From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Wed Jan  3 21:39:05 2007
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:39:05 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200701040339.l043d5R12671@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Free

Subject: Free computer books

All books are in good condition.  Some are a bit old.  I'll include ISBN so you can get the details.  Also makes good kindling.

Java in a Nutshell, 1-56592-262-X
Java 2 Complete, 0-7821-2468-2
Tcl and the Tk Toolkit, 0-201-63337-X
Learning Perl, 1-56592-284-0
The C++ Programming Language, 0-201-53992-6
Javascript, the Definitive Guide, 1-56592-392-8


Seller Email address: johntrammell at gmail dot com

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From jsievert at gmail.com  Fri Jan  5 16:07:00 2007
From: jsievert at gmail.com (Jason Sievert)
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:07:00 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Rack screws and clip nuts
Message-ID: <6cfb19470701051407h470e3887h60e344140c662422@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all, I am looking trying to find a local supplier for some rack
hardware.  Something like this from APC.
http://apcc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=AR8100&tab=features

Any ideas?

Thanks,
Jason Sievert
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070105/d5eeb848/attachment.htm 

From cdf123 at cdf123.net  Fri Jan  5 15:46:19 2007
From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick)
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:46:19 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] vim expert needed - <S-Fx> not working
Message-ID: <459EC72B.6070309@cdf123.net>

Hi all,

I've got a bunch of external macros and commands that I want to use my 
function keys for in vim (e.g. cvs commands).  And I'd like to map 
similar commands together, but if I map them all, I'm going to be 
running out of function keys pretty quick.  So I'm trying to map 
commands like this:

"load functions
source ~/bin/cdf.vim
:map <F5> :CVSDiff<C-M>
:map <S-F5> :CdfCvsDiffPrevious<C-M>
:map <F6> :CdfCvsUpdateReport<C-M>
:map <S-F6> :CVSCommit<C-M>
etc...

But none of the shift function keys are doing what I want.  If I open 
vim and do Ctrl-K and then a Shift-F5, instead of a "<S-F5>" I get 
"<HELP>", and when I try it with F6 I get "[29~".

Does anyone here know what's going on?  I'm running gentoo, fluxbox, and 
  Eterm, all with mostly default settings, so I don't think they would 
be messing with any key mappings or anything, xev shows everything 
working ok.  Any help would be great.

Thanks all,
Chris Frederick


From tclug-list at scotjenkins.com  Fri Jan  5 17:43:38 2007
From: tclug-list at scotjenkins.com (Scot Jenkins)
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:43:38 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] vim expert needed - <S-Fx> not working
In-Reply-To: <459EC72B.6070309@cdf123.net>
References: <459EC72B.6070309@cdf123.net>
Message-ID: <1168040618.459ee2aa70542@webmail.pajunas.net>

Quoting Chris Frederick <cdf123 at cdf123.net>:

> I've got a bunch of external macros and commands that I want to use my
> function keys for in vim (e.g. cvs commands).  And I'd like to map
> similar commands together, but if I map them all, I'm going to be
> running out of function keys pretty quick.  So I'm trying to map
> commands like this:
>
> "load functions
> source ~/bin/cdf.vim
> :map <F5> :CVSDiff<C-M>
> :map <S-F5> :CdfCvsDiffPrevious<C-M>
> :map <F6> :CdfCvsUpdateReport<C-M>
> :map <S-F6> :CVSCommit<C-M>
> etc...
>
> But none of the shift function keys are doing what I want.  If I open
> vim and do Ctrl-K and then a Shift-F5, instead of a "<S-F5>" I get
> "<HELP>", and when I try it with F6 I get "[29~".

In vi, in input mode, type CTRL+V then hit the key combination you want.  CTRL+V
will quote the next char.

Scot



From cdf123 at cdf123.net  Fri Jan  5 18:05:07 2007
From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick)
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:05:07 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Update:  vim expert needed - <S-Fx> not working
In-Reply-To: <459EC72B.6070309@cdf123.net>
References: <459EC72B.6070309@cdf123.net>
Message-ID: <459EE7B3.2030200@cdf123.net>

Chris Frederick wrote:
> <snipped>
> 
> But none of the shift function keys are doing what I want.  If I open 
> vim and do Ctrl-K and then a Shift-F5, instead of a "<S-F5>" I get 
> "<HELP>", and when I try it with F6 I get "[29~".
> 
> Does anyone here know what's going on?  I'm running gentoo, fluxbox, and 
> Eterm, all with mostly default settings, so I don't think they would 
> be messing with any key mappings or anything, xev shows everything 
> working ok.  Any help would be great.
> 
> <snipped>

Why is it that when you spend hours looking for something and ask for 
help, you find it yourself in an hour or so?

I tried different terminals and found that xterm works perfectly.  So it 
must be a problem with eterm, and sure enough:

http://www.eterm.org/docs/view.php?doc=ref

Looks like eterm (and several others btw) are mapping <S-F1-10> to 
<F11-20>.  This seems kind of odd.  This makes <S-F1>=<F11>, and 
<S-F2>=<F12>.  So instead of 24 function key combinations, I'm cut down 
to 20.  I'm not seeing anything obvious available to change this 
"feature" (commenting out the code in term.c and recompiling didn't do 
what I want), but I'm still looking.

For now though ':help :map' to the rescue.  I've remapped the <S-Fx> 
keys to the key codes being given by eterm.  Just added this to my .vimrc:

set <S-F3>=[25~
set <S-F4>=[26~
set <S-F5>=<xHelp>
set <S-F6>=[29~
set <S-F7>=[31~
set <S-F8>=[32~
set <S-F9>=[33~
set <S-F10>=[34~
set <S-F11>=[23$
set <S-F12>=[24$
"F15 is apparently the help key, so undo it's mapping so I can use it.
map <Help> <Nop>
map! <Help> <Nop>

If anyone knows a quick and easy way to make eterm/rxvt/etc.. work more 
like xterm for key bindings, please let me know.  Something tells me I 
cant just swap out term.c and expect everything to work, but I'll keep 
digging.

Thanks again for any help.
Chris Frederick


From Dean.Benjamin at mm.com  Fri Jan  5 18:52:21 2007
From: Dean.Benjamin at mm.com (Dean.Benjamin at mm.com)
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:52:21 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Rack screws and clip nuts
In-Reply-To: <6cfb19470701051407h470e3887h60e344140c662422@mail.gmail.co
 m>
References: <6cfb19470701051407h470e3887h60e344140c662422@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20070105184550.035d5800@pop.mm.com>

Three suppliers come to mind:
   Ace Hardware
   Home Depot
   Menard's

Rack screws are regular machine screws; nothing special about 
them.  Nylon locking hex nuts, lock washers. &c are also standard fare.

I forget the thread pitch, but if you bring one of your rack screws 
to your neighborhood hardware store, they'll be able to figure it out 
in a few seconds.  Home Depot has a thread gage where you can find 
the right match yourself.




At 04:07 PM 1/5/07, Jason Sievert wrote:
>Hello all, I am looking trying to find a local supplier for some 
>rack hardware.  Something like this from APC.
><http://apcc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=AR8100&tab=features>http://apcc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=AR8100&tab=features 
>
>
>Any ideas?



From dniesen at gmail.com  Sun Jan  7 18:38:49 2007
From: dniesen at gmail.com (Donovan Niesen)
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 18:38:49 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mismatch between du/df
Message-ID: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>

I have a Fedora Core 4 server that is hosting a number of web sites.
It seems every week or so that a large number of GB go missing.  What
I mean is that while df shows 26GB used, du of that same mount show
only 7.4 GB used.  It seems that MySQL may be chomping some space in a
weird way because when I restart the MySQL server the space reappears.

The partition in question is xfs with usrquota enabled.  Has anyone
seen this behavior before?

-- 
Donovan Niesen


From justin.kremer at gmail.com  Sun Jan  7 21:25:03 2007
From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer)
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 21:25:03 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mismatch between du/df
In-Reply-To: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>
References: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <27e6356a0701071925w2898aca4oc08a16ab1828b2ba@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/7/07, Donovan Niesen <dniesen at gmail.com> wrote:
> What
> I mean is that while df shows 26GB used, du of that same mount show
> only 7.4 GB used.  It seems that MySQL may be chomping some space in a
> weird way because when I restart the MySQL server the space reappears.

I remember seeing a discussion about this a while back.
http://mailman.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/2004-May.txt
Search for "where is my disk space" on that page.  I'm guessing that
MySQL is keeping "deleted" files open, similar to what Tom was seeing
with his app, and that's why restarting MySQL frees up the space.
- Justin


From dniesen at gmail.com  Sun Jan  7 21:41:28 2007
From: dniesen at gmail.com (Donovan Niesen)
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 21:41:28 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mismatch between du/df
In-Reply-To: <27e6356a0701071925w2898aca4oc08a16ab1828b2ba@mail.gmail.com>
References: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>
	<27e6356a0701071925w2898aca4oc08a16ab1828b2ba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <47f4d5e70701071941j714815d1i6ab46f4a5d270283@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/7/07, Justin Kremer <justin.kremer at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 1/7/07, Donovan Niesen <dniesen at gmail.com> wrote:
> > What
> > I mean is that while df shows 26GB used, du of that same mount show
> > only 7.4 GB used.  It seems that MySQL may be chomping some space in a
> > weird way because when I restart the MySQL server the space reappears.
>
> I remember seeing a discussion about this a while back.
> http://mailman.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/2004-May.txt
> Search for "where is my disk space" on that page.  I'm guessing that
> MySQL is keeping "deleted" files open, similar to what Tom was seeing
> with his app, and that's why restarting MySQL frees up the space.
> - Justin
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

This must be it.  I have a script that updates the db on machine every
day from an outside source; I have a feeling either MySQL or some
error in my script must be unlinking a file and letting it hang out.
Thanks guys!

-- 
Donovan Niesen


From thecubic at thecubic.net  Sun Jan  7 22:00:48 2007
From: thecubic at thecubic.net (Dave Carlson)
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 22:00:48 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mismatch between du/df
In-Reply-To: <47f4d5e70701071941j714815d1i6ab46f4a5d270283@mail.gmail.com>
References: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>
	<27e6356a0701071925w2898aca4oc08a16ab1828b2ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<47f4d5e70701071941j714815d1i6ab46f4a5d270283@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200701072200.49095.thecubic@thecubic.net>

"lsof +L1" should tell you the file(s) in question and if they are regular 
files, the size also.

-Dave

On Sunday 07 January 2007 21:41, Donovan Niesen wrote:
> This must be it.  I have a script that updates the db on machine every
> day from an outside source; I have a feeling either MySQL or some
> error in my script must be unlinking a file and letting it hang out.


From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Mon Jan  8 01:05:26 2007
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 01:05:26 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200701080705.l0875Q722504@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Sale

Subject: Computers and Misc

For sale:


1.  Dell Insperion E1505
Specs - 
2.00ghz Intel Duo Core(Not Core 2)
2gb Ram
80gb hdd
Sony dvd+/- RW
Intel 3945 A/B/G Wireless
Onboard - 
10/100 Nic,
56k Modem
Sound
Mini Firewire
4 usb 2.0 ports
6 in one media card reader
and Multi-Media buttons on the front pannel.

Other -

System does come with all restore cds. WinXp Pro Sp2 cd provided by dell with licence code. Remaining 2 1/2 years on Gold level warrenty. Power cable and charger.

No Operating system currently loaded. But Can have Ubuntu/Kbuntu/Mandriva/Fedora loaded for showing.
$1400.00 Or Best Offer
---

Other parts/machines - 

Gateway 1.4ghz Athlon
128mb pc-133 ram
3gb hdd
cd-rw drive
$35.00
---

Pc-Chips Motherboard with 1.2ghz Duron
128mb pc-133ram
no hdds,cd, case or powersupply.
$20.00
--

Intel Celeron 500mhz box, cd-drive, dlink nic, 3gb hdd, 384mb ram.
$10.00

---

Cash or Certified Check only.



Seller Email address: blacknight_709 at hotmail dot com

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From erriiik at riseup.net  Mon Jan  8 01:15:56 2007
From: erriiik at riseup.net (Erik)
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2007 01:15:56 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] a few good geeks...
In-Reply-To: <200701072200.49095.thecubic@thecubic.net>
References: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>	<27e6356a0701071925w2898aca4oc08a16ab1828b2ba@mail.gmail.com>	<47f4d5e70701071941j714815d1i6ab46f4a5d270283@mail.gmail.com>
	<200701072200.49095.thecubic@thecubic.net>
Message-ID: <45A1EFAC.7010805@riseup.net>

Hi Everyone,

The Twin Cities Indymedia collective is working on a project to outfit
coffeeshops and community centers around the Metro Area with free
computer kiosks with which people can check the indymedia site
(http://www.twincities.indymedia.org), other news sites, their email, or
whatever.

Our purpose is to provide access to the alternative information flows of
the Internet and Indymedia (the world's largest independent media
network), as well as general computer access, to people who would
otherwise not have it. We are hoping to start out with 1-2 kiosks in the
coming months, and eventually expand as far as possible.

In the spirit of freedom of information, we would like to run the
computer kiosks on Linux. And that's where you (hopefully!) come in. We
need volunteers (a few good geeks) to set up donated computers with
Linux, and if possible, maintain them once installed. The kiosks will
then not only promote independent media, but the open-source movement as
well.

If you are interested in participating in this project, please email me
off-list.

I also need help with booting Ubuntu from a firewire drive, but that's
an entirely different story...

Thanks for your help!

in solidarity,
Erik


From dniesen at gmail.com  Mon Jan  8 06:34:05 2007
From: dniesen at gmail.com (Donovan Niesen)
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 06:34:05 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mismatch between du/df
In-Reply-To: <200701072200.49095.thecubic@thecubic.net>
References: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>
	<27e6356a0701071925w2898aca4oc08a16ab1828b2ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<47f4d5e70701071941j714815d1i6ab46f4a5d270283@mail.gmail.com>
	<200701072200.49095.thecubic@thecubic.net>
Message-ID: <47f4d5e70701080434j34d14602w4276197640afe61a@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/7/07, Dave Carlson <thecubic at thecubic.net> wrote:
> "lsof +L1" should tell you the file(s) in question and if they are regular
> files, the size also.
>
> -Dave
>
> On Sunday 07 January 2007 21:41, Donovan Niesen wrote:
> > This must be it.  I have a script that updates the db on machine every
> > day from an outside source; I have a feeling either MySQL or some
> > error in my script must be unlinking a file and letting it hang out.
>

The culprit ended up being mysql.log which was growing huge because it
was logging every query.  It seems that when it got rotated out each
morning the file was unlinked but was not converted to free space.
Turning this logging off saved my valuable space.

Thanks again, everyone!

-- 
Donovan Niesen


From nate at refried.org  Mon Jan  8 08:03:08 2007
From: nate at refried.org (Nate Straz)
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 08:03:08 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mismatch between du/df
In-Reply-To: <47f4d5e70701080434j34d14602w4276197640afe61a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <47f4d5e70701071638k24f572bft8d62c33287737571@mail.gmail.com>
	<27e6356a0701071925w2898aca4oc08a16ab1828b2ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<47f4d5e70701071941j714815d1i6ab46f4a5d270283@mail.gmail.com>
	<200701072200.49095.thecubic@thecubic.net>
	<47f4d5e70701080434j34d14602w4276197640afe61a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20070108140308.GA25511@refried.org>

On Mon, Jan 08, 2007 at 06:34:05AM -0600, Donovan Niesen wrote:
> The culprit ended up being mysql.log which was growing huge because it
> was logging every query.  It seems that when it got rotated out each
> morning the file was unlinked but was not converted to free space.
> Turning this logging off saved my valuable space.

If you still want this logging, you should check to see if MySQL has
some configuration directives for rotating the logs.  Some daemons have
an option to rotates logs themselves, others accept a signal when their
logs have been rotated so they can close and re-open their logs.

Nate


From rclark at lakesplus.com  Mon Jan  8 14:09:54 2007
From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean)
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2007 14:09:54 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Latest FC5 kernel
Message-ID: <1168286994.11186.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>

I may be just a bit befuddled here ... but ... I am trying to upgrade my
kernel on a Fedora Core 5 system.

I tried using YUM and it did not fly all that well.  There was an error
message while trying to install the kernel ... some error related to
grub ... searched the web, but no luck.

so ... I run rpm -qa | grep kernel  and I get

	[rclark at dualasus ~]$ rpm -qa | grep kernel
	kernel-smp-2.6.15-1.2054_FC5
	kernel-smp-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5

The 2.16.15 version is what I have now.  But ... the grub.conf shows
nothing related to 2.6.18 ... which I would like to try and install.  I
tried going out to download the SRC and work at it from that way ... but
none of the repositories go past the 2.6.15-1.2054.

How does the 2.6.18-1 show up ... how do i install it properly ... and
why does it not show up out on the repositories?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Randy



From joey.rockhold at gmail.com  Thu Jan 11 09:37:24 2007
From: joey.rockhold at gmail.com (Joey Rockhold)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:37:24 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Documentation Server
Message-ID: <101e49ea0701110737w4b9ec6afw5582ed9aaa5a3e7d@mail.gmail.com>

At the place where I work, paperwork is overkill.  I am getting ready to
demo BugZilla to my company as a method of tracking system bugs and
projects, etc.  Along with this, we need a great way to pool all our
documents together, so I am hoping to find a product (free preferred) that
we can put all of our notes together.

Here are some examples of what we currently do:
1) I log my time spent on projects in to a spreadsheet (for my own use),
which I then turn around and enter in to our time keeping system
(company-made app).  I then enter this information in to a word document as
a "Status Report" for the week.  On days in which I telecommute from home, I
have to fill out a "Telecommuting Status Report", which is a word document.
I first enter what I plan to get accomplished from home on this document,
then the next day update this document with what I actually got done for the
day.  Finally, at the end of the week, I have to summarize all these times
by GL-Number on a time card, which is not automated, it is actually entered
by pen and paper.  This time card is what is sent to payroll.

2) Our CSRs have tons of documents about everything, but they are mostly
word and excel documents saved in dozens of folders all over the network.
They also have the biggest collections of emails.  I did get them going on
the use of Google Desktop Search, which has helped them a lot.

3) Our operations department has many many jobs.  They keep paper check
lists for a lot of what they do throughout the day.

I don't know if what I am looking for is a Wiki product, or what.  If anyone
has any ideas on the best way to pool all this information together, it
would be appreciated.  We do run an internal linux server, but only because
I set it up and maintain it, otherwise this is a fully Microsoft shop
(though we have a linux ip phone system going now).  So any products
mentioned either has to run in a web browser if it is linux based, or on
Windows desktops.  I would prefer it run in the linux box myself.

Thanks in advance.

- Joey
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070111/0b9f1194/attachment.htm 

From hewhocutsdown at gmail.com  Mon Jan  8 14:50:15 2007
From: hewhocutsdown at gmail.com (Jordan Peacock)
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 14:50:15 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] mod_perl won't execute .pl scripts
Message-ID: <bada98250701081250m1768a4d7x71a0f96f2d54094b@mail.gmail.com>

We are running a SuSE 10.1 box w/ Apache 2.2.3 compiled w/ mod_perl 2.0.3 &
perl 5.8.8.

When we attempt to view .pl/.cgi scripts in a browser, all we get is the
text of the script displayed:

eg.

#!/usr/bin/perl
print "Content-type: text/plain\r\n\r\n";
print "Testing mod_perl installation!\n";


Theoretically, this should be about a 5-step process, and all the make-tests
for all-dependencies pass with flying colors. Nevertheless, once compiled,
the scripts (such as the one above) still do not run.

Any ideas on where to start looking to troubleshoot this?

-- 

Jordan Peacock
hewhocutsdown at gmail.com
hewhocutsdown.blogspot.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070108/4467be94/attachment.htm 

From gscottwalters at gmail.com  Wed Jan 10 10:50:39 2007
From: gscottwalters at gmail.com (G. Scott Walters)
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:50:39 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Problem,
Message-ID: <34b4c76d0701100850s3036c918ybd3459765b5941a6@mail.gmail.com>

I've got a couple hundred PDF files that have been malformed with some
extra lines AFTER the EOF. This keeps them from being doing important
things like printing, or displaying properly on some versions of
Acrobat. Not all PDFs are necessarily effected with this issue...

Since these files are hosted on a linux server, I figured the proper
tool to solve this problem would be PERL. The question is, how....if I
open the file with a standard open function, won't it read the file
til the EOF and not beyond?

I understand that SED might be helpful, but I'm sed-impaired, but I'm
working on that.

Any thoughts or ideas?

-- 
-
G. Scott Walters
http://www.apt518.net


From david.alitz at charter.net  Thu Jan 11 06:35:40 2007
From: david.alitz at charter.net (Dave Alitz)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 06:35:40 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] RAID1 to RAID5 migration
Message-ID: <45A62F1C.9040204@charter.net>

I've got a small server ( 4 drive bays ) with a RAID1 (mirrored) md 
array on two drives that I'd like to convert to RAID5 ( adding two new 
drives -- one active and one as a spare).

I'm starting with 4 drives.  Two active in the current mirror and two 
unused. The process I'm considering:

    Fail and remove a drive from the current md mirror, leaving three 
unused drives
    Create a new RAID5 array
    Add the new md RAID5 device as a member of the degraded mirror
    Wait for mirror to sync (thus copying the existing data to the new 
device)
    fail the remaining drive in the RAID mirror
    remove the old md device
    update GRUB and boot from the new RAID5 device

Does anyone know if md can be used recursively like that?  More 
importantly -- will if cause major problems if I try?  I'm guessing that 
md won't let me do it; but it sure would be easier than moving the files 
by hand.

Dave Alitz


From cschumann at twp-llc.com  Thu Jan 11 14:41:23 2007
From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:41:23 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Latest FC5 kernel
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1.1168365604.2718.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
References: <mailman.1.1168365604.2718.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
Message-ID: <26755.168.86.12.2.1168548083.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com>

> Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2007 14:09:54 -0600
> From: Randy Clarksean <rclark at lakesplus.com>

> I may be just a bit befuddled here ... but ... I am trying to upgrade my
> kernel on a Fedora Core 5 system.
>
> I tried using YUM and it did not fly all that well.  There was an error
> message while trying to install the kernel ... some error related to
> grub ... searched the web, but no luck.

Hmm. More information might be useful. I'm running FC5 on one box.

> so ... I run rpm -qa | grep kernel  and I get
>
> 	[rclark at dualasus ~]$ rpm -qa | grep kernel
> 	kernel-smp-2.6.15-1.2054_FC5
> 	kernel-smp-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5

I see you've got the kernel package installed. Odd.

I get this:
  [root at tick ~]# rpm -qa | grep kernel
  kernel-devel-2.6.18-1.2200.fc5
  kernel-devel-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5
  kernel-2.6.18-1.2200.fc5
  kernel-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5
  [root at tick ~]# uname -r
  2.6.18-1.2200.fc5

Grub has entries for those two kernels. (Hmm. I must not have rebooted
after the last kernel update.)

Here's my grub entry for that kernel:
title Fedora Core (2.6.18-1.2257.fc5)
        root (hd0,0)
        kernel /vmlinuz-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5 ro root=LABEL=/1
        initrd /initrd-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5.img

I did nothing special to any repository or yum configuration. It just works.

"yum update" updates the kernel just like everything else.

> The 2.16.15 version is what I have now.  But ... the grub.conf shows
> nothing related to 2.6.18 ... which I would like to try and install.  I
> tried going out to download the SRC and work at it from that way ... but
> none of the repositories go past the 2.6.15-1.2054.
>
> How does the 2.6.18-1 show up ... how do i install it properly ... and
> why does it not show up out on the repositories?
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Randy

Try yum update. If that doesn't work, try "yum clean all" then "yum
update". Send us the output if the update fails.

Chris





From srcfoo at gmail.com  Thu Jan 11 14:51:12 2007
From: srcfoo at gmail.com (Eric Peterson)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:51:12 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Documentation Server
In-Reply-To: <101e49ea0701110737w4b9ec6afw5582ed9aaa5a3e7d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <101e49ea0701110737w4b9ec6afw5582ed9aaa5a3e7d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <579c6fd30701111251x34dc9012s9e68c9213238e5d4@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/11/07, Joey Rockhold <joey.rockhold at gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't know if what I am looking for is a Wiki product, or what.  If anyone
> has any ideas on the best way to pool all this information together, it
> would be appreciated.  We do run an internal linux server, but only because
> I set it up and maintain it, otherwise this is a fully Microsoft shop
> (though we have a linux ip phone system going now).  So any products
> mentioned either has to run in a web browser if it is linux based, or on
> Windows desktops.  I would prefer it run in the linux box myself.

A local company, mindtouch, sells a product that should do what you
want. Check them out here:

mindtouch.com

-Eric


From srcfoo at gmail.com  Thu Jan 11 15:04:06 2007
From: srcfoo at gmail.com (Eric Peterson)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:04:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Latest FC5 kernel
In-Reply-To: <1168286994.11186.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1168286994.11186.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <579c6fd30701111304s27e05dc9y1263f4914713a07c@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/8/07, Randy Clarksean <rclark at lakesplus.com> wrote:
> I may be just a bit befuddled here ... but ... I am trying to upgrade my
> kernel on a Fedora Core 5 system.
>
> I tried using YUM and it did not fly all that well.  There was an error
> message while trying to install the kernel ... some error related to
> grub ... searched the web, but no luck.
>
> so ... I run rpm -qa | grep kernel  and I get
>
>         [rclark at dualasus ~]$ rpm -qa | grep kernel
>         kernel-smp-2.6.15-1.2054_FC5
>         kernel-smp-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5
>
> The 2.16.15 version is what I have now.  But ... the grub.conf shows
> nothing related to 2.6.18 ... which I would like to try and install.  I
> tried going out to download the SRC and work at it from that way ... but
> none of the repositories go past the 2.6.15-1.2054.
>
> How does the 2.6.18-1 show up ... how do i install it properly ... and
> why does it not show up out on the repositories?
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Randy

Hi Randy,

For whatever reason, the rpm package couldn't update your
/boot/grub/menu.lst (that's a sym link to /boot/grub/grub.conf in case
your machine is missing it).

First check that it created a new, up-to-date initrd image for the new
kernel. You should find an initrd image file in /boot that has the
kernel version number after it. So it should look something like:

/boot/initrd-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5.img

If not, you'll need to create it by using the mkinitrd command like so:

mkinitrd /boot/initrd-2.6.18-1.2257.fc5.img <kernel-version>

Replace <kernel-version> with the directory name in /lib/modules/ that
matches the new kernel version. In your case it will probably be
2.6.18-1.2257.fc5.

Now update your /boot/grub/menu.lst file to include the kernel and
initrd image (I'm assuming the kernel is in the proper place since it
showes the RPM is installed). The simplest way to do that would be to
copy the existing entry for your older kernel and change the version
numbers to match the new kernel on the kernel and initrd lines. Don't
forget to change the title line to reflect the new kernel version.

That should do it.

Good luck!

Eric


From daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com  Thu Jan 11 15:06:06 2007
From: daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com (Dan Armbrust)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:06:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] mod_perl won't execute .pl scripts
In-Reply-To: <bada98250701081250m1768a4d7x71a0f96f2d54094b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <bada98250701081250m1768a4d7x71a0f96f2d54094b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <45A6A6BE.6090403@gmail.com>

Its probably a matter of adding the proper handlers for the file type in 
your httpd.conf file (assuming the modules are loaded already).

If you are seeing it parsed as a text file, the server just doesn't 
realize that it needs to send files with this extension into the module 
- so it guesses at the mime type, and treats it as a text file.

#
# AddHandler allows you to map certain file extensions to "handlers":
# actions unrelated to filetype. These can be either built into the server
# or added with the Action directive (see below)
#
# To use CGI scripts outside of ScriptAliased directories:
# (You will also need to add "ExecCGI" to the "Options" directive.)
#

#AddHandler cgi-script .cgi

I'm not sure on the specifics.  I've done it for php a number of times, 
but not perl.  It probably depends on how the perl module is put together.

For php, I have to do the following:

LoadModule php5_module        modules/libphp5.so

AddType application/x-httpd-php .php






-- 
****************************
Daniel Armbrust
Biomedical Informatics
Mayo Clinic Rochester
daniel.armbrust(at)mayo.edu
http://informatics.mayo.edu/


From sac at cheesecake.org  Thu Jan 11 15:13:27 2007
From: sac at cheesecake.org (Sidney Cammeresi)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:13:27 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] RAID1 to RAID5 migration
In-Reply-To: <45A62F1C.9040204@charter.net>
References: <45A62F1C.9040204@charter.net>
Message-ID: <20070111211327.GA32233@cheesecake.org>

On Thu, 11 Jan 2007 at 06.35.40 -0600, Dave Alitz wrote:
> I'm starting with 4 drives.  Two active in the current mirror and two 
> unused. The process I'm considering:
> 
>     Fail and remove a drive from the current md mirror, leaving three 
> unused drives
>     Create a new RAID5 array
>     Add the new md RAID5 device as a member of the degraded mirror

RAID1 doesn't work the way you think it does.  You'll end up with a
degraded RAID1 made from a RAID5.  It will work though.

I recommend creating a degraded RAID5 from your two unused disks and
doing a copy to the new array.  After the data are copied, fail one disk
out of the old array and add it to the new array, which will cause parity
to be computed.  After that's done, nuke the old array and add the last
disk to the new array as a hot spare.

This way, you end up with one array composed of physical disks, and your
data are always in two places throughout the process.

-- 
Sidney CAMMERESI
http://www.cheesecake.org/sac/


From rwh at visi.com  Thu Jan 11 14:54:36 2007
From: rwh at visi.com (rwh)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:54:36 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Problem,
In-Reply-To: <34b4c76d0701100850s3036c918ybd3459765b5941a6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <34b4c76d0701100850s3036c918ybd3459765b5941a6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <45A6A40C.10700@visi.com>

You may want to take a look at pdftk (http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/)
and see if it can read and write the problem files which hopefully gives
you a valid pdf on output.

There are also some Perl modules that can read and write pdf files,
http://search.cpan.org/~antro/PDF-111/PDF.pm

I've used both fairly successfully to create/manage/manipulate a couple
of million pages of survey results and they are both pretty solid.

I think Ghostscript could also 'print' the pdfs to another pdf which
might clear out the errors as well. Finally, Imagemagick can do a
conversion from pdf -> ps -> pdf that might fix things as well, although
it is a lot slower than the other options.

--rick

G. Scott Walters wrote:
> I've got a couple hundred PDF files that have been malformed with some
> extra lines AFTER the EOF. This keeps them from being doing important
> things like printing, or displaying properly on some versions of
> Acrobat. Not all PDFs are necessarily effected with this issue...
> 
> Since these files are hosted on a linux server, I figured the proper
> tool to solve this problem would be PERL. The question is, how....if I
> open the file with a standard open function, won't it read the file
> til the EOF and not beyond?
> 
> I understand that SED might be helpful, but I'm sed-impaired, but I'm
> working on that.
> 
> Any thoughts or ideas?
> 



From admin at lctn.org  Thu Jan 11 10:38:55 2007
From: admin at lctn.org (admin at lctn.org)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 10:38:55 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] ppd for Konica
Message-ID: <36767.64.8.149.194.1168533535.squirrel@lctn.org>

I am trying to share a Konica Bizhub 350/250 through Ubuntu. I am having
difficulty finding the right driver. Anyone have a link to one that will
give me full function?

Raymond

-- 
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.



From david.alitz at charter.net  Thu Jan 11 16:29:05 2007
From: david.alitz at charter.net (Dave Alitz)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 16:29:05 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] RAID1 to RAID5 migration
In-Reply-To: <20070111211327.GA32233@cheesecake.org>
References: <45A62F1C.9040204@charter.net>
	<20070111211327.GA32233@cheesecake.org>
Message-ID: <45A6BA31.7000202@charter.net>

Thanks.  After playing with it I figured out I'd still have an md 
superblock for the mirrored array on my disk.  I was hoping I could 
accomplish everything without taking it offline -- I guess not.

P.S. - In case anyone is following along; I'm actually booting from a 
separate mirrored boot partition (/boot).  The RAID5 array holds /, 
/var, and /home.  I won't need to make any changes in GRUB since I'm 
leaving that array alone.  The last I heard, you can't boot from RAID5.

Sidney Cammeresi wrote:
> On Thu, 11 Jan 2007 at 06.35.40 -0600, Dave Alitz wrote:
>   
>> I'm starting with 4 drives.  Two active in the current mirror and two 
>> unused. The process I'm considering:
>>
>>     Fail and remove a drive from the current md mirror, leaving three 
>> unused drives
>>     Create a new RAID5 array
>>     Add the new md RAID5 device as a member of the degraded mirror
>>     
>
> RAID1 doesn't work the way you think it does.  You'll end up with a
> degraded RAID1 made from a RAID5.  It will work though.
>
> I recommend creating a degraded RAID5 from your two unused disks and
> doing a copy to the new array.  After the data are copied, fail one disk
> out of the old array and add it to the new array, which will cause parity
> to be computed.  After that's done, nuke the old array and add the last
> disk to the new array as a hot spare.
>
> This way, you end up with one array composed of physical disks, and your
> data are always in two places throughout the process.
>
>   


From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Wed Jan 10 05:06:02 2007
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 05:06:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200701101106.l0AB62O07004@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Sale

Subject: misc for sale

Have the following for sale:

Belkin OmniView SE 4-Port KVM - Comes with cables for 4 PC's and rack mount bracket  ($50)

IBM ServerRAID controller FRU# 76H6875   ($20)

SIIG UltraATA 133 PCI controller card   SC-PE4B12     ($15)

Promise ATA RAID controller FastTRAK SX4000  w/256MB RAM ($50)

Linksys Wireless-G Access Point Model: WAP54G  ($40  new in unopened box)

The following cards are free:
Adaptec AHA-2940/2940U SCSI controller
Adaptec AVA-2906 controller
Adaptec AHA-2940 Controller
3-Com  3c905-tx NIC (Qty:2)
USR internal ISA Sportster modem Model#0461
Internal ISA modem (unsure of make/model)

Seller Email address: sfertch at gmail dot com

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From dniesen at gmail.com  Thu Jan 11 17:35:21 2007
From: dniesen at gmail.com (Donovan Niesen)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 17:35:21 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Documentation Server
In-Reply-To: <579c6fd30701111251x34dc9012s9e68c9213238e5d4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <101e49ea0701110737w4b9ec6afw5582ed9aaa5a3e7d@mail.gmail.com>
	<579c6fd30701111251x34dc9012s9e68c9213238e5d4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <47f4d5e70701111535q792f8e7fy31a74779cfcad4a@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/11/07, Eric Peterson <srcfoo at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 1/11/07, Joey Rockhold <joey.rockhold at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I don't know if what I am looking for is a Wiki product, or what.  If anyone
> > has any ideas on the best way to pool all this information together, it
> > would be appreciated.  We do run an internal linux server, but only because
> > I set it up and maintain it, otherwise this is a fully Microsoft shop
> > (though we have a linux ip phone system going now).  So any products
> > mentioned either has to run in a web browser if it is linux based, or on
> > Windows desktops.  I would prefer it run in the linux box myself.
>
> A local company, mindtouch, sells a product that should do what you
> want. Check them out here:
>
> mindtouch.com
>
> -Eric
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

Looks like what they sell is just DekiWiki in a pre-configured server.
 The Wiki is pretty impressive and may do a lot of what you are
looking to do.  Here's a direct link:

http://www.opengarden.org/dekiwiki

Their demo is pretty impressive as well:

http://mindtouch.com/demo/index.html


-- 
Donovan Niesen


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Thu Jan 11 23:09:14 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:09:14 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Problem,
In-Reply-To: <34b4c76d0701100850s3036c918ybd3459765b5941a6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <34b4c76d0701100850s3036c918ybd3459765b5941a6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701112257220.23204@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Wed, 10 Jan 2007, G. Scott Walters wrote:

> I've got a couple hundred PDF files that have been malformed with some 
> extra lines AFTER the EOF. This keeps them from being doing important 
> things like printing, or displaying properly on some versions of 
> Acrobat. Not all PDFs are necessarily effected with this issue...
>
> Since these files are hosted on a linux server, I figured the proper 
> tool to solve this problem would be PERL. The question is, how....if I 
> open the file with a standard open function, won't it read the file til 
> the EOF and not beyond?
>
> I understand that SED might be helpful, but I'm sed-impaired, but I'm 
> working on that.


This should do it:

perl -pi -e 'BEGIN{undef $/} ; s/\A(.+?%%EOF).*\z/$1\n/gs' *.pdf

That will remove everything after the newline following the first %%EOF in 
all .pdf files in the default directory.  I tested it on some files and it 
worked.  It can be used if the file is not corrupted -- it will then leave 
the file unchanged except that it will change the date stamp.  It is 
pretty fast.

Best,
Mike


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Thu Jan 11 23:52:28 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:52:28 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Problem,
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701112257220.23204@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
References: <34b4c76d0701100850s3036c918ybd3459765b5941a6@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701112257220.23204@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701112348090.29403@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Thu, 11 Jan 2007, Mike Miller wrote:

> This should do it:
>
> perl -pi -e 'BEGIN{undef $/} ; s/\A(.+?%%EOF).*\z/$1\n/gs' *.pdf


By the way, that alters the files in place -- replacing the original with 
the repaired version.  If you want to retain the originals with a .bak 
extension, do this:

perl -pi.bak -e 'BEGIN{undef $/} ; s/\A(.+?%%EOF).*\z/$1\n/gs' *.pdf

Mike


From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com  Fri Jan 12 11:42:32 2007
From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:42:32 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] mod_perl won't execute .pl scripts
In-Reply-To: <bada98250701081250m1768a4d7x71a0f96f2d54094b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <bada98250701081250m1768a4d7x71a0f96f2d54094b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20070112174231.GA23155@mail.el-swifto.com>

On Mon, Jan 08, 2007 at 02:50:15PM -0600, Jordan Peacock wrote:
> We are running a SuSE 10.1 box w/ Apache 2.2.3 compiled w/ mod_perl
> 2.0.3 & perl 5.8.8.
> 
> When we attempt to view .pl/.cgi scripts in a browser, all we get is
> the text of the script displayed:
> 
> eg.
> 
> #!/usr/bin/perl
> print "Content-type: text/plain\r\n\r\n";
> print "Testing mod_perl installation!\n";

It's not clear from your message what configuration you're using.
Here's a link to the "quick start" document on the mod_perl homepage:

  http://perl.apache.org/docs/2.0/user/intro/start_fast.html

perhaps that can point you in the right direction....

-- 
trammell at el-swifto.com  9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58  FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5
Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG)      Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota


From hewhocutsdown at gmail.com  Fri Jan 12 11:50:14 2007
From: hewhocutsdown at gmail.com (Jordan Peacock)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:50:14 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] mod_perl won't execute .pl scripts
In-Reply-To: <20070112174231.GA23155@mail.el-swifto.com>
References: <bada98250701081250m1768a4d7x71a0f96f2d54094b@mail.gmail.com>
	<20070112174231.GA23155@mail.el-swifto.com>
Message-ID: <bada98250701120950t70d756b3l3daa307c7de182a0@mail.gmail.com>

We got it working. My colleague will follow up with an explanatory post.
Thanks everyone.

On 1/12/07, John J. Trammell <trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Jan 08, 2007 at 02:50:15PM -0600, Jordan Peacock wrote:
> > We are running a SuSE 10.1 box w/ Apache 2.2.3 compiled w/ mod_perl
> > 2.0.3 & perl 5.8.8.
> >
> > When we attempt to view .pl/.cgi scripts in a browser, all we get is
> > the text of the script displayed:
> >
> > eg.
> >
> > #!/usr/bin/perl
> > print "Content-type: text/plain\r\n\r\n";
> > print "Testing mod_perl installation!\n";
>
> It's not clear from your message what configuration you're using.
> Here's a link to the "quick start" document on the mod_perl homepage:
>
>   http://perl.apache.org/docs/2.0/user/intro/start_fast.html
>
> perhaps that can point you in the right direction....
>
> --
> trammell at el-swifto.com  9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58  FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5
> Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG)      Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>



-- 

Jordan Peacock
hewhocutsdown at gmail.com
hewhocutsdown.blogspot.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070112/f7f44f38/attachment.htm 

From dan at dandrake.org  Fri Jan 12 14:26:15 2007
From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:26:15 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
Message-ID: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>

I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
anything.

I'm working with a Python script that parses LaTeX documents [1], and
I'm using a regexp to find comments (beginning of line, any whitespace,
then a percent sign: "^\s*%"). But in the middle of the verbatim
environment, it shouldn't interpret anything as comments -- so I'd like
to use some sort of regexp that never matches, so I can just switch the
particular regexp object I'm using while parsing such an environment.

Any suggestions? I could randomly generate a bizarre string (like
"\y;$j[3o*6I[/W~fq\+l|~yr~as") which in practical terms will work, but
that's an ugly solution. 

TIA for the help.

Dan

  1. http://www.pps.jussieu.fr/~beffara/soft/rubber/
-- 
Ceci n'est pas une .signature.
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 189 bytes
Desc: Digital signature
Url : http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070112/82711922/attachment.pgp 

From tclug at freakzilla.com  Fri Jan 12 14:37:59 2007
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (Yaron)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:37:59 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0701121436480.23647@Rooster>

Can you do something like !"" ?


On Fri, 12 Jan 2007, Dan Drake wrote:

> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
> anything.
>
> I'm working with a Python script that parses LaTeX documents [1], and
> I'm using a regexp to find comments (beginning of line, any whitespace,
> then a percent sign: "^\s*%"). But in the middle of the verbatim
> environment, it shouldn't interpret anything as comments -- so I'd like
> to use some sort of regexp that never matches, so I can just switch the
> particular regexp object I'm using while parsing such an environment.
>
> Any suggestions? I could randomly generate a bizarre string (like
> "\y;$j[3o*6I[/W~fq\+l|~yr~as") which in practical terms will work, but
> that's an ugly solution.
>
> TIA for the help.
>
> Dan
>
>  1. http://www.pps.jussieu.fr/~beffara/soft/rubber/
> -- 
> Ceci n'est pas une .signature.
>


-Yaron

--


From andyzib at gmail.com  Fri Jan 12 14:41:28 2007
From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:41:28 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
Message-ID: <e3a54b020701121241x34af24bcyeb2d305d9eec096b@mail.gmail.com>

I'm no regexp expert, but !.* should the opposite of .* (match
everything and nothing).

-- 
Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0;
0 rows returned


From andyzib at gmail.com  Fri Jan 12 14:44:23 2007
From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:44:23 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <e3a54b020701121241x34af24bcyeb2d305d9eec096b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<e3a54b020701121241x34af24bcyeb2d305d9eec096b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e3a54b020701121244w372fc57s94904e4b77207a9f@mail.gmail.com>

Err, never mind me that's not right. It's been a long day and I left
my regex book at home. ;)

On 1/12/07, Andrew Zbikowski <andyzib at gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm no regexp expert, but !.* should the opposite of .* (match
> everything and nothing).

-- 
Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0;
0 rows returned


From andyzib at gmail.com  Fri Jan 12 14:57:48 2007
From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:57:48 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <e3a54b020701121244w372fc57s94904e4b77207a9f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<e3a54b020701121241x34af24bcyeb2d305d9eec096b@mail.gmail.com>
	<e3a54b020701121244w372fc57s94904e4b77207a9f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e3a54b020701121257y7e1197afyc511328a4e5b4b71@mail.gmail.com>

OK, I'm willing to try sticking my foot in my mouth one more time. ;-)

Negative lookahead if you want to match something not followed by
something else. Like if you wanted to find a q that wasn't followed by
a u: q(?!u)

So say we want to match anything zero or more times that isn't
followed by anything zero or more times...

.*(?!.*)

I can't find anything that the above regex will match, and if I change
it to a positive look ahead .*(?=.*) it matches everything...

It might work. Good luck.

-- 
Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0;
0 rows returned


From aristophrenic at warpmail.net  Fri Jan 12 14:56:46 2007
From: aristophrenic at warpmail.net (Isaac Atilano)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:56:46 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0701121436480.23647@Rooster>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64.0701121436480.23647@Rooster>
Message-ID: <1168635406.29929.1169005671@webmail.messagingengine.com>

Wouldn't that match everything?


----- Original message -----
From: "Yaron" <tclug at freakzilla.com>
To: "TCLUG" <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:37:59 -0600 (CST)
Subject: Re: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?

Can you do something like !"" ?


On Fri, 12 Jan 2007, Dan Drake wrote:

> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
> anything.
>
> I'm working with a Python script that parses LaTeX documents [1], and
> I'm using a regexp to find comments (beginning of line, any whitespace,
> then a percent sign: "^\s*%"). But in the middle of the verbatim
> environment, it shouldn't interpret anything as comments -- so I'd like
> to use some sort of regexp that never matches, so I can just switch the
> particular regexp object I'm using while parsing such an environment.
>
> Any suggestions? I could randomly generate a bizarre string (like
> "\y;$j[3o*6I[/W~fq\+l|~yr~as") which in practical terms will work, but
> that's an ugly solution.
>
> TIA for the help.
>
> Dan
>
>  1. http://www.pps.jussieu.fr/~beffara/soft/rubber/
> -- 
> Ceci n'est pas une .signature.
>


-Yaron

--

_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From s.earl.martin at gmail.com  Fri Jan 12 15:17:36 2007
From: s.earl.martin at gmail.com (Sam Martin)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 15:17:36 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
Message-ID: <d9a50e890701121317t56f28efdt864ec9beaf664469@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/12/07, Dan Drake wrote:
> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
> anything.

How about "(?!)" ?

For the record, I googled '"regular expression" "never matches"', and
came up with the following from a paper about creating a regex
debugger in perl (http://perl.plover.com/Rx/paper/):

". . . (?!) is a pattern that never matches anything, so when the
regex engine reaches it, it is forced to backtrack. "

sm


From aristophrenic at warpmail.net  Fri Jan 12 14:55:02 2007
From: aristophrenic at warpmail.net (Isaac Atilano)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:55:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
Message-ID: <1168635302.29746.1169003937@webmail.messagingengine.com>

This means that you know when you're in the verbatim area since you'll
have to know when to switch the regex object.
With this knowledge block out the "comment found" part of your code when
you're in the verbatim environment. The implementation is up to your
imagination.


----- Original message -----
From: "Dan Drake" <dan at dandrake.org>
To: "tclug-list at mn-linux.org" <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:26:15 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?

I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
anything.

I'm working with a Python script that parses LaTeX documents [1], and
I'm using a regexp to find comments (beginning of line, any whitespace,
then a percent sign: "^\s*%"). But in the middle of the verbatim
environment, it shouldn't interpret anything as comments -- so I'd like
to use some sort of regexp that never matches, so I can just switch the
particular regexp object I'm using while parsing such an environment.

Any suggestions? I could randomly generate a bizarre string (like
"\y;$j[3o*6I[/W~fq\+l|~yr~as") which in practical terms will work, but
that's an ugly solution. 

TIA for the help.

Dan

  1. http://www.pps.jussieu.fr/~beffara/soft/rubber/
-- 
Ceci n'est pas une .signature.


From srcfoo at gmail.com  Fri Jan 12 16:05:29 2007
From: srcfoo at gmail.com (Eric Peterson)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:05:29 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
Message-ID: <579c6fd30701121405ve258418heac22c2ea900bcc5@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/12/07, Dan Drake <dan at dandrake.org> wrote:
> then a percent sign: "^\s*%"). But in the middle of the verbatim
> environment, it shouldn't interpret anything as comments -- so I'd like

Dan,

I don't understand why you'd want to waste cpu cycles checking a
regular expression if you know that you are either in the "verbatim
environment" or not, which you imply you know if you can switch re
objects.

If you're using readlines() on the file object to parse it, couldn't
you simply set a flag when you find the start of your verbatim section
and unset the flag when you find the end? Then as long as that flag is
set you'd simply call "continue" to get to the next line after
checking for the end of the verbatim section.

How do you know that you're in the "verbatim environment"?

Cheers!

Eric


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Fri Jan 12 18:31:43 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:31:43 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <d9a50e890701121317t56f28efdt864ec9beaf664469@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<d9a50e890701121317t56f28efdt864ec9beaf664469@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701121823260.29136@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Fri, 12 Jan 2007, Sam Martin wrote:

> On 1/12/07, Dan Drake wrote:
>> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
>> anything.
>
> How about "(?!)" ?
>
> For the record, I googled '"regular expression" "never matches"', and 
> came up with the following from a paper about creating a regex debugger 
> in perl (http://perl.plover.com/Rx/paper/):
>
> ". . . (?!) is a pattern that never matches anything, so when the regex 
> engine reaches it, it is forced to backtrack. "


In case anyone is interested in more on this, from "man perlre":

      `(?!pattern)'
                A zero-width negative look-ahead assertion.  For
                example `/foo(?!bar)/' matches any occurrence of
                "foo" that isn't followed by "bar".  Note however
                that look-ahead and look-behind are NOT the same
                thing.  You cannot use this for look-behind.

                If you are looking for a "bar" that isn't preceded
                by a "foo", `/(?!foo)bar/' will not do what you
                want.  That's because the `(?!foo)' is just saying
                that the next thing cannot be "foo"--and it's not,
                it's a "bar", so "foobar" will match.  You would
                have to do something like `/(?!foo)...bar/' for
                that.   We say "like" because there's the case of
                your "bar" not having three characters before it.
                You could cover that this way:
                `/(?:(?!foo)...|^.{0,2})bar/'.  Sometimes it's
                still easier just to say:

                    if (/bar/ && $` !~ /foo$/)

                For look-behind see below.


From esper at sherohman.org  Sat Jan 13 12:20:59 2007
From: esper at sherohman.org (Dave Sherohman)
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:20:59 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <d9a50e890701121317t56f28efdt864ec9beaf664469@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<d9a50e890701121317t56f28efdt864ec9beaf664469@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20070113182059.GS6486@genma.sherohman.org>

On Fri, Jan 12, 2007 at 03:17:36PM -0600, Sam Martin wrote:
> ". . . (?!) is a pattern that never matches anything, so when the
> regex engine reaches it, it is forced to backtrack. "

Aye, and that's the flaw I see in this scheme...  Backtracking.
Whenever the regex engine hits the unmatchable (part of) your regex,
it will happily back up, be a little less greedy, and try again to
find a match.  This can be a very expensive process, especially if your
unmatchable bit is preceded by (or includes) a .* or similar token.

Isaac and Eric have the right idea:  Don't use an unmatchable regex, use
a flag that tells you not to run a regex at all.  It'll be much faster.

-- 
I would rather be exposed to the inconvenience attending too much Liberty
than those attending too small degree of it.
  - Thomas Jefferson


From vandongend at yahoo.com  Sat Jan 13 14:10:47 2007
From: vandongend at yahoo.com (David Van Dongen)
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:10:47 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Need  help installing on a ThinkPad
Message-ID: <855782.75852.qm@web53608.mail.yahoo.com>


I have two questions:

I need help installing Ubuntu on my ThinkPad.  It does
not recognize the external CD-ROM as a boot device,
and sbootmgr does not see it either.  Any suggestions?

When does the group meet?

David


 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate 
in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q&A.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545367


From dan at dandrake.org  Sat Jan 13 14:30:56 2007
From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake)
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 14:30:56 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
Message-ID: <20070113203056.GA9587@dandrake.org>

Thanks for all the suggestions! I'll try some of those and see what
works.

Dan

-- 
Ceci n'est pas une .signature.
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 189 bytes
Desc: Digital signature
Url : http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070113/a794f816/attachment.pgp 

From slushpupie at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 08:44:41 2007
From: slushpupie at gmail.com ( )
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:44:41 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
Message-ID: <ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/12/07, Dan Drake <dan at dandrake.org> wrote:
> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
> anything.

Ive used  $^ before.  But it does depend on how you are using it.  the
end-of-string followed by a beginning-of-string can show up if $ and ^
match new-lines.



-- 
Jay Kline
http://www.slushpupie.com/


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Mon Jan 15 09:15:59 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:15:59 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007,   wrote:

> On 1/12/07, Dan Drake <dan at dandrake.org> wrote:
>
>> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match 
>> anything.
>
> Ive used $^ before.  But it does depend on how you are using it.  the 
> end-of-string followed by a beginning-of-string can show up if $ and ^ 
> match new-lines.


I don't understand how that can fail.  How can $ and ^ match newlines? 
Is that something that can be affected by command line arguments?  When I 
tried it, it seemed to work very well, so I like your idea.  It does not 
match anything in a string of consecutive newlines, for example.

Mike


From slushpupie at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 09:41:45 2007
From: slushpupie at gmail.com ( )
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:41:45 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <ace41e70701150741p4ba228cfr592df602fa59d50a@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/15/07, Mike Miller <mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu> wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Jan 2007,   wrote:
>
> > On 1/12/07, Dan Drake <dan at dandrake.org> wrote:
> >
> >> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
> >> anything.
> >
> > Ive used $^ before.  But it does depend on how you are using it.  the
> > end-of-string followed by a beginning-of-string can show up if $ and ^
> > match new-lines.
>
>
> I don't understand how that can fail.  How can $ and ^ match newlines?
> Is that something that can be affected by command line arguments?  When I
> tried it, it seemed to work very well, so I like your idea.  It does not
> match anything in a string of consecutive newlines, for example.
>

Im not a big python person, but in perl if you add the m modifier for
"multiple lines" it changes the definition of ^ and $ to match
newlines.  I assumed python would have something like it.  As long as
they keep their standard definitions, though, you should never find
the end of a string before the beginning.

-- 
Jay Kline
http://www.slushpupie.com/


From clay at fandre.com  Mon Jan 15 10:11:05 2007
From: clay at fandre.com (Clay Fandre)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:11:05 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] TCLUG Volunteers
Message-ID: <45ABA799.1090208@fandre.com>

As most of you know, the TCLUG meetings has been pretty inactive over
the last year or so. This has been because of the lack of time to get
things coordinated, mainly because of my kids taking up all of my free
time. But I would like to get the group back on it's feet and back to a
point where we have regular monthly (or bi-monthly) meetings. But in
order to do that I need some help. So if anyone is willing to donate
their time to the cause, please let me know. Here are some of the areas
I would like help with:

1. Coordinating monthly meetings. (Scheduling/Booking meeting locations)
2. Soliciting speakers and/or deciding topics
3. Special events coordinator (installfests, other local events)

If you are interested in helping out, please let me know. If you do
volunteer, you will get a free lifetime membership to the TCLUG and your
name on the tclug website if you desire. How can you pass that up?

Thanks and happy Linux'ing!

-- Clay


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Mon Jan 15 10:14:51 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:14:51 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <ace41e70701150741p4ba228cfr592df602fa59d50a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org> 
	<ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com> 
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
	<ace41e70701150741p4ba228cfr592df602fa59d50a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151011360.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007,   wrote:

> On 1/15/07, Mike Miller <mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu> wrote:
>> On Mon, 15 Jan 2007,   wrote:
>> 
>> > On 1/12/07, Dan Drake <dan at dandrake.org> wrote:
>> >
>> >> I'm looking for a regular expression that's guaranteed to never match
>> >> anything.
>> >
>> > Ive used $^ before.  But it does depend on how you are using it.  the
>> > end-of-string followed by a beginning-of-string can show up if $ and ^
>> > match new-lines.
>> 
>> 
>> I don't understand how that can fail.  How can $ and ^ match newlines?
>> Is that something that can be affected by command line arguments?  When I
>> tried it, it seemed to work very well, so I like your idea.  It does not
>> match anything in a string of consecutive newlines, for example.
>
>
> Im not a big python person, but in perl if you add the m modifier for 
> "multiple lines" it changes the definition of ^ and $ to match newlines. 
> I assumed python would have something like it.  As long as they keep 
> their standard definitions, though, you should never find the end of a 
> string before the beginning.


I had forgotten that this was about a python regexp.  Still, I mostly use 
perl and I am interested personally in understanding this better.  I can't 
get it to mess up.  For example:

# echo 'abcd efgh' | gawk '{print $1"\n\n"$2}' | perl -pe 's/$^/X/ms'
abcd

efgh

What am I doing wrong?  I can't figure out how to get "$^" to match 
anything.

Mike


From slushpupie at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 11:56:57 2007
From: slushpupie at gmail.com ( )
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:56:57 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151011360.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
	<ace41e70701150741p4ba228cfr592df602fa59d50a@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151011360.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <ace41e70701150956j43afe13ds6cff769b2dcb255@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/15/07, Mike Miller <mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu> wrote:
> I had forgotten that this was about a python regexp.  Still, I mostly use
> perl and I am interested personally in understanding this better.  I can't
> get it to mess up.  For example:
>
> # echo 'abcd efgh' | gawk '{print $1"\n\n"$2}' | perl -pe 's/$^/X/ms'
> abcd
>
> efgh
>
> What am I doing wrong?  I can't figure out how to get "$^" to match
> anything.

You are right, I cant get it to match either.  Though, I think it
should.  (Ive never *needed* to match that before)  If you are trying
to match end-of-line followed by beginning-of-line, that should be a
perfectly valid sequence when you have a few blank lines in there, as
per your example.  So how would one go about matching that? In a more
"rational" case, you should be able to something like this:

$_ = "foo\n\n\nbar";
if(/^$^$/ms) {  print "it has 2 blank lines in a row\n"; }

But that dosnt seem to match either.  Now you have me wondering...


-- 
Jay Kline
http://www.slushpupie.com/


From slushpupie at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 12:03:48 2007
From: slushpupie at gmail.com ( )
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:03:48 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <ace41e70701150956j43afe13ds6cff769b2dcb255@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org>
	<ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
	<ace41e70701150741p4ba228cfr592df602fa59d50a@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151011360.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
	<ace41e70701150956j43afe13ds6cff769b2dcb255@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ace41e70701151003w196dddc7u61fc236424d4c10@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/15/07, slushpupie at gmail.com <slushpupie at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 1/15/07, Mike Miller <mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu> wrote:
> > I had forgotten that this was about a python regexp.  Still, I mostly use
> > perl and I am interested personally in understanding this better.  I can't
> > get it to mess up.  For example:
> >
> > # echo 'abcd efgh' | gawk '{print $1"\n\n"$2}' | perl -pe 's/$^/X/ms'
> > abcd
> >
> > efgh
> >
> > What am I doing wrong?  I can't figure out how to get "$^" to match
> > anything.
>

Bah.  After a little more careful reading, ^ and $ match just before
and after a newline.  Not the newline itself.  Therefore it is
impossible to have $^ match anything.

-- 
Jay Kline
http://www.slushpupie.com/


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Mon Jan 15 12:08:01 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:08:01 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <ace41e70701150956j43afe13ds6cff769b2dcb255@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org> 
	<ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com> 
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu> 
	<ace41e70701150741p4ba228cfr592df602fa59d50a@mail.gmail.com> 
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151011360.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu>
	<ace41e70701150956j43afe13ds6cff769b2dcb255@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151204200.20461@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007,   wrote:

> On 1/15/07, Mike Miller <mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu> wrote:
>> I had forgotten that this was about a python regexp.  Still, I mostly use
>> perl and I am interested personally in understanding this better.  I can't
>> get it to mess up.  For example:
>> 
>> # echo 'abcd efgh' | gawk '{print $1"\n\n"$2}' | perl -pe 's/$^/X/ms'
>> abcd
>> 
>> efgh
>> 
>> What am I doing wrong?  I can't figure out how to get "$^" to match
>> anything.
>
> You are right, I cant get it to match either.  Though, I think it
> should.  (Ive never *needed* to match that before)  If you are trying
> to match end-of-line followed by beginning-of-line, that should be a
> perfectly valid sequence when you have a few blank lines in there, as
> per your example.  So how would one go about matching that? In a more
> "rational" case, you should be able to something like this:
>
> $_ = "foo\n\n\nbar";
> if(/^$^$/ms) {  print "it has 2 blank lines in a row\n"; }
>
> But that dosnt seem to match either.  Now you have me wondering...


Of course, the good thing about this is that you didn't want it to match! 
The idea was to find a string that matched nothing.  So far, so good.  ;-)

Also, "$^" is way better than "(?!)" because "$^" is presumably always 
very fast.

Mike


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Mon Jan 15 12:08:40 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:08:40 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] regular expression that never matches?
In-Reply-To: <ace41e70701151003w196dddc7u61fc236424d4c10@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20070112202615.GA8259@dandrake.org> 
	<ace41e70701150644o77c4f636t3bca5122c1515547@mail.gmail.com> 
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701150911190.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu> 
	<ace41e70701150741p4ba228cfr592df602fa59d50a@mail.gmail.com> 
	<Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151011360.940@taxa.epi.umn.edu> 
	<ace41e70701150956j43afe13ds6cff769b2dcb255@mail.gmail.com>
	<ace41e70701151003w196dddc7u61fc236424d4c10@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701151208110.20461@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007,   wrote:

> On 1/15/07, slushpupie at gmail.com <slushpupie at gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 1/15/07, Mike Miller <mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu> wrote:
>> > I had forgotten that this was about a python regexp.  Still, I mostly 
>> use
>> > perl and I am interested personally in understanding this better.  I 
>> can't
>> > get it to mess up.  For example:
>> >
>> > # echo 'abcd efgh' | gawk '{print $1"\n\n"$2}' | perl -pe 's/$^/X/ms'
>> > abcd
>> >
>> > efgh
>> >
>> > What am I doing wrong?  I can't figure out how to get "$^" to match
>> > anything.
>> 
>
> Bah.  After a little more careful reading, ^ and $ match just before
> and after a newline.  Not the newline itself.  Therefore it is
> impossible to have $^ match anything.


Excellent.  That is what I thought.  So I think you have the best answer 
so far to the question.

Mike


From jesse_s at beezwax.net  Wed Jan  3 10:15:53 2007
From: jesse_s at beezwax.net (Jesse Sanford)
Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:15:53 -0800
Subject: [tclug-list] PHP misery with Apache and MySQL on Debian Sarge
Message-ID: <06102789-4560-40CB-A3A8-E16EA273CFA8@beezwax.net>


Hi Steve,

I've been seeing exactly the same problem you described in your post  
to the tclug-list on July 6, right down to the same function calls.   
Also using debian packages php4-mysql, etc., and Apache 1.3 from sarge.

Did you ever solve this problem?  Anyone else report it that you found?

Thanks very much for your help!  (Open Source rocks.)







--
Jesse Sanford <jesse_s at beezwax.net>
Infrastructure Architect
beezwax datatools, inc.
486 Mandana Blvd., Ste. 6
Oakland, CA  94610
direct (415)794-4393 office (510) 835-4483
www.beezwax.net




-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070103/daa1884d/attachment-0001.htm 

From becca at ilsr.org  Fri Jan  5 14:34:11 2007
From: becca at ilsr.org (Becca Vargo Daggett)
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:34:11 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Community Discussion of Municipal Wireless
Message-ID: <FBEA3822-B735-4927-9C08-4330B26031EF@ilsr.org>

Please join Concordia's College of Business and Organizational  
Leadership for a community discussion of municipal wireless. This  
event will use futurist Joel Barker's tool for understanding change.  
The "Implications Wheel" draws upon group wisdom to quickly and  
effectively uncover the short and long term implications of any change.

Topic: Should Wi-Fi in Saint Paul be publicly or privately owned?
When: 3:30-6 p.m., Jan. 17, 2007
Where: Library & Technology Center, Concordia University
Hosted by: Concordia University College of Business and  
Organizational Leadership

Participants will uncover second- and third-order implications of  
citywide wireless projects. Saint Paul is the example, but residents  
and decision makers in all metro cities can learn from the exercise.

The event is free, but you must register online at:
http://www.csp.edu/CBOL/strategicdiscovery/

Send questions to:
strategicdiscovery at csp.edu

Joel Barker - "We did a wheel for NASA on a project they had been  
considering for a year. In three hours, our team had identified a  
dozen implications as important as any their experts had uncovered.  
The director had to start over in his assessment of the project."

Read a Pioneer Press article about Joel Barker and the Implications  
Wheel:
http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/business/special_packages/ 
biz_home/15924801.htm

Register online at:
http://www.csp.edu/CBOL/strategicdiscovery/


-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070105/1cb61e1d/attachment-0001.htm 

From dutchwaffles at gmail.com  Sun Jan 14 21:55:30 2007
From: dutchwaffles at gmail.com (Rey Willems)
Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:55:30 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New install fest
Message-ID: <aef7ce190701141955u4fe19f93s9ea453193a191188@mail.gmail.com>

 Hello


I would like some help in the switch to linux then I found the site of the
minneapolis user group. I have been looking to convert to Linux how ever
I'm not too great computer so I would like a little help.  IF any one would
like to help me convert please let me know.

I would be interested in converting my PC.  I am also interested in possibly
converting my x box to a Linux machine if you know anyone that has been
involved with that.

Thank you for the time,  Ryan
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070114/7ba13e01/attachment-0001.htm 

From swaite at sbn-services.com  Mon Jan 15 13:33:48 2007
From: swaite at sbn-services.com (Sean Waite)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:33:48 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
Message-ID: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>

I have been 
calling around to different services without luck so far trying to get a 
decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static IP. So far the 
mainstream companies like Qwest only offer this with their Business 
services, which can not be installed at a residence. I remember years back 
this was not the case, but since I have used cable for my residence for so 
long I am somewhat behind the times. Is it still possible to get a decent 
DSL service with static IP? The reason I need static is I am looking to host 

my own e-mail and web, which not only requires just a static IP but a PTR 
record as well. I had thought that my present Comcast could do this since 
they really do not chance the IP address, but they are not going to do a PTR 

record for you. Any help on what I can do would be much appreciated










Sean Waite
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070115/eaa7edaf/attachment.htm 

From nate at refried.org  Mon Jan 15 13:46:53 2007
From: nate at refried.org (Nate Straz)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:46:53 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <20070115194653.GB3885@refried.org>

On Mon, Jan 15, 2007 at 01:33:48PM -0600, Sean Waite wrote:
> I have been 
> calling around to different services without luck so far trying to get a 
> decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static IP. So far the 

Check out visi.com.

http://home.visi.com/services/dsl/dsl_standard.html

Nate


From srcfoo at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 13:56:16 2007
From: srcfoo at gmail.com (Eric Peterson)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:56:16 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <579c6fd30701151156k6b785aa6xf5e105a07af93749@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/15/07, Sean Waite <swaite at sbn-services.com> wrote:
>
>
> I have been calling around to different services without luck so far trying
> to get a decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static IP. So far the
> mainstream companies like Qwest only offer this with their Business
> services, which can not be installed at a residence. I remember years back
> this was not the case, but since I have used cable for my residence for so
> long I am somewhat behind the times. Is it still possible to get a decent
> DSL service with static IP? The reason I need static is I am looking to host
> my own e-mail and web, which not only requires just a static IP but a PTR
> record as well. I had thought that my present Comcast could do this since
> they really do not chance the IP address, but they are not going to do a PTR
> record for you. Any help on what I can do would be much appreciated

Have you looked at Comcast's business service? They offer static IP
and the prices are pretty good depending on what you need. Their
lowest end service is just slightly more expensive then the normal
residential service.

The best bang for you buck IMO is at the 4M down/ 768K up for $90.
Don't quote me on those numbers, but I think they're close.

-Eric


From tclug at natecarlson.com  Mon Jan 15 14:00:11 2007
From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:00:11 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.63.0701151359330.6301@tungsten.msp.technicality.org>

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, Sean Waite wrote:
> The catch is I need a static IP. So far the mainstream companies like 
> Qwest only offer this with their Business services, which can not be 
> installed at a residence.

Qwest will install business services at a residence; they charge something 
like $13/mo for the ISP service, IIRC.

I also highly recommend ipHouse - http://www.ipHouse.com. Tell 'em I sent 
you.  :)

------------------------------------------------------------------------
| nate carlson | natecars at natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com |
|       depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981            |
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 13:59:38 2007
From: daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com (Dan Armbrust)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:59:38 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <45ABDD2A.1030401@gmail.com>

Could you get by using something like http://www.dyndns.com/services/ ?

I've used them for quite some time (for free!) to get a name to map back 
to my dynamic comcast address.

They have fairly cheap pay services for more advanced needs.  Probably a 
lot cheaper than business package dsl.

Dan


-- 
****************************
Daniel Armbrust
Biomedical Informatics
Mayo Clinic Rochester
daniel.armbrust(at)mayo.edu
http://informatics.mayo.edu/


From sos at zjod.net  Mon Jan 15 13:58:52 2007
From: sos at zjod.net (Steve Siegfried)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:58:52 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <200701151958.l0FJwqqZ006676@zjod.net>

Sean Waite wrote:
> 
> I have been 
> calling around to different services without luck so far trying to get a 
> decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static IP. So far the 
> mainstream companies like Qwest only offer this with their Business 
> services, which can not be installed at a residence. I remember years back 
> this was not the case, but since I have used cable for my residence for so 
> long I am somewhat behind the times. Is it still possible to get a decent 
> DSL service with static IP? The reason I need static is I am looking to host 
> 
> my own e-mail and web, which not only requires just a static IP but a PTR 
> record as well. I had thought that my present Comcast could do this since 
> they really do not chance the IP address, but they are not going to do a PTR 
> 
> record for you. Any help on what I can do would be much appreciated
> 
> Sean Waite

Actually, you don't need a static IP to run an email or http server.
There are dynamic DNS servers out there that let you send/receive
email as "sean at Waite.org" (or whatever) and host a web server at
your domain, too.  Google "Dynamic DNS service" (with the quotes)
for a list of suppliers.

I'm using www.tzo.com dynamic DNS service.  Been with 'em for 5+ years
and it works great... oh yeah... my net-tone supplier is Comcast.

Costs involved are:
	- monthly Comcast service (you're already paying this)
	- a domain name ($10-35/year)
	- a DNS forwarding agent ($0-60/year)

Hope this helps,

-S
 sos at zjod.net
 http://zjod.net


From drue at therub.org  Mon Jan 15 13:53:46 2007
From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:53:46 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <20070115195346.GR37321@therub.org>

On Mon, Jan 15, 2007 at 01:33:48PM -0600, Sean Waite wrote:
> 
>    I have been calling around to different services without luck so far
>    trying to get a decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static
>    IP. So far the mainstream companies like Qwest only offer this with
>    their Business services, which can not be installed at a residence. I
>    remember years back this was not the case, but since I have used cable
>    for my residence for so long I am somewhat behind the times. Is it
>    still possible to get a decent DSL service with static IP? The reason
>    I need static is I am looking to host my own e-mail and web, which not
>    only requires just a static IP but a PTR record as well. I had thought
>    that my present Comcast could do this since they really do not chance
>    the IP address, but they are not going to do a PTR record for you. Any
>    help on what I can do would be much appreciated

This topic seems to come up every 6-9 months..  

If you have Qwest for telephone service, which it sounds like you do, I
can *highly* recommend IPHouse.  Visi is also very good.  They will set
you up with a static, or many statics - PTR, the whole shabang. 

If you're stuck in sprint land, like me, ..  No Dice.  

Dan


From sos at zjod.net  Mon Jan 15 14:16:29 2007
From: sos at zjod.net (Steve Siegfried)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:16:29 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] X-Greylist headers?
Message-ID: <200701152016.l0FKGTXP011876@zjod.net>


Hey, what's the deal with TCLUG email headers like:
	> X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.4
and
	> X-Greylist: delayed 00:05:08 by SQLgrey-1.7.4

Seems like some of the folks posting here are more equal than others.

-S


From radke at winternet.com  Mon Jan 15 14:26:06 2007
From: radke at winternet.com (Joshua Radke)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:26:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.63.0701151359330.6301@tungsten.msp.technicality.org>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.63.0701151359330.6301@tungsten.msp.technicality.org>
Message-ID: <op.tl7ppsy9eclzwf@jradke.gallipot.com>

Hrm, I am just in the process of setting up a FC6 machine at home, spurred
by the sudden appearance of quest DSL in our neighborhood (I was thrilled
to get off of Comcast's terms of service).  I have the residential
service, and pay $5.95/month for a static IP.  They will provide
a single reverse DNS entry for your static IP (accessible from their
website tools).  It may be that they're being more 'generous' because of
their new presense in the neighborhood, I'm not sure.


On Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:00:11 -0600, Nate Carlson <tclug at natecarlson.com>  
wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, Sean Waite wrote:
>> The catch is I need a static IP. So far the mainstream companies like
>> Qwest only offer this with their Business services, which can not be
>> installed at a residence.
>
> Qwest will install business services at a residence; they charge  
> something
> like $13/mo for the ISP service, IIRC.
>
> I also highly recommend ipHouse - http://www.ipHouse.com. Tell 'em I sent
> you.  :)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> | nate carlson | natecars at natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com |
> |       depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981            |
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From sfertch at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 14:27:15 2007
From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:27:15 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <20070115195346.GR37321@therub.org>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
	<20070115195346.GR37321@therub.org>
Message-ID: <67f3084a0701151227n4367341an4986ddbe4a25d8cf@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/15/07, Dan Rue <drue at therub.org> wrote:
>
> This topic seems to come up every 6-9 months..
>
> If you have Qwest for telephone service, which it sounds like you do, I
> can *highly* recommend IPHouse.  Visi is also very good.  They will set
> you up with a static, or many statics - PTR, the whole shabang.
>
> If you're stuck in sprint land, like me, ..  No Dice.
>

You can get static IP's with Qwest and you don't even need a business
account to do it:

Qwest internet basic   $29.99 to $49.99 a month IIRC for the line
depending on speed
$10.99 for ISP services (no e-mail, website, etc)
$14.99 for a block of 8 static IP's.

I just dropped my static IP's from Qwest which I've had for over 3
years.  Aside from having a buried line go bad during heavy rains a
couple years ago, and some headaches of moving DSL services from one
phoneline to the other, I've never had a problem with Qwest service.

Some people just absolutely hate them and will bitch about anything
because they don't like Qwest.  Then again, many of these same people
are those that will find something to bitch about regardless of what
it is.

-- 
-Shawn

-Nemo me impune lacessit.  Ne Obliviscaris..


From tim at filn.net  Mon Jan 15 14:16:13 2007
From: tim at filn.net (Tim Erlin)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:16:13 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <45ABE10D.2020406@filn.net>

www.speakeasy.net

Nationwide DSL service, also hosting and VoIP. Traditionally good
service with technical folks. They also don't balk when you're talking
to support and they find our you're on Linux.

--Tim

Sean Waite wrote:
> I have been calling around to different services without luck so far
> trying to get a decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static IP.
> So far the mainstream companies like Qwest only offer this with their
> Business services, which can not be installed at a residence. I remember
> years back this was not the case, but since I have used cable for my
> residence for so long I am somewhat behind the times. Is it still
> possible to get a decent DSL service with static IP? The reason I need
> static is I am looking to host my own e-mail and web, which not only
> requires just a static IP but a PTR record as well. I had thought that
> my present Comcast could do this since they really do not chance the IP
> address, but they are not going to do a PTR record for you. Any help on
> what I can do would be much appreciated
> 
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
>  
> 
>  
> Sean Waite
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

-- 
-| Tim Erlin
-| tim at filn.net
-| http://www.filn.net


From h.iverson at gmail.com  Mon Jan 15 14:42:03 2007
From: h.iverson at gmail.com (Harlan Iverson)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:42:03 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X-Greylist headers?
In-Reply-To: <200701152016.l0FKGTXP011876@zjod.net>
References: <200701152016.l0FKGTXP011876@zjod.net>
Message-ID: <25097ca30701151242t3720d847o3ec6352e850b8d6b@mail.gmail.com>

Usually grey list delays will only happen on somebody's first email. I don't
kow the history behind the emails those headers were attached to, but my bet
would be that the first is a known poster while the second is a first-time
poster.

On 1/15/07, Steve Siegfried <sos at zjod.net> wrote:
>
>
> Hey, what's the deal with TCLUG email headers like:
>        > X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.4
> and
>        > X-Greylist: delayed 00:05:08 by SQLgrey-1.7.4
>
> Seems like some of the folks posting here are more equal than others.
>
> -S
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070115/5a2bf8c3/attachment.htm 

From josh at joshwelch.com  Mon Jan 15 14:23:39 2007
From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:23:39 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X-Greylist headers?
In-Reply-To: <200701152016.l0FKGTXP011876@zjod.net>
References: <200701152016.l0FKGTXP011876@zjod.net>
Message-ID: <20070115142339.gqbdzp0jjw8wkc8s@bullwinkle.joshwelch.com>

Quoting Steve Siegfried <sos at zjod.net>:

>
> Hey, what's the deal with TCLUG email headers like:
> 	> X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.4
> and
> 	> X-Greylist: delayed 00:05:08 by SQLgrey-1.7.4
>
> Seems like some of the folks posting here are more equal than others.
>
> -S
>

There was a recent discussion of greylisting on the list not too long 
ago, and you can find out more on greylisting via Google. Basically, 
the first time you send an email you will get delayed until your mail 
server retries, which a spam zombie won't generally do. After that 
first delay and retry your future mail should go through without delay, 
unless your mail system is doing something foolish.

It's nothing personal.

Josh




From Craig.A.Smith at honeywell.com  Mon Jan 15 14:56:30 2007
From: Craig.A.Smith at honeywell.com (Smith, Craig A (MN14))
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:56:30 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <45ABDD2A.1030401@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AA3F3B3134B63643A9BCE9BB74F58FEC01ABD4F1@MN65EV802.global.ds.honeywell.com>


Sean Waite wrote:

> Could you get by using something like http://www.dyndns.com/services/
?

Excellent suggestion!  I've used dyndns.org free service for about 6
years: more reliable than Qwest's DSL service.  

You need to run a client program - checks your ip every few minutes and
updates DynDns's DNS when there's a change.  You also have to update
every 15 days even if there's no change (they don't want to maintain
records for dead names).  

There's a number of 3rd party clients available.  I can recommend
ddclient (perl).

http://www.dyndns.com/support/clients/third-party.html 





From tanner at real-time.com  Mon Jan 15 14:56:11 2007
From: tanner at real-time.com (Bob Tanner)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:56:11 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X-Greylist headers?
References: <200701152016.l0FKGTXP011876@zjod.net>
	<25097ca30701151242t3720d847o3ec6352e850b8d6b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <eogppb$61c$1@sea.gmane.org>

Harlan Iverson wrote:

> Usually grey list delays will only happen on somebody's first email. I
> don't kow the history behind the emails those headers were attached to,
> but my bet would be that the first is a known poster while the second is a
> first-time poster.
> 
> On 1/15/07, Steve Siegfried <sos at zjod.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hey, what's the deal with TCLUG email headers like:
>> > X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.4
>> and
>> > X-Greylist: delayed 00:05:08 by SQLgrey-1.7.4
>>

Bingo!

More details. If you haven't posted in 15 days, your whitelist entry will be
purged from the database and you'll have to "re-greylist" 

-- 
Bob Tanner <tanner at real-time.com>          | Phone : (952)943-8700
http://www.real-time.com, Minnesota, Linux | Fax   : (952)943-8500
Key fingerprint = AB15 0BDF BCDE 4369 5B42  1973 7CF1 A709 2CC1 B288



From sos at zjod.net  Mon Jan 15 14:58:42 2007
From: sos at zjod.net (Steve Siegfried)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 14:58:42 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] X-Greylist headers?
In-Reply-To: <20070115142339.gqbdzp0jjw8wkc8s@bullwinkle.joshwelch.com>
Message-ID: <200701152058.l0FKwg97026373@zjod.net>

Josh Welch wrote:
> 
> Quoting Steve Siegfried <sos at zjod.net>:
> 
> >
> > Hey, what's the deal with TCLUG email headers like:
> > 	> X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.4
> > and
> > 	> X-Greylist: delayed 00:05:08 by SQLgrey-1.7.4
> >
> > Seems like some of the folks posting here are more equal than others.
> >
> > -S
> >
> 
> There was a recent discussion of greylisting on the list not too long 
> ago, and you can find out more on greylisting via Google. Basically, 
> the first time you send an email you will get delayed until your mail 
> server retries, which a spam zombie won't generally do. After that 
> first delay and retry your future mail should go through without delay, 
> unless your mail system is doing something foolish.
> 
> It's nothing personal.
> 
> Josh
> 

... with a nightly update or some such, right?

I'm normally a tclug mailing list lurker, but 2 (with this post, 3)
emails to the list today gave me the "X-Greylist: delayed" header
and I wondered about it.

thanks and never mind'idly,

-S


From tclug at beitsahour.net  Mon Jan 15 15:03:23 2007
From: tclug at beitsahour.net (Munir Nassar)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 15:03:23 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
References: <200701151958.l0FJwqqZ006676@zjod.net>
Message-ID: <cone.1168895003.277376.26763.1001@home>

Steve Siegfried writes:

> Actually, you don't need a static IP to run an email or http server.
> There are dynamic DNS servers out there that let you send/receive
> email as "sean at Waite.org" (or whatever) and host a web server at
> your domain, too.  Google "Dynamic DNS service" (with the quotes)
> for a list of suppliers.
> 
> I'm using www.tzo.com dynamic DNS service.  Been with 'em for 5+ years
> and it works great... oh yeah... my net-tone supplier is Comcast.
> 
> Costs involved are:
> 	- monthly Comcast service (you're already paying this)
> 	- a domain name ($10-35/year)
> 	- a DNS forwarding agent ($0-60/year)

I would urge you NOT to do it this way. while the rfcs are a bit fuzzy on 
the issue, an SMTP server should have matching forward and reverse dns 
entries and many anti spam features make use of this.

I've been doing it for a long time and i am starting to see major 
ISPs and email providers(like Hotmail and AOL) do the same and reject mail 
when forward and reverse dns does not match. There is no reason why a 
legitimate mail server does not have matching dns entries.

Do yourself and all of us a favor and do the right thing; use a mail 
server that has matching forward and reverse dns matching.

--
Munir Nassar


From sos at zjod.net  Mon Jan 15 15:23:25 2007
From: sos at zjod.net (Steve Siegfried)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 15:23:25 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <cone.1168895003.277376.26763.1001@home>
Message-ID: <200701152123.l0FLNPXU027949@zjod.net>

Munir Nassar wrote:
> 
> Steve Siegfried writes:
> 
> > Actually, you don't need a static IP to run an email or http server.
> > There are dynamic DNS servers out there that let you send/receive
> > email as "sean at Waite.org" (or whatever) and host a web server at
> > your domain, too.  Google "Dynamic DNS service" (with the quotes)
> > for a list of suppliers.
> > 
> > I'm using www.tzo.com dynamic DNS service.  Been with 'em for 5+ years
> > and it works great... oh yeah... my net-tone supplier is Comcast.
> > 
> > Costs involved are:
> > 	- monthly Comcast service (you're already paying this)
> > 	- a domain name ($10-35/year)
> > 	- a DNS forwarding agent ($0-60/year)
> 
> I would urge you NOT to do it this way. while the rfcs are a bit fuzzy on 
> the issue, an SMTP server should have matching forward and reverse dns 
> entries and many anti spam features make use of this.
> 
> I've been doing it for a long time and i am starting to see major 
> ISPs and email providers(like Hotmail and AOL) do the same and reject mail 
> when forward and reverse dns does not match. There is no reason why a 
> legitimate mail server does not have matching dns entries.
> 
> Do yourself and all of us a favor and do the right thing; use a mail 
> server that has matching forward and reverse dns matching.
> 

You get around that issue by using "Smart" relay host, which for Comcast
looks like (in sendmail.cf):
	> # "Smart" relay host (may be null)
	> DSsmtp.comcast.net

Hotmail, AOL, et al have been rejecting mail when forward/reverse DNS
do not match for quite some time... like since CodeRed came out in 2001
(or was it the ILOVEYOU virus in 2000?).


From sraun at fireopal.org  Mon Jan 15 15:11:40 2007
From: sraun at fireopal.org (Scott Raun)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 15:11:40 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X-Greylist headers?
In-Reply-To: <25097ca30701151242t3720d847o3ec6352e850b8d6b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200701152016.l0FKGTXP011876@zjod.net>
	<25097ca30701151242t3720d847o3ec6352e850b8d6b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20070115211140.GA19994@fireopal.org>

On Mon, Jan 15, 2007 at 02:42:03PM -0600, Harlan Iverson wrote:
> Usually grey list delays will only happen on somebody's first email.

I thought that grey lists were normally configured to clear out their
'accept from' databases after some period of inactivity - the most
common numbers I recall are 14 and 30 days.

-- 
Scott Raun
sraun at fireopal.org


From adam at askewview.net  Mon Jan 15 17:08:18 2007
From: adam at askewview.net (Adam)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 17:08:18 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
Message-ID: <1400.71.87.50.199.1168902498.squirrel@mail.askewview.net>

I've got a DSL line from Qwest at my home. For my internet provider I'm
using Qwest.net internet services. I have this at my residence and they
allow for static IPs.

-Adam

On Mon, January 15, 2007 1:33 pm, Sean Waite wrote:
> I have been
> calling around to different services without luck so far trying to get a
> decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static IP. So far the
> mainstream companies like Qwest only offer this with their Business
> services, which can not be installed at a residence. I remember years
> back this was not the case, but since I have used cable for my residence
> for so long I am somewhat behind the times. Is it still possible to get a
> decent DSL service with static IP? The reason I need static is I am
> looking to host
>
> my own e-mail and web, which not only requires just a static IP but a PTR
>  record as well. I had thought that my present Comcast could do this
> since they really do not chance the IP address, but they are not going to
> do a PTR
>
> record for you. Any help on what I can do would be much appreciated
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Sean Waite
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>



From jlund at portrait.com  Mon Jan 15 17:28:39 2007
From: jlund at portrait.com (James Lund)
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 17:28:39 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <1400.71.87.50.199.1168902498.squirrel@mail.askewview.net>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
	<1400.71.87.50.199.1168902498.squirrel@mail.askewview.net>
Message-ID: <45AC0E27.6050501@portrait.com>


I have a Frontier business DSL line in my house, but it is not priced
competitively.  Living in Apple Valley there isn't much for choice.

James.

Adam wrote:
> I've got a DSL line from Qwest at my home. For my internet provider I'm
> using Qwest.net internet services. I have this at my residence and they
> allow for static IPs.
> 
> -Adam
> 
> On Mon, January 15, 2007 1:33 pm, Sean Waite wrote:
>> I have been
>> calling around to different services without luck so far trying to get a
>> decent DSL for my home. The catch is I need a static IP. So far the
>> mainstream companies like Qwest only offer this with their Business
>> services, which can not be installed at a residence. I remember years
>> back this was not the case, but since I have used cable for my residence
>> for so long I am somewhat behind the times. Is it still possible to get a
>> decent DSL service with static IP? The reason I need static is I am
>> looking to host
>>
>> my own e-mail and web, which not only requires just a static IP but a PTR
>>  record as well. I had thought that my present Comcast could do this
>> since they really do not chance the IP address, but they are not going to
>> do a PTR
>>
>> record for you. Any help on what I can do would be much appreciated
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sean Waite
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 


From tj at kewlness.net  Tue Jan 16 00:48:29 2007
From: tj at kewlness.net (T.J. Duchene)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 00:48:29 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
Message-ID: <45AC753D.90605@kewlness.net>

Sean,

There are ways you can be obnoxious, sneaky, or simply cost effective, and tunnel/proxy a two way connection to serve traffic from home even with a dynamic DSL assignment.  You need an external IP address somewhere to tunnel to, obviously.  I wouldn't recommend it, if performance is a concern.  It involves a little bit of rerouting, but it's mildly entertaining.

No matter that they block certain ports, either.  There are ways around that, as long as you can establish an outgoing connection to create the tunnel in the first place. I hope it doesn't sound too shady.  It's actually quite legitimate and very practical if you are stuck between a rock and the wall.

I just thought I'd mention it if you are desperate for a stopgap measure until you can get something else set up.  If you are interested, please email me, and I'll chat with you about it.


-- 
T.J.



====================================================
"I believe C++ instills fear in programmers, fear that the 
interaction of some details causes unpredictable results. Its 
unmanageable complexity has spawned more fear-preventing tools 
than any other language, but the solution _should_ have been 
to create and use a language that does not overload the 
whole goddamn human brain with irrelevant details."
-- Erik Naggum

-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: tj.vcf
Type: text/x-vcard
Size: 117 bytes
Desc: not available
Url : http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070116/1761dfe9/attachment.vcf 

From jima at beer.tclug.org  Tue Jan 16 08:43:28 2007
From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:43:28 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <45AC0E27.6050501@portrait.com>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
	<1400.71.87.50.199.1168902498.squirrel@mail.askewview.net>
	<45AC0E27.6050501@portrait.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0701160841490.2481@beer.tclug.org>

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, James Lund wrote:
> I have a Frontier business DSL line in my house, but it is not priced
> competitively.  Living in Apple Valley there isn't much for choice.

  You do realize Frontier customers can get Visi for their ISP, right? 
(Ask Nate Straz.)  That's what I'd be doing if I wasn't happy with my 
10m/1m Charter service. ;)

      Jima


From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us  Tue Jan 16 14:09:04 2007
From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:09:04 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
Message-ID: <s5acdc8b.039@mdh-gw9.health.state.mn.us>

>>> On 1/15/2007 at 2:27 PM, "Shawn Fertch" <sfertch at gmail.com> wrote:
> Some people just absolutely hate them and will bitch about anything
> because they don't like Qwest.  Then again, many of these same
people
> are those that will find something to bitch about regardless of what
> it is.

Shawn,

You just mentioned three problems you personally had with Qwest, then 
you give people who have had REAL problems with Qwest a kick in the
pants. I'd say I was hurt and offended, but I'd hate to complain, and 
it would only annoy you. ;-)

Troy





From nate at refried.org  Tue Jan 16 14:29:26 2007
From: nate at refried.org (Nate Straz)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:29:26 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0701160841490.2481@beer.tclug.org>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>
	<1400.71.87.50.199.1168902498.squirrel@mail.askewview.net>
	<45AC0E27.6050501@portrait.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64.0701160841490.2481@beer.tclug.org>
Message-ID: <20070116202926.GA6109@refried.org>

On Tue, Jan 16, 2007 at 08:43:28AM -0600, Jima wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, James Lund wrote:
> > I have a Frontier business DSL line in my house, but it is not priced
> > competitively.  Living in Apple Valley there isn't much for choice.
> 
>   You do realize Frontier customers can get Visi for their ISP, right? 
> (Ask Nate Straz.)  That's what I'd be doing if I wasn't happy with my 
> 10m/1m Charter service. ;)

IMHO, the best way to deal with Frontier is to let the guys at Visi do
it for you.  I run my email and web server from home and it's all thanks
to Visi.  They understand what an ISP is supposed to be.

Nate


From jlund at portrait.com  Tue Jan 16 14:46:49 2007
From: jlund at portrait.com (James Lund)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:46:49 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <20070116202926.GA6109@refried.org>
References: <WorldClient-F200701151333.AA33480111@sbn-services.com>	<1400.71.87.50.199.1168902498.squirrel@mail.askewview.net>	<45AC0E27.6050501@portrait.com>	<Pine.LNX.4.64.0701160841490.2481@beer.tclug.org>
	<20070116202926.GA6109@refried.org>
Message-ID: <45AD39B9.6070803@portrait.com>

Thanks Jima and Nate!  I had no idea there was an option.

Nate Straz wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 16, 2007 at 08:43:28AM -0600, Jima wrote:
>> On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, James Lund wrote:
>>> I have a Frontier business DSL line in my house, but it is not priced
>>> competitively.  Living in Apple Valley there isn't much for choice.
>>   You do realize Frontier customers can get Visi for their ISP, right? 
>> (Ask Nate Straz.)  That's what I'd be doing if I wasn't happy with my 
>> 10m/1m Charter service. ;)
> 
> IMHO, the best way to deal with Frontier is to let the guys at Visi do
> it for you.  I run my email and web server from home and it's all thanks
> to Visi.  They understand what an ISP is supposed to be.
> 
> Nate
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 


From sfertch at gmail.com  Tue Jan 16 18:02:52 2007
From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:02:52 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
In-Reply-To: <s5acdc8b.038@mdh-gw9.health.state.mn.us>
References: <s5acdc8b.038@mdh-gw9.health.state.mn.us>
Message-ID: <67f3084a0701161602k18ec736buf9f584f6e9723422@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/16/07, Troy.A Johnson <troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us> wrote:
> Shawn,
>
> You just mentioned three problems you personally had with Qwest, then
> you give people who have had REAL problems with Qwest a kick in the
> pants. I'd say I was hurt and offended, but I'd hate to complain, and
> it would only annoy you. ;-)
>
> Troy
>


Please explain to me where I cited three problems with Qwest because I
fail to see three.

For the record, here's my e-mail again:
-------
You can get static IP's with Qwest and you don't even need a business
account to do it:

Qwest internet basic   $29.99 to $49.99 a month IIRC for the line
depending on speed
$10.99 for ISP services (no e-mail, website, etc)
$14.99 for a block of 8 static IP's.

I just dropped my static IP's from Qwest which I've had for over 3
years.  Aside from having a buried line go bad during heavy rains a
couple years ago, and some headaches of moving DSL services from one
phoneline to the other, I've never had a problem with Qwest service.

Some people just absolutely hate them and will bitch about anything
because they don't like Qwest.  Then again, many of these same people
are those that will find something to bitch about regardless of what
it is.
-------------

I fail to see where I mention three problems.  I mentioned a line
going bad, which I cannot say is an issue with Qwest because it is a
failure of a component that had been buried for who knows how many
years.  Component failures do not necessarily equate to problems with
the service provider.  A problem would be if they sat on my call for
weeks on end and not responding to the call.

The issue I had with switching DSL service from one line to another
was a minor issue, and from what I've gathered a non-standard request.
 I wanted to drop my second phone line, but my DSL service was
connected to it.  In the process, I wanted to keep my static IP's
which I had had for quite some time to avoid unnecessary work on my
end.  Had I of moved, and had a DHCP assigned address it wouldn't have
been an issue.  Yes, I was more than a little peeved at the time.
But, once I found that it isn't a common request, and they did it as I
requested I was fine with it.

There really was only one problem that I had, as I really cannot say
that the buried phone line was an issue with Qwest because of age,
weather exposure, and it was probably cut from people digging at one
time or another.  All of this was outside their control as far as I'm
concerned.

The reason for dropping my static IP's recently was because I moved my
web services to a hosting service and don't have a need for statics
anymore.

My last statement in my original e-mail was for those who bitch just
because they like to.  If it's a legitimate problem that's fine.  But,
if you're bitching for no reason other than to hear yourself bitch, do
us all a favor and STFU.


-- 
-Shawn

-Nemo me impune lacessit.  Ne Obliviscaris..


From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us  Wed Jan 17 10:12:39 2007
From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:12:39 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
Message-ID: <s5adf6a4.050@mdh-gw9.health.state.mn.us>

Shawn,

>>> On 1/16/2007 at 6:02 PM, "Shawn Fertch" <sfertch at gmail.com> wrote:
> Please explain to me where I cited three problems with Qwest because
I
> fail to see three.

O.K.

1)
> Aside from having a buried line go bad during heavy rains a
> couple years ago, 

2) 3)
> and some headaches of moving DSL services from one
> phoneline to the other

I suppose "some" could mean more than two, but I thought it safe to
minimize the number.

Cheers!

Troy




From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us  Wed Jan 17 10:36:26 2007
From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:36:26 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] OT: DSL Service w/ Static IP
Message-ID: <s5adfc39.010@mdh-gw9.health.state.mn.us>

TCLUG OT Readers:

If you think I am being a jerk, I do apologize, but I really do 
want to hear complaints about ISPs (yes, including Qwest) in 
these little OT email conversations we have on the half year.
Performance can change over time, and I want to know who to 
recommend to those who ask. I really hope no one will "STFU"
because someone else doesn't want to hear about it. 

Right now I give Qwest a "OK" rating, despite my own negative 
experiences with them, because they seem to do alright by 
many of their customers. I do prefer places like Speakeasy and 
IP House because they consistently emphasize customer service, 
and that makes a big difference even when they can't fix things 
for you. 

Thanks,

Troy




From auditodd at comcast.net  Wed Jan 17 13:25:23 2007
From: auditodd at comcast.net (auditodd at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 19:25:23 +0000
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
Message-ID: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>

Hey all,

My team at work needs an external USB hard drive that we can ship to vendors and them them return.

I'm thinking it would be nice if I could find an enclosure that comes with a matching hard case that would withstand abuse by the average UPS/FedEx flunky. 

Otherwise, we will probably buy generic external USB drives and an Otterbox cases.

Thanks for any input! Links to actual products would be appreciated.

--
==========
Todd Young


From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com  Wed Jan 17 14:46:21 2007
From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:46:21 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>
References: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <20070117204621.GA8729@mail.el-swifto.com>

On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 07:25:23PM +0000, auditodd at comcast.net wrote:
> My team at work needs an external USB hard drive that we can ship to
> vendors and them them return.

Why not just burn to CD/DVD?  Media are cheap and sturdy.

-- 
trammell at el-swifto.com  9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58  FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5
Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG)      Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota


From Larry.Pint at ntuminc.com  Wed Jan 17 14:59:49 2007
From: Larry.Pint at ntuminc.com (Larry R. Pint)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:59:49 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <AD1913F70C219A458F44131CC9E91BA637F2E9@exch01.internal.ntuminc.com>


I assume it's too much data to fit on a "thumb drive"?  We've used them
in the past with up to 1 Gbyte.  Relatively cheap, easy to ship, worked
great.

Larry Pint
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-
> linux.org] On Behalf Of auditodd at comcast.net
> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 1:25 PM
> To: TCLUG
> Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
> 
> Hey all,
> 
> My team at work needs an external USB hard drive that we can ship to
> vendors and them them return.
> 
> I'm thinking it would be nice if I could find an enclosure that comes
with
> a matching hard case that would withstand abuse by the average
UPS/FedEx
> flunky.
> 
> Otherwise, we will probably buy generic external USB drives and an
> Otterbox cases.
> 
> Thanks for any input! Links to actual products would be appreciated.
> 
> --
> ==========
> Todd Young
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Wed Jan 17 15:11:28 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:11:28 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <20070117204621.GA8729@mail.el-swifto.com>
References: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>
	<20070117204621.GA8729@mail.el-swifto.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701171510270.27244@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007, John J. Trammell wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 07:25:23PM +0000, auditodd at comcast.net wrote:
>> My team at work needs an external USB hard drive that we can ship to
>> vendors and them them return.
>
> Why not just burn to CD/DVD?  Media are cheap and sturdy.


If they have 500 GB of data, it will fill more than 100 DVDs.  If the 
client needs to make some changes to the data and return it, it will be a 
huge effort.  The USB drive would be much better for such uses.

Mike


From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu  Wed Jan 17 15:10:09 2007
From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:10:09 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <AD1913F70C219A458F44131CC9E91BA637F2E9@exch01.internal.ntuminc.com>
References: <AD1913F70C219A458F44131CC9E91BA637F2E9@exch01.internal.ntuminc.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.60.0701171509300.27244@taxa.epi.umn.edu>

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007, Larry R. Pint wrote:

> I assume it's too much data to fit on a "thumb drive"?  We've used them 
> in the past with up to 1 Gbyte.  Relatively cheap, easy to ship, worked 
> great.


A DVD holds more and costs much less.

Mike


From joey.rockhold at gmail.com  Wed Jan 17 15:19:56 2007
From: joey.rockhold at gmail.com (Joey Rockhold)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:19:56 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>
References: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <101e49ea0701171319h1b446f2aj30ce0b21c388c3c8@mail.gmail.com>

Would it work to use a higher-capacity tape drive and mail a box of tapes
back and forth?

- Joey

On 1/17/07, auditodd at comcast.net <auditodd at comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Hey all,
>
> My team at work needs an external USB hard drive that we can ship to
> vendors and them them return.
>
> I'm thinking it would be nice if I could find an enclosure that comes with
> a matching hard case that would withstand abuse by the average UPS/FedEx
> flunky.
>
> Otherwise, we will probably buy generic external USB drives and an
> Otterbox cases.
>
> Thanks for any input! Links to actual products would be appreciated.
>
> --
> ==========
> Todd Young
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20070117/e255a528/attachment.htm 

From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us  Wed Jan 17 16:34:53 2007
From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:34:53 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Open Document Format in Minnesota?
Message-ID: <s5ae503d.071@mdh-gw9.health.state.mn.us>

I thought this might be on topic for TCLUG because it might
possibly put Linux in better standing as a desktop client:

http://ros.leg.mn/bin/bldbill.php?bill=H0176.0.html&session=ls85





From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Wed Jan 17 16:58:56 2007
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:58:56 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200701172258.l0HMwut22000@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Sale

Subject: Equipment Sale

All the computers listed are solid machines. My wife wants me to reduce my "inventory".

HP Omnibook XE4400S
1.8GHz 
1GB RAM (2x512 Corsair)
20GB hard drive
DVD-ROM and Floppy built in
Linksys Wi-Fi PCMCIA 802.11b/g
Windows XP Pro Product Key
Eddie Bauer laptop bag
$500 - OBO
====
HP Omnibook 6000
600MHz
256MB of RAM
20GB hard drive
DVD-ROM and Floppy modules
Docking station with CD-R and NIC (uses standard power cord)
Laptop bag
Win98 Product Key
$170 - OBO
====
HP Omnibook XE3-GC
800MHz
256MB of RAM
20GB hard drive
DVD-ROM and floppy
Port replicator w/power supply
Laptop bag
Win98 Product Key
$150 - OBO
====
Intergraph GL2
Dual P2-400MHz
512MB of ECC RAM
Sony CD-R
$50 - OBO
====
Zip Drives and Discs
3-250MB drives
2-100MB drives
1-250MB disc
19-100MB discs
$40 - OBO
====
Baystack 24 port managed switch
$20 - OBO
====
Palm 3e w/cradle
$10 - OBO
====
IBM 300GL (2 of these)
Type 6282
Pentium-233MHz
128MB of RAM
1GB hard drive
CDROM & Floppy
2-USB1 ports
2-10/100 NICs
Fully functional, perfect for a firewall!
$10 each - OBO

====
FREE!
- HP ScanJet 5100C
- HP ScanJet 4P
- Generic Pentium-200MHz PC

Seller Email address: auditodd at comcast dot net

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From auditodd at comcast.net  Wed Jan 17 17:09:07 2007
From: auditodd at comcast.net (Todd Young)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 17:09:07 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <101e49ea0701171319h1b446f2aj30ce0b21c388c3c8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>
	<101e49ea0701171319h1b446f2aj30ce0b21c388c3c8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <45AEAC93.6080307@comcast.net>

Joey Rockhold wrote:
> Would it work to use a higher-capacity tape drive and mail a box of 
> tapes back and forth?
>  
> - Joey
>  
> On 1/17/07, *auditodd at comcast.net <mailto:auditodd at comcast.net>* 
> <auditodd at comcast.net <mailto:auditodd at comcast.net>> wrote:
> 
>     Hey all,
> 
>     My team at work needs an external USB hard drive that we can ship to
>     vendors and them them return.
> 
>     I'm thinking it would be nice if I could find an enclosure that
>     comes with a matching hard case that would withstand abuse by the
>     average UPS/FedEx flunky.
> 
>     Otherwise, we will probably buy generic external USB drives and an
>     Otterbox cases.
> 
>     Thanks for any input! Links to actual products would be appreciated.
> 
>     --
>     ==========
>     Todd Young

Tape drive would work, but then you have to worry about whether the 
receiving party has the right format. Not to mention that getting data 
copied to a tape would be quite the "fun" experience.

OtterBox didn't have anything that would fit an external USB drive, but 
I did find a company called S3 that has similar products that would 
work. That combined with a generic enclosure and Western Digital drives 
will probably be our resolution. Western Digital has a great head park 
feature that if the drive loses power it uses energy from the spindle to 
park the heads.

-- 
Todd Young


From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com  Wed Jan 17 18:35:41 2007
From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:35:41 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Job - Information Security Specialist
Message-ID: <914f813c0701171635u65f24840yc4091b8c60e50431@mail.gmail.com>

LarsonAllen currently has a job position open. Please email
rromes at larsonallen.com with your resume and contact information to
apply.

-John



Job Description ? Information Security Specialist Intern

LarsonAllen is currently looking for an Information Security
Specialist Intern to join the Information Security Services Group
(ISSG) in our Minneapolis office.  The Information Security Specialist
will provide technical security consulting to clients, as well as
develop and maintain the ISSG network infrastructure.  The majority of
the work consists of testing remote and local networks for security
vulnerabilities.  This person performs as a significant member of the
ISSG Team to provide quality customer service.

* Perform network security assessments.
* Project Team Participation Responsibilities
* Application Software Selection Responsibilities
* Application Software Implementation Responsibilities
* Application Software Support Responsibilities

*** This opportunity will lead to a full-time position for the right person. ***

For consideration we require:
B.S. or an associate degree from a two-year college focused on
IT/IS/MIS or computer science
A GPA of 3.0 or above in your major, and a copy of your transcript.
A minimum of 6 months experience in a support or development role,
related to application development, desktop, server, or network
infrastructure

Preference will be given to applicants with experience in some or all
of the following:
Experience with Cisco IOS software, Cisco hardware, and/or similar
experience in network infrastructure hardware and software
Experience with Linux operating systems
Experience with Microsoft Windows operating systems, servers, and networking
Programming and/or Web application development

From cncole at earthlink.net  Thu Jan 18 02:04:30 2007
From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole)
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 02:04:30 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <AD1913F70C219A458F44131CC9E91BA637F2E9@exch01.internal.ntuminc.com>
Message-ID: <JHEAJICPPADJEPOKEGDGKEGNCGAA.cncole@earthlink.net>



> -----Original Message-----
> From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Larry R. Pint
> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 3:00 PM
>
>
> I assume it's too much data to fit on a "thumb drive"?  We've
> used them
> in the past with up to 1 Gbyte.  Relatively cheap, easy to
> ship, worked
> great.
>
> Larry Pint


I've seen sizes up to 8gb offered.  Also, I got a USB adapter for SD
digital camera cards for $.99 plus S&H off ebay.  The adapter claims to
be unlimited except by the card, so over 4gb isn't hard to do.  Rotating
things are much more vulnerable in shipping, but can have much larger
capacities.

Chuck




From daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com  Thu Jan 18 07:45:52 2007
From: daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com (Dan Armbrust)
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:45:52 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Request for ideas
In-Reply-To: <45AEAC93.6080307@comcast.net>
References: <011720071925.25382.45AE7823000408BE0000632622007637040B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net>	<101e49ea0701171319h1b446f2aj30ce0b21c388c3c8@mail.gmail.com>
	<45AEAC93.6080307@comcast.net>
Message-ID: