18, 2014 9:56 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> Yeah, this in .tcshrc seems to have worked:
>
>         setenv LC_CTYPE en_US.ISO-8859-1
>         setenv LANG en_US.ISO-8859-1
>
>
> On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:
>
>  I'm not trying to get aterm to support unicode. Hmm. I wonder if I can
>> remember what the pre-unicode locale used to be... iso-8859-1 was it?...
>>
>> On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>  The output of locale looks fine and I'm guessing your /etc/local.gen and
>>> /etc/locale.alias are set up correctly.
>>> I'm not sure there is much you can do, as I couldn't find anything about
>>> aterm's unicode support.
>>>
>>> -> Jake
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>>       sterling at dragon:/home/sterling> locale
>>>       LANG=en_US.UTF-8
>>>       LANGUAGE=
>>>       LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
>>>       LC_ALL=
>>>
>>>
>>>       (and yeah, it does work with uxterm).
>>>
>>>
>>>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>>
>>>             Hmm, I have not done much with aterm.
>>>             What does the output of locale give you?
>>>
>>>             -> Jake
>>>
>>>             On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>>             wrote:
>>>                   I might, but I actually use aterm, and I'm not
>>>             switching away
>>>                   from it because nothing else has all the cute
>>>             nice features I
>>>                   want (:
>>>
>>>                   Basically I want to tell the thing to stop
>>>             with the unicode.
>>>
>>>                   On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>                         Do you have uxterm installed?
>>>                         I thought uxterm had unicode support.
>>>
>>>                         -> Jake
>>>
>>>                         On May 18, 2014 8:39 PM,
>>>             <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>>                         wrote:
>>>                               Followup, naturally when I look at
>>>             that email
>>>                         using OS X's
>>>                               built-in terminal, those look like
>>>                         wrapped-quotes. My xterm in
>>>                               Linux, though, just shows junk. So
>>>             I'm
>>>                         assuming this is a
>>>                               unicode thing and I need to tell
>>>             my Linux
>>>                         system to cut that
>>>                               out. Ideas?
>>>
>>>                               On Sun, 18 May 2014,
>>>             tclug at freakzilla.com
>>>                         wrote:
>>>
>>>                                     Hi all,
>>>
>>>                                     Ok, so a while ago for some
>>>             reason
>>>                         quotemarks in my
>>>                                     terminal window have been
>>>             replaced by
>>>                         weird
>>>                                     characters. Like right now
>>>             I'm running a
>>>                         cp -v, and
>>>                                     the results look like this:
>>>
>>>
>>>                         ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>>>
>>>             ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>>>
>>>                                     Normally that used to be
>>>             surrounded by
>>>                                     single-quotes. Now it's that
>>>             weird mess
>>>                         that I'm not
>>>                                     even sure will display
>>>             correctly in
>>>                         everyone else's
>>>                                     email.
>>>
>>>
>>>                                     Pretty sure it's a locale
>>>             setting but
>>>                         since I've
>>>                                     never messed with that, I
>>>             have no idea
>>>                         what to look
>>>                                     for. Anyone?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>             _______________________________________________
>>>                               TCLUG Mailing List -
>>>             Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>>                         Minnesota
>>>                               tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>>
>>>
>>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>             _______________________________________________
>>>                   TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>>             Minnesota
>>>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>>
>>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 22:12:38 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 22:12:38 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <CAMeWMmi942uj2J1CwrXYnkQUf8cOCrsSasW9npi1Xu-L4cfG4Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182153190.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmi942uj2J1CwrXYnkQUf8cOCrsSasW9npi1Xu-L4cfG4Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182212170.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>

Yup, it's using regular ' things instead of super-fantastic unicode 
wrap-quotes.


On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:

> 
> So everything displays correctly now?
> 
> -> Jake
> 
> On May 18, 2014 9:56 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>       Yeah, this in .tcshrc seems to have worked:
>
>       ? ? ? ? setenv LC_CTYPE en_US.ISO-8859-1
>       ? ? ? ? setenv LANG en_US.ISO-8859-1
> 
>
>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:
>
>             I'm not trying to get aterm to support unicode. Hmm.
>             I wonder if I can remember what the pre-unicode
>             locale used to be... iso-8859-1 was it?...
>
>             On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>                   The output of locale looks fine and I'm
>                   guessing your /etc/local.gen and
>                   /etc/locale.alias are set up correctly.
>                   I'm not sure there is much you can do,
>                   as I couldn't find anything about
>                   aterm's unicode support.
>
>                   -> Jake
> 
> 
> 
>
>                   On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM,
>                   <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>                   ? ? ? sterling at dragon:/home/sterling>
>                   locale
>                   ? ? ? LANG=en_US.UTF-8
>                   ? ? ? LANGUAGE=
>                   ? ? ? LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
>                   ? ? ? LC_ALL=
> 
>
>                   ? ? ? (and yeah, it does work with
>                   uxterm).
> 
>
>                   ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath
>                   wrote:
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? Hmm, I have not done much
>                   with aterm.
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? What does the output of
>                   locale give you?
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? -> Jake
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM,
>                   <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I might, but I
>                   actually use aterm, and I'm not
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? switching away
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? from it because
>                   nothing else has all the cute
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? nice features I
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? want (:
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Basically I want to
>                   tell the thing to stop
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? with the unicode.
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014,
>                   Jake Vath wrote:
> 
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Do you have
>                   uxterm installed?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I thought uxterm
>                   had unicode support.
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -> Jake
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On May 18, 2014
>                   8:39 PM,
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Followup,
>                   naturally when I look at
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? that email
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? using OS X's
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? built-in
>                   terminal, those look like
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? wrapped-quotes.
>                   My xterm in
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Linux,
>                   though, just shows junk. So
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? I'm
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? assuming this is
>                   a
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? unicode
>                   thing and I need to tell
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? my Linux
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? system to cut
>                   that
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? out.
>                   Ideas?
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, 18
>                   May 2014,
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? tclug at freakzilla.com
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hi
>                   all,
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Ok,
>                   so a while ago for some
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? reason
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? quotemarks in my
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   terminal window have been
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? replaced by
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? weird
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   characters. Like right now
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? I'm running a
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? cp -v, and
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? the
>                   results look like this:
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   Normally that used to be
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? surrounded by
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   single-quotes. Now it's that
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? weird mess
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? that I'm not
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? even
>                   sure will display
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? correctly in
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? everyone else's
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   email.
> 
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   Pretty sure it's a locale
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? setting but
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? since I've
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   never messed with that, I
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? have no idea
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? what to look
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? for.
>                   Anyone?
> 
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   _______________________________________________
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? TCLUG
>                   Mailing List -
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Minnesota
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   _______________________________________________
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List -
>                   Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? Minnesota
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   ? ? ? ? ? ?
>                   http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>
>                   _______________________________________________
>                   TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St.
>                   Paul, Minnesota
>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>                   http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
> 
>
>       _______________________________________________
>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>

From jake.vath at gmail.com  Sun May 18 22:14:15 2014
From: jake.vath at gmail.com (Jake Vath)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 22:14:15 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182212170.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182153190.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmi942uj2J1CwrXYnkQUf8cOCrsSasW9npi1Xu-L4cfG4Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182212170.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <CAMeWMmi13aXAndXKURj62LFTVQFTbrc2wq+XNVw7qtsYpYVw-A@mail.gmail.com>

Nicely done!

->  Jake
On May 18, 2014 10:13 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> Yup, it's using regular ' things instead of super-fantastic unicode
> wrap-quotes.
>
>
> On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>
>> So everything displays correctly now?
>>
>> -> Jake
>>
>> On May 18, 2014 9:56 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>       Yeah, this in .tcshrc seems to have worked:
>>
>>               setenv LC_CTYPE en_US.ISO-8859-1
>>               setenv LANG en_US.ISO-8859-1
>>
>>
>>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com wrote:
>>
>>             I'm not trying to get aterm to support unicode. Hmm.
>>             I wonder if I can remember what the pre-unicode
>>             locale used to be... iso-8859-1 was it?...
>>
>>             On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>                   The output of locale looks fine and I'm
>>                   guessing your /etc/local.gen and
>>                   /etc/locale.alias are set up correctly.
>>                   I'm not sure there is much you can do,
>>                   as I couldn't find anything about
>>                   aterm's unicode support.
>>
>>                   -> Jake
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                   On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM,
>>                   <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>                         sterling at dragon:/home/sterling>
>>                   locale
>>                         LANG=en_US.UTF-8
>>                         LANGUAGE=
>>                         LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                         LC_ALL=
>>
>>
>>                         (and yeah, it does work with
>>                   uxterm).
>>
>>
>>                         On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath
>>                   wrote:
>>
>>                               Hmm, I have not done much
>>                   with aterm.
>>                               What does the output of
>>                   locale give you?
>>
>>                               -> Jake
>>
>>                               On May 18, 2014 8:47 PM,
>>                   <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>                               wrote:
>>                                     I might, but I
>>                   actually use aterm, and I'm not
>>                               switching away
>>                                     from it because
>>                   nothing else has all the cute
>>                               nice features I
>>                                     want (:
>>
>>                                     Basically I want to
>>                   tell the thing to stop
>>                               with the unicode.
>>
>>                                     On Sun, 18 May 2014,
>>                   Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>
>>                                           Do you have
>>                   uxterm installed?
>>                                           I thought uxterm
>>                   had unicode support.
>>
>>                                           -> Jake
>>
>>                                           On May 18, 2014
>>                   8:39 PM,
>>                               <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>                                           wrote:
>>                                                 Followup,
>>                   naturally when I look at
>>                               that email
>>                                           using OS X's
>>                                                 built-in
>>                   terminal, those look like
>>                                           wrapped-quotes.
>>                   My xterm in
>>                                                 Linux,
>>                   though, just shows junk. So
>>                               I'm
>>                                           assuming this is
>>                   a
>>                                                 unicode
>>                   thing and I need to tell
>>                               my Linux
>>                                           system to cut
>>                   that
>>                                                 out.
>>                   Ideas?
>>
>>                                                 On Sun, 18
>>                   May 2014,
>>                               tclug at freakzilla.com
>>                                           wrote:
>>
>>                                                       Hi
>>                   all,
>>
>>                                                       Ok,
>>                   so a while ago for some
>>                               reason
>>                                           quotemarks in my
>>
>>                   terminal window have been
>>                               replaced by
>>                                           weird
>>
>>                   characters. Like right now
>>                               I'm running a
>>                                           cp -v, and
>>                                                       the
>>                   results look like this:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                   ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>>
>>
>>                   ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>>
>>
>>                   Normally that used to be
>>                               surrounded by
>>
>>                   single-quotes. Now it's that
>>                               weird mess
>>                                           that I'm not
>>                                                       even
>>                   sure will display
>>                               correctly in
>>                                           everyone else's
>>
>>                   email.
>>
>>
>>
>>                   Pretty sure it's a locale
>>                               setting but
>>                                           since I've
>>
>>                   never messed with that, I
>>                               have no idea
>>                                           what to look
>>                                                       for.
>>                   Anyone?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                   _______________________________________________
>>                                                 TCLUG
>>                   Mailing List -
>>                               Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>                                           Minnesota
>>
>>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>
>>
>>
>>                   http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                   _______________________________________________
>>                                     TCLUG Mailing List -
>>                   Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>                               Minnesota
>>
>>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>
>>
>>                   http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>                   _______________________________________________
>>                   TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St.
>>                   Paul, Minnesota
>>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>                   http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>       _______________________________________________
>>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sun May 18 22:15:34 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 22:15:34 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <CAMeWMmi13aXAndXKURj62LFTVQFTbrc2wq+XNVw7qtsYpYVw-A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182153190.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmi942uj2J1CwrXYnkQUf8cOCrsSasW9npi1Xu-L4cfG4Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182212170.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmi13aXAndXKURj62LFTVQFTbrc2wq+XNVw7qtsYpYVw-A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182215250.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>

Thanks for the help! (:

On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:

> 
> Nicely done!
> 
> ->? Jake
> 
> On May 18, 2014 10:13 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>       Yup, it's using regular ' things instead of super-fantastic
>       unicode wrap-quotes.
> 
>
>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
> 
>
>             So everything displays correctly now?
>
>             -> Jake
>
>             On May 18, 2014 9:56 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>             wrote:
>             ? ? ? Yeah, this in .tcshrc seems to have worked:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? setenv LC_CTYPE en_US.ISO-8859-1
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? setenv LANG en_US.ISO-8859-1
> 
>
>             ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com
>             wrote:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? I'm not trying to get aterm to support
>             unicode. Hmm.
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? I wonder if I can remember what the
>             pre-unicode
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? locale used to be... iso-8859-1 was
>             it?...
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? The output of locale looks fine
>             and I'm
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? guessing your /etc/local.gen and
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? /etc/locale.alias are set up
>             correctly.
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I'm not sure there is much you can
>             do,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? as I couldn't find anything about
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? aterm's unicode support.
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -> Jake
> 
> 
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             sterling at dragon:/home/sterling>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? locale
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LANG=en_US.UTF-8
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LANGUAGE=
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? LC_ALL=
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? (and yeah, it does work with
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? uxterm).
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake
>             Vath
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hmm, I have not done
>             much
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? with aterm.
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? What does the output
>             of
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? locale give you?
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -> Jake
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On May 18, 2014 8:47
>             PM,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I might, but I
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? actually use aterm, and I'm not
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? switching away
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? from it because
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? nothing else has all the cute
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? nice features I
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? want (:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Basically I want
>             to
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? tell the thing to stop
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? with the unicode.
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On Sun, 18 May
>             2014,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Jake Vath wrote:
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Do you
>             have
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? uxterm installed?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I thought
>             uxterm
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? had unicode support.
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -> Jake
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On May 18,
>             2014
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 8:39 PM,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             Followup,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? naturally when I look at
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? that email
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? using OS
>             X's
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             built-in
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? terminal, those look like
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             wrapped-quotes.
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? My xterm in
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             Linux,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? though, just shows junk. So
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I'm
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? assuming
>             this is
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? a
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             unicode
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? thing and I need to tell
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? my Linux
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? system to
>             cut
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? that
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? out.
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Ideas?
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? On
>             Sun, 18
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? May 2014,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? tclug at freakzilla.com
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? wrote:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? Hi
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? all,
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? Ok,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? so a while ago for some
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? reason
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? quotemarks
>             in my
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? terminal window have been
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? replaced by
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? weird
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? characters. Like right now
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? I'm running a
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? cp -v, and
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? the
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? results look like this:
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Normally that used to be
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? surrounded by
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? single-quotes. Now it's that
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? weird mess
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? that I'm
>             not
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? even
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? sure will display
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? correctly in
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? everyone
>             else's
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? email.
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Pretty sure it's a locale
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? setting but
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? since I've
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? never messed with that, I
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? have no idea
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? what to
>             look
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? for.
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Anyone?
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             _______________________________________________
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             TCLUG
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Mailing List -
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Minnesota
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             _______________________________________________
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing
>             List -
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Minnesota
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             _______________________________________________
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List -
>             Minneapolis/St.
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Paul, Minnesota
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>             ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
> 
>
>             ? ? ?
>             _______________________________________________
>             ? ? ? TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>             Minnesota
>             ? ? ? tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>             ? ? ?
>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>
>       _______________________________________________
>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> 
>

From jake.vath at gmail.com  Sun May 18 22:18:52 2014
From: jake.vath at gmail.com (Jake Vath)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 22:18:52 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Weird, probably locale-related question
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182215250.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182018250.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182037380.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmhLD=mdW0VQP2RfiJU1DXmcowS=EoUFK31O2oStuEkiQg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182046050.22869@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmg0K7sBPVBvo-0T0kb_6pPgHyCKWmwQjOBVgC09dhAoLg@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182104090.24431@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmgoFJ-hpSeQJ2pVt23aFudWY-4vD7ucRzO4v3VWrfNuDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182143440.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182153190.23266@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmi942uj2J1CwrXYnkQUf8cOCrsSasW9npi1Xu-L4cfG4Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182212170.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>
 <CAMeWMmi13aXAndXKURj62LFTVQFTbrc2wq+XNVw7qtsYpYVw-A@mail.gmail.com>
 <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405182215250.23395@cockerel.yaron.org>
Message-ID: <CAMeWMmhQWvmQ+LQUZCEtU6BAV-i_j_bf5rVoyXMVZsDSWvXo3g@mail.gmail.com>

No problem, I'm glad to have been able to help.

-> Jake
On May 18, 2014 10:16 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> Thanks for the help! (:
>
> On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>
>
>> Nicely done!
>>
>> ->  Jake
>>
>> On May 18, 2014 10:13 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>       Yup, it's using regular ' things instead of super-fantastic
>>       unicode wrap-quotes.
>>
>>
>>       On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>
>>             So everything displays correctly now?
>>
>>             -> Jake
>>
>>             On May 18, 2014 9:56 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>             wrote:
>>                   Yeah, this in .tcshrc seems to have worked:
>>
>>                           setenv LC_CTYPE en_US.ISO-8859-1
>>                           setenv LANG en_US.ISO-8859-1
>>
>>
>>                   On Sun, 18 May 2014, tclug at freakzilla.com
>>             wrote:
>>
>>                         I'm not trying to get aterm to support
>>             unicode. Hmm.
>>                         I wonder if I can remember what the
>>             pre-unicode
>>                         locale used to be... iso-8859-1 was
>>             it?...
>>
>>                         On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>                               The output of locale looks fine
>>             and I'm
>>                               guessing your /etc/local.gen and
>>                               /etc/locale.alias are set up
>>             correctly.
>>                               I'm not sure there is much you can
>>             do,
>>                               as I couldn't find anything about
>>                               aterm's unicode support.
>>
>>                               -> Jake
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                               On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 9:04 PM,
>>                               <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>>
>>             sterling at dragon:/home/sterling>
>>                               locale
>>                                     LANG=en_US.UTF-8
>>                                     LANGUAGE=
>>                                     LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
>>
>>             LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
>>                                     LC_ALL=
>>
>>
>>                                     (and yeah, it does work with
>>                               uxterm).
>>
>>
>>                                     On Sun, 18 May 2014, Jake
>>             Vath
>>                               wrote:
>>
>>                                           Hmm, I have not done
>>             much
>>                               with aterm.
>>                                           What does the output
>>             of
>>                               locale give you?
>>
>>                                           -> Jake
>>
>>                                           On May 18, 2014 8:47
>>             PM,
>>                               <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>                                           wrote:
>>                                                 I might, but I
>>                               actually use aterm, and I'm not
>>                                           switching away
>>                                                 from it because
>>                               nothing else has all the cute
>>                                           nice features I
>>                                                 want (:
>>
>>                                                 Basically I want
>>             to
>>                               tell the thing to stop
>>                                           with the unicode.
>>
>>                                                 On Sun, 18 May
>>             2014,
>>                               Jake Vath wrote:
>>
>>
>>                                                       Do you
>>             have
>>                               uxterm installed?
>>                                                       I thought
>>             uxterm
>>                               had unicode support.
>>
>>                                                       -> Jake
>>
>>                                                       On May 18,
>>             2014
>>                               8:39 PM,
>>                                           <tclug at freakzilla.com>
>>                                                       wrote:
>>
>>             Followup,
>>                               naturally when I look at
>>                                           that email
>>                                                       using OS
>>             X's
>>
>>             built-in
>>                               terminal, those look like
>>
>>             wrapped-quotes.
>>                               My xterm in
>>
>>             Linux,
>>                               though, just shows junk. So
>>                                           I'm
>>                                                       assuming
>>             this is
>>                               a
>>
>>             unicode
>>                               thing and I need to tell
>>                                           my Linux
>>                                                       system to
>>             cut
>>                               that
>>                                                             out.
>>                               Ideas?
>>
>>                                                             On
>>             Sun, 18
>>                               May 2014,
>>                                           tclug at freakzilla.com
>>                                                       wrote:
>>
>>
>>               Hi
>>                               all,
>>
>>
>>               Ok,
>>                               so a while ago for some
>>                                           reason
>>                                                       quotemarks
>>             in my
>>
>>
>>                               terminal window have been
>>                                           replaced by
>>                                                       weird
>>
>>
>>                               characters. Like right now
>>                                           I'm running a
>>                                                       cp -v, and
>>
>>               the
>>                               results look like this:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             ?/mnt/cf/DCIM/100CANON/IMG_1421.CR2? ->
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             ?/home/sterling/Photos/2014/05/1818?
>>
>>
>>
>>                               Normally that used to be
>>                                           surrounded by
>>
>>
>>                               single-quotes. Now it's that
>>                                           weird mess
>>                                                       that I'm
>>             not
>>
>>               even
>>                               sure will display
>>                                           correctly in
>>                                                       everyone
>>             else's
>>
>>
>>                               email.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                               Pretty sure it's a locale
>>                                           setting but
>>                                                       since I've
>>
>>
>>                               never messed with that, I
>>                                           have no idea
>>                                                       what to
>>             look
>>
>>               for.
>>                               Anyone?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             _______________________________________________
>>
>>             TCLUG
>>                               Mailing List -
>>                                           Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>                                                       Minnesota
>>
>>                               tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             _______________________________________________
>>                                                 TCLUG Mailing
>>             List -
>>                               Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>                                           Minnesota
>>
>>                               tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>
>>
>>
>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             _______________________________________________
>>                               TCLUG Mailing List -
>>             Minneapolis/St.
>>                               Paul, Minnesota
>>                               tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>
>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             _______________________________________________
>>                   TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul,
>>             Minnesota
>>                   tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>
>>             http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
>>       _______________________________________________
>>       TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>       tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>       http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From chrome at real-time.com  Mon May 19 12:39:30 2014
From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 13:39:30 -0400
Subject: [tclug-list] DSL router recommendations
In-Reply-To: <53724645.4010905@iexposure.com>
References: <20140508162953.GM853@real-time.com>
 <53724645.4010905@iexposure.com>
Message-ID: <20140519173929.GE475@real-time.com>

On 05/13 11:20 , Bret Baptist wrote:
> I purchased the D-Link DSL-520B at Microcenter awhile ago.  It has
> been by far the most stable that I have used with DSL.  I have had
> Zyxel, 2Wire, Actiontec, and the old Cisco routers.  Recommended by
> me.

Thanks for the recommendation Bret, really appreciated.

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com

From trieff at greencaremankato.com  Tue May 20 12:32:12 2014
From: trieff at greencaremankato.com (Thomas Rieff)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 12:32:12 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Ubuntu 14.04 & Root
In-Reply-To: <1125485040.2970845.1400606763307.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
Message-ID: <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>

TCLUG, 
Working on a new server project. Installed Ubuntu 14.04 Server with software raid. 
Setup went without a hitch and raid seems to work when I disconnect one drive and then the other...easiest setup so far. 
But, when working with root from putty and winscp, I get access denied on root. Using my username works fine. 
I have tried numerous things...and have at times been able to use root from putty but then at times I get Access Denied again. 
Unable to get connected with samba. So trying to figure out if is a samba issue, a 14.04 issue or a permission issue. 
Any thoughts on if they changed something in 14.04??? 
Tom 

Thomas Rieff 
GreenCare 
1717 3rd Avenue 
Mankato, MN 56001 
(507) 344-8314 Office 
(507) 344-8316 Fax 
(507) 381-0660 Cell 

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From ryan.c.dunlop at gmail.com  Tue May 20 12:54:56 2014
From: ryan.c.dunlop at gmail.com (Ryan Dunlop)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 12:54:56 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Ubuntu 14.04 & Root
In-Reply-To: <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
References: <1125485040.2970845.1400606763307.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
 <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
Message-ID: <CAKOK-RwCZKGv1uS+sTOtQZV_5KXE6tGOQoFFVHEy8P6ZoHxvHA@mail.gmail.com>

Root is not enabled in Ubuntu.  The use of sudo accomplishes the feats that
root would bring:

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo


On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 12:32 PM, Thomas Rieff
<trieff at greencaremankato.com>wrote:

> TCLUG,
> Working on a new server project. Installed Ubuntu 14.04 Server with
> software raid.
> Setup went without a hitch and raid seems to work when I disconnect one
> drive and then the other...easiest setup so far.
> But, when working with root from putty and winscp, I get access denied on
> root. Using my username works fine.
> I have tried numerous things...and have at times been able to use root
> from putty but then at times I get Access Denied again.
> Unable to get connected with samba. So trying to figure out if is a samba
> issue, a 14.04 issue or a permission issue.
> Any thoughts on if they changed something in 14.04???
> Tom
>
> Thomas Rieff
> GreenCare
> 1717 3rd Avenue
> Mankato, MN 56001
> (507) 344-8314 Office
> (507) 344-8316 Fax
> (507) 381-0660 Cell
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From jeremy.mountainjohnson at gmail.com  Tue May 20 12:59:44 2014
From: jeremy.mountainjohnson at gmail.com (Jeremy MountainJohnson)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 12:59:44 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Ubuntu 14.04 & Root
In-Reply-To: <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
References: <1125485040.2970845.1400606763307.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
 <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
Message-ID: <CACEdYO2x10YZHtyN70eJz3ZR8-3CCYjGiwQE4VZn=y4-1Lturw@mail.gmail.com>

Not an Ubuntu user but it sounds like permit root logon in sshd config is
disabled.

In addition, last time I used Ubuntu I had to use sudo to enable the root
account locally first to get it to work remotely.

--
Jeremy MountainJohnson
Jeremy.MountainJohnson at gmail.com


On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 12:32 PM, Thomas Rieff
<trieff at greencaremankato.com>wrote:

> TCLUG,
> Working on a new server project. Installed Ubuntu 14.04 Server with
> software raid.
> Setup went without a hitch and raid seems to work when I disconnect one
> drive and then the other...easiest setup so far.
> But, when working with root from putty and winscp, I get access denied on
> root. Using my username works fine.
> I have tried numerous things...and have at times been able to use root
> from putty but then at times I get Access Denied again.
> Unable to get connected with samba. So trying to figure out if is a samba
> issue, a 14.04 issue or a permission issue.
> Any thoughts on if they changed something in 14.04???
> Tom
>
> Thomas Rieff
> GreenCare
> 1717 3rd Avenue
> Mankato, MN 56001
> (507) 344-8314 Office
> (507) 344-8316 Fax
> (507) 381-0660 Cell
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Tue May 20 13:12:21 2014
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (tclug at freakzilla.com)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 13:12:21 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Ubuntu 14.04 & Root
In-Reply-To: <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
References: <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.10.1405201310270.3372@cockerel.yaron.org>

Like others have said, root login is something most UNIX-variants have 
moved away from. There's really no need to do it outside of single-user 
mode (in which case it's automatic).

Login as yourself, then use sudo to do individual commands, or sudo -s for 
a consistent root shell.

On Tue, 20 May 2014, Thomas Rieff wrote:

> TCLUG,
> Working on a new server project. Installed Ubuntu 14.04 Server with software
> raid.
> Setup went without a hitch and raid seems to work when I disconnect one
> drive and then the other...easiest setup so far.
> But, when working with root from putty and winscp, I get access denied on
> root. Using my username works fine.
> I have tried numerous things...and have at times been able to use root from
> putty but then at times I get Access Denied again.
> Unable to get connected with samba. So trying to figure out if is a samba
> issue, a 14.04 issue or a permission issue.
> Any thoughts on if they changed something in 14.04???
> Tom
> 
> Thomas Rieff
> GreenCare
> 1717 3rd Avenue
> Mankato, MN 56001
> (507) 344-8314 Office
> (507) 344-8316 Fax
> (507) 381-0660 Cell
> 
> 
>

From andrew.krull at gmail.com  Tue May 20 13:13:00 2014
From: andrew.krull at gmail.com (Andrew Krull)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 13:13:00 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Ubuntu 14.04 & Root
In-Reply-To: <CACEdYO2x10YZHtyN70eJz3ZR8-3CCYjGiwQE4VZn=y4-1Lturw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1125485040.2970845.1400606763307.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
 <781255644.2974894.1400607132554.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>
 <CACEdYO2x10YZHtyN70eJz3ZR8-3CCYjGiwQE4VZn=y4-1Lturw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPCvcCyf9EvNsiM-s-Y-eM-4rKzje3UUE5kH5Zx9DLGuKM7RDQ@mail.gmail.com>

Issue the following (following is a capture modified a bit...)

user at hostname:~$ sudo su -
[sudo] password for user:
root at hostname:~#
root at hostname:~# passwd
Enter new UNIX password:
Retype new UNIX password:
passwd: password updated successfully
root at hostname:~#

If you want to be able to ssh/scp to a system as root you will need to
ensure the following is set in /etc/ssh/sshd_config (not recommended...)

PermitRootLogin yes

If you had to modify sshd_config you will need to restart SSH



On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Jeremy MountainJohnson <
jeremy.mountainjohnson at gmail.com> wrote:

> Not an Ubuntu user but it sounds like permit root logon in sshd config is
> disabled.
>
> In addition, last time I used Ubuntu I had to use sudo to enable the root
> account locally first to get it to work remotely.
>
> --
> Jeremy MountainJohnson
> Jeremy.MountainJohnson at gmail.com
>
>
> On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 12:32 PM, Thomas Rieff <
> trieff at greencaremankato.com> wrote:
>
>> TCLUG,
>> Working on a new server project. Installed Ubuntu 14.04 Server with
>> software raid.
>> Setup went without a hitch and raid seems to work when I disconnect one
>> drive and then the other...easiest setup so far.
>> But, when working with root from putty and winscp, I get access denied on
>> root. Using my username works fine.
>> I have tried numerous things...and have at times been able to use root
>> from putty but then at times I get Access Denied again.
>> Unable to get connected with samba. So trying to figure out if is a samba
>> issue, a 14.04 issue or a permission issue.
>> Any thoughts on if they changed something in 14.04???
>> Tom
>>
>> Thomas Rieff
>> GreenCare
>> 1717 3rd Avenue
>> Mankato, MN 56001
>> (507) 344-8314 Office
>> (507) 344-8316 Fax
>> (507) 381-0660 Cell
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From trieff at greencaremankato.com  Tue May 20 19:24:47 2014
From: trieff at greencaremankato.com (Thomas Rieff)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 19:24:47 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Ubuntu 14.04 & Root
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1039.1400609604.1736.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
References: <mailman.1039.1400609604.1736.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
Message-ID: <232071831.28215.1400631887641.JavaMail.zimbra@greencaremankato.com>

Thanks for the comments. 
Resolved the root issue with... 
no talloc stackframe at ../source3/param/loadparm.c:4864, leaking memory
This is a known bug, not yet fixed, see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/samba/+bug/1257186 Workaround: apt-get remove libpam-smbpass 
Don't know exactly what this does??? 
Resolved the samba connect issue by changing eth0 to p2pl, which I remembered from the interfaces file 
and needed to correct in the smb.conf. 
Must be a new way to address the network interface??? 
Next issue is to install Bit Torrent Sync... 
I was looking for some form of file/folder sync to backup the main server files to other servers and off-site servers. 
Found this...anyone with experience on this or is there something else??? 
Tom 

Thomas Rieff 
GreenCare 
1717 3rd Avenue 
Mankato, MN 56001 
(507) 344-8314 Office 
(507) 344-8316 Fax 
(507) 381-0660 Cell 
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed May 21 02:33:50 2014
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 02:33:50 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [tclug-list] Beginning Ubuntu Linux - free book
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1405210227270.7136@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

This is a good book, but my copy was for Ubuntu 9.04.  I'm sure about 90% 
of it is still good info for beginners.  If you want it, it is yours.  I 
live at 41st Ave S and E. Lake St.  You can pick it up here, preferably.

Mike

From john.a.frisk at gmail.com  Tue May 27 17:28:04 2014
From: john.a.frisk at gmail.com (John Frisk)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2014 17:28:04 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Question/Advice on Single Sign On
Message-ID: <CAAvSaRpshMXG_2PA-wxXVkuBmCkgSpzVvP2w+Xyb4bQ69BHj_g@mail.gmail.com>

Hello All,
I currently have an older ldap style installation for single sign on where
I use nss_ldapd for client authentication and identity. (i.e. password
stored in hash directly in slapd)

I am looking at doing either one of two styles in the future:
1) Set up samba4 as an AD DC and keep the users for single sign on in there

2) Set up ldap/kerberos installation on ubuntu to have an updated
environment from above.

My question is what are people using these days?  Obviously the Active
Directory solution is probably what a lot of enterprises are doing, but I
have mostly Linux VM's and machines with only one Win7 installation. What
recommendations do you guys have?  Also, what is easier for web
technologies to use for web-enabled apps?
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From tclug at beitsahour.net  Tue May 27 17:35:59 2014
From: tclug at beitsahour.net (Munir Nassar)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2014 17:35:59 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Question/Advice on Single Sign On
In-Reply-To: <CAAvSaRpshMXG_2PA-wxXVkuBmCkgSpzVvP2w+Xyb4bQ69BHj_g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAvSaRpshMXG_2PA-wxXVkuBmCkgSpzVvP2w+Xyb4bQ69BHj_g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMg8xau99J7pmf8RP+x_b3aZVMh-jmGWiXo_8Do2q5woP58-wQ@mail.gmail.com>

what is wrong with LDAP authentication? in other words: what problem
are you trying to solve?

On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 5:28 PM, John Frisk <john.a.frisk at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello All,
> I currently have an older ldap style installation for single sign on where I
> use nss_ldapd for client authentication and identity. (i.e. password stored
> in hash directly in slapd)
>
> I am looking at doing either one of two styles in the future:
> 1) Set up samba4 as an AD DC and keep the users for single sign on in there
>
> 2) Set up ldap/kerberos installation on ubuntu to have an updated
> environment from above.
>
> My question is what are people using these days?  Obviously the Active
> Directory solution is probably what a lot of enterprises are doing, but I
> have mostly Linux VM's and machines with only one Win7 installation. What
> recommendations do you guys have?  Also, what is easier for web technologies
> to use for web-enabled apps?
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

From john.a.frisk at gmail.com  Tue May 27 18:02:04 2014
From: john.a.frisk at gmail.com (John Frisk)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2014 18:02:04 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Question/Advice on Single Sign On
In-Reply-To: <CAMg8xau99J7pmf8RP+x_b3aZVMh-jmGWiXo_8Do2q5woP58-wQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAvSaRpshMXG_2PA-wxXVkuBmCkgSpzVvP2w+Xyb4bQ69BHj_g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMg8xau99J7pmf8RP+x_b3aZVMh-jmGWiXo_8Do2q5woP58-wQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAvSaRpmOtbK3JOXkuHrE5A=cbf+HTtMz1RFGoqNCyCwMz-9KQ@mail.gmail.com>

There is nothing per se wrong with the current LDAP authentication I have
just for identity and authentication.  Some security folks believe having
the hash stored in your LDAP tree is in itself a security problem but I'm
not so worried about that.

There are two problems though I am trying to solve and am looking for an
over all architecture.

Problem 1) NFSv4 is more secure with kerberos, and since I use NFS
currently without kerberos I'd like to use NFSv4 with Kerberos.  That would
mean though I need to integrate LDAP and Kerberos together to keep the same
level of authenication as today.

Problem 2) Samba4 as I am reading does not support Linux OpenLDAP/Kerberos
as it's system for authentication due to incompatibilities in the way AD
was implemented.  So to get single sign on across multiple OS's I believe
I've read that having AD Samba4 is the way to support that which would
again require me to move away from just having LDAP storing the hash in the
tree.

I am also looking at web enabled applications that can use the single sign
on recommendation to perform identity and authentication.



On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 5:35 PM, Munir Nassar <tclug at beitsahour.net> wrote:

> what is wrong with LDAP authentication? in other words: what problem
> are you trying to solve?
>
> On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 5:28 PM, John Frisk <john.a.frisk at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Hello All,
> > I currently have an older ldap style installation for single sign on
> where I
> > use nss_ldapd for client authentication and identity. (i.e. password
> stored
> > in hash directly in slapd)
> >
> > I am looking at doing either one of two styles in the future:
> > 1) Set up samba4 as an AD DC and keep the users for single sign on in
> there
> >
> > 2) Set up ldap/kerberos installation on ubuntu to have an updated
> > environment from above.
> >
> > My question is what are people using these days?  Obviously the Active
> > Directory solution is probably what a lot of enterprises are doing, but I
> > have mostly Linux VM's and machines with only one Win7 installation. What
> > recommendations do you guys have?  Also, what is easier for web
> technologies
> > to use for web-enabled apps?
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> >
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From ryanjcole at me.com  Wed May 28 20:18:44 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 20:18:44 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Getting LDAP set up as main AUTH path
Message-ID: <6D6BB087-25DE-4406-8CC4-9D62B18B530F@me.com>

Does anyone where have experience setting up a system for LDAP authentication? I know I?ve asked before but I?m now on my summer schedule and have the time to putz around with my mail server.

I would like it to do everything but SSH, if possible. I?m open to any platform at this point but I?d prefer some direct guidance rather than ?you should try? response - those usually aren?t helpful.

Thanks,
Ryan

From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Wed May 28 20:48:35 2014
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 20:48:35 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Getting LDAP set up as main AUTH path
In-Reply-To: <6D6BB087-25DE-4406-8CC4-9D62B18B530F@me.com>
References: <6D6BB087-25DE-4406-8CC4-9D62B18B530F@me.com>
Message-ID: <CAOZLdJWvLLg3dcwDC7E7Vg_0-CKbR7jCZy9+JLhgMMDvXnTTOQ@mail.gmail.com>

I can think of two basic approaches:

1)  Individually make each app refer to LDAP for authentication.  For
instance, it's pretty trivial to make Postfix/Dovecot do this (or
hashes, or SQL, or anything really).  Hooking up Apache and Ejabberd
are pretty straightforward as well.  Whether this works for you will
depend on what you're running, obviously.

2)  Make each app refer to PAM for authentication, and tie PAM into
LDAP.  If going this route you'd need to exclude SSH somehow.  It
might be easiest to go ahead and let SSH consult the LDAP tree, but
then restrict SSH logins to a group, and only put your local users in
that group.  Making PAM refer to LDAP is well documented, but making
your apps all talk to PAM will again vary by application.

Other than that rather generic answer, specifics would depend on your
use case's definition of "everything" (ie what software you're
running).

From ryanjcole at me.com  Wed May 28 20:50:52 2014
From: ryanjcole at me.com (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 20:50:52 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Getting LDAP set up as main AUTH path
In-Reply-To: <CAOZLdJWvLLg3dcwDC7E7Vg_0-CKbR7jCZy9+JLhgMMDvXnTTOQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <6D6BB087-25DE-4406-8CC4-9D62B18B530F@me.com>
 <CAOZLdJWvLLg3dcwDC7E7Vg_0-CKbR7jCZy9+JLhgMMDvXnTTOQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2F8A2CC9-AD69-468C-A859-F2A7C6961CE2@me.com>

Postfix/dovecot and pretty much nothing else. 

I haven?t had any luck with the making folders/permissions side of things yet but I had to put it down for spring events that tied up the last 6 weeks of my schedule.


On May 28, 2014, at 20:48, Tony Yarusso <tonyyarusso at gmail.com> wrote:

> I can think of two basic approaches:
> 
> 1)  Individually make each app refer to LDAP for authentication.  For
> instance, it's pretty trivial to make Postfix/Dovecot do this (or
> hashes, or SQL, or anything really).  Hooking up Apache and Ejabberd
> are pretty straightforward as well.  Whether this works for you will
> depend on what you're running, obviously.
> 
> 2)  Make each app refer to PAM for authentication, and tie PAM into
> LDAP.  If going this route you'd need to exclude SSH somehow.  It
> might be easiest to go ahead and let SSH consult the LDAP tree, but
> then restrict SSH logins to a group, and only put your local users in
> that group.  Making PAM refer to LDAP is well documented, but making
> your apps all talk to PAM will again vary by application.
> 
> Other than that rather generic answer, specifics would depend on your
> use case's definition of "everything" (ie what software you're
> running).
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From sjruprecht at gmail.com  Fri May 30 15:36:05 2014
From: sjruprecht at gmail.com (Steve Ruprecht)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2014 15:36:05 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] SCLUG still around?
Message-ID: <CALb_yGNuHd5h+fq2VG5zAca+smPTtF84f3tZ=75td6+jM=aUQA@mail.gmail.com>

Does anyone know if the Saint Cloud Linux user group is still
meeting/active?

If there is a group: Anyone have any contacts?

If there isn't a group: Anyone in the SC area want to start meeting up?

-Steve
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From cdf123 at cdf123.net  Fri May 30 16:27:13 2014
From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2014 16:27:13 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] SCLUG still around?
In-Reply-To: <CALb_yGNuHd5h+fq2VG5zAca+smPTtF84f3tZ=75td6+jM=aUQA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALb_yGNuHd5h+fq2VG5zAca+smPTtF84f3tZ=75td6+jM=aUQA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5388F7B1.1030408@cdf123.net>

I wouldn't mind meeting up.  I used to follow the SCALUG mailing list, but it was pretty stagnant, so I dropped it.  I see there's a yahoo group 
for them, but no activity since 2010.

Chris

On 05/30/14 15:36, Steve Ruprecht wrote:
> Does anyone know if the Saint Cloud Linux user group is still
> meeting/active?
>
> If there is a group: Anyone have any contacts?
>
> If there isn't a group: Anyone in the SC area want to start meeting up?
>
> -Steve
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>


From john.a.frisk at gmail.com  Fri May 30 17:47:09 2014
From: john.a.frisk at gmail.com (John Frisk)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2014 17:47:09 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] May Penguins Unbound Meeting
Message-ID: <CAAvSaRq-bOa+Ndm9GrmaHcbmd7qk6qeZXZdsuU=czyOCrGTzjg@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry for getting this out so late - been a fun week. :)

Please join us to May 31st @ 10AM at TIES to do a Q&A with Trusty 14.04
release.  We only have 2 hrs at TIES so a full install may not be
possible.  Come share your knowledge if you've already upgraded.  Hope to
see you there!

John

http://www.penguinsunbound.com/
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