From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Tue Feb 1 07:20:13 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Tue Feb 1 07:09:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP Help Message-ID: <1EBB89EF7A5CF244186AF3B7533F7730@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Okay. I was using rcp to push from Linux to Windows. As per everyone's advice, I installed Putty and WinSCP on my windows machine. I did "pscp -r blah blah blah" exactly as explained, from my Win box. I'm certain my syntax was correct. Problem: I get the error "ssh init: Connection timed out." It times out after ten seconds. I'm guessing this problem is on the Linux side but for the life of me I couldn't find where to change it. What's the easiest way to fix this problem? I'm getting closer to getting my home network up and running! (Still a networking newbie, so that's a big deal.) THANK YOU to everyone, especially Adam and Shawn, who've answered countless questions about this. I've got info that's really important to me on my Linux system, which has been infinitely better than when I stored the info on a Windows system. I just need to be able to copy my files from Linux to Windows in order to backup, print, burn to CD's, etc. ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ Support Care2 Email: 1,400 whales may be killed this year. Take action! http://www.care2.com/go/z/17954 From stutterstutt at comcast.net Tue Feb 1 08:13:30 2005 From: stutterstutt at comcast.net (Jeff Nelson) Date: Tue Feb 1 08:19:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] System hang on disk I/O In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41FF8E8A.308@comcast.net> On Sat, 29 Jan 2005, I wrote: >A system I built about a month ago is hanging whenever I do any >significant disk I/O. In particular, the system will hang when I use tar >to transfer a bunch of files from an NTFS-formatted disk to a >reiserfs-formatted disk (using tar). This is a hard hang -- the mouse >pointer freezes and nothing except a hardware reset will bring the >system back. > > I thought I'd write an update on what's happened so far. There were three suspects: 1. ASUS A7N8X-E motherboard with known ACPI issues (fixed in kernel 2.6.10) 2. Promise Technology Ultra100 controller 3. NTFS file system I received advice from Chad, Dave and Brian. Chad Walstrom wrote: >Historically, Linux has had crappy NTFS support. Since you mentioned >using tar to transfer, I'm assuming this a read operation. That should >be O.K., but you never know. I'd stay away from write operations on the >NTFS system if possible. Indeed, these were NTFS file systems mounted read-only, hooked up to a Promise Technology controller. Chad also said: >Promise controllers suck royally, IMHO. Their standard IDE >controllers may be O.K., but my experience in working with their >software RAID cards has given me the general impression that you want to >stay away from Promise if you can. So the first thing I did was to move away from the Ultra100 controller. I had two available motherboard IDE connections so I hooked up the source and destination disks to them and reran the archive/restore operations. I got farther than before, but the system still hanged. However, just before it locked up the process running the tar "create archive" operation encountered an "unexpected EOF" error, and the copy was aborted. Based on this result, I decided that the Ultra100 controller might be partially responsible for the failures I was seeing, but it wasn't the only factor. Brian Hurt wrote: >I'd play with hdparm and turning down the I/O speed of the drive, to see >if the problem goes away. The other thing to check is to see if there's >an updated IDE driver that might help. > > I never did play with this, though I thought about turning DMA off. Finally, Dave Erickson wrote: >If possible, install the NTFS drive(s) into a windows box and copy via samba. > >I did this while converting a computer from windows to Linux and it works really well. I did this next. I resurrected the PC that originally held the disks, exported them as Windows shares, and remote-mounted them with samba. I am now copying the directory tree from one SMB file system to a Linux LVG file system. It's been running for over 9 hours and so far there have been no problems. I'm not getting the performance I would have hoped, but at least the copy is running. I've got to transfer about 180gb worth of data spread across 5000 files. I'm getting about 3.6gb/hour so I figure I'm looking at 50 hours. This is on a 100baseT LAN. Thanks to all who offered advice. I'm blaming NTFS support for the problems I encountered. -Jeff From josh at joshwelch.com Tue Feb 1 11:34:13 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Tue Feb 1 11:39:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP Help In-Reply-To: <1EBB89EF7A5CF244186AF3B7533F7730@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> References: <1EBB89EF7A5CF244186AF3B7533F7730@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: <20050201113413.16h0ugozbcowksgk@moose.joshwelch.com> Quoting Nick : > Okay. I was using rcp to push from Linux to Windows. As per > everyone's advice, I installed Putty and WinSCP on my windows > machine. I did "pscp -r blah blah blah" exactly as explained, from > my Win box. I'm certain my syntax was correct. > > Problem: > I get the error "ssh init: Connection timed out." It times out after > ten seconds. I'm guessing this problem is on the Linux side but for > the life of me I couldn't find where to change it. What's the > easiest way to fix this problem? > > I'm getting closer to getting my home network up and running! (Still > a networking newbie, so that's a big deal.) > THANK YOU to everyone, especially Adam and Shawn, who've answered > countless questions about this. I've got info that's really > important to me on my Linux system, which has been infinitely better > than when I stored the info on a Windows system. I just need to be > able to copy my files from Linux to Windows in order to backup, > print, burn to CD's, etc. > To clarify, you are trying to copy files from Linux to Windows. On the windows box you run something like pscp -r nick@remotehost.com:/some/directory c:\backup You get an error on your Windows host that says ssh init: Connection timed out. Because that ssh init error sounds like a Linux error and you should be running pscp from the Windows box. Let me know if I am confused. Josh From strayf at freeshell.org Tue Feb 1 11:33:44 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Tue Feb 1 11:39:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP Help In-Reply-To: <1EBB89EF7A5CF244186AF3B7533F7730@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> References: <1EBB89EF7A5CF244186AF3B7533F7730@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: <20050201173344.GB14630@callisto> On Tue, Feb 01, 2005 at 07:20:13AM -0600, Nick wrote: > [...] > Problem: > I get the error "ssh init: Connection timed out." It times out after > ten seconds. I'm guessing this problem is on the Linux side but for > the life of me I couldn't find where to change it. What's the > easiest way to fix this problem? This sounds like a network level problem. Can the machines ping each other or make any other sort of connection? Do you have a firewall on one or the other? If so, you'll need to open port 22 on the Linux machine to accept the connection from the Windows machine. Do you have the ssh server running on the Linux machine? -Steve From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Feb 1 11:56:46 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Tue Feb 1 11:59:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP Help In-Reply-To: <20050201113413.16h0ugozbcowksgk@moose.joshwelch.com> References: <1EBB89EF7A5CF244186AF3B7533F7730@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> <20050201113413.16h0ugozbcowksgk@moose.joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Feb 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > Quoting Nick : > >> Okay. I was using rcp to push from Linux to Windows. As per >> everyone's advice, I installed Putty and WinSCP on my windows >> machine. I did "pscp -r blah blah blah" exactly as explained, from >> my Win box. I'm certain my syntax was correct. pscp does not allow you to push files from Linux to Windows. It allows you to pull files from Linux to Windows. If you want to use scp on Linux to send files to a Windows machine, the Windows machine must be running an ssh daemon. To do that, I think you need to run Cygwin and OpenSSH. There might be another way, but I don't know what it is. It's good to run Cygwin anyway. Mike From josh at joshwelch.com Tue Feb 1 12:56:02 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Tue Feb 1 12:59:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fwd: Re: PSCP Message-ID: <20050201125602.z4wdgx60er6s08ws@moose.joshwelch.com> This is poor form typically but your email server does not like mine. I need to see about getting my provider to do rDNS. In the meantime our conversation will need to be via the list. > Josh, > > Yes, what you said is correct. I'm running the pscp command from the > Windows side, trying to pull from Linux. But I think my firewall may > be on or my ssh daemon is off. > > How do I turn on the ssh daemon? > > Nick > What distro are you running again? Red Hat/Fedora, Debian, Gentoo? Red Hat/Fedora: #service sshd start Debian: #/etc/init.d/ssh start Gentoo: who cares ;) Also, make sure that you have no firewall running. I believe that a default Debian install does not have a firewall running. A default install of later Red Hat versions has a very restrictive firewall setup. Red Hat #service iptables stop Josh From austad at signal15.com Tue Feb 1 14:07:11 2005 From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad) Date: Tue Feb 1 14:12:18 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] got a shell on my phone Message-ID: :) I posted about it here: http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=556405 I can telnet in with full root access and do SMB sharing with full RW access. Now, if I could get ahold of a replacement for the bluetooth daemon, I'd be in business. :) Anyone have any experience reverse engineering stripped binaries? ~jay From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Tue Feb 1 14:52:35 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Tue Feb 1 14:54:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fwd: Re: PSCP In-Reply-To: <20050201125602.z4wdgx60er6s08ws@moose.joshwelch.com> References: <20050201125602.z4wdgx60er6s08ws@moose.joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <914f813c0502011252626dc8ee@mail.gmail.com> Not that I'm looking to feed a troll.... On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:56:02 -0600, Josh Welch wrote: > What distro are you running again? Red Hat/Fedora, Debian, Gentoo? > > Red Hat/Fedora: > #service sshd start > > Debian: > #/etc/init.d/ssh start > > Gentoo: > who cares ;) Same exact command as Debian, except it's sshd. From bhurt at spnz.org Tue Feb 1 21:00:30 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Tue Feb 1 20:59:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] got a shell on my phone In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Feb 2005, Jay Austad wrote: > :) > > I posted about it here: > http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=556405 > > I can telnet in with full root access and do SMB sharing with full RW > access. Now, if I could get ahold of a replacement for the bluetooth > daemon, I'd be in business. :) > > Anyone have any experience reverse engineering stripped binaries? Yes. Answer to your next question: no. Brian From linuser at esox.us Tue Feb 1 23:06:11 2005 From: linuser at esox.us (Dave Erickson) Date: Tue Feb 1 23:12:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] System hang on disk I/O In-Reply-To: <42005780.1090606@comcast.net> References: <41FF8E8A.308@comcast.net> <420035B2.2010709@esox.us> <42005780.1090606@comcast.net> Message-ID: <42005FC3.6050207@esox.us> Jeff Nelson wrote: > Dave Erickson wrote: > >> Jeff Nelson wrote: >> >>> I'm not getting the performance I would have hoped, but at least the >>> copy is running. I've got to transfer about 180gb worth of data >>> spread across 5000 files. I'm getting about 3.6gb/hour so I figure >>> I'm looking at 50 hours. This is on a 100baseT LAN. >> >> >> >> Maybe time for a 1000 mBit LAN Card? Anyways, glad to help.... > > > > I actually thought about it for a bit. The ASUS does come with a > 1000/100/10 integrated NIC, so the idea is tempting 'cause I'd only need > one, plus a crossover cable (or a switch upgrade, too). > > But I decided this was the best I was going to get. Why? Because the > transfer is not limited by bandwidth, it's limited by the SMB protocol > implementation. I've got at least 3 times the bandwidth capacity > available in my existing 100mbit LAN that I'm not using. Both systems > aren't even breathing hard. The single switch that's between the two > systems blinks activity at a rate of about 4 times/sec with noticable > pauses between flashes. I think the protocol is inefficient, but it > works. I could get way better performance using FTP, but I've got lots > of files and subdirectories and FTP isn't recursive. Maybe I oughta poke > around for a graphical FTP client that is... > > But it was fun to think about 1000mBit for a while. :-) > > Thanks again for the help. > > -Jeff I recently did a transfer of about 30 GB ove samba and a 1000 mBit direct connection with a crossover cable and I was averaging 15-20 percent bandwidth utilization throughout. Which is anywhere from 150 - 200 mBit per second. But if it's working maybe best not to tinker.... -- Dave Erickson [ http://www.esox.us/ ] From austad at signal15.com Tue Feb 1 23:22:25 2005 From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad) Date: Tue Feb 1 23:24:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] help me to hack this embedded linux device Message-ID: <6C28DA56-74DA-11D9-A3DA-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> This is for my a768i phone. Does anyone have any idea how I would go about reading /dev/roflash? I can't even cat it to a file. However, it's readable on boot, it has to be because it contains the root filesystem according to this: # cat /proc/roflash_info ROFLASH Driver status: Ready ROFLASH area name is rootfs ROFLASH area size = 15728640 bytes ROFLASH area offset = 1048576 bytes ROFLASH area l_x_b(10) ROFLASH area name is language ROFLASH area size = 11141120 bytes ROFLASH area offset = 5242880 bytes ROFLASH area l_x_b(1000) ROFLASH area name is setup ROFLASH area size = 131072 bytes ROFLASH area offset = 16384000 bytes ROFLASH area l_x_b(1000) # Also /dev/mtd0 through /dev/mtd3 have info on them, but only 2 and 3 appear in /dev. Any ideas how to work around this? I tried mknod and got an operation not permitted error. Here are the mounted filesystems: /dev/root on / type cramfs (rw) none on /ram type ramfs (rw) proc on /ram/proc type proc (rw) /dev/roflash1 on /usr/language type cramfs (rw) /dev/roflash2 on /usr/setup type cramfs (rw) none on /dev/pts type devpts (rw) /dev/mtdblock2 on /ezxlocal type vfm (rw,noatime) /dev/tffsa1 on /diska type ext3 (rw,noatime) Only /ezxlocal and /diska are writeable, even though they all say (rw). From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Wed Feb 2 08:28:22 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Wed Feb 2 08:34:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: PSCP Help In-Reply-To: <78DD9B4D82402194AB5B378CCE51B6A4@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> References: <78DD9B4D82402194AB5B378CCE51B6A4@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 2 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > Thanks for your response, but I've got a couple questions? > > 1. How do I turn on the ssh daemon on my Linux box, or make sure it's > on? Send that question to the list. You should be able to do this: ps aux | grep sshd And see if there is a line ending in something like '/usr/sbin/sshd'. If there is such a line, sshd is running. I don't know if it is protected by tcp wrappers by default. The other guys will know. If it isn't running, I'm not sure what to do, but you need to have the proper script in the /etc/init.d directory. > 2. What's the difference between pushing and pulling? When a file is transmitted from A to B, if A initiates the transaction, then the file is pushed. If B initiates the transaction, the file was pulled. Thus, if you use scp to transfer a file from A to B, there are two ways to do it. Do you run scp on A and enter your password on B? Or do you run scp on B and enter your password on A? > 3. With these email lists should I be replying back to the list, or is > it typically okay to contact people directly? I wasn't sure if there was > some rule I didn't know about. Always send them to the list unless you have a good reason not to. I will cc this to the list. Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Wed Feb 2 09:33:33 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Wed Feb 2 09:39:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Math Behind the Curtains, W Feb 9, 7pm, B75 Amundson Hall Message-ID: This sounds really cool and it's open to the public. --Mike "MATH BEHIND THE CURTAINS: DYNAMIC SIMULATION AT PIXAR," by senior animation scientist David Baraff, Pixar Animation Studios, will explore core physical simulation technologies of recent movies and the balancing of creative and technical needs in production. Presented by the Institute for Mathematics and Its Applications. Feb. 9, 7 p.m., B75 Amundson Hall. For more information, see http://www.ima.umn.edu/public-lecture/2004-05/baraff From natecars at real-time.com Wed Feb 2 19:51:07 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (natecars@real-time.com) Date: Wed Feb 2 19:54:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] FYI for RoadRunner users: 5mb is here! Message-ID: Just a FYI for people with RoadRunner (or Earthlink Cable) - RR has upgraded the basic connectivity to 5mb down/384k for the same price. All you gotta do is reset the modem. Premium is now 8mb down/512k up. -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Wed Feb 2 20:41:54 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Wed Feb 2 20:47:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] FYI for RoadRunner users: 5mb is here! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050202204154.00000871@prokofiev> On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 19:51:07 -0600 (CST) natecars@real-time.com wrote: > Just a FYI for people with RoadRunner (or Earthlink Cable) - RR has > upgraded the basic connectivity to 5mb down/384k for the same price. > All you gotta do is reset the modem. > > Premium is now 8mb down/512k up. Thanks for the FYI, I might have never known! http://www.timewarnercable.com/minnesota/products/internet/speedincreaseinstructions.html Josh From lists at turbobit.com Thu Feb 3 02:53:56 2005 From: lists at turbobit.com (Karl Bongers) Date: Thu Feb 3 07:39:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] help me to hack this embedded linux device In-Reply-To: <6C28DA56-74DA-11D9-A3DA-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> References: <6C28DA56-74DA-11D9-A3DA-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> Message-ID: <20050203085356.GA12352@dad1> Hi Jay, On Tue, Feb 01, 2005 at 11:22:25PM -0600, Jay Austad wrote: > This is for my a768i phone. Does anyone have any idea how I would go > about reading /dev/roflash? I can't even cat it to a file. However, > it's readable on boot, it has to be because it contains the root > filesystem according to this: I don't know why you would not be able to cat from it, looks like it holds your root fs, I can cat from my harddrive raw partition. Could it be an initrd root fs? > # cat /proc/roflash_info > ROFLASH Driver status: Ready > > ROFLASH area name is rootfs > ROFLASH area size = 15728640 bytes > ROFLASH area offset = 1048576 bytes > ROFLASH area l_x_b(10) > ROFLASH area name is language > ROFLASH area size = 11141120 bytes > ROFLASH area offset = 5242880 bytes > ROFLASH area l_x_b(1000) > ROFLASH area name is setup > ROFLASH area size = 131072 bytes > ROFLASH area offset = 16384000 bytes > ROFLASH area l_x_b(1000) > # I wonder if this is an odd driver. I did a google on ROFLASH, but didn't get anywhere. How about lsmod? Or can you find the driver associated with it? How can we figure out the driver associated with /dev/roflash? Where does it come from? Have you done a dmesg to get the kernel log? Don't forget cat /proc/mounts, /proc/filesystems > Also /dev/mtd0 through /dev/mtd3 have info on them, but only 2 and 3 > appear in /dev. Any ideas how to work around this? I tried mknod and > got an operation not permitted error. How can you be sure mtd0 to mtd3 have info, but only 2,3 are in /dev? How would you access them if they don't have dev nodes setup? cramfs is read only, so that might explain the not permitted error, you could try writing on /tmp, or /ram. > Here are the mounted filesystems: > /dev/root on / type cramfs (rw) > none on /ram type ramfs (rw) > proc on /ram/proc type proc (rw) > /dev/roflash1 on /usr/language type cramfs (rw) > /dev/roflash2 on /usr/setup type cramfs (rw) > none on /dev/pts type devpts (rw) > /dev/mtdblock2 on /ezxlocal type vfm (rw,noatime) > /dev/tffsa1 on /diska type ext3 (rw,noatime) > Only /ezxlocal and /diska are writeable, even though they all say (rw). The cramfs is made with mkcramfs or some such tool, then it is dd'ed direct to a partition. You can dd it back to file, then mount it loop. The mtd0,mtd1 if I remember correct are associated with mtdblock0,1, and are used for indirect operations like formating. You may have empty slots(a mtdblock2, but not a mtdblock0,1). The mtd drivers are stock kernel for flash and special memory devices. A google on "vfm" file type shows maybe it's a special flash block driver from intel. How about /dev/tffsa1, whats that thing? From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Fri Feb 4 07:51:58 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Fri Feb 4 07:39:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] More PSCP Help Message-ID: Hello again, Background: I have a Suse 9.0 Linux box set up as 192.168.1.2 I've a Win XP Home Edition box as 192.168.1.1 I've got Putty and Winscp installed on the winbox. I'm trying to pull a few small directories from the Linux box to Windows. They're attached with a crossover cable. Both ping eachother. As per previous help from all of you (Thanks!) I've got my SSH Daemon running on Linux, and my firewall is off on Linux (always was.) The windows box doesn't have a firewall. Problem: Still, no matter what, when trying to pscp -r and pull from Linux to Windows I get the error: ssh init: Connection timed out. (I'm doing this from the Windows command prompt.) I don't have it in front of me, but I'm following the syntax for the command exactly as several listmembers here wrote it out. Any ideas? There's got to be some simple setting I'm missing. Thanks! Nick ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ Support Care2 Email: 1,400 whales may be killed this year. Take action! http://www.care2.com/go/z/17954 From josh at joshwelch.com Fri Feb 4 08:47:15 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Fri Feb 4 08:49:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] More PSCP Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050204084715.abgn8l2bp7z4ocgo@moose.joshwelch.com> Quoting Nick : > Hello again, > > Background: > I have a Suse 9.0 Linux box set up as 192.168.1.2 > I've a Win XP Home Edition box as 192.168.1.1 > I've got Putty and Winscp installed on the winbox. I'm trying to > pull a few small directories from the Linux box to Windows. They're > attached with a crossover cable. Both ping eachother. > > As per previous help from all of you (Thanks!) I've got my SSH > Daemon running on Linux, and my firewall is off on Linux (always > was.) The windows box doesn't have a firewall. > > Problem: > Still, no matter what, when trying to pscp -r and pull from Linux to > Windows I get the error: ssh init: Connection timed out. (I'm doing > this from the Windows command prompt.) I don't have it in front of > me, but I'm following the syntax for the command exactly as several > listmembers here wrote it out. > > Any ideas? There's got to be some simple setting I'm missing. > > Thanks! > Nick > > Quoting Nick : > Hello again, > > Background: > I have a Suse 9.0 Linux box set up as 192.168.1.2 > I've a Win XP Home Edition box as 192.168.1.1 > I've got Putty and Winscp installed on the winbox. I'm trying to > pull a few small directories from the Linux box to Windows. They're > attached with a crossover cable. Both ping eachother. > > As per previous help from all of you (Thanks!) I've got my SSH > Daemon running on Linux, and my firewall is off on Linux (always > was.) The windows box doesn't have a firewall. > > Problem: > Still, no matter what, when trying to pscp -r and pull from Linux to > Windows I get the error: ssh init: Connection timed out. (I'm doing > this from the Windows command prompt.) I don't have it in front of > me, but I'm following the syntax for the command exactly as several > listmembers here wrote it out. > > Any ideas? There's got to be some simple setting I'm missing. > > Thanks! > Nick > > Basic troubleshooting: Can you ping the linux box from the windows box? Can you ping the windows box from the linux box? Can you ssh to localhost on the linux box? Josh From strayf at freeshell.org Fri Feb 4 09:54:24 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Fri Feb 4 09:59:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] More PSCP Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050204155424.GA3309@callisto> On Fri, Feb 04, 2005 at 07:51:58AM -0600, Nick wrote: > Problem: > Still, no matter what, when trying to pscp -r and pull from Linux to > Windows I get the error: ssh init: Connection timed out. (I'm doing > this from the Windows command prompt.) I don't have it in front of > me, but I'm following the syntax for the command exactly as several > listmembers here wrote it out. First, on the linux machine try "ssh localhost" to make sure sshd is accepting connections. Second, I'd try from the windows machine "telnet linux.ip.address 22". You won't be able to make a valid connection, but you should see sshd identify itself. -Steve From dan at dandrake.org Fri Feb 4 10:26:45 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake) Date: Fri Feb 4 10:29:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? Message-ID: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> Time Warner says [1] that you just need to power-cycle your modem to get 5 megabits/sec...I've tried that, and we're still at 3Mb/s (which I'm not complaining about!). Is anyone seeing 5Mb/s? Dan 1. http://www.timewarnercable.com/minnesota/products/internet/speedincreaseinstructions.html -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050204/562e5d7a/attachment.pgp From john.meier at gmail.com Fri Feb 4 10:36:28 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Fri Feb 4 10:39:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <65293fcc05020408367795ef88@mail.gmail.com> Best way to test??? > Is anyone seeing 5Mb/s? > I can test mine - how are you testing yours (I have never actually tested my speeds - what's a good way to do it? From natecars at real-time.com Fri Feb 4 10:48:12 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Fri Feb 4 10:49:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, Dan Drake wrote: > Time Warner says [1] that you just need to power-cycle your modem to get > 5 megabits/sec...I've tried that, and we're still at 3Mb/s (which I'm > not complaining about!). Is anyone seeing 5Mb/s? Yeah, I'm getting it. Notice it on apt-get upgrades. :) -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From natecars at real-time.com Fri Feb 4 10:50:17 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Fri Feb 4 10:58:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, Nate Carlson wrote: > Yeah, I'm getting it. Notice it on apt-get upgrades. :) Good test is to grab a file from ftp.us.kernel.org; here's grabbing a kernel: linux-2.6.8.tar.gz: 42.61 MB 584.40 kB/s -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From j_wrocky at comcast.net Fri Feb 4 10:52:25 2005 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry Weihrauch) Date: Fri Feb 4 10:59:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc05020408367795ef88@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> <65293fcc05020408367795ef88@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4203A849.2080900@comcast.net> John Meier wrote: >Best way to test??? > > > >>Is anyone seeing 5Mb/s? >> >> >> > >I can test mine - how are you testing yours (I have never actually >tested my speeds - what's a good way to do it? > > > One that has many sites to test: http://home.cfl.rr.com/eaa/Bandwidth.htm Over on the other side of the river Comcast said they were increasing speed? Most of the tests on the above site are near 3Mb/s from my computer. Jerry W From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Fri Feb 4 12:53:38 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Fri Feb 4 12:44:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help Message-ID: <6FEEB3B5331C30D45BBA2547779D9E94@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> ************* Original Msg. ************ Can you ping the linux box from the windows box? Can you ping the windows box from the linux box? Can you ssh to localhost on the linux box? Josh Yes, I can ping both ways. I can also ssh to localhost on the Linux machine. Nick ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ Support Care2 Email: 1,400 whales may be killed this year. Take action! http://www.care2.com/go/z/17954 From tmarble at info9.net Fri Feb 4 12:56:55 2005 From: tmarble at info9.net (Tom Marble) Date: Fri Feb 4 12:59:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <4203C577.4050605@info9.net> Dan Drake wrote: > Time Warner says [1] that you just need to power-cycle your modem to get > 5 megabits/sec...I've tried that, and we're still at 3Mb/s (which I'm > not complaining about!). Is anyone seeing 5Mb/s? I tried yesterday using http://www.dslreports.com/stest Before: Your download speed : 2855087 bps, or 2788 kbps. Your upload speed : 363867 bps, or 355 kbps. After: Your download speed : 3096876 bps, or 3024 kbps. Your upload speed : 366804 bps, or 358 kbps. So apparently the roll out is not complete? --Tom -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 256 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050204/b603a33b/signature.pgp From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Feb 4 12:55:54 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Feb 4 12:59:43 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help In-Reply-To: <6FEEB3B5331C30D45BBA2547779D9E94@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> References: <6FEEB3B5331C30D45BBA2547779D9E94@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > ************* Original Msg. ************ > Can you ping the linux box from the windows box? > Can you ping the windows box from the linux box? > Can you ssh to localhost on the linux box? > > Yes, I can ping both ways. I can also ssh to localhost on the Linux > machine. Are you doing ssh as root? Are you using a username? Show us your exact command line (without a password if that's in the command line!). SSH can have root access disallowed so that you have to login to a different account, then 'su' or 'sudo' to root. Mike From dave at math.umn.edu Fri Feb 4 13:08:21 2005 From: dave at math.umn.edu (Dave Carlson) Date: Fri Feb 4 13:09:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <200502041308.24265.dave@math.umn.edu> On Friday 04 February 2005 10:26 am, Dan Drake wrote: > Time Warner says [1] that you just need to power-cycle your modem to get > 5 megabits/sec...I've tried that, and we're still at 3Mb/s (which I'm > not complaining about!). Is anyone seeing 5Mb/s? Definitely getting 5 megabits here (torrents can max it out for testing purposes). I noticed my cable modem upgrade itself after I powered it off, also (it has a different light sequence for me). -- -dave Dave Carlson Systems Administrator School of Mathematics, University of Minnesota http://www.math.umn.edu 8 Vincent Hall Computer Support Requests: 612-625-4895 Cell Phone: 612-747-5415 (personal) E-mail Pager: 6127475415@mobile.att.net PGP/GPG Fingerprint: C3D0 9962 1E98 B742 132D 0E1A CE11 7C4B 5309 97A7 (visit http://www.gnupg.org for more information) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050204/a1d34bf3/attachment.pgp From john.meier at gmail.com Fri Feb 4 13:11:56 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Fri Feb 4 13:15:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <4203C577.4050605@info9.net> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> <4203C577.4050605@info9.net> Message-ID: <65293fcc05020411115c4fcba@mail.gmail.com> Whaaaa.....: Your download speed : 837570 bps, or 817 kbps. Your upload speed : 95123 bps, or 92 kbps. Hummm...... methinks something is up here.... On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 12:56:55 -0600, Tom Marble wrote: > Dan Drake wrote: > > Time Warner says [1] that you just need to power-cycle your modem to get > > 5 megabits/sec...I've tried that, and we're still at 3Mb/s (which I'm > > not complaining about!). Is anyone seeing 5Mb/s? > > I tried yesterday using http://www.dslreports.com/stest > > Before: > Your download speed : 2855087 bps, or 2788 kbps. > Your upload speed : 363867 bps, or 355 kbps. > > After: > Your download speed : 3096876 bps, or 3024 kbps. > Your upload speed : 366804 bps, or 358 kbps. > > So apparently the roll out is not complete? > > --Tom > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > From dan at dandrake.org Fri Feb 4 13:18:33 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake) Date: Fri Feb 4 13:24:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] altering 'Actions' menu in Gnome 2.8? Message-ID: <20050204191833.GB5245@dandrake.org> Here in the math department they use Fedora Core 3, running Gnome 2.8. In my Actions menu, I'd like to remove the 'Lock screen' option, because (1) I never use it and (2) the 'Log out' option is just below it, and I sometimes accidentally lock the screen when trying to log out -- then I have to type my password to unlock the screen and *then* log out. There seems to be no way whatsoever to change this menu, which I find extremely irritating. It's *my* session. I should be able to configure it the way that *I* like it. Am I missing something? This seems like it should be super easy (like power-cycling my cable modem, hmmm...). Thanks, Dan -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050204/2300f33f/attachment.pgp From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Fri Feb 4 13:55:38 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Fri Feb 4 13:44:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help Message-ID: It asks for a password. The computer is at home. If everything were working, of course, I could easily print out and show you what's on the Linux screen. I'm sure it's frustrating trying to get the information you need out of someone that doesn't know as much. I know when I "ssh localhost" it prints a bunch of info out and asks for my user password, NOT the root password. Yes, I'm doing ssh as root. Nick ---- Begin Original Message ---- From: Mike Miller Sent: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:55:54 -0600 (CST) To: Nick CC: TCLUG List Subject: Re: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > ************* Original Msg. ************ > Can you ping the linux box from the windows box? > Can you ping the windows box from the linux box? > Can you ssh to localhost on the linux box? > > Yes, I can ping both ways. I can also ssh to localhost on the Linux > machine. Are you doing ssh as root? ?Are you using a username? ?Show us your exact command line (without a password if that's in the command line!). SSH can have root access disallowed so that you have to login to a different account, then 'su' or 'sudo' to root. Mike ---- End Original Message ---- ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ Support Care2 Email: 1,400 whales may be killed this year. Take action! http://www.care2.com/go/z/17954 From drue at therub.org Fri Feb 4 13:53:40 2005 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Fri Feb 4 13:54:43 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050204195340.GU57293@therub.org> On Fri, Feb 04, 2005 at 01:55:38PM -0600, Nick wrote: > It asks for a password. The computer is at home. If everything were > working, of course, I could easily print out and show you what's on > the Linux screen. I'm sure it's frustrating trying to get the > information you need out of someone that doesn't know as much. > I know when I "ssh localhost" it prints a bunch of info out and asks > for my user password, NOT the root password. > > Yes, I'm doing ssh as root. > > Nick > It would /really/ help us if you'd just paste character for character the command you're running. Have you tried sshing as a user? Dan From john.meier at gmail.com Fri Feb 4 14:37:56 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Fri Feb 4 14:39:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc05020411115c4fcba@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> <4203C577.4050605@info9.net> <65293fcc05020411115c4fcba@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc05020412375cdf5011@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 13:11:56 -0600, John Meier wrote: > Whaaaa.....: > > Your download speed : 837570 bps, or 817 kbps. > > Your upload speed : 95123 bps, or 92 kbps. > > Hummm...... methinks something is up here.... > 2005-02-04 15:34:16 EST: 4475 / 265 Your download speed : 4583275 bps, or 4475 kbps. A 559.4 KB/sec transfer rate. Your upload speed : 271775 bps, or 265 kbps. That's better.... My first test I was VPNed in to a client's site and was running a PCanywhere session, a couple of Remote desktop sessions (wrapped with ssh) and was connected to a hogg of an application through a Citrix server...No wonder the speed test was slloooowwww.... I'm sure glad it's friday. From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Fri Feb 4 14:58:33 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Fri Feb 4 14:59:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc05020412375cdf5011@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> <4203C577.4050605@info9.net> <65293fcc05020411115c4fcba@mail.gmail.com> <65293fcc05020412375cdf5011@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <914f813c050204125819f57138@mail.gmail.com> With naked DSL, I got 1166 down/836 up. Not too bad, considering a claim of 1.5 down/768 up. From smac at visi.com Fri Feb 4 15:03:54 2005 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Fri Feb 4 15:09:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc05020412375cdf5011@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> <4203C577.4050605@info9.net> <65293fcc05020411115c4fcba@mail.gmail.com> <65293fcc05020412375cdf5011@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1107551034.4203e33a64cbd@my.visi.com> Sounds like John (and the rest of us) could use a beer. Sam. Quoting John Meier : > On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 13:11:56 -0600, John Meier wrote: > > Whaaaa.....: > > > > Your download speed : 837570 bps, or 817 kbps. > > > > Your upload speed : 95123 bps, or 92 kbps. > > > > Hummm...... methinks something is up here.... > > > > 2005-02-04 15:34:16 EST: 4475 / 265 > Your download speed : 4583275 bps, or 4475 kbps. > A 559.4 KB/sec transfer rate. > Your upload speed : 271775 bps, or 265 kbps. > > That's better.... > > My first test I was VPNed in to a client's site and was running a > PCanywhere session, a couple of Remote desktop sessions (wrapped with > ssh) and was connected to a hogg of an application through a Citrix > server...No wonder the speed test was slloooowwww.... > > I'm sure glad it's friday. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From smac at visi.com Fri Feb 4 15:09:39 2005 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Fri Feb 4 15:14:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1107551379.4203e49354e53@my.visi.com> You will need to enable SSH as root but this is not a.... secure idea. SSH as just a user, us "su" to gain root access. If you open SSH up for root login be ready to have a some fun removing a rootkit or re-installing Linux. BTW... "it prints a bunch of info out" that "info" is very important to us when we attempt to trouble shoot any problem. Sam. Quoting Nick : > It asks for a password. The computer is at home. If everything were > working, of course, I could easily print out and show you what's on > the Linux screen. I'm sure it's frustrating trying to get the > information you need out of someone that doesn't know as much. > I know when I "ssh localhost" it prints a bunch of info out and asks > for my user password, NOT the root password. > > Yes, I'm doing ssh as root. > > Nick > > ---- Begin Original Message ---- > > From: Mike Miller > Sent: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:55:54 -0600 (CST) > To: Nick > CC: TCLUG List > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help > > > On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > > > ************* Original Msg. ************ > > Can you ping the linux box from the windows box? > > Can you ping the windows box from the linux box? > > Can you ssh to localhost on the linux box? > > > > Yes, I can ping both ways. I can also ssh to localhost on the > Linux > > machine. > > > Are you doing ssh as root? ?Are you using a username? ?Show us your > exact > command line (without a password if that's in the command line!). > > SSH can have root access disallowed so that you have to login to a > different account, then 'su' or 'sudo' to root. > > Mike > > > > ---- End Original Message ---- > > > > > ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the > oppressor, never the victim.? > ~ Elie Wiesel > > View my blog & artwork! > *********************** > http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ > Support Care2 Email: 1,400 whales may be killed this year. Take action! > http://www.care2.com/go/z/17954 > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Feb 4 16:14:26 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Feb 4 16:19:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help In-Reply-To: <1107551379.4203e49354e53@my.visi.com> References: <1107551379.4203e49354e53@my.visi.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 smac@visi.com wrote: > You will need to enable SSH as root but this is not a.... secure idea. > SSH as just a user, us "su" to gain root access. That's what I do too. > If you open SSH up for root login be ready to have a some fun removing a > rootkit or re-installing Linux. Some people argue vociferously that this is not an important security precaution. The key, they say, is using good passwords and applying security patches immediately when they become available. They have a point, but I say that it will make a difference whenever you are running an insecure ssh. That might never happen, but if it does happen, you'll be protected. I assume that the argument for allowing root login is based entirely on convenience. Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Feb 4 16:09:55 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Feb 4 16:24:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: More PSCP Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > It asks for a password. The computer is at home. You are at the windows machine trying to connect to the linux machine and the linux machine sends a password prompt to you at the windows machine. Is that correct? The linux machine is at home, or the windows machine is at home? You are in your office at work? > If everything were working, of course, I could easily print out and show > you what's on the Linux screen. I'm sure it's frustrating trying to get > the information you need out of someone that doesn't know as much. > I know when I "ssh localhost" it prints a bunch of info out and asks for > my user password, NOT the root password. That's a good sign. Try this: ssh root@localhost And tell us if that works. > Yes, I'm doing ssh as root. You might have root access turned off. Do this: less /etc/sshd_config And look for this line: PermitRootLogin no If you have that line, you can't do root login. If it says 'yes' instead of 'no' at the end of that line, you can do root login but ... More on that later... Mike From bradyh at bitstream.net Fri Feb 4 18:12:20 2005 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Fri Feb 4 18:14:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] altering 'Actions' menu in Gnome 2.8? In-Reply-To: <20050204191833.GB5245@dandrake.org> References: <20050204191833.GB5245@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <1107562340.5208.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> I've looked into this myself. There are some clues here: http://www.gnome.org/start/2.0/menuediting.html On the one hand I hope that Gnome 2.10 will allow menu editing again. Gnome 2.4 had it but it went away when they started implementing open desktop standards (to,among other things, make Gnome and KDE more compatible.) On the other hand I'm curious so I'll look into it this weekend and let you know if I find anything out. Brady On Fri, 2005-02-04 at 13:18 -0600, Dan Drake wrote: > Here in the math department they use Fedora Core 3, running Gnome 2.8. > In my Actions menu, I'd like to remove the 'Lock screen' option, because > (1) I never use it and (2) the 'Log out' option is just below it, and I > sometimes accidentally lock the screen when trying to log out -- then I > have to type my password to unlock the screen and *then* log out. > > There seems to be no way whatsoever to change this menu, which I find > extremely irritating. It's *my* session. I should be able to configure it > the way that *I* like it. > > Am I missing something? This seems like it should be super easy (like > power-cycling my cable modem, hmmm...). > > Thanks, > > Dan > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Brady Hegberg From poptix at poptix.net Fri Feb 4 20:55:44 2005 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Fri Feb 4 20:59:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] anyone getting 5 megabits on a Time Warner cable modem? In-Reply-To: <4203A849.2080900@comcast.net> References: <20050204162644.GA4997@dandrake.org> <65293fcc05020408367795ef88@mail.gmail.com> <4203A849.2080900@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20050205025544.GB3913@momentum.poptix.net> On Fri, Feb 04, 2005 at 10:52:25AM -0600, Jerry Weihrauch wrote: > > Over on the other side of the river Comcast said they were increasing > speed? Most of the tests on the above site are near 3Mb/s from my computer. Comcast plans to have their entire network upgraded by March 31st, Minnesota should be sometime before then. Two packages will be available, the standard 4.2mbit/384kbit package and their gold/pro/home networking package at 6.4mbit/768kbit for an extra $10/month. -- Matthew S. Hallacy FUBAR, LART, BOFH Certified http://www.poptix.net GPG public key 0x01938203 From linuser at esox.us Fri Feb 4 22:18:31 2005 From: linuser at esox.us (Dave Erickson) Date: Fri Feb 4 22:19:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] altering 'Actions' menu in Gnome 2.8? In-Reply-To: <20050204191833.GB5245@dandrake.org> References: <20050204191833.GB5245@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <42044917.7080508@esox.us> Dan Drake wrote: > Here in the math department they use Fedora Core 3, running Gnome 2.8. > In my Actions menu, I'd like to remove the 'Lock screen' option, because > (1) I never use it and (2) the 'Log out' option is just below it, and I > sometimes accidentally lock the screen when trying to log out -- then I > have to type my password to unlock the screen and *then* log out. > > There seems to be no way whatsoever to change this menu, which I find > extremely irritating. It's *my* session. I should be able to configure it > the way that *I* like it. > > Am I missing something? This seems like it should be super easy (like > power-cycling my cable modem, hmmm...). > > Thanks, > > Dan Don't know about the menu editing but to at least help your frustration: Open up the xscreensaver prefs and set a delay for the 'require password' section. Can't test it right now but I think it will work. Good Luck -- Dave Erickson [ http://www.esox.us/ ] From nate at refried.org Sat Feb 5 21:22:54 2005 From: nate at refried.org (Nate Straz) Date: Sat Feb 5 21:24:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] IETF meeting in Minneapolis in March Message-ID: <20050206032253.GA2872@refried.org> Does anyone know someone going to the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) meeting in March? It's going to be in Minneapolis during the second week. I'm thinking it would be really cool to have one of the speakers give a practice talk in front of TCLUG the Saturday before. For those interested in how I found out about the meeting: 1. I saw Sunbird was released so I had to take a look 2. I found the tutorial on how Sunbird can publish to webdav really easily. I use Zope which supports webdev so I had to try that out. 3. I thought it would be cool to have more support for iCalendar in Zope or Python so I searched around for that. 4. I found many of the projects hadn't been touched in years so I searched to find out what the current status of RFC 2445 is. 5. I found a new mailing list for internet calendaring and scheduling on which a new draft for iCal-Basic. 6. Also on the list was some talk about setting up a BoF at the Minneapolis IETF meeting. 7. I had to find out when it was. Nate - Surfing in circles today. From florin at iucha.net Sun Feb 6 01:04:23 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Sun Feb 6 01:04:53 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] IETF meeting in Minneapolis in March In-Reply-To: <20050206032253.GA2872@refried.org> References: <20050206032253.GA2872@refried.org> Message-ID: <4205C177.8080306@iucha.net> Nate Straz wrote: >For those interested in how I found out about the meeting: > 1. I saw Sunbird was released so I had to take a look > 2. I found the tutorial on how Sunbird can publish to webdav really > easily. I use Zope which supports webdev so I had to try that out. > 3. I thought it would be cool to have more support for iCalendar in > Zope or Python so I searched around for that. > 4. I found many of the projects hadn't been touched in years so I > searched to find out what the current status of RFC 2445 is. > 5. I found a new mailing list for internet calendaring and scheduling > on which a new draft for iCal-Basic. > 6. Also on the list was some talk about setting up a BoF at the > Minneapolis IETF meeting. > 7. I had to find out when it was. > > >Nate > - Surfing in circles today. > > Nate, Do you have a weather applet? Those 50+ degrees were OUTSIDE, not Mobo temperature... florin From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Sun Feb 6 01:05:23 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (SDALAN04@smumn.edu) Date: Sun Feb 6 01:09:53 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ISSA Chapter Interest? Message-ID: <2005020607052374bf5502f3@mail.smumn.edu> Good morning everyone, I'd like to thank every single one of you who donated to the Minneapolis Library back in November/December. The main purpose for this e-mail is to ask whether I could get one or two individuals who would be interested to give a speech (presentation) on Computer Security this coming Spring. The presentations would be given at the Spring maybe Summer conferences for the Information Systems Security Association, if interested please e-mail me w/ any questions or concerns. If you consider being a speaker, remember that they are geared towards Security Professionals. Thank you for your time and look forward hearing from you. Dave Alanis sdalan04 at smumn edu From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Sun Feb 6 09:59:49 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Sun Feb 6 09:59:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? Message-ID: <20050206095949.00006ef2@prokofiev> Hi, I ordered a dual pIII board from eBay and seperately a matched pair set of CPUs. The board is missing the retention braces though for mounting the CPUs so they kinda hang loose right now. Does anyone have any of these? Also a general question. This case has two fans mounted on the back, both CPUs have a heat sink, but no fan attached directly to the CPU. Is this enough cooling? (933 Mhz PIII's) Josh From smac at visi.com Sun Feb 6 11:55:28 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sun Feb 6 11:59:56 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? In-Reply-To: <20050206095949.00006ef2@prokofiev> References: <20050206095949.00006ef2@prokofiev> Message-ID: <42065A10.4080907@visi.com> Hard to tell if the 2 fans will be enough to keep 2 CPU's at a safe temperature. I googled cpu + temperature + linux http://secure.netroedge.com/~lm78/ Last update was January 3, 2005 Sam. Josh Trutwin wrote: >Hi, > >I ordered a dual pIII board from eBay and seperately a matched pair >set of CPUs. The board is missing the retention braces though for >mounting the CPUs so they kinda hang loose right now. Does anyone >have any of these? > >Also a general question. This case has two fans mounted on the back, >both CPUs have a heat sink, but no fan attached directly to the CPU. >Is this enough cooling? (933 Mhz PIII's) > >Josh > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.5 - Release Date: 2/3/2005 From jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com Sun Feb 6 12:38:51 2005 From: jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com (Jason Reynolds) Date: Sun Feb 6 12:44:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? In-Reply-To: <20050206095949.00006ef2@prokofiev> Message-ID: <200502061838.j16IcsXg029232@ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com> -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Josh Trutwin Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2005 10:00 AM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [tclug-list] Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? Hi, I ordered a dual pIII board from eBay and seperately a matched pair set of CPUs. The board is missing the retention braces though for mounting the CPUs so they kinda hang loose right now. Does anyone have any of these? Also a general question. This case has two fans mounted on the back, both CPUs have a heat sink, but no fan attached directly to the CPU. Is this enough cooling? (933 Mhz PIII's) Josh I have an older style Gateway Solo. It is in a small case and originally had just the power supply fan and a little hood to cool it. It did the job, but I have seen some of these have motherboards fail. Not sure if it's due to components being cheap or maybe a heating issue. I placed a fan & heatsink on the processor to prevent any issues in my little computer and it's working great. They are 1Ghz P3's. So I'd recommended playing it safe and getting some decent cooling for your processors. It should cost very much for some peace of mind. Jason Reynolds From jonner.2530195 at bloglines.com Sun Feb 6 13:53:05 2005 From: jonner.2530195 at bloglines.com (jonner.2530195@bloglines.com) Date: Sun Feb 6 13:54:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] altering 'Actions' menu in Gnome 2.8? Message-ID: <1107719585.1811932469.29177.sendItem@bloglines.com> Apologies if this comes through twice. I think i forgot to 'reply to all' on my last one though. The "lock screen" menu item looks like it can be removed like this: * fire up gconf-editor * navigate to apps > panel > global * select checkbox for "disable lock screen" Kind of hack-y (in that there doesn't seem to be a user-visible preference for it), but it seems to work fine for me. Jonathon From cschumann at twp-llc.com Sun Feb 6 14:08:55 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Sun Feb 6 14:09:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Free 16MB EDO Message-ID: <200502062007.j16K7v07009992@alpha.twp-llc.com> Free to first taker: One piece 16MB RAM 60nS 72 pin SIMM Works as EDO or FPM (apparently) 8 chips labelled TI TMS 417409-DJ60 Board marked Southland Sticker says 30432G6Y/151J Another says A009840 16MB You can pick up at my home in Saint Paul. No warranty, as it's FREE, but it worked when I removed it from a working machine... like an IBM PS ValuePoint 486. Whenever that was. From chewie at wookimus.net Sun Feb 6 14:11:46 2005 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Sun Feb 6 14:15:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] SchoolBell -- Python iCalendar Server Message-ID: <20050206201146.GD768@wookimus.net> Nate Straz wrote: > 3. I thought it would be cool to have more support for iCalendar in > Zope or Python so I searched around for that. Cool project I found the other day by doing similar surfing. Looking at one of the the Bounties page for Python projects, I ran into the SchoolTool project -- a Python-based administration software for educational institutions. They've split off SchoolBell and genericized it to be an all-around calendaring application. Debian has packages for it, it appears. I plan on test-driving it once I get back from vacation. -- Chad Walstrom http://www.wookimus.net/ assert(expired(knowledge)); /* core dump */ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050206/de3f9cc8/attachment.pgp From webmaster at mn-linux.org Mon Feb 7 01:10:36 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Feb 7 01:15:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502070710.j177AaK23859@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: random pc stuff --Linksys EtherFast 10/100 16port hub, modle # efah16w..$5 Previous owner claimed to have issues w/ it; it has been fine for me. --Linksys EtherFast 10/100 5 port switch model # ezxs55w...$5 sometimes the power plug doesn't make contact...long as you don't bump it alot it works fine. ATX full tower, 6 5.25 bays, 280w p/s...$5 ATX Gateway midtower, 200w p/s...$2 Gateway pII 450, 64mb ram, 6gb hd, nic, ls120 drive, no cd or real floppy...$25 Bunch of US Robotics 33.6 modems, should be flashable to 56k, $0.25ea Seller Email address: jungle at hickorytech dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From jpschewe at mtu.net Mon Feb 7 06:45:39 2005 From: jpschewe at mtu.net (Jon Schewe) Date: Mon Feb 7 06:50:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] smbfs and DFS? Message-ID: <1107780339.1865.20.camel@mn65-eggplant.htc.honeywell.com> Anyone been able to mount a dfs tree with samba or know of some documentation that might tell me if it should work? ________________________________________________________________________ Jon Schewe | http://mtu.net/~jpschewe GPG signature at http://mtu.net/~jpschewe/gpg.sig.html For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. - Romans 8:38-39 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050207/76d30bfc/attachment.htm From d9387120 at sihope.com Mon Feb 7 07:54:08 2005 From: d9387120 at sihope.com (dan empanger) Date: Mon Feb 7 07:55:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Retentiion Braces for Mother Board In-Reply-To: <200502061806.j16I6hZX087908@marvin.sihope.com> References: <200502061806.j16I6hZX087908@marvin.sihope.com> Message-ID: <42077300.6010606@sihope.com> No - you should have a fan on the CPU. I would try GenNano on University or Que Computers on East Hennepin. They may be able to help you. tclug-list-request@mn-linux.org wrote: >Send tclug-list mailing list submissions to > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://shadowknight.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > tclug-list-request@mn-linux.org > >You can reach the person managing the list at > tclug-list-owner@mn-linux.org > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of tclug-list digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. IETF meeting in Minneapolis in March (Nate Straz) > 2. Re: IETF meeting in Minneapolis in March (Florin Iucha) > 3. ISSA Chapter Interest? (SDALAN04@smumn.edu) > 4. Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? (Josh Trutwin) > 5. Re: Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? (Sam MacDonald) > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Message: 1 >Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 21:22:54 -0600 >From: nate@refried.org (Nate Straz) >Subject: [tclug-list] IETF meeting in Minneapolis in March >To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org >Message-ID: <20050206032253.GA2872@refried.org> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > >Does anyone know someone going to the Internet Engineering Task Force >(IETF) meeting in March? It's going to be in Minneapolis during the >second week. I'm thinking it would be really cool to have one of the >speakers give a practice talk in front of TCLUG the Saturday before. > >For those interested in how I found out about the meeting: > 1. I saw Sunbird was released so I had to take a look > 2. I found the tutorial on how Sunbird can publish to webdav really > easily. I use Zope which supports webdev so I had to try that out. > 3. I thought it would be cool to have more support for iCalendar in > Zope or Python so I searched around for that. > 4. I found many of the projects hadn't been touched in years so I > searched to find out what the current status of RFC 2445 is. > 5. I found a new mailing list for internet calendaring and scheduling > on which a new draft for iCal-Basic. > 6. Also on the list was some talk about setting up a BoF at the > Minneapolis IETF meeting. > 7. I had to find out when it was. > > >Nate > - Surfing in circles today. > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 2 >Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 01:04:23 -0600 >From: Florin Iucha >Subject: Re: [tclug-list] IETF meeting in Minneapolis in March >To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org >Message-ID: <4205C177.8080306@iucha.net> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > >Nate Straz wrote: > > > >>For those interested in how I found out about the meeting: >>1. I saw Sunbird was released so I had to take a look >>2. I found the tutorial on how Sunbird can publish to webdav really >> easily. I use Zope which supports webdev so I had to try that out. >>3. I thought it would be cool to have more support for iCalendar in >> Zope or Python so I searched around for that. >>4. I found many of the projects hadn't been touched in years so I >> searched to find out what the current status of RFC 2445 is. >>5. I found a new mailing list for internet calendaring and scheduling >> on which a new draft for iCal-Basic. >>6. Also on the list was some talk about setting up a BoF at the >> Minneapolis IETF meeting. >>7. I had to find out when it was. >> >> >>Nate >>- Surfing in circles today. >> >> >> >> >Nate, > >Do you have a weather applet? > >Those 50+ degrees were OUTSIDE, not Mobo temperature... > >florin > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 3 >Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 01:05:23 -0600 >From: SDALAN04@smumn.edu >Subject: [tclug-list] ISSA Chapter Interest? >To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org >Message-ID: <2005020607052374bf5502f3@mail.smumn.edu> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > >Good morning everyone, I'd like to thank every single one of you who donated to the Minneapolis Library back in November/December. The main purpose for this e-mail is to ask whether I could get one or two individuals who would be interested to give a speech (presentation) on Computer Security this coming Spring. The presentations would be given at the Spring maybe Summer conferences for the Information Systems Security Association, if interested please e-mail me w/ any questions or concerns. If you consider being a speaker, remember that they are geared towards Security Professionals. Thank you for your time and look forward hearing from you. > > >Dave Alanis > >sdalan04 at smumn edu > > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 4 >Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 09:59:49 -0600 >From: Josh Trutwin >Subject: [tclug-list] Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? >To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org >Message-ID: <20050206095949.00006ef2@prokofiev> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > >Hi, > >I ordered a dual pIII board from eBay and seperately a matched pair >set of CPUs. The board is missing the retention braces though for >mounting the CPUs so they kinda hang loose right now. Does anyone >have any of these? > >Also a general question. This case has two fans mounted on the back, >both CPUs have a heat sink, but no fan attached directly to the CPU. >Is this enough cooling? (933 Mhz PIII's) > >Josh > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 5 >Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 11:55:28 -0600 >From: Sam MacDonald >Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Retention Braces for Slot 1 MOBO? >To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org >Message-ID: <42065A10.4080907@visi.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > >Hard to tell if the 2 fans will be enough to keep 2 CPU's at a safe >temperature. >I googled cpu + temperature + linux > >http://secure.netroedge.com/~lm78/ > >Last update was January 3, 2005 > >Sam. > >Josh Trutwin wrote: > > > >>Hi, >> >>I ordered a dual pIII board from eBay and seperately a matched pair >>set of CPUs. The board is missing the retention braces though for >>mounting the CPUs so they kinda hang loose right now. Does anyone >>have any of these? >> >>Also a general question. This case has two fans mounted on the back, >>both CPUs have a heat sink, but no fan attached directly to the CPU. >>Is this enough cooling? (933 Mhz PIII's) >> >>Josh >> >>_______________________________________________ >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Mon Feb 7 09:14:48 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Mon Feb 7 09:05:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Even More PSCP Message-ID: <81D56B2E317D3EE47B6B35E9F56C3E0E@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Okay. As per the requests of several people, here's a readout of what I'm seeing. The exact command I'm running from my Windows box is: pscp -r /home/user/directories/to/copy user@192.168.1.2:/C:\Home "Home" is the name of a directory on the Windows machine where I want to put my copied files. On the Linux machine when I "ssh localhost" as root I get this: "Authenticity of host "localhost 127.0.0.1" can't be established. RSA key fingerprint is 46:e9:37:b7:4f:d6:9c:b8:69:a1:57:aa:06:1f:fa:87" It then asks if I want to continue and I say "yes". It then reads: "Write failed. Broken pipe." That "Broken Pipe" part is new. When I "ssh localhost" as a user it pauses for a minute, then asks for the user password. I enter the password and it reads out the date and time of last login and goes back to the command prompt. Also, to answer a few questions, both machines are at home, and I'm at work corresponding through email. One is running Suse Linux 9.0 and the other is Windows XP Home Edition. Thanks! Nick ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ Support Care2 Email: 1,400 whales may be killed this year. Take action! http://www.care2.com/go/z/17954 From dan at dandrake.org Mon Feb 7 09:25:22 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake) Date: Mon Feb 7 09:30:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] altering 'Actions' menu in Gnome 2.8? In-Reply-To: <1107719585.1811932469.29177.sendItem@bloglines.com> References: <1107719585.1811932469.29177.sendItem@bloglines.com> Message-ID: <20050207152522.GA11828@dandrake.org> Hacky or not, that worked. Thanks. On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 at 07:53PM -0000, jonner.2530195@bloglines.com wrote: > Apologies if this comes through twice. I think i forgot to 'reply to > all' on my last one though. The "lock screen" menu item looks like > it can be removed like this: > > * fire up gconf-editor > > * navigate to apps > panel > global > > * select checkbox for "disable lock screen" Dan -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050207/5adc1e45/attachment.pgp From obelin23 at gmail.com Mon Feb 7 09:29:22 2005 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Mon Feb 7 09:35:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Slackware 10.1 Released Message-ID: <72278d10502070729bd9b3d0@mail.gmail.com> Like the subject says. For those who were wondering about helping Pat out from his illness - the closest he came to asking for help, is to say that purchasing this release would help with the unexpected expenses from his 'medical vacation'. Cheers, Charlie Obert From sfertch at gmail.com Mon Feb 7 10:00:05 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Feb 7 10:05:04 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] Even More PSCP In-Reply-To: <67f3084a05020707365d89dc0e@mail.gmail.com> References: <81D56B2E317D3EE47B6B35E9F56C3E0E@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> <67f3084a05020707365d89dc0e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a05020708006720e8aa@mail.gmail.com> Forwarding to list for archival purposes, keep forgetting to change the reply-to... ---------- Forwarded message ---------- On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 09:14:48 -0600, Nick wrote: > Okay. As per the requests of several people, here's a readout of > what I'm seeing. > > The exact command I'm running from my Windows box is: > > pscp -r /home/user/directories/to/copy user@192.168.1.2:/C:\Home > > "Home" is the name of a directory on the Windows machine where I > want to put my copied files. The command should be: pscp -r username@linuxbox:/home/username/directories/to/copy c:\Home However, I usually work from the directory I'm manipulating files on the windows machine, so it's: pscp -r username@linuxbox:/home/username/directories/to/copy . The "." represents the current working directory. From bradyh at bitstream.net Mon Feb 7 10:12:54 2005 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Mon Feb 7 10:12:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] altering 'Actions' menu in Gnome 2.8? In-Reply-To: <20050207152522.GA11828@dandrake.org> References: <1107719585.1811932469.29177.sendItem@bloglines.com> <20050207152522.GA11828@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <1107792774.5208.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> Well, that's much less hacky then poking around for the file with the setting in it and changing it manually. (And then maybe having to change it again later if the file is overwritten.) And btw, I didn't get this figured out over the weekend because of damn World of Warcraft. Which runs pretty good on Transgaming's new Wine, though I think you need >512MB. > Hacky or not, that worked. Thanks. > > On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 at 07:53PM -0000, jonner.2530195@bloglines.com wrote: > > Apologies if this comes through twice. I think i forgot to 'reply to > > all' on my last one though. The "lock screen" menu item looks like > > it can be removed like this: > > > > * fire up gconf-editor > > > > * navigate to apps > panel > global > > > > * select checkbox for "disable lock screen" > > Dan > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Brady Hegberg From smac at visi.com Mon Feb 7 11:31:51 2005 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Feb 7 11:38:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT [Wise Installer] Message-ID: <1107797511.4207a60704fab@my.visi.com> I used this product several versions ago... okay a long time ago I used version 1. I have and opportunity to get back in to software packaging at a much higher rate of pay then I am making now. Would anyone with these skills be willing to give me a crash course in the latest version? I am reading the documentation now so I am getting a feel for the software. I have also down loaded the trial version. Sam. From obelin23 at gmail.com Mon Feb 7 11:45:52 2005 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Mon Feb 7 11:52:26 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] Slackware 10.1 Released - Upgrading In-Reply-To: <72278d105020709394c62c027@mail.gmail.com> References: <72278d10502070729bd9b3d0@mail.gmail.com> <20050207104855.00004713@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> <72278d105020709394c62c027@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <72278d10502070945767b0a5e@mail.gmail.com> (My response re Slackware upgrading, forwarded to the TCLUG List - I assume his question to me went to the list also. CO2) Hi Josh, Yes, there is a file named UPGRADE.TXT . I found it on the Oregon State mirror online, under the Slackware 10.1 directory - not the ISO directory, the other one. (If you get the ISO image it should be on the image, though I haven't confirmed that.) Anyway, here it is - I copied the contents to this email. I haven't done it yet - I subscribe to Slackware and will wait for the official disks to arrive. (I switched to Slack last spring so I am only moderately experienced with the distro.) Basically you are using the upgradepkg command, and then cleaning up config files that have changed. It looks extremely similar to the 9.1 to 10.0 procedure. Enjoy, and keep the Slack. CO2 ---- Slackware 10.0 to 10.1 Upgrade HOWTO This document explains how to upgrade from Slackware 10.0 to Slackware 10.1 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Before you begin, I would strongly recommend making a backup of your system, or, if not the entire system, at least the /etc directory. You might find that you need to refer to a few things about the upgrade process is complete. Back it up, or take your chances. OK, now that everything is safely backed up, let's proceed. :-) To do this, you'll need the Slackware 10.1 packages. If these are on a CD, create a new directory to mount the CD on so that it doesn't get in the way during the upgrade: mkdir /packages mount /dev/cdrom /packages The packages don't have to be on a CD-ROM, as an alternative you could copy the slackware directory (the one with the various package subdirectories in it, basically the "slackware" directory from the install CD) to someplace like /root/slackware/. The important thing is that you know where the slackware packages directory is. We'll use /root/slackware in the following examples. 0. Put your machine in single-user mode: telinit 1 1. Upgrade your glibc shared libraries. This is important, or things might go haywire during the first part of the upgrade: upgradepkg /root/slackware/a/glibc-solibs-*.tgz 2. Upgrade your package utilities: upgradepkg /root/slackware/a/pkgtools-*.tgz 3. Install sed. You should already have this, but since it's used by the package utilities it is best to be sure: upgradepkg --install-new /root/slackware/a/sed-*.tgz 4. Upgrade everything else (and install new packages): upgradepkg --install-new /root/slackware/*/*.tgz 5. Make sure your system will boot. If you use LILO, make sure the paths in /etc/lilo.conf point to a valid kernel and then type 'lilo' to reinstall LILO. If you use a bootdisk, you'll need to use makebootdisk to make a new bootdisk using the kernel in /boot. 6. Fix your config files. Some of the config files in /etc are going to need your attention. You'll find the new incoming config files on your system with the ".new" extension. You may need to fill these in with information from your old config files and then move them over. Feel brave? You can use this little script to install all of the .new config files in /etc. If you've made any local changes you'll need to add them to the newly installed files. Your old config files will be copied to *.bak. Anyway, it might be an easier starting point. Here it is: #!/bin/sh cd /etc find . -name "*.new" | while read configfile ; do if [ ! "$configfile" = "./rc.d/rc.inet1.conf.new" \ -a ! "$configfile" = "./group.new" \ -a ! "$configfile" = "./passwd.new" \ -a ! "$configfile" = "./shadow.new" ]; then cp -a $(echo $configfile | rev | cut -f 2- -d . | rev) \ $(echo $configfile | rev | cut -f 2- -d . | rev).bak 2> /dev/null mv $configfile $(echo $configfile | rev | cut -f 2- -d . | rev) fi done You'll probably also need to edit your /etc/X11/xorg.conf to change the name of the keyboard driver from "Keyboard" to "kbd". I don't know why this changed, but it did. 7. Return to multi-user mode: telinit 3 8. Remove obsolete packages. If you go into /var/log/packages and take a look at the package list: ls -lt | less You may spot some old, obsolete, or discontinued packages. If so, you can remove these using 'removepkg'. 9. Remove KDE language bloat. By upgrading all packages using --install-new you've probably installed all of the KDE language translations from the KDEI series, which will use up about 500MB. If you need only US English, you may remove the KDE language packs like this: cd /var/log/packages removepkg kde-i18n* koffice-i18n* Even if you need one of these, it might be best to start by removing them all, and then go back and install the ones you need with installpkg. At this point you should be running Slackware 10.1. :-) I wish everyone good luck with this! --- Patrick Volkerding volkerdi@slackware.com From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Mon Feb 7 11:57:58 2005 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Mon Feb 7 12:00:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT [Wise Installer] Message-ID: Sam, Check this out while you are looking into the Wise Installer: http://www.jrsoftware.org/isinfo.php Seems pretty nice if you need to make Windows installation packages. I have used it for a few things, and it works well. Troy >>> 02/07/05 11:31 AM >>> I used this product several versions ago... okay a long time ago I used version 1. I have and opportunity to get back in to software packaging at a much higher rate of pay then I am making now. Would anyone with these skills be willing to give me a crash course in the latest version? I am reading the documentation now so I am getting a feel for the software. I have also down loaded the trial version. Sam. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Mon Feb 7 11:47:49 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Feb 7 12:06:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Even More PSCP In-Reply-To: <81D56B2E317D3EE47B6B35E9F56C3E0E@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> References: <81D56B2E317D3EE47B6B35E9F56C3E0E@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 7 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > Okay. As per the requests of several people, here's a readout of > what I'm seeing. > > The exact command I'm running from my Windows box is: > > pscp -r /home/user/directories/to/copy user@192.168.1.2:/C:\Home I think this is backwards...it should be: pscp -r user@192.168.1.2:/home/user/directories C:\Home ^ SOURCE ^ ^ Destination You are copying /home/user/dirs from 192.168.1.2 TO C:\Home From cschumann at twp-llc.com Mon Feb 7 13:31:33 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Feb 7 13:35:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: Slackware 10.1 Released In-Reply-To: <200502071758.j17Hwf07013010@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200502071931.j17JVX07013332@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 15:29:22 +0000 > From: Charlie O > For those who were wondering about helping Pat out from his > illness - the closest he came to asking for help, is to say > that purchasing this release would help with the unexpected > expenses from his 'medical vacation'. > > Cheers, > > Charlie Obert I'm a Red Hat and Fedora user so far. But now I have an old laptop (486) that I want to get running. Debian seems OK, but the XFree86 is lame (320x200). I've never tried Slackware, but I'm downloading the torrents for CD's 1 and 2 right now and will seed them for a few days to help with the load. I'm more than happy to buy a set if it works for me. Chris Schumann From j_wrocky at comcast.net Mon Feb 7 13:36:59 2005 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry Weihrauch) Date: Mon Feb 7 13:40:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PC parts & supplies Message-ID: <4207C35B.6040205@comcast.net> Computer supplies and parts Que computers has moved, the new address is 2600 26th Ave. S, Minneapolis http://www.quecomputers.com/ Jerry W From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Mon Feb 7 15:04:04 2005 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Feb 7 15:10:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Debian on 486 laptop In-Reply-To: <200502071931.j17JVX07013332@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200502071758.j17Hwf07013010@alpha.twp-llc.com> <200502071931.j17JVX07013332@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <20050207150404.A7790@pchelka.space.umn.edu> On Mon, Feb 07, 2005 at 01:31:33PM -0600, Chris Schumann wrote: > I'm a Red Hat and Fedora user so far. But now I have an old > laptop (486) that I want to get running. Debian seems OK, but > the XFree86 is lame (320x200). 320x200 ? That's odd. If that's your main problem with Debian on the laptop, you might want to search for a better XF86Config for it. Does the laptop have a CD drive? If so you might want to try Knoppix, which sometimes does a better job of configuring X than Debian itself. Just boot up Knoppix, and copy the XF86Config to your Debian partition. -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | From DeBeau at aol.com Sun Feb 6 19:25:09 2005 From: DeBeau at aol.com (DeBeau@aol.com) Date: Mon Feb 7 21:56:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Upgrade Message-ID: <64.4e4f185d.2f381d75@aol.com> I have a dual boot program (GRUB) on my hard drive to boot Fedora or Windows XP. I recently upgraded the System board, CPU and RAM. Now the system does not go to the GRUB program but announces that it finds no boot sector and suggests that it be booted from "A" drive. How do I get it back to GRUB? Thanks Richard DeBeau -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050206/d83983c6/attachment.htm From thay0012 at umn.edu Mon Feb 7 14:36:18 2005 From: thay0012 at umn.edu (Tryggvi Thayer) Date: Mon Feb 7 21:56:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Looking for a subject for a research project Message-ID: <52dd15d5335daf3ad1a472d2a09f3e1b@umn.edu> Dear members of the Twin Cities Linux User Group, My name is Tryggvi Thayer and I am a graduate student at the U of M. I am looking for a subject for a case study looking at open source development as a model for online learning. For the subject this would entail being interviewed once or twice about how participating in open source development contributes to their own learning and professional development. If anyone is interested please email me at thay0012 at umn dot edu. Kind regards, Tryggvi Thayer From tmarble at info9.net Mon Feb 7 22:28:25 2005 From: tmarble at info9.net (Tom Marble) Date: Mon Feb 7 22:33:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Upgrade In-Reply-To: <64.4e4f185d.2f381d75@aol.com> References: <64.4e4f185d.2f381d75@aol.com> Message-ID: <42083FE9.7090705@info9.net> DeBeau@aol.com wrote: > I have a dual boot program (GRUB) on my hard drive to boot Fedora or > Windows XP. I recently upgraded the System board, CPU and RAM. Now the > system does not go to the GRUB program but announces that it finds no > boot sector and suggests that it be booted from "A" drive. > How do I get it back to GRUB? 1. Boot from a grub floppy (if you can remember the partition names) http://www.gnu.org/software/grub/manual/html_node/Creating-a-GRUB-boot-floppy.html#Creating%20a%20GRUB%20boot%20floppy 2. On a separate working computer connected to the net burn a "Recovery Is Possible" Disk (or floppy) http://www.tux.org/pub/people/kent-robotti/looplinux/rip/ Log on as root (no passwd) Look at your partitions (assuming this is an IDE/ATA disk on the primary controller): # fdisk -l /dev/hda You may want to look at and/or make a backup of your menu.lst file (assume /boot is on /dev/hda3 for example, and this assumes you have a separate /boot partition) # mkdir /mnt/boot # mount -t ext2 /dev/hda3 /mnt/boot # cd /mnt/boot/grub # cp menu.lst menu.sav # more menu.lst Consider re-installing grub... (Note there is a slight bug with the RIP disk that you can workaround here): # ln -s /usr/share/grub /usr/lib/grub # grub-install --root-directory=/boot /dev/hda Good luck! --Tom -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 256 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050207/587f1217/signature.pgp From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Tue Feb 8 07:51:05 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Tue Feb 8 07:40:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fun w/ PSCP Message-ID: Okay. Here is the newest report. I tried several things people suggested. On Linux - When I type "ssh root@localhost" it hangs for several minutes, and does not print anything to the screen. Typed: less /etc/ssdh_config Said: No such file or directory I typed: find / sshd It said: no such file or directory When I typed "telnet localhost 22" it said "Trying 1 . . ." and did nothing else. It gave no SSH version. Typed "telnet 192.168.1.2 22" It said: Connected to 192.168.1.2 Escape character is 'ctrl ]' SSH-1.99-OpenSSH_3.7.1p2 Typed: tcpdump -n src host 192.168.1.1 Said: Command not found. I can ping Linux box from Windows. I can ping Windows from Linux. When I ping Windows from the Linux box it keeps going and going and going. Can I "ssh to localhost" on the Linux box? No. Also, many of you pointed out that I had the PSCP command backwards. I reversed it, exactly as was explained. When typed on the Windows machine: pscp -r user@192.168.1.2:/home/user/directories/to/copy c:\home I still get the error "ssh_init: Connection timed out" On Windows - Typed: arp -a 192.168.1.2 Said: No ARP entries found Ideas? What am I missing? Nick ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ Support Care2 Email: 1,400 whales may be killed this year. Take action! http://www.care2.com/go/z/17954 From jkjones at tcq.net Tue Feb 8 07:53:37 2005 From: jkjones at tcq.net (Kraig Jones) Date: Tue Feb 8 07:55:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Upgrade In-Reply-To: <64.4e4f185d.2f381d75@aol.com> References: <64.4e4f185d.2f381d75@aol.com> Message-ID: <1107870817.6341.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2005-02-06 at 20:25 -0500, DeBeau@aol.com wrote: > I have a dual boot program (GRUB) on my hard drive to boot Fedora or > Windows XP. I recently upgraded the System board, CPU and RAM. Now the > system does not go to the GRUB program but announces that it finds no > boot sector and suggests that it be booted from "A" drive. > How do I get it back to GRUB? > It sounds like your new system board may not be finding the hard drive during the BIOS boot. First, check that the IDE cable from the hard drive is connected to the correct connector on the system board. And check the boot drive sequence in the BIOS (usually hit "Del" or "F?" key when the system is just starting up). You probably want something like Floppy, then CD, then first IDE drive. Again, that's why you need to check that the IDE cable is on the correct header on the system board. Kraig From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Feb 8 08:03:51 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Tue Feb 8 08:05:20 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fun w/ PSCP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <67f3084a050208060348d6fa36@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 07:51:05 -0600, Nick wrote: > Okay. Here is the newest report. I tried several things people > suggested. > > On Linux - > > When I type "ssh root@localhost" it hangs for several minutes, and > does not print anything to the screen. Do you have another user on the system? If so, try that instead. You may have root locked down. Or, simply try "ssh localhost" or "ssh ip.add.re.ss" > Typed: less /etc/ssdh_config > Said: No such file or directory It's probably in /etc/ssh/. However, check your spelling as there is no file such as ssdh_config > I typed: find / sshd > It said: no such file or directory See above. Context is "find / -name sshd*" > When I typed "telnet localhost 22" it said "Trying 1 . . ." and did > nothing else. It gave no SSH version. Localhost might be restricted from ssh maybe? > Typed "telnet 192.168.1.2 22" > It said: Connected to 192.168.1.2 > Escape character is 'ctrl ]' > SSH-1.99-OpenSSH_3.7.1p2 See above... > Typed: tcpdump -n src host 192.168.1.1 > Said: Command not found. tcpdump may not be installed... > I can ping Linux box from Windows. I can ping Windows from Linux. > When I ping Windows from the Linux box it keeps going and going and > going. Okay, the ping on a *NIX (except solaris) system will continue indefinately until either you do a ctrl-c to break it, or you set option to ping for a specific count. > Also, many of you pointed out that I had the PSCP command backwards. > I reversed it, exactly as was explained. When typed on the Windows > machine: > pscp -r user@192.168.1.2:/home/user/directories/to/copy c:\home > I still get the error "ssh_init: Connection timed out" > > On Windows - > Typed: arp -a 192.168.1.2 > Said: No ARP entries found > > Ideas? What am I missing? Out of curiosity, the network settings (except ip) are identical on both the windows and linux systems? Same subnet, same gateway, etc? Please post output from "ifconfig -a" and "netstat -rn" please from your linux system, and output from "ipconfig /all" from your windows system Find your ssh_config and sshd_config files and post to the list. They're most likely under /etc/ssh. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Feb 8 08:56:15 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Feb 8 09:04:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502081456.j18EuF510764@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: Want to Buy Subject: Mother Board I need a mother board for a AMD Athlon Thunderbird 750Mhz processor. I need to see if the processor works first. See the TCLUG list for more information. Seller Email address: smac at visi dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From smac at visi.com Tue Feb 8 09:08:38 2005 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Tue Feb 8 09:10:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT [Motherboard] Message-ID: <1107875318.4208d5f63d40f@my.visi.com> Hi All I put an add on the list but I wanted to see if anyone had any ideas on what to do first. The case I put my old motherboard and other parts in may have a nasty short in it. I believe it blew my Tyan S2390 motherboard (sniff, sniff). Thought it was the power supply but a "new" power supply didn't do a thing. It could be the power switch but I doubt it. I pulled the motherboard out and tried to power it up outside the case but it didn't work (I used the power switch from the bad case) I want to test the parts Processor, Memory, and other stuff to see if they work (I really hope they do). Does anyone have a motherboard for an Athlon Thunderbird 750Mhz I can use for testing and possible purchase or trade? Yes I'm getting a different case! Thanks Sam. From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Feb 8 09:10:46 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Tue Feb 8 09:15:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Debian on 486 laptop In-Reply-To: <200502081350.j18Dok07016149@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200502081510.j18FAi07016352@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 15:04:04 -0600 > From: Jim Crumley > On Mon, Feb 07, 2005 at 01:31:33PM -0600, Chris Schumann wrote: > > I'm a Red Hat and Fedora user so far. But now I have an old > > laptop (486) that I want to get running. Debian seems OK, but > > the XFree86 is lame (320x200). > > 320x200 ? That's odd. If that's your main problem with Debian > on the laptop, you might want to search for a better XF86Config > for it. Does the laptop have a CD drive? If so you might want > to try Knoppix, which sometimes does a better job of configuring > X than Debian itself. Just boot up Knoppix, and copy the > XF86Config to your Debian partition. The issue is that the laptop has the WD 90C24 chip. The svga driver (or that portion) was not ported to XFree86 4.x and the package has no maintainer. The generic vga driver is being used, so that's limited to 64k video memory with 1 or 8 bits per pixel, and 256k with 4. My machine has 1024k video memory, which is enough for 640x480 at 24bpp. The old laptop is an IBM ThinkPad 750P. It has no CD-ROM at all. I can network with it, but that won't let me boot Knoppix. I'm also limited by the 36MB of RAM in it right now, which I just upgraded on Saturday to that maximum level. At least Linux can see and use the 12GB hard disk in it. From dutchman_mn at charter.net Tue Feb 8 09:31:58 2005 From: dutchman_mn at charter.net (dutchman_mn@charter.net) Date: Tue Feb 8 09:35:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT [Motherboard] Message-ID: <3khe4g$gkimq7@mxip01a.cluster1.charter.net> Sam: I have an Abit KT7A RAID board that I was having some stability issues with. I switched over to an ASUS board. You can have it, it should be good for what you need it for. Talk to me offline and we can arrange to get it to you. Perry Hoekstra dutchman_mn@charter.net From adam at whee.org Tue Feb 8 09:28:04 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Tue Feb 8 09:44:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fun w/ PSCP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > Typed: less /etc/ssdh_config > Said: No such file or directory Try /etc/ssh/sshd_config and /usr/local/etc/sshd_config and /usr/local/etc/ssh/sshd_config. But I don't think it's an SSH configuration issue. The only thing I could think of is if it's refusing to start the session because of DNS. > I typed: find / sshd > It said: no such file or directory find / -name "sshd" But I don't think it's an SSH issue > Typed "telnet 192.168.1.2 22" > It said: Connected to 192.168.1.2 > Escape character is 'ctrl ]' > SSH-1.99-OpenSSH_3.7.1p2 Okay, this proves sshd is running, and listening on the 192.168.1.2 interface. The fact that you get the connection timed out message still points to a firewall issue or DNS. > Typed: tcpdump -n src host 192.168.1.1 > Said: Command not found. tcpdump probably isn't installed by default. Oh well. > On Windows - > Typed: arp -a 192.168.1.2 > Said: No ARP entries found Do this within a few minutes of pinging the Linux box, and see if it shows up. Also try just "arp -a" without specifying the IP, and see what else is listed. If you can ping 192.168.1.2, it should definately be showing up there. Heck, send us the output from these commands on Windows: arp -a (<-- ping 192.168.1.2 first) ipconfig /all netstat -rn And you can prove whether it's DNS or not by editing /etc/hosts on Linux and adding a line: 192.168.1.1 windows Then try pscp again. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Feb 8 10:06:17 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Feb 8 10:10:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502081606.j18G6HW13072@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: Want to Buy Subject: Seeking wireless firewall WTB: used 4-port wireless router with firewall. 802.11b is OK. Will be placed into service at a nonprofit. Seller Email address: jnmnus at yahoo dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From scotjenkins at gmail.com Tue Feb 8 10:36:19 2005 From: scotjenkins at gmail.com (Scot Jenkins) Date: Tue Feb 8 10:40:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Debian on 486 laptop In-Reply-To: <200502081510.j18FAi07016352@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200502081350.j18Dok07016149@alpha.twp-llc.com> <200502081510.j18FAi07016352@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: I have an old Thinkpad 755c that uses the same video chipset. You might try XF86Config: http://thinkunix.net/unix/os/linux/XF86Configs/wd90c24-tp755c-debian30r1 On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:10:46 -0600, Chris Schumann wrote: > > Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 15:04:04 -0600 > > From: Jim Crumley > > > On Mon, Feb 07, 2005 at 01:31:33PM -0600, Chris Schumann wrote: > > > I'm a Red Hat and Fedora user so far. But now I have an old > > > laptop (486) that I want to get running. Debian seems OK, but > > > the XFree86 is lame (320x200). > > > > 320x200 ? That's odd. If that's your main problem with Debian > > on the laptop, you might want to search for a better XF86Config > > for it. Does the laptop have a CD drive? If so you might want > > to try Knoppix, which sometimes does a better job of configuring > > X than Debian itself. Just boot up Knoppix, and copy the > > XF86Config to your Debian partition. > > The issue is that the laptop has the WD 90C24 chip. The svga driver > (or that portion) was not ported to XFree86 4.x and the package has > no maintainer. > > The generic vga driver is being used, so that's limited to 64k > video memory with 1 or 8 bits per pixel, and 256k with 4. My machine > has 1024k video memory, which is enough for 640x480 at 24bpp. > > The old laptop is an IBM ThinkPad 750P. It has no CD-ROM at all. > I can network with it, but that won't let me boot Knoppix. > > I'm also limited by the 36MB of RAM in it right now, which I just > upgraded on Saturday to that maximum level. > > At least Linux can see and use the 12GB hard disk in it. > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From admin at lctn.org Tue Feb 8 14:06:23 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Tue Feb 8 14:10:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] need to fix @INC Message-ID: <3609.64.8.149.194.1107893183.squirrel@64.8.149.194> I need to fix @INC after using up2date. Anyone on the list have experience with this or know the best place to post my question? Can't locate Apache/Constants.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /opt/rt3/local/lib /opt/rt3/lib /data/WebGUI/lib /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.3/i386-linux-thread-multi /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.3 /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.3/i386-linux-thread-multi /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.2/i386-linux-thread-multi /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.1/i386-linux-thread-multi /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.0/i386-linux-thread-multi /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.3 /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.2 /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.1 /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.0 /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl /usr/lib/perl5/vendor_perl/5.8.3/i386-linux-thread-multi / Raymond From andyzib at gmail.com Tue Feb 8 17:23:43 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Tue Feb 8 17:30:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fun w/ PSCP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Perhaps adding: PermitRootLogin yes To your sshd_config will help. Another helpful option might me: UseDNS no Specifies whether sshd should lookup the remote host name and check that the resolved host name for the remote IP address maps back to the very same IP address. The default is ``yes''. (man sshd_config is your friend!) Idealy, this should be on. But sometimes you do want to turn it off...say when you're in a private network behind a firewall and your private IPS, (192.168.x.X, 10.0.0.X, etc...) don't resolve. You could aslo get around this by adding entries to /etc/hosts... If you do make changes to sshd_config, make sure you restart the ssh server before trying it. :) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From andyzib at gmail.com Tue Feb 8 17:30:27 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Tue Feb 8 17:35:43 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Debian on 486 laptop In-Reply-To: References: <200502081350.j18Dok07016149@alpha.twp-llc.com> <200502081510.j18FAi07016352@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: If your video card isn't supported by XFree86 4.x, and lots of old chips aren't...486 machines should just go to that great computer grave yard after all... Anyway, RedHat/Fedora/Whater is detecting your chipset, and most likely using XFree86 v3.x instead of v4.x, thus the better performance. It looks like Debian has dropped support for XFree86 v3 in Testing/Unstable, but you could add in stable source lines and fetch the old version of your XServer. Debian is trying to tell you something: Get rid of that old laptop. :) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From veldy at veldy.net Wed Feb 9 08:47:15 2005 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Wed Feb 9 08:50:20 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Quality LDAP schema for Mozilla/Outlook address books? Message-ID: <420A2273.6030706@veldy.net> I am currently using OpenLDAP 2.2.19 for my mail configuration and I would like to included a global address book as an option. I recall attempting this in the past with limitted success. I recall having a terrible time finding a working mozilla schema and then I also recall that many attributes were missing from either the Outlook addressbook or the Mozilla addressbook when I actually was viewing an entry. So, can anybody lead me to a quality schema[s] and perhaps a nice HOWTO that actually works well? Thanks in advance. -- Thomas T. Veldhouse Key Fingerprint: 07C7 BF05 4176 F50B A083 4542 0118 1315 761F D300 Spammers please contact me at renegade@veldy.net. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Wed Feb 9 09:52:51 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Wed Feb 9 09:55:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: step 2 playground Step climber and swing combo. lock together design. For ages 3 and up. 5 1/2 foot slide attached to play climber and 2 swings. Bought at Menards 2 years ago. Barely used. Paid 450 for both pieces will sell for 200. Also a little tikes yellow cottage, slide, turtle sandbox and teetor tauter. Will part all for 300. We are located in Somerset Wisconsin. Phone is 6123691049. Jim Seller Email address: chalupanoz at hotmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From drue at therub.org Wed Feb 9 10:01:25 2005 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Wed Feb 9 10:03:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> References: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> Message-ID: <20050209160125.GJ64494@therub.org> On Wed, Feb 09, 2005 at 09:52:51AM -0600, TCLUG Classifieds wrote: > New TCLUG Classified Ad > > Category: Computer > > Type of Ad: For Sale > > Subject: step 2 playground > > Step climber and swing combo. lock together design. For ages 3 and > up. 5 1/2 foot slide attached to play climber and 2 swings. Bought > at Menards 2 years ago. Barely used. Paid 450 for both pieces will > sell for 200. Also a little tikes yellow cottage, slide, turtle > sandbox and teetor tauter. Will part all for 300. We are located in > Somerset Wisconsin. Phone is 6123691049. Jim > Awesome. Does it boot gentoo? ;) dan From adam at whee.org Wed Feb 9 10:21:06 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Wed Feb 9 10:40:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: <20050209160125.GJ64494@therub.org> References: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> <20050209160125.GJ64494@therub.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Feb 2005, Dan Rue wrote: >> Category: Computer LIAR! >> Subject: step 2 playground > > Awesome. Does it boot gentoo? ;) Of course, it's a toy. :P From austad at signal15.com Wed Feb 9 11:28:13 2005 From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad) Date: Wed Feb 9 11:30:21 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] what to do w/ extra servers Message-ID: I've got 8 PIII 900's sitting here doing nothin'. Any ideas for a neat cluster setup or something? From sfertch at gmail.com Wed Feb 9 11:39:14 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Wed Feb 9 11:45:21 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] what to do w/ extra servers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <67f3084a05020909395204ae10@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:28:13 -0600, Jay Austad wrote: > I've got 8 PIII 900's sitting here doing nothin'. Any ideas for a neat > cluster setup or something? Sounds like a perfect opportunity for either Beowolf or Oscar clustering with some H/A databases or other applications. Gives you an opportunity to test load balancing, as well as system failures and how it affects the cluster. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From sfertch at gmail.com Wed Feb 9 12:04:51 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Wed Feb 9 12:10:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] what to do w/ extra servers In-Reply-To: <200502091157.48301.scheides@iexposure.com> References: <67f3084a05020909395204ae10@mail.gmail.com> <200502091157.48301.scheides@iexposure.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a0502091004263991a5@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:57:48 -0600, Chris Scheidecker wrote: > http://www.linuxvirtualserver.org/ > I may have to give this a try instead of Beowolf or Oscar clusters... I've got about 10 old systems at home that could make for a nice test bed.... -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From tclug at ryanorourke.org Wed Feb 9 12:38:18 2005 From: tclug at ryanorourke.org (Ryan O'Rourke) Date: Wed Feb 9 12:45:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: References: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> <20050209160125.GJ64494@therub.org> Message-ID: <420A589A.80703@ryanorourke.org> Adam Maloney wrote: >> >> Awesome. Does it boot gentoo? ;) > > > Of course, it's a toy. :P That's right. Gentoo is for Ricers. http://funroll-loops.org/ From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Wed Feb 9 11:45:02 2005 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Wed Feb 9 16:55:23 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] what to do w/ extra servers Message-ID: Jay, You can check out the Warewulf Cluster Toolkit: http://warewulf-cluster.org/ It's supposed to be pretty easy to set up and maintain. Troy >>> Jay Austad 02/09/05 11:28 AM >>> I've got 8 PIII 900's sitting here doing nothin'. Any ideas for a neat cluster setup or something? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tsinks at isd.net Wed Feb 9 12:28:19 2005 From: tsinks at isd.net (Tim Sinks) Date: Wed Feb 9 20:19:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] news on HP Message-ID: <007701c50ed5$24799d60$0300000a@net.tsinks> Well, the big news today is the change in CEO at HP. Carly Fiorina is out after 6 years. CFO Robert Wayman is the temp CEO. Keep looking up, Tim Sinks From sterling at freakzilla.com Wed Feb 9 10:54:43 2005 From: sterling at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Wed Feb 9 20:19:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: References: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> <20050209160125.GJ64494@therub.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Feb 2005, Adam Maloney wrote: > On Wed, 9 Feb 2005, Dan Rue wrote: >>> Category: Computer > LIAR! *lol* I think we need more categories in the classifieds. I've been wanting to sell a couple of things which are neither a computer nor a roommate. On an unrelated note, anyone want to buy a digital camera? -Yaron -- From ntraxler at usfamily.net Wed Feb 9 21:40:39 2005 From: ntraxler at usfamily.net (Nick Traxler) Date: Wed Feb 9 21:45:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Math Behind the Curtains, W Feb 9, 7pm, B75 Amundson Hall In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <420AD7B7.3010800@usfamily.net> Was this any good? Somebody scheduled way too small a room, and there were people standing in the hall when I got there. Stupid event parking in the ramp, too. :( Mike Miller wrote: > This sounds really cool and it's open to the public. --Mike > > > "MATH BEHIND THE CURTAINS: DYNAMIC SIMULATION AT PIXAR," --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! --- From gsker at tcfreenet.org Wed Feb 9 22:18:55 2005 From: gsker at tcfreenet.org (gsker@tcfreenet.org) Date: Wed Feb 9 22:20:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Motorola SB5120 Cabe Modem Message-ID: My comcast sharkfin started losing link so I got them to get me a new one. It's a Motorola SB5120. 1. Is anyone using the USB interface on this one? (ethernet works fine) 2. I'm using Fedora Core 2 and it doesn't recognize the device as a usbnet device. CDCether is builtin in this kernel 2.6.10-1.12_FC2 CONFIG_USB_CDCETHER=y 3. Tried Knoppix 3.6 -- No joy 4. Ran Kudzu which found the device and added "alias eth2 usbnet" to modprobe.conf but eth2 is not recognized as a device and usbnet doesn't get loaded. (hwconf says "driver: unknown") Google doesn't help much. Tried SB5100 Surfboard 5100 etc... Any clues? -- Gerry Skerbitz gsker@comcast.net From justin.kremer at gmail.com Thu Feb 10 00:23:25 2005 From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer) Date: Thu Feb 10 00:25:26 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: References: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> <20050209160125.GJ64494@therub.org> Message-ID: <27e6356a05020922236e33d92@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 10:54:43 -0600 (CST), Yaron wrote: > *lol* I think we need more categories in the classifieds. I've been > wanting to sell a couple of things which are neither a computer nor a > roommate. On an unrelated note, anyone want to buy a digital camera? This got me to thinking. Anyone want to buy a roommate or two? Had I known it was possible, I would have sold mine long ago! -- Justin Kremer From jwreese0 at comcast.net Thu Feb 10 05:54:33 2005 From: jwreese0 at comcast.net (John Reese) Date: Thu Feb 10 05:58:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: What to do w\ extra servers Message-ID: <420B4B79.2000906@comcast.net> Just as a 'proof of concept' you could download Cluster Knoppix, burn a disk for each machine, and boot up a working cluster with a decent admin interface in just ten minutes. Then run a benchmark test against the cluster vs. an individual server. It's a great way to show a boss that it's a project worthy of your time and his equipment. John Reese From dan at dandrake.org Thu Feb 10 08:37:19 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake) Date: Thu Feb 10 08:40:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Math Behind the Curtains, W Feb 9, 7pm, B75 Amundson Hall In-Reply-To: <420AD7B7.3010800@usfamily.net> References: <420AD7B7.3010800@usfamily.net> Message-ID: <20050210143719.GA4040@dandrake.org> On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 at 09:40PM -0600, Nick Traxler wrote: > Was this any good? Somebody scheduled way too small a room, and there > were people standing in the hall when I got there. It was really good, although I would have preferred a bit more math. Their simulator seems like little more than a numerical differential equation solver on steroids. Next time I TA a calculus class I'll probably bring that up..."look kids, learn the Runge-Kutta method and you too can make several hundred million dollars." The next talk is March 30th: http://www.ima.umn.edu/public-lecture/2004-05/hales/ Dan -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050210/e8a3a771/attachment-0001.pgp From scheides at iexposure.com Thu Feb 10 09:32:51 2005 From: scheides at iexposure.com (Chris Scheidecker) Date: Thu Feb 10 09:35:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] what to do w/ extra servers In-Reply-To: <67f3084a05020909395204ae10@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a05020909395204ae10@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200502100932.51833.scheides@iexposure.com> On Wednesday 09 February 2005 11:39 am, Shawn Fertch wrote: > On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:28:13 -0600, Jay Austad wrote: > > I've got 8 PIII 900's sitting here doing nothin'. Any ideas for a neat > > cluster setup or something? > > Sounds like a perfect opportunity for either Beowolf or Oscar > clustering with some H/A databases or other applications. > > Gives you an opportunity to test load balancing, as well as system > failures and how it affects the cluster. http://www.linuxvirtualserver.org/ -- Chris Scheidecker Associate Systems Administrator cscheidecker@iexposure.com Internet Exposure, Inc. http://www.iexposure.com 612.676.1946 x33 Web Development-Web Marketing-ISP Services ------------------------------------------ From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Thu Feb 10 11:59:23 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Thu Feb 10 12:01:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: Following up on my longstanding concerns about the future of OpenVMS: http://news.com.com/HP+to+rejuvenate+OpenVMS+on+Monday/2100-1016_3-5537046.html http://news.com.com/HP+looks+beyond+Fiorina/2009-7341_3-5569425.html >From the second page of the first URL above: When HP bought Compaq, OpenVMS "was probably one of the close calls when they decided what was going to move forward and what projects they were going to cancel, simply because OpenVMS is clearly for legacy systems," said Illuminata analyst Gordon Haff. "When (administrators of) legacy systems are faced with a transition, they are going to look at other alternatives." But presumably, HP did the math and decided the investment was worthwhile--unlike the conclusion it reached with its largely phased-out HP 3000 line. The OpenVMS business was profitable in 2003, but HP declined to state whether it is today, citing investor regulations. According to c|net news, the day Fiorina/HP bought Compaq was "a day of infamy" in the company's history. I suppose that has little to do with OpenVMS. We'll see what happens with a new CEO at HP. We don't know what they'll do with OpenVMS, but I envision them keeping it going unless they are operating at a loss. If they can offer help with transitions from OpenVMS to UNIX/Linux, they might retain more customers than if they make it equally easy for their customers to leave for a different service provider. They should be able to capitalize on loyalty. If they do nothing to aid in transitions away from OpenVMS, then why won't current OpenVMS customers dump HP for another company? With the current OpenVMS customer base continuing to erode, they'll have to cut their losses someday. What are your views? Mike -- Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Division of Epidemiology and Community Health and Institute of Human Genetics University of Minnesota http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Thu Feb 10 14:08:31 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Thu Feb 10 14:15:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <914f813c050210120847583d27@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 11:59:23 -0600 (CST), Mike Miller wrote: > According to c|net news, the day Fiorina/HP bought Compaq was "a day of > infamy" in the company's history. I suppose that has little to do with > OpenVMS. > > We'll see what happens with a new CEO at HP. We don't know what they'll > do with OpenVMS, but I envision them keeping it going unless they are > operating at a loss. If they can offer help with transitions from OpenVMS > to UNIX/Linux, they might retain more customers than if they make it > equally easy for their customers to leave for a different service > provider. They should be able to capitalize on loyalty. If they do > nothing to aid in transitions away from OpenVMS, then why won't current > OpenVMS customers dump HP for another company? With the current OpenVMS > customer base continuing to erode, they'll have to cut their losses > someday. > > What are your views? Not OVMS-centric, but I think HP is probably better off without Fiorina. I read a pretty good article on her/her style of management/strengths/weaknesses in the Wall Street Journal this morning, and they likened her to Steve Case (AOL) and Steve Jobs (Apple). The difference, I think, is Case and Jobs had, have [respectively] good ideas and business sense. The only thing I can associate with Fiorina is the Compaq merger, which I wouldn't be surprised if she didn't have much to do with it. I hope the next HPaq overlord has a vision; HP is the only big PC company I can think of that pays attention to design and aesthetic when designing a product. That gives them an edge, in some circles, over white-box retailers (including the Gateways and Dells, who innovated the industry by making their white boxes black). From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Thu Feb 10 14:08:31 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Thu Feb 10 14:15:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <914f813c050210120847583d27@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 11:59:23 -0600 (CST), Mike Miller wrote: > According to c|net news, the day Fiorina/HP bought Compaq was "a day of > infamy" in the company's history. I suppose that has little to do with > OpenVMS. > > We'll see what happens with a new CEO at HP. We don't know what they'll > do with OpenVMS, but I envision them keeping it going unless they are > operating at a loss. If they can offer help with transitions from OpenVMS > to UNIX/Linux, they might retain more customers than if they make it > equally easy for their customers to leave for a different service > provider. They should be able to capitalize on loyalty. If they do > nothing to aid in transitions away from OpenVMS, then why won't current > OpenVMS customers dump HP for another company? With the current OpenVMS > customer base continuing to erode, they'll have to cut their losses > someday. > > What are your views? Not OVMS-centric, but I think HP is probably better off without Fiorina. I read a pretty good article on her/her style of management/strengths/weaknesses in the Wall Street Journal this morning, and they likened her to Steve Case (AOL) and Steve Jobs (Apple). The difference, I think, is Case and Jobs had, have [respectively] good ideas and business sense. The only thing I can associate with Fiorina is the Compaq merger, which I wouldn't be surprised if she didn't have much to do with it. I hope the next HPaq overlord has a vision; HP is the only big PC company I can think of that pays attention to design and aesthetic when designing a product. That gives them an edge, in some circles, over white-box retailers (including the Gateways and Dells, who innovated the industry by making their white boxes black). From ericw at dcvast.com Thu Feb 10 14:56:42 2005 From: ericw at dcvast.com (Eric Wicklund) Date: Thu Feb 10 15:00:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: <27e6356a05020922236e33d92@mail.gmail.com> References: <200502091552.j19Fqpv26475@crusader.real-time.com> <20050209160125.GJ64494@therub.org> <27e6356a05020922236e33d92@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <420BCA8A.1010004@dcvast.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050210/09cca4f2/attachment.html From stutterstutt at comcast.net Thu Feb 10 16:59:02 2005 From: stutterstutt at comcast.net (Jeff Nelson) Date: Thu Feb 10 17:00:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <420BE736.6000409@comcast.net> Mike Miller wrote: > Following up on my longstanding concerns about the future of OpenVMS: > > http://news.com.com/HP+to+rejuvenate+OpenVMS+on+Monday/2100-1016_3-5537046.html > > http://news.com.com/HP+looks+beyond+Fiorina/2009-7341_3-5569425.html > >> From the second page of the first URL above: > > > When HP bought Compaq, OpenVMS "was probably one of the close calls > when > they decided what was going to move forward and what projects they > were > going to cancel, simply because OpenVMS is clearly for legacy > systems," > said Illuminata analyst Gordon Haff. "When (administrators of) legacy > systems are faced with a transition, they are going to look at other > alternatives." > > But presumably, HP did the math and decided the investment was > worthwhile--unlike the conclusion it reached with its largely > phased-out > HP 3000 line. The OpenVMS business was profitable in 2003, but HP > declined to state whether it is today, citing investor regulations. > According to c|net news, the day Fiorina/HP bought Compaq was "a day > of infamy" in the company's history. I suppose that has little to do > with OpenVMS. Carly visited the engineering lab where OpenVMS is built and specifically praised the technology and history of Digital and of OpenVMS in particular. She said (paraphrased) that "we knew what gems we were acquiring when decided to merge with Compaq; this was more than just two PC companies merging" (which was a popular idea at the time). > We'll see what happens with a new CEO at HP. We don't know what > they'll do with OpenVMS, but I envision them keeping it going unless > they are operating at a loss. If they can offer help with transitions > from OpenVMS to UNIX/Linux, they might retain more customers than if > they make it equally easy for their customers to leave for a different > service provider. They should be able to capitalize on loyalty. If > they do nothing to aid in transitions away from OpenVMS, then why > won't current OpenVMS customers dump HP for another company? With the > current OpenVMS customer base continuing to erode, they'll have to cut > their losses someday. You might find the interview with the VP of OpenVMS Engineering (Mark Gorham) enlightening. It was slashdotted. Start here for the interview: http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=05/01/19/6559130 and go here for a pointer to /.: http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=05/01/19/0380642 He answers many of the questions you've asked. If there's something missing and you'd like more, feel free to ask me or write to Mark directly. He is very open about receiving and responding to customer email. And yes, HP does offer transition services. Let me know if you'd like more details. > What are your views? Biased. :-) As you know, I'm an OpenVMS operating system software engineer employed by HP. I have an understandable tendancy to want to promote OpenVMS and help others see it for what it is truely is. On the other hand, I'm not so naive to believe that OpenVMS is the answer to every problem. I'm glad you are taking the time to ask. > Mike -Jeff From silwenae at silwenae.com Fri Feb 11 14:38:37 2005 From: silwenae at silwenae.com (Paul Cutler) Date: Fri Feb 11 14:45:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] VLC - Record to file Message-ID: <1108154317.26937.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> Anyone know how, using VLC, to record a stream to a file (say an ogg)? I'm a big fan of MPR's new station, 89.3 the Current, and use VLC to listen to their aacPlus stream. (Using the latest VLC 0.8.1 on Ubuntu Warty, downloaded the debs from Ubuntu Hoary). I've googled around quite a bit today without any luck, and have been playing with VLC for almost 2 hours trying to record the stream to a file but no joy (but I'm now a master of making VLC crash!). I've tried just about every way to save a stream, transcoding, saving to a raw file, but I'm just guessing at the settings. 89.3 is doing an interview with Matt Wilson of Semisonic fame today at 5, and playing some of his new music. I was hoping to capture an ogg of it but darned if I can figure it out. If anyone has any hints, tips, tricks or links, I'd be grateful. Paul From webmaster at mn-linux.org Fri Feb 11 15:43:15 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Fri Feb 11 15:45:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502112143.j1BLhFf26248@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Ham scope Attn Hams! Have a Heathkit SB-610 Monitor scope in good working condition with manual and three extra spare tubes. From a non smokers shack. Has a few "nic marks" on the front panel but no stains or wear marks. Asking $100.00 firm. Reply: j_wrocky at comcast dot net Seller Email address: j_wrocky at comcast dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From john.meier at gmail.com Sat Feb 12 08:37:21 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Sat Feb 12 08:40:52 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games Message-ID: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> This is just sickening... http://www.securityfocus.net/news/10466 .... "Hackers, if they're allowed to do this kind of thing, will be allowed to hack into any game, anywhere," Pfeiffer warns. "We spent millions of dollars to develop these games, and people are coming in and changing the code to their liking, and that's illegal." From sulrich at botwerks.org Sat Feb 12 09:08:40 2005 From: sulrich at botwerks.org (steve ulrich) Date: Sat Feb 12 09:10:53 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> absurd, yes. sickening? there's a lot worse going on in this world that probably deserves the "sickening" moniker. write your congress-critter[1], and make sure that you're donating to the EFF[2]. a plug for the EFF folks is in order. they hire lawyers and see things through the court system. they lobby folks and they promote awareness on these issues. if you're going to get peeved about this stuff, you might as well work to do something about it. :) On Feb 12, 2005, at 8:37 AM, John Meier wrote: > This is just sickening... > > http://www.securityfocus.net/news/10466 > > > .... "Hackers, if they're allowed to do this kind of thing, will be > allowed to hack into any game, anywhere," Pfeiffer warns. "We spent > millions of dollars to develop these games, and people are coming in > and changing the code to their liking, and that's illegal." > {snipped - misc. signatures} references ---------- [1] - http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm? State=MN [2] - http://www.eff.org -- steve ulrich sulrich@botwerks.org PGP: 8D0B 0EE9 E700 A6CF ABA7 AE5F 4FD4 07C9 133B FAFC -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050212/33ead1bc/PGP.pgp From smac at visi.com Sat Feb 12 10:28:58 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sat Feb 12 10:30:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> Message-ID: <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> I'm going to get flamed for this! If the copy write says they should not reverse engineer the game or change it in any way, explain to me why the company in question should not stand up for their rights? The idea that "this is just a game" isn't acceptable when the product is not open source. From what I've read this is a closed source program not an open source program. What we need to recognize is, in the United States everyone has a right to due process. If we agree or not with what someone does, they have a right to due process. Even SCO has the right, but they must produce evidence that I don't think they have and it looks like a judge is saying the same thing. Remember SCO gets lots of money from M$. Doom, Quake, Call of Duty, and others have many mods for the original games, but the people who make the games said making the mods is cool. Yes contribute to EFF, yes stand up for what we believe in, but we must let others do the same no mater what we think. Sam. steve ulrich wrote: > absurd, yes. sickening? there's a lot worse going on in this world > that probably deserves the "sickening" moniker. > > write your congress-critter[1], and make sure that you're donating to > the EFF[2]. a plug for the EFF folks is in order. they hire lawyers > and see things through the court system. they lobby folks and they > promote awareness on these issues. > > if you're going to get peeved about this stuff, you might as well > work to do something about it. :) > > On Feb 12, 2005, at 8:37 AM, John Meier wrote: > >> This is just sickening... >> >> http://www.securityfocus.net/news/10466 >> >> >> .... "Hackers, if they're allowed to do this kind of thing, will be >> allowed to hack into any game, anywhere," Pfeiffer warns. "We spent >> millions of dollars to develop these games, and people are coming in >> and changing the code to their liking, and that's illegal." >> > > {snipped - misc. signatures} > > references > ---------- > [1] - > http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm? > State=MN > [2] - http://www.eff.org -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From markdeb.browne at comcast.net Sat Feb 12 11:16:10 2005 From: markdeb.browne at comcast.net (markdeb.browne@comcast.net) Date: Sat Feb 12 11:20:56 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? Message-ID: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> http://abcnews.go.com/Business/print?id=88655 Mark Browne From cschumann at twp-llc.com Sat Feb 12 12:24:16 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Sat Feb 12 12:25:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <200502121803.j1CI3P07031932@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200502121824.j1CIO607031976@alpha.twp-llc.com> OK, I'll bite > Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 10:28:58 -0600 > From: Sam MacDonald > If the copy write says they should not reverse engineer the > game or change it in any way, explain to me why the company > in question should not stand up for their rights? Copyright law says no one can distribute something without the permission of the copyright owner, basically. Licensing terms restrict what one can do with software. For example, if I buy a book, I can make a photocopy of small sections for review, or large sections for my own use, or sell or lend the book to someone else. It's called fair use. If I buy software, most of the time I have to agree to an onerous license agreement that says I can't even look under the hood to see what the software is doing on *MY* computer. Some licenses even restrict my from selling the software when I get tired of it. Or if I get tired of the software publisher from calling its customers thieves. Don't get me wrong. I think it's just fine for any entity to sell their product as they see fit. I'm just really glad there's an alternative to most of the hand-tying linceses out there. > Doom, Quake, Call of Duty, and others have many mods for the > original games, but the people who make the games said making > the mods is cool. Some say copyright law says it's cool to mod the games you buy. I suppose we should not be allowed to record TV shows and edit out the commercials too. I'd bet most studios don't like that I can legally do that... for now. > Yes contribute to EFF, yes stand up for what we believe in, > but we must let others do the same no mater what we think. I agree with you 100% Sam, on both counts. I hope you'll agree that it's important to have sane laws too. Like ones that say that I can make a backup of the SpongeBob DVD I bought (not really) so I don't have to take the original into the minivan (that I don't own) so the kids (that I don't have) can scratch it up and I have to buy another one. Chris (wearing my EFF member t-shirt right now) From bhurt at spnz.org Sat Feb 12 13:02:15 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Sat Feb 12 13:00:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 markdeb.browne@comcast.net wrote: > http://abcnews.go.com/Business/print?id=88655 "No, no- that's just their shipping product. Think it's bad now- you should have been here back in the nineties. Whoa boy!" I'm not so sure. I'll be exstatic if I'm wrong, but my gut sense at the moment is that Microsoft isn't going anywhere. Up or down. Because what's supporting Microsoft at this point is not technology or economics, but politics. Corporate politics, in the companies. The people in power have staked their careers on Microsoft being the way, the truth, and the light, and will fight by any means necessary being proven wrong. Of course, I may be slightly cynical because the company I work at just lost a big sale because our embedded servers ran Linux and not Windows. It's an embedded server- what the eff do you care what OS it runs? It works, what's the problem? No I don't want to drink your damned koolaid, or buy a flower. Brian From adam at whee.org Sat Feb 12 14:05:49 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Sat Feb 12 14:20:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Brian Hurt wrote: > Because what's supporting Microsoft at this point is not technology or > economics, but politics. Corporate politics, in the companies. The > people in power have staked their careers on Microsoft being the way, the > truth, and the light, and will fight by any means necessary being proven > wrong. "No one ever got fired for buying IBM" syndrome. From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Feb 12 14:57:33 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sat Feb 12 15:00:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Brian Hurt wrote: > Of course, I may be slightly cynical because the company I work at just > lost a big sale because our embedded servers ran Linux and not Windows. > It's an embedded server- what the eff do you care what OS it runs? It > works, what's the problem? Good question. Did they give a reason for that preference? Don't we have stats showing that Linux file servers are faster than Microsoft servers? Isn't Linux more stable than Windows? It's probably just FUD. It will take some time to overcome that but I think we're making good progress. Mike From jack at jacku.com Sat Feb 12 15:28:36 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Sat Feb 12 15:30:56 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> Message-ID: <200502121528.36475.jack@jacku.com> I agree with the opinion of it being absurd. At issue here is the extension of the copyright in the DMCA. The no reverse engineering clause was added and many believe it contradicts some of the fair use doctrine that has been part of copyright for a long time. Specifically since the latest extensions on copyright period create an almost permanent copyright on all work. Yes the company has a right to protect itself, but it will be interesting to see how they claim it hurts them. The only thing I can think of is that now they can't sell a "kit" to do the customization since there is already one out there. Or maybe that's the point. They get a court to declare what was done illegal and then release a software package that does the same thing. (Maybe even taking the existing code to do it!) Jack On Saturday 12 February 2005 10:28 am, Sam MacDonald wrote: > I'm going to get flamed for this! > > If the copy write says they should not reverse engineer the game or > change it in any way, explain to me why the company in question should > not stand up for their rights? > The idea that "this is just a game" isn't acceptable when the product is > not open source. From what I've read this is a closed source program not > an open source program. What we need to recognize is, in the United > States everyone has a right to due process. If we agree or not with what > someone does, they have a right to due process. > > Even SCO has the right, but they must produce evidence that I don't > think they have and it looks like a judge is saying the same thing. > Remember SCO gets lots of money from M$. > > Doom, Quake, Call of Duty, and others have many mods for the original > games, but the people who make the games said making the mods is cool. > > Yes contribute to EFF, yes stand up for what we believe in, but we must > let others do the same no mater what we think. > -- Jack Ungerleider jack@jacku.com From jack at jacku.com Sat Feb 12 15:36:56 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Sat Feb 12 15:38:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> Message-ID: <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> On Saturday 12 February 2005 11:16 am, markdeb.browne@comcast.net wrote: > http://abcnews.go.com/Business/print?id=88655 > First things first, a large diverse company, and MS is that at this point, with a lot of cash in the mattress (or bank) isn't going to die an time soon. Witness: IBM. What will have to happen is new leadership will have to be found to evolve the company further. Once the monopoly is truly broken then we'll find out what MS is really about. For what it's worth we may all be surprised. Jack -- Jack Ungerleider jack@jacku.com From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Sat Feb 12 15:35:50 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Sat Feb 12 15:42:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] VLC - Record to file In-Reply-To: <1108154317.26937.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1108154317.26937.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <914f813c050212133536cdf6@mail.gmail.com> I wish I could provide help, but instead I'm going to echo your sentiments and say 89.3 is awesome. I've found some buginess that took awhile to resolve with VLC's volume adjustment, but I think it has to do with different settings for ALSA vs. OSS. Good luck, and perhaps check to see if there's a VLC channel on freenode... On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 14:38:37 -0600, Paul Cutler wrote: > Anyone know how, using VLC, to record a stream to a file (say an ogg)? > > I'm a big fan of MPR's new station, 89.3 the Current, and use VLC to > listen to their aacPlus stream. (Using the latest VLC 0.8.1 on Ubuntu > Warty, downloaded the debs from Ubuntu Hoary). > > I've googled around quite a bit today without any luck, and have been > playing with VLC for almost 2 hours trying to record the stream to a > file but no joy (but I'm now a master of making VLC crash!). I've tried > just about every way to save a stream, transcoding, saving to a raw > file, but I'm just guessing at the settings. > > 89.3 is doing an interview with Matt Wilson of Semisonic fame today at > 5, and playing some of his new music. I was hoping to capture an ogg of > it but darned if I can figure it out. > > If anyone has any hints, tips, tricks or links, I'd be grateful. > > Paul > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- John T. Hoffoss From smac at visi.com Sat Feb 12 17:46:35 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sat Feb 12 17:50:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <200502121824.j1CIO607031976@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200502121824.j1CIO607031976@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <420E955B.1000509@visi.com> The way to sane laws is in our hands. Sam. Chris Schumann wrote: >OK, I'll bite > > > >>Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 10:28:58 -0600 >>From: Sam MacDonald >> >> > > > >>If the copy write says they should not reverse engineer the >>game or change it in any way, explain to me why the company >>in question should not stand up for their rights? >> >> > >Copyright law says no one can distribute something without the >permission of the copyright owner, basically. > >Licensing terms restrict what one can do with software. > >For example, if I buy a book, I can make a photocopy of small >sections for review, or large sections for my own use, or sell >or lend the book to someone else. It's called fair use. > >If I buy software, most of the time I have to agree to an onerous >license agreement that says I can't even look under the hood to >see what the software is doing on *MY* computer. Some licenses >even restrict my from selling the software when I get tired of it. >Or if I get tired of the software publisher from calling its >customers thieves. > >Don't get me wrong. I think it's just fine for any entity to >sell their product as they see fit. I'm just really glad there's >an alternative to most of the hand-tying linceses out there. > > > >>Doom, Quake, Call of Duty, and others have many mods for the >>original games, but the people who make the games said making >>the mods is cool. >> >> > >Some say copyright law says it's cool to mod the games you buy. > >I suppose we should not be allowed to record TV shows and edit >out the commercials too. I'd bet most studios don't like that I >can legally do that... for now. > > > >>Yes contribute to EFF, yes stand up for what we believe in, >>but we must let others do the same no mater what we think. >> >> > >I agree with you 100% Sam, on both counts. I hope you'll agree >that it's important to have sane laws too. Like ones that say that >I can make a backup of the SpongeBob DVD I bought (not really) so I >don't have to take the original into the minivan (that I don't own) >so the kids (that I don't have) can scratch it up and I have to buy >another one. > >Chris >(wearing my EFF member t-shirt right now) > > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From random at argle.org Sat Feb 12 19:47:05 2005 From: random at argle.org (random@argle.org) Date: Sat Feb 12 19:45:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > I'm going to get flamed for this! > > If the copy write says they should not reverse engineer the game or change it > in any way, explain to me why the company in question should not stand up for > their rights? Because Copyright doesn't say that. It isn't one of their rights. Copyright is exactly what it says: Copy Right, the right to make and distribute copies of a written or recorded work. Specifically granted in the US Constitution for the promotion of the advancement of Arts and Sciences. NOT to protect "Artistic Integrity" or long term profits, but to encourage the creation of new works. > The idea that "this is just a game" isn't acceptable when the product is not > open source. From what I've read this is a closed source program not an open > source program. What we need to recognize is, in the United States everyone > has a right to due process. If we agree or not with what someone does, they > have a right to due process. > Yes, everyone has a right to due process. It is the big corporations that are trying to deny that right to everyone else. Due process is bad for profits, yaknow. > Even SCO has the right, but they must produce evidence that I don't think > they have and it looks like a judge is saying the same thing. Remember SCO > gets lots of money from M$. > Yep, and if any Linux developer discovered a copyright violation a patch to remedy the situation would accompany the announcement of the discovery. > Doom, Quake, Call of Duty, and others have many mods for the original games, > but the people who make the games said making the mods is cool. > But they didn't have to. Mods predated Doom, and are perfectly legal as long as they are distributed as diffs against the original work. > Yes contribute to EFF, yes stand up for what we believe in, but we must let > others do the same no mater what we think. > We must also call people on it when they are trying to claim "rights" that they do not have. Don't let people take advantage of you just because they have Italian suits and talk pretty legalese. -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. From bhurt at spnz.org Sat Feb 12 19:53:41 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Sat Feb 12 19:52:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Adam Maloney wrote: > On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Brian Hurt wrote: > > > Because what's supporting Microsoft at this point is not technology or > > economics, but politics. Corporate politics, in the companies. The > > people in power have staked their careers on Microsoft being the way, the > > truth, and the light, and will fight by any means necessary being proven > > wrong. > > "No one ever got fired for buying IBM" syndrome. > It started as that. It's changed to something closer to "Anyone not buying Microsoft will get fired." Brian From bhurt at spnz.org Sat Feb 12 20:12:16 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Sat Feb 12 20:10:56 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Mike Miller wrote: > On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Brian Hurt wrote: > > > Of course, I may be slightly cynical because the company I work at just > > lost a big sale because our embedded servers ran Linux and not Windows. > > It's an embedded server- what the eff do you care what OS it runs? It > > works, what's the problem? > > Good question. Did they give a reason for that preference? Don't we have > stats showing that Linux file servers are faster than Microsoft servers? > Isn't Linux more stable than Windows? It's also cheaper (license fees?), and requires fewer resources (CPU, memory). If you don't need hard real time gaurentees, it's a great embedded OS. Which is why we use it. Brian From j_wrocky at comcast.net Sat Feb 12 20:14:03 2005 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry Weihrauch) Date: Sat Feb 12 20:16:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> Where would we be today if Digital Research had provided IBM with an operating system "CP/M"? Where would Bill Gates be now? Would it be open source, would we have a "Windows" type GUI or something else? Would we have "point and click icons"? Interesting "food for thought". Jerry W From smac at visi.com Sat Feb 12 21:11:22 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sat Feb 12 21:15:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> Message-ID: <420EC55A.3050606@visi.com> Should we reserve respect only for who we agree with? What do we loose if we deny (even big companies) due process? Sam. random@argle.org wrote: > On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > >> I'm going to get flamed for this! >> >> If the copy write says they should not reverse engineer the game or >> change it in any way, explain to me why the company in question >> should not stand up for their rights? > > > Because Copyright doesn't say that. It isn't one of their rights. > Copyright is exactly what it says: Copy Right, the right to make and > distribute > copies of a written or recorded work. Specifically granted in the US > Constitution for > the promotion of the advancement of Arts and Sciences. NOT to protect > "Artistic Integrity" or long term profits, but to encourage the > creation of new works. > > >> The idea that "this is just a game" isn't acceptable when the product >> is not open source. From what I've read this is a closed source >> program not an open source program. What we need to recognize is, in >> the United States everyone has a right to due process. If we agree or >> not with what someone does, they have a right to due process. >> > Yes, everyone has a right to due process. It is the big corporations > that are trying to deny that right to everyone else. Due process is > bad for profits, yaknow. > >> Even SCO has the right, but they must produce evidence that I don't >> think they have and it looks like a judge is saying the same thing. >> Remember SCO gets lots of money from M$. >> > Yep, and if any Linux developer discovered a copyright violation a patch > to remedy the situation would accompany the announcement of the > discovery. > >> Doom, Quake, Call of Duty, and others have many mods for the original >> games, but the people who make the games said making the mods is cool. >> > But they didn't have to. Mods predated Doom, and are perfectly legal > as long > as they are distributed as diffs against the original work. > >> Yes contribute to EFF, yes stand up for what we believe in, but we >> must let others do the same no mater what we think. >> > We must also call people on it when they are trying to claim "rights" > that they > do not have. Don't let people take advantage of you just because they > have Italian suits and talk pretty legalese. > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From smac at visi.com Sat Feb 12 21:15:07 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sat Feb 12 21:16:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> References: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> Message-ID: <420EC63B.4040000@visi.com> I do believe Xerox had the point and click icons. Apple and Xerox were in court for years over the icons, it cost Apple a large amount of market share. Are we the same as the hippies of the 60's only with an alternative OS? A different Idea of what is right and wrong. Sam. Jerry Weihrauch wrote: > Where would we be today if Digital Research had provided IBM with an > operating system "CP/M"? Where would Bill Gates be now? > Would it be open source, would we have a "Windows" type GUI or > something else? Would we have "point and click icons"? > > Interesting "food for thought". > > Jerry W > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From smac at visi.com Sat Feb 12 21:19:11 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sat Feb 12 21:20:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> IBM has over 300,000 employees world wide. I don't know what M$ numbers are but it's big. Yes IBM has helped the open source community but, IBM helped because it sees profit. Just like it sees profit in M$. If you look at what almost happened when a big auto maker almost failed I think you will see what would happen if M$ starts to falter. Sam. Jack Ungerleider wrote: >On Saturday 12 February 2005 11:16 am, markdeb.browne@comcast.net wrote: > > >>http://abcnews.go.com/Business/print?id=88655 >> >> >> > >First things first, a large diverse company, and MS is that at this point, >with a lot of cash in the mattress (or bank) isn't going to die an time soon. >Witness: IBM. What will have to happen is new leadership will have to be >found to evolve the company further. Once the monopoly is truly broken then >we'll find out what MS is really about. For what it's worth we may all be >surprised. > >Jack > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From jack at jacku.com Sun Feb 13 00:00:56 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Sun Feb 13 00:06:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> Message-ID: <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> On Saturday 12 February 2005 09:19 pm, Sam MacDonald wrote: > IBM has over 300,000 employees world wide. I don't know what M$ numbers > are but it's big. Yes IBM has helped the open source community but, IBM > helped because it sees profit. Just like it sees profit in M$. > > If you look at what almost happened when a big auto maker almost failed > I think you will see what would happen if M$ starts to falter. > Sam your missing my point. When the hardware business started to falter so did IBM until Gerstner turned them into a services company. Apple may be a better example of a "back from the brink" story. The original article even mentioned it. What is Apple's primary business today? Digital music. It's iPods and iTunes. Macs, mini and otherwise are not were Apple is making its big money. I don't think a comparison to Chrysler is warranted in this case. It will take a long, very long, slide for MS to be in the position Chrysler was in 25 years ago. The shareholders would cause a leadership change long before that happens. -- Jack Ungerleider jack@jacku.com From seg at haxxed.com Sun Feb 13 01:15:18 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Sun Feb 13 01:15:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <420EC63B.4040000@visi.com> References: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> <420EC63B.4040000@visi.com> Message-ID: <1108278919.5865.73.camel@bigtime> On Sat, 2005-02-12 at 21:15 -0600, Sam MacDonald wrote: > I do believe Xerox had the point and click icons. > Apple and Xerox were in court for years over the icons, it cost Apple a > large amount of market share. What the Xerox workstations were capable of in the late 70's is quite impressive. They were indeed a solid 15 years ahead of what mere mortals would ever see on their desktops. High resolution 19in displays, object oriented OS environment from top to bottom, well integrated network capability in the OS and applications, its where Ethernet originated after all. Scanners, laser printers with print sharing, file sharing, domain login, email... Xerox's trailblazing goes way beyond icons, overlapping windows, menus and mice. The more I learn, the more it feels like all we've been doing for the past 20 years as far as GUI environments and application development is reinventing what Xerox already had in 1981. Badly. And repeatedly. Apple only initially ripped off the concept of the GUI itself. Steve Jobs himself has said he was so amazed by the GUI that he missed the significance of everything else he was shown at PARC. Namely, desktop publishing, networking, and object oriented programming. Apple eventually did desktop publishing, and a weak try at networking, but totally missed the boat about OOP. Jobs had to get kicked out of Apple and start NeXT before he took a decent shot at OOP... And of course NeXTStep remained purely a luxury item until the release of OSX. 20 years after Xerox. http://www.digibarn.com/friends/curbow/star/index.html http://www.digibarn.com/friends/alanfreier/index.html http://www.digibarn.com/collections/systems/xerox6085/index.html http://www.digibarn.com/collections/systems/xerox-8010/index.html http://www.digibarn.com/collections/games/xerox-maze-war/index.html http://www.digibarn.com/collections/software/alto/index.html http://www.digibarn.com/collections/books/xerox-parc-1970-80/alto- article/index.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050213/530c261d/attachment.pgp From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Feb 13 01:34:34 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sun Feb 13 01:36:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Apple v. Apple (was "R.I.P. Microsoft?") In-Reply-To: <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 13 Feb 2005, Jack Ungerleider wrote: > What is Apple's primary business today? Digital music. It's iPods and > iTunes. That is an interesting fact. It is interesting because before Apple formed as a company, there was another company called Apple. It was owned by the Beatles. When Apple computer started up, they were sued by Apple recording. The agreement allowed new Apple computer to keep their name so long as they agreed never to get into the music business. When Apple computer started selling digital music on the 'net, the Beatles were nowhere to be found in that digital collection. Anyway, this is the story I heard and have believed. Maybe one of you can confirm or refute it. Actually, here's the data... http://www.google.com/search?q=apple+computer+apple+recording+suit+beatles ...but I don't have time to sift through it now to make sure I have the story right. Mike From smac at visi.com Sun Feb 13 02:13:00 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sun Feb 13 02:15:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: <420F0C0C.3010809@visi.com> The point is the government will not let big companies fail because no politician wants to loose an election because several hundred thousand people lost their Jobs. (excuse the pun :-D) The problem isn't big companies, the problem is politicians without term limits! Sam. Jack Ungerleider wrote: >On Saturday 12 February 2005 09:19 pm, Sam MacDonald wrote: > > >>IBM has over 300,000 employees world wide. I don't know what M$ numbers >>are but it's big. Yes IBM has helped the open source community but, IBM >>helped because it sees profit. Just like it sees profit in M$. >> >>If you look at what almost happened when a big auto maker almost failed >>I think you will see what would happen if M$ starts to falter. >> >> >> > >Sam your missing my point. When the hardware business started to falter so did >IBM until Gerstner turned them into a services company. Apple may be a better >example of a "back from the brink" story. The original article even mentioned >it. What is Apple's primary business today? Digital music. It's iPods and >iTunes. Macs, mini and otherwise are not were Apple is making its big money. >I don't think a comparison to Chrysler is warranted in this case. It will >take a long, very long, slide for MS to be in the position Chrysler was in 25 >years ago. The shareholders would cause a leadership change long before that >happens. > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From random at argle.org Sun Feb 13 10:24:11 2005 From: random at argle.org (random@argle.org) Date: Sun Feb 13 10:23:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <420EC55A.3050606@visi.com> References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> <420EC55A.3050606@visi.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > Should we reserve respect only for who we agree with? > What do we loose if we deny (even big companies) due process? > What does respect have to do with it? If someone is wrong, they are wrong. It's not like I am suggesting taking their little red wagon away because they are wrong, I am suggesting exercising our rights to do what we want to with our stuff. Because that is what it is. It is our stuff. We paid for it, we have it in our bookshelves, entertainment centers, or wherever, and they want to tell us what we can do with it. That is wrong. I'm not going to run around selling other people's products and I get quite offended when they want my freedom as part of the price of their product. It isn't really about the copying, it is about greed and power. They want all the money and all the power. Excuse me if I'm less than inclined to just hand it over. Greed is bad. There's a reason it plays a major part in most of the Seven Deadly Sins. Pandering to greed is therefore also bad. > > Sam. > > random@argle.org wrote: > >> On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: >> >>> I'm going to get flamed for this! >>> >>> If the copy write says they should not reverse engineer the game or >>> change it in any way, explain to me why the company in question should >>> not stand up for their rights? >> >> >> Because Copyright doesn't say that. It isn't one of their rights. >> Copyright is exactly what it says: Copy Right, the right to make and >> distribute >> copies of a written or recorded work. Specifically granted in the US >> Constitution for >> the promotion of the advancement of Arts and Sciences. NOT to protect >> "Artistic Integrity" or long term profits, but to encourage the >> creation of new works. >> >> >>> The idea that "this is just a game" isn't acceptable when the product >>> is not open source. From what I've read this is a closed source program >>> not an open source program. What we need to recognize is, in the United >>> States everyone has a right to due process. If we agree or not with >>> what someone does, they have a right to due process. >>> >> Yes, everyone has a right to due process. It is the big corporations that >> are trying to deny that right to everyone else. Due process is bad for >> profits, yaknow. >> >>> Even SCO has the right, but they must produce evidence that I don't >>> think they have and it looks like a judge is saying the same thing. >>> Remember SCO gets lots of money from M$. >>> >> Yep, and if any Linux developer discovered a copyright violation a patch >> to remedy the situation would accompany the announcement of the >> discovery. >> >>> Doom, Quake, Call of Duty, and others have many mods for the original >>> games, but the people who make the games said making the mods is cool. >>> >> But they didn't have to. Mods predated Doom, and are perfectly legal as >> long >> as they are distributed as diffs against the original work. >> >>> Yes contribute to EFF, yes stand up for what we believe in, but we must >>> let others do the same no mater what we think. >>> >> We must also call people on it when they are trying to claim "rights" >> that they >> do not have. Don't let people take advantage of you just because they >> have Italian suits and talk pretty legalese. >> >> > > > > -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. From bhurt at spnz.org Sun Feb 13 11:26:07 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Sun Feb 13 11:26:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Jerry Weihrauch wrote: > Where would we be today if Digital Research had provided IBM with an > operating system "CP/M"? Where would Bill Gates be now? > Would it be open source, would we have a "Windows" type GUI or something > else? Would we have "point and click icons"? Yes, because these didn't come from Microsoft, they came from Xerox Parc by way of Apple. If fact, we probably would have gotten it sooner- even Unix had a GUI by mid/late eighties. Brian From smac at visi.com Sun Feb 13 11:28:23 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sun Feb 13 11:31:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> <420EC55A.3050606@visi.com> Message-ID: <420F8E37.6030801@visi.com> I understand your point of view and agree that wrong is wrong. But If you purchase something that has a binding legal agreement with and you use said product you are bound by law to abide by that agreement. Wrong is wrong even if it's my wrong. Read and understand the rules of a product before purchasing the product. We need to be smart consumers not sheep that make mistakes because we didn't read and understand the agreement. Maybe if we didn't purchase the stuff that has crazy legal agreements the legal agreements wouldn't be so crazy. The power company tells us to call before we dig but every year people are killed by underground power lines when they put a spade through the line. Should the power company have to post a warning every 5 feet. The price of power would be $100.00 per kWh, what then? Sam Read and understand the safety warnings before you use your power tools and remember always wear safety glasses. Norm (This Old House) random@argle.org wrote: > On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > >> Should we reserve respect only for who we agree with? >> What do we loose if we deny (even big companies) due process? >> > What does respect have to do with it? If someone is wrong, they are > wrong. > It's not like I am suggesting taking their little red wagon away > because they are wrong, I am suggesting exercising our rights > to do what we want to with our stuff. Because that is what it is. > It is our stuff. We paid for it, we have it in our bookshelves, > entertainment > centers, or wherever, and they want to tell us what we can do with it. > > That is wrong. > > I'm not going to run around selling other people's products and I get > quite offended when they want my freedom as part of the price of their > product. It isn't really about the copying, it is about greed and > power. They want all the money and all the power. Excuse me if I'm > less than inclined to just hand it over. > > Greed is bad. There's a reason it plays a major part in most > of the Seven Deadly Sins. Pandering to greed is therefore also > bad. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From smac at visi.com Sun Feb 13 11:47:27 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sun Feb 13 11:51:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <420F92AF.5020300@visi.com> Don't forget the people that have staked their careers on M$ have also bought M$ stock and want that stock to be more valuable. Why would they let people bring anything else in to the work place. IBM on the other hand wants to win everything no mater what the product. As a past IBM employee, I had to have 3 wins every quarter to show that I was making IBM money. I constantly had to prove that I was being productive. Not only in my work but in the time I spent at work. IBM requires a minimum of 48 hours every week (every week). I would work circles around other people and I still had to put in 48 hours every week. The measure is unfair to the people that can work faster and produce more results then other employees. I would end up doing other peoples work just to keep my hours up. But that is the way IBM wants it, and that's why I left. Why should I pickup the the slack from slackers? So you see if you blame M$ for all the bad in the industry without looking at the full view of the industry you are missing the truth. IBM looks good to the Linux community now but if Linux is not profitable, IBM will drop Linux like a hot potato. BTW M$ had the most productive quarter ever I don't think M$ is going anywhere. Sam. Brian Hurt wrote: >On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 markdeb.browne@comcast.net wrote: > > > >>http://abcnews.go.com/Business/print?id=88655 >> >> > >"No, no- that's just their shipping product. Think it's bad now- you >should have been here back in the nineties. Whoa boy!" > >I'm not so sure. I'll be exstatic if I'm wrong, but my gut sense at the >moment is that Microsoft isn't going anywhere. Up or down. > >Because what's supporting Microsoft at this point is not technology or >economics, but politics. Corporate politics, in the companies. The >people in power have staked their careers on Microsoft being the way, the >truth, and the light, and will fight by any means necessary being proven >wrong. > >Of course, I may be slightly cynical because the company I work at just >lost a big sale because our embedded servers ran Linux and not Windows. >It's an embedded server- what the eff do you care what OS it runs? It >works, what's the problem? No I don't want to drink your damned koolaid, >or buy a flower. > >Brian > > > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.7 - Release Date: 2/10/2005 From j_wrocky at comcast.net Sun Feb 13 11:54:06 2005 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry Weihrauch) Date: Sun Feb 13 11:56:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] This Day in History - On February 13 Message-ID: <420F943E.7070802@comcast.net> This Day in History - On February 13 1946 ENIAC is turned on for the first time. Weighing 30 tons and filling an entire room, it is the world's first fully functional electronic digital computer, and about as powerful as a single microchip today. Jerry W From random at argle.org Sun Feb 13 12:23:48 2005 From: random at argle.org (random@argle.org) Date: Sun Feb 13 12:29:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <420F8E37.6030801@visi.com> References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <5f93fdade78957d89970bbd22c8db5d9@botwerks.org> <420E2ECA.8000906@visi.com> <420EC55A.3050606@visi.com> <420F8E37.6030801@visi.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 13 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > I understand your point of view and agree that wrong is wrong. > But > If you purchase something that has a binding legal agreement with and you use > said product you are bound by law to abide by that agreement. Wrong is wrong > even if it's my wrong. > Right. Of course, the concept of shrinkwrap agreements is on dubious legal ground, and I generally _don't_ buy such software. I looove the GPL! Yeah, it kind of limits my computer gaming options, but that is what consoles and arcades are for. Besides, arcades are much more fun than any hardware I can afford. > Read and understand the rules of a product before purchasing the product. We > need to be smart consumers not sheep that make mistakes because we didn't > read and understand the agreement. > Part of the dubious legal ground of shrinkwrap agreements is that you can't read it first. The other part is that it is unilaterally binding on the purchaser (you can't "return it to the place of purchase" if you disagree with it). There is no option of refusal after you have read the agreement, and most people don't know what it says. > Maybe if we didn't purchase the stuff that has crazy legal agreements the > legal agreements wouldn't be so crazy. > I don't, and they are. Go figure. > The power company tells us to call before we dig but every year people are > killed by underground power lines when they put a spade through the line. > Should the power company have to post a warning every 5 feet. The price of > power would be $100.00 per kWh, what then? > Bogus argument. We aren't talking about physical safety issues, we are talking about companies trying to sell stuff without actually giving anything up to do so. A more appropriate example would be if the electric company were to wire the electric through your plumbing at random intervals, and send you notice through the post when they did so (after the fact). All the risk would then be yours, and you wouldn't know about the risk until potentially too late. -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. From bbaptist at iexposure.com Sun Feb 13 12:25:39 2005 From: bbaptist at iexposure.com (Bret Baptist) Date: Sun Feb 13 12:29:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <420F8E37.6030801@visi.com> References: <65293fcc050212063737f47386@mail.gmail.com> <420F8E37.6030801@visi.com> Message-ID: <200502131225.39600.bbaptist@iexposure.com> On Sunday 13 February 2005 11:28 am, Sam MacDonald wrote: > I understand your point of view and agree that wrong is wrong. > But > If you purchase something that has a binding legal agreement with and > you use said product you are bound by law to abide by that agreement. > Wrong is wrong even if it's my wrong. A contract that take away your rights is not binding. This is what they are trying to change. They are trying to take away your *RIGHTS* that you have now, and make it so their greedy little contracts are legal. -- Bret Baptist Systems and Technical Support Specialist bbaptist@iexposure.com Internet Exposure, Inc. http://www.iexposure.com (612)676-1946 x17 Web Development-Web Marketing-ISP Services ------------------------------------------ Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Feb 13 12:28:37 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Feb 13 12:31:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502131828.j1DISbH15569@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: ibm z pro workstation i have an IBM Z Pro workstation for sale, dual processor capable (one installed) P3 550 Xeon, 1gb memory, 2940U2W controller but no hdds. whats wrong with it: 1. some cosmetic issues - missing covers, faceplates, etc. i will send you pictures if you want to see it before hand 2. it has an Intergraph 3d labs intense 3d wildcat 3600 video card w/ L5 Geometry Accelerator. there are drivers for W2K but i'm not sure you'll find anything for linux. however this is removable and there is an AGP slot. asking $80 or b.o. i can meet between minneapolis and stillwater in the early evening during the week. Seller Email address: intothefloodagain at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From bhurt at spnz.org Sun Feb 13 13:16:54 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Sun Feb 13 13:16:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT : Hacking video games In-Reply-To: <420F8E37.6030801@visi.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 13 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > I understand your point of view and agree that wrong is wrong. > But > If you purchase something that has a binding legal agreement with and > you use said product you are bound by law to abide by that agreement. > Wrong is wrong even if it's my wrong. The "binding legal agreement" is where the disconnect comes from. EULAs are generally defended as if they're contracts. The problem is, the one time they've come up in front of a judge, the judge said they weren't: http://slashdot.org/articles/01/11/28/1551200.shtml It's called "right of first purchase". Also known as "simply claiming something is true, doesn't make it so." Among other differences, contracts imply negotiation. Generally, when I sign a contract giving up some of my freedoms, I have some ability to negotiate what the terms of the contract are- not so with EULAs. Secondly, there is generally compensation. I'm giving up my rights voluntarily for some form of compensation. Note, you can't call getting the software compensation- I'm paying for the software. Third, contracts generally require stronger affirmation- generally at least a signature, if not a witness notary. Clicking 'OK' doesn't count. Fourth, minors can not sign contracts- but they can purchase and install the software (and be covered by the EULA!). Microsoft trys to get around this by saying that simply *using* their software means you are covered by the EULA. By reading this email you agree to pay Brian Hurt $1,000 (cash, and in small bills, sucka). > The power company tells us to call before we dig but every year people > are killed by underground power lines when they put a spade through the > line. Should the power company have to post a warning every 5 feet. The > price of power would be $100.00 per kWh, what then? > And the award for the wost analogy of the year goes to... The power company is not claiming any rights when they say that if you try to dig up a power line, it'll probably kill you. If they want to run a power line through my property, they have to get a right of way agreement- which means they need to get me to sign a peice of paper saying they can run a power line through my property. If I don't sign, they have to go around. Brian From bhurt at spnz.org Sun Feb 13 13:37:20 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Sun Feb 13 13:36:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <420F92AF.5020300@visi.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 13 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > Don't forget the people that have staked their careers on M$ have also > bought M$ stock and want that stock to be more valuable. Why would they > let people bring anything else in to the work place. This strikes me as being a conflict of interest. "It's more important to me for this other company to do good than for my company to do good." And, I note, beyond what I was accusing people of. I was simply accusing them of being stupid, not actively illegal. > > IBM on the other hand wants to win everything no mater what the product. And this is different from every other company in what way? > > As a past IBM employee, I had to have 3 wins every quarter to show that > I was making IBM money. I constantly had to prove that I was being > productive. Not only in my work but in the time I spent at work. > IBM requires a minimum of 48 hours every week (every week). The 40-hour work week is increasingly being gutted. But that's a different argument. > > So you see if you blame M$ for all the bad in the industry without > looking at the full view of the industry you are missing the truth. IBM > looks good to the Linux community now but if Linux is not profitable, > IBM will drop Linux like a hot potato. Oh, rest assured I'm not blaming MS for all the bad in the industry. Just the bad they are directly and demonstratably responsible for. There's more than enough blame to go around. I don't blame the Microsoft Koolaid drinkers on Microsoft. I do blame their shoddy products, exhorbinant prices, and despicable business practices on them. My theory: it's fear that drives the Microsoft Koolaid Contingent. If there isn't a choice, you're not responsible for the outcome. If there is a choice, this implies that there is a wrong choice. Now, suddenly, you are responsible for the outcome. Open source is nothing but choices. Linux vr.s BSD. Xfree86 vr.s X.org. Gnome vr.s KDE. Mozilla vr.s Netscape vr.s Firefox vr.s Konqueror vr.s Galleon vr.s etc. C++ vr.s Java vr.s Perl vr.s Python vr.s Ruby vr.s Ocaml vr.s etc. For every need there is generally two (or more) possible solutions. On the Windows side, there is a comforting (for those afraid of making wrong choices) lack of choice. Brian From gsker at comcast.net Sun Feb 13 14:58:07 2005 From: gsker at comcast.net (Gerry) Date: Sun Feb 13 15:01:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] VLC - Record to file In-Reply-To: <1108154317.26937.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1108154317.26937.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: vsound will allow you to capture what goes to /dev/dsp, but only in mono mode. http://www.xenoclast.org/vsound/ On Fri, 11 Feb 2005, Paul Cutler wrote: > Anyone know how, using VLC, to record a stream to a file (say an ogg)? [SNIP] > > Paul -- Gerry Skerbitz gsker@comcast.net From adam at whee.org Mon Feb 14 08:25:49 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Feb 14 08:46:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: <420EC63B.4040000@visi.com> References: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> <420EC63B.4040000@visi.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > I do believe Xerox had the point and click icons. Something many Apple zealots forget when they whine that MS stole Mac's GUI idea > Are we the same as the hippies of the 60's only with an alternative OS? A > different Idea of what is right and wrong. Make code not WARez? We are a bunch of hippies - look at Carl, with his long hair and scruffy beard! From smac at visi.com Mon Feb 14 09:01:31 2005 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Feb 14 09:06:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> <420EC63B.4040000@visi.com> Message-ID: <1108393291.4210bd4b6c289@my.visi.com> Someone is finally getting the humor... Sam. Quoting Adam Maloney : > On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Sam MacDonald wrote: > > > I do believe Xerox had the point and click icons. > > Something many Apple zealots forget when they whine that MS > stole Mac's GUI idea > > > Are we the same as the hippies of the 60's only with an alternative OS? A > > different Idea of what is right and wrong. > > Make code not WARez? > > We are a bunch of hippies - look at Carl, with his long hair and scruffy > beard! > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From natecars at real-time.com Mon Feb 14 09:31:27 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Feb 14 09:39:23 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: <420EB7EB.2050505@comcast.net> <420EC63B.4040000@visi.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Adam Maloney wrote: > We are a bunch of hippies - look at Carl, with his long hair and scruffy > beard! ..not anymore. :) -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From adam at whee.org Mon Feb 14 09:31:06 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Feb 14 09:47:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] [OT] Geek Valentines Message-ID: I love my wife. An e-mail exchange this morning: Adam: Do you want to go out tonight? Phantom is playing at Har Mar. Wifey: We own the DVD. (dramatic pause, because we don't) Adam: ... of the Opera, not Menace. Geek. Also, thank god for Google changing their homepage graphic today! From jima at beer.tclug.org Mon Feb 14 09:50:24 2005 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Feb 14 09:56:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Nate Carlson wrote: > On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Adam Maloney wrote: > > We are a bunch of hippies - look at Carl, with his long hair and scruffy > > beard! > > ..not anymore. :) What, did you and Munir decide to pull a prank on him? *bzzzzzz...* ;) Jima From sfertch at gmail.com Mon Feb 14 10:51:24 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Feb 14 10:56:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Software raid5 issue (can create RAID5, can't create VG using RAID device) Message-ID: <67f3084a050214085121b8ca68@mail.gmail.com> I've created a software RAID5 from three physical disks. However, when I try to create a volume group out of the RAID device, I get an error message: [root@netman etc]# vgcreate /dev/vg01 /dev/md4p1 vgcreate -- no valid physical volumes in command line Here's the RAID device information: [root@netman etc]# fdisk -l /dev/md4 Disk /dev/md4: 36.3 GB, 36388339712 bytes 2 heads, 4 sectors/track, 8883872 cylinders Units = cylinders of 8 * 512 = 4096 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/md4p1 1 8883872 35535486 8e Linux LVM Full system disk info: [root@netman etc]# fdisk -l Disk /dev/sda: 9100 MB, 9100369920 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 1106 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sda1 * 1 13 104391 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sda2 14 111 787185 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sda3 112 175 514080 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sda4 176 1106 7478257+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sdb: 9100 MB, 9100369920 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 1106 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sdb1 * 1 13 104391 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sdb2 14 111 787185 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sdb3 112 175 514080 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sdb4 176 1106 7478257+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sdc: 18.2 GB, 18200739840 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 2212 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sdc1 * 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sdd: 18.2 GB, 18200739840 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 2212 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sdd1 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sde: 18.2 GB, 18200739840 bytes 254 heads, 63 sectors/track, 2221 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16002 * 512 = 8193024 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sde1 * 1 2221 17770189+ fd Linux raid autodetect [root@netman etc]# Cat of mdstat: [root@netman etc]# cat /proc/mdstat Personalities : [raid0] [raid1] [raid5] read_ahead 1024 sectors Event: 6 md4 : active raid5 sde1[2] sdd1[1] sdc1[0] 35535488 blocks level 5, 64k chunk, algorithm 2 [3/3] [UUU] md0 : active raid1 sdb1[1] sda1[0] 104320 blocks [2/2] [UU] md1 : active raid1 sdb2[1] sda2[0] 787072 blocks [2/2] [UU] md2 : active raid1 sdb3[1] sda3[0] 513984 blocks [2/2] [UU] md3 : active raid1 sdb4[1] sda4[0] 7478144 blocks [2/2] [UU] unused devices: Relevant section of /etc/raidtab: [root@netman etc]# more /etc/raidtab raiddev /dev/md4 raid-level 5 nr-raid-disks 3 chunk-size 64k persistent-superblock 1 parity-algorithm left-symmetric nr-spare-disks 0 device /dev/sdc1 raid-disk 0 device /dev/sdd1 raid-disk 1 device /dev/sde1 raid-disk 2 I ran vgcreate in debug mode, however the output was incredible, and from what little I could read, didn't see anything that would point to the error. Any thoughts on what could be wrong? -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From natecars at real-time.com Mon Feb 14 12:12:01 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Feb 14 12:16:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Software raid5 issue (can create RAID5, can't create VG using RAID device) In-Reply-To: <67f3084a050214085121b8ca68@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a050214085121b8ca68@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > [root@netman etc]# vgcreate /dev/vg01 /dev/md4p1 > vgcreate -- no valid physical volumes in command line Do you have a md4p1 device? AFAIK, you're not supposed to put partitions on md devices, although it is possible. Looking at /dev/ seems to agree with this: brw-rw---- 1 root disk 9, 0 Mar 10 2004 md0 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 9, 1 Mar 10 2004 md1 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 9, 2 Mar 10 2004 md2 There's no gap between the minor numbers like there are for disk devices: brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 0 Mar 10 2004 sda brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 16 Mar 10 2004 sdb brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 32 Mar 10 2004 sdc sda1 would be major 8 minor 1, sda2 would be major 8 minor 2, etc. In any case, if you just use md4, should work fine. -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From sfertch at gmail.com Mon Feb 14 12:29:29 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Feb 14 12:31:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Software raid5 issue (can create RAID5, can't create VG using RAID device) In-Reply-To: References: <67f3084a050214085121b8ca68@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a050214102957fe1d06@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:12:01 -0600 (CST), Nate Carlson wrote: > Do you have a md4p1 device? > > AFAIK, you're not supposed to put partitions on md devices, although it is > possible. Looking at /dev/ seems to agree with this: > > In any case, if you just use md4, should work fine. > I did some work bases off of your thoughts, here's the output. [root@netman etc]# fdisk -l /dev/md4 Disk /dev/md4: 36.3 GB, 36388339712 bytes 2 heads, 4 sectors/track, 8883872 cylinders Units = cylinders of 8 * 512 = 4096 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System [root@netman etc]# ll /dev/md4 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 9, 4 Jun 24 2004 /dev/md4 [root@netman etc]# vgcreate /dev/vg01 /dev/md4 vgcreate -- no valid physical volumes in command line [root@netman etc]# fdisk -l /dev/md4 Disk /dev/md4: 36.3 GB, 36388339712 bytes 2 heads, 4 sectors/track, 8883872 cylinders Units = cylinders of 8 * 512 = 4096 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/md4p1 1 8883872 35535486 8e Linux LVM [root@netman etc]# ll /dev/md4* brw-rw---- 1 root disk 9, 4 Jun 24 2004 /dev/md4 [root@netman etc]# vgcreate /dev/vg01 /dev/md4p1 vgcreate -- no valid physical volumes in command line I first removed the partitions off of the md4 device, then tried again with them. According to documentation, I should be able to use the RAID devices as I would with any other disk device. For the record, this is an RHELv3-ES system. On initial install of the system, I'm able to select and create RAID5 devices and then put LVM on top of it. However, this is after the box is created. Thanks for the help on it, Nate. Any other thoughts? -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From natecars at real-time.com Mon Feb 14 12:36:01 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Feb 14 12:41:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Jima wrote: > What, did you and Munir decide to pull a prank on him? *bzzzzzz...* ;) Nah, he did it on it's own. :) -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From natecars at real-time.com Mon Feb 14 12:35:31 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Feb 14 12:41:20 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Software raid5 issue (can create RAID5, can't create VG using RAID device) In-Reply-To: <67f3084a050214102957fe1d06@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a050214085121b8ca68@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a050214102957fe1d06@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > I did some work bases off of your thoughts, here's the output. > > [root@netman etc]# vgcreate /dev/vg01 /dev/md4 > vgcreate -- no valid physical volumes in command line Oh, wait - sorry, didn't think this all the way through. What I said about the md devices still applies (I think!), but are you creating the pv's before the vg's? Simple LVM howto: http://www.mythtv.org/docs/mythtv-HOWTO-22.html#ss22.3 (I know, there are better ones, but the MythTV site's the one I knew the location of quickly. *grin*) basically, you need to do a 'pvcreate /dev/md4', then a 'vgcreate vg01 -s XX /dev/md4' -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From sfertch at gmail.com Mon Feb 14 12:47:22 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Feb 14 12:52:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Software raid5 issue (can create RAID5, can't create VG using RAID device) In-Reply-To: References: <67f3084a050214085121b8ca68@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a050214102957fe1d06@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a05021410475cc45fe9@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:35:31 -0600 (CST), Nate Carlson wrote: > basically, you need to do a 'pvcreate /dev/md4', then a 'vgcreate vg01 -s XX /dev/md4' > D'oh! Forgot the 'pvcreate /dev/md4' command.... Afterwards, I was able to create as usual. Thanks! -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From veldy at veldy.net Mon Feb 14 15:06:51 2005 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Feb 14 15:11:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 Message-ID: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> Has anybody on this list had a chance to evaluate NetBSD 2.0 on the x86 architecture? I am curious to see FreeBSD in turmoil and NetBSD exploding onto the scene. I am especially curious to see the wonderful performance improvements that they have reported. Thanks for any information you would like to share. I am always interested in performance benchmarks against Linux 2.6 and FreeBSD as well. -- Thomas T. Veldhouse Key Fingerprint: 07C7 BF05 4176 F50B A083 4542 0118 1315 761F D300 Spammers please contact me at renegade@veldy.net. From adam at whee.org Mon Feb 14 15:35:56 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Feb 14 15:51:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Has anybody on this list had a chance to evaluate NetBSD 2.0 on the x86 > architecture? I am curious to see FreeBSD in turmoil and NetBSD exploding > onto the scene. I am especially curious to see the wonderful performance > improvements that they have reported. Turmoil? Other than the new logo fiasco, the only other turmoil I'm aware of was some troll that was posting to (at least) -users and -hackers about a benchmark that showed NetBSD was faster in some regard than FreeBSD, which he took to mean that he should help save the souls of the poor FreeBSD losers from being stuck on an inferior OS, by spewing his message to a bunch of mailing lists. FUD FUD FUD! > Thanks for any information you would like to share. I am always interested > in performance benchmarks against Linux 2.6 and FreeBSD as well. Beware the benchmark - not just in the case of Linux vs the BSD's, but in general...yes, choose on performance. But include all the factors in your decision. This includes hardware support, maturity of the app on the OS, and especially how familiar the admin will be with the OS. If you have 30 Linux servers and you see that some app runs 10% faster on BSD, is that 10% worth having a server that's different from the rest? (Assume "Linux", "10%", and "BSD" to be variables) Especially if your existing staff are experts in one and not the other. If I'm sizing a server for a particular app, I don't pay attention to benchmark's across OSes. If performance could be an issue, I make sure I have a plan to scale it up. If Linux is 10% faster for MySQL than FreeBSD, and the FreeBSD box can't handle the load, it does me no good to switch it to Linux since in 2 months I'll need two boxes anyways. Just my $0.02. From poptix at poptix.net Mon Feb 14 15:56:53 2005 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Mon Feb 14 16:01:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> Message-ID: <20050214215653.GP3913@momentum.poptix.net> It's right up[down?] there with BeOS. Unfortunately I threw out all the hardware it supports 5 years ago. On Mon, Feb 14, 2005 at 03:06:51PM -0600, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Has anybody on this list had a chance to evaluate NetBSD 2.0 on the x86 > architecture? I am curious to see FreeBSD in turmoil and NetBSD > exploding onto the scene. I am especially curious to see the wonderful > performance improvements that they have reported. > > Thanks for any information you would like to share. I am always > interested in performance benchmarks against Linux 2.6 and FreeBSD as well. -- Matthew S. Hallacy FUBAR, LART, BOFH Certified http://www.poptix.net GPG public key 0x01938203 From sulrich at botwerks.org Mon Feb 14 16:43:46 2005 From: sulrich at botwerks.org (steve ulrich) Date: Mon Feb 14 16:46:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: <20050214215653.GP3913@momentum.poptix.net> References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> <20050214215653.GP3913@momentum.poptix.net> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 you've tossed all your x86 hardware? you must have come to your senses and bought a mac. congratulations! welcome to an OS that doesn't piss your time and energies away and lets you solve the problems at hand. oh, you were trolling, right. On Feb 14, 2005, at 3:56 PM, Matthew S. Hallacy wrote: > > > It's right up[down?] there with BeOS. Unfortunately I threw out all the > hardware it supports 5 years ago. > > > > On Mon, Feb 14, 2005 at 03:06:51PM -0600, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: >> Has anybody on this list had a chance to evaluate NetBSD 2.0 on the >> x86 >> architecture? I am curious to see FreeBSD in turmoil and NetBSD >> exploding onto the scene. I am especially curious to see the >> wonderful >> performance improvements that they have reported. >> >> Thanks for any information you would like to share. I am always >> interested in performance benchmarks against Linux 2.6 and FreeBSD as >> well. {snipped - misc. signatures} - -- steve ulrich sulrich@botwerks.org PGP: 8D0B 0EE9 E700 A6CF ABA7 AE5F 4FD4 07C9 133B FAFC -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin) iD8DBQFCESmlT9QHyRM7+vwRAq8aAJ0SLt1q5Ci/aZZ83bB8T/UBpmWRxgCgp/5x Zmm+9w0e+mhlkUiqcORSJpQ= =wxV2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From poptix at poptix.net Mon Feb 14 17:10:08 2005 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Mon Feb 14 17:16:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> <20050214215653.GP3913@momentum.poptix.net> Message-ID: <20050214231008.GQ3913@momentum.poptix.net> Hah, actually I did buy a Mac. It keeps overheating, crashing, and having random hardware failures though. Fortunately AppleCare is there to replace it all promptly. At least it's kind enough to tell me it crashed in multiple languages: http://www.poptix.net/gallery/fuckmac/DCP01255 http://www.poptix.net/gallery/fuckmac/DCP01253 Luckily I still have my linux laptop (that NetBSD wouldn't even manage to boot on), and a windows desktop (which NetBSD doesn't support half the hardware in) to keep me on-net while my Mac is in the shop. =) On Mon, Feb 14, 2005 at 04:43:46PM -0600, steve ulrich wrote: > you've tossed all your x86 hardware? you must have come to your senses > and bought a mac. congratulations! welcome to an OS that doesn't piss > your time and energies away and lets you solve the problems at hand. > > oh, you were trolling, right. > > On Feb 14, 2005, at 3:56 PM, Matthew S. Hallacy wrote: > > > > > > > It's right up[down?] there with BeOS. Unfortunately I threw out all the > > hardware it supports 5 years ago. > > > > -- Matthew S. Hallacy FUBAR, LART, BOFH Certified http://www.poptix.net GPG public key 0x01938203 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050214/3baf90f2/attachment.pgp From veldy at veldy.net Sun Feb 13 17:33:07 2005 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Feb 14 17:36:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> Message-ID: <420FE3B3.1040802@veldy.net> Adam Maloney wrote: > On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > >> Has anybody on this list had a chance to evaluate NetBSD 2.0 on the >> x86 architecture? I am curious to see FreeBSD in turmoil and NetBSD >> exploding onto the scene. I am especially curious to see the >> wonderful performance improvements that they have reported. > > > Turmoil? Other than the new logo fiasco, the only other turmoil I'm > aware of was some troll that was posting to (at least) -users and > -hackers about a benchmark that showed NetBSD was faster in some > regard than FreeBSD, which he took to mean that he should help save > the souls of the poor FreeBSD losers from being stuck on an inferior > OS, by spewing his message to a bunch of mailing lists. FUD FUD FUD! > To my knowledge, those were real benchmarks. As far as FreeBSD goes, they are having a difficult time with 5.x. ULE is broken and they were forced to go back to 4BSD for scheduling. The kernel performance [not sure what benchmarks were used] is much worse with a uniprocessor build due to issues of their incorporation of SMP and giant locking. There are simply a lot of other problems that have made several people ask about fixing 6.x and releasing it as early as the end of the summer. But that wasn't my question at all. My question was simply asking if anybody here has real world experience with NetBSD 2.0. Several users here are Linux users and FreeBSD users and OpenBSD users, so I thought it natural that there might be NetBSD users as well. Tom Veldhouse From andyzib at gmail.com Mon Feb 14 17:58:15 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Feb 14 18:01:21 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] R.I.P. Microsoft? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: As much as we would all like to hope and pray, Microsoft isn't going anywhere. Despite all the hell home users go through, office users don't face the same level of issues. I manage 150 or so Windows 2000 and XP stations, as well as mutiple servers. With Active Directory and Group Policy, and a lot know how, it's become a great operating enviorment, for a Microsoft based soultion. ;) It doesn't matter when Longhorn ships. People will STILL be using NT4 on their servers. I thought I was finially done with NT4, then we purchased another company and the whole mess started over again. Being part of a company where I'm not top IT managment, Exchange and Outlook is what we have for e-mail. There are solid clients for Windows (Outlook), Mac OSX (Entourage), and *NIX (Evolution). Once Exchange has been mandated to you, it's hard to break the MS lock in. You have to buy a Windows server CAL as well as an Exchange CAL for every device, and when you're company is big enough to get a licenesing agreement Windows Server 2003 comes in around $500, vs. Red Hat Enterprise which is around $1,000. Once you're in, you're in. Luckly, being a printing company, there are enough Macs around that I can push for XServes instead of Dell Windows servers. They deal with active directory stuff just fine, and are perfect replacments to NT4 boxes. Definitly a happy medium there. Even with all that, there is still a place for Linux. I've currently got 30 Linux web/data entry terminals, a couple servers, and there are 15 more terminals waiting for me to install them. People get to see Linux and Mozilla do something great. Yay. In 99% of businesses out there, you can't escape Windows desktops. The best way to manage Windows desktops is with Windows servers, just like the best way to manage Mac desktops is with Mac servers. And hey, the Windows servers and the Mac servers know how to get along just fine, and there is bliss. And the Linux installs will talk to everything. Great. I don't see any of these OSes/Platforms going away. MS is too prevalent, Apple has too much money in the bank, Linux has open source. And now I'm rambling. ;) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From scotjenkins at gmail.com Mon Feb 14 18:21:22 2005 From: scotjenkins at gmail.com (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Feb 14 18:26:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: <420FE3B3.1040802@veldy.net> References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> <420FE3B3.1040802@veldy.net> Message-ID: You might have received a better response from the local *BSD user's group: http://www.tcbug.org/ On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 17:33:07 -0600, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > But that wasn't my question at all. My question was simply asking if > anybody here has real world experience with NetBSD 2.0. Several users > here are Linux users and FreeBSD users and OpenBSD users, so I thought > it natural that there might be NetBSD users as well. > > Tom Veldhouse From frstprin at mninter.net Mon Feb 14 07:09:49 2005 From: frstprin at mninter.net (James J. Baker) Date: Mon Feb 14 22:06:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Suse question Message-ID: Members, As a newbie to both PC and Linux, I'd like to install a Suse OS on a Pentium II. Is the Suse Linux (DVD) 9.2 pretty much the same as Suse Personal Edition 9.1--in terms of ease of use, etc? Will 9.2 run on the Pentium II? Thanks From jack at jacku.com Mon Feb 14 22:48:54 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Mon Feb 14 22:51:20 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Suse question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200502142248.54463.jack@jacku.com> On Monday 14 February 2005 07:09 am, James J. Baker wrote: > Members, > As a newbie to both PC and Linux, I'd like to install a Suse OS on a > Pentium II. Is the Suse Linux (DVD) 9.2 pretty much the same as Suse > Personal Edition 9.1--in terms of ease of use, etc? Will 9.2 run on the > Pentium II? > Thanks The 9.2 DVD is 9.2 Professional, I think. It appears that the "Personal Edition" has been phased out. On the DVD (assuming its the same as the boxed set DVD) you have all the binaries for 32-bit and 64-bit (AMD64 and EM64T). There should be a second DVD for the sources, but I suspect that ISO isn't available since all the source packages are available from the mirrors. From a functionality standpoint it should be the same. You'll just have access to more software packages than the old Personal Edition. Requirements (from the box) - Processor: Pentium II should work (Pentium 1-4 or one of the AMD processors required) RAM: 128MB required; 256MB recommended - I suspect this means that if you don't have 128MB of RAM the YaST installer won't run. So my guess is that if you have the RAM you should be okay. You may want to do some research on KDE 3.3 (if you're a KDE user) and how it performs on a system with your specs. I just installed the 64-bit on a new HP laptop this weekend. Looks good haven't had a chance to do much with it yet. (*#@%&! Broadcom wireless adapter...) Jack Local SuSE Bigot -- Jack Ungerleider jack@jacku.com From jpschewe at mtu.net Tue Feb 15 07:06:47 2005 From: jpschewe at mtu.net (Jon Schewe) Date: Tue Feb 15 07:11:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Suse question In-Reply-To: <200502142248.54463.jack@jacku.com> References: <200502142248.54463.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: <1108472807.12404.7.camel@mn65-eggplant.htc.honeywell.com> On Mon, 2005-02-14 at 22:48 -0600, Jack Ungerleider wrote: > On Monday 14 February 2005 07:09 am, James J. Baker wrote: > > Members, > > As a newbie to both PC and Linux, I'd like to install a Suse OS on a > > Pentium II. Is the Suse Linux (DVD) 9.2 pretty much the same as Suse > > Personal Edition 9.1--in terms of ease of use, etc? Will 9.2 run on the > > Pentium II? > > Thanks > > The 9.2 DVD is 9.2 Professional, I think. It appears that the "Personal > Edition" has been phased out. On the DVD (assuming its the same as the boxed > set DVD) you have all the binaries for 32-bit and 64-bit (AMD64 and EM64T). > There should be a second DVD for the sources, but I suspect that ISO isn't > available since all the source packages are available from the mirrors. > Be careful there with that DVD. It has been noted that at least the lt_modem driver is not on the ISO, but is on the ftp site. Based on that information there are some packages that are on the ftp site and not on the ISO image. > RAM: 128MB required; 256MB recommended - I suspect this means that if you > don't have 128MB of RAM the YaST installer won't run. > Actually the non-graphical version will probably run with less than 128MB, it has in the past. --- ________________________________________________________________________ Jon Schewe | http://mtu.net/~jpschewe GPG signature at http://mtu.net/~jpschewe/gpg.sig.html For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. - Romans 8:38-39 From adam at whee.org Tue Feb 15 07:58:02 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Tue Feb 15 08:16:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> <420FE3B3.1040802@veldy.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Feb 2005, Scot Jenkins wrote: > You might have received a better response from the local *BSD user's group: > > http://www.tcbug.org/ Nope. We're all FreeBSD bigots over there too :) Tom, as for the turmoil...I dunno. 4.x is still rock-solid, and I haven't seen any issues in 5.x that would make me consider switching. I use 5.x on my workstation at home, 4.x on my...other...workstation at home. Now that I've been running 5 at home for a few months I'm starting to put it on new servers as well, but I'm in no hurry to upgrade the 4.x boxes. I do remember reading something about the uni-processor issues you mentioned, but I haven't seen any show-stoppers myself. You might do good to take Scot's advice and ask others on the TCBUG list about their NetBSD experiences, and whether the issues you mention in 5.x are going to be problematic for whatever it is you're doing. I haven't seriously used NetBSD in a few years now (I had an old Alpha system...) so I can't say whether it's matured or not as of 2. As for buying a Mac, the last apple product I owned was a IIgs. Rock-solid, and one of the most dependable POSes I've ever owned. Played DigDug like a dream. Probably boots NetBSD. Does Apple even still make computers? If they do, they must be at like Apple VIgs by now. If they fixed some of the bugs in the Basic interpreter, I would definately buy one of these new-fangled Apple machines again. I'll just have to get a new RF converter so I can hook it up to my TV. From smac at visi.com Tue Feb 15 10:01:09 2005 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Tue Feb 15 10:06:26 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Porting Linux Applications to IBM MainFrame In-Reply-To: References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> <420FE3B3.1040802@veldy.net> Message-ID: <1108483269.42121cc51944d@my.visi.com> I just found this on Google News I don't know if it's good news or bad for the PC market. http://www.internetnews.com/dev-news/article.php/3483221 Sam. From jsurek at mn.rr.com Tue Feb 15 09:53:38 2005 From: jsurek at mn.rr.com (Jack Surek) Date: Tue Feb 15 10:06:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. Message-ID: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> I went back to grad school late and have been meaning to get smart with Linux to leverage it to run some molecular modeling software, but the last 5 years have been all experiments. A little over a year ago I bought a new machine and the network guy in our lab partition it to run both RedHat and Win2000. He's not a Linux guy though. Everything worked at installation, but since that time I switched from a CRT to flat panel monitor. Now the display is blank after login cause it was set to come up X-windows and drive the CRT--i.e. I need to reset the display parameters in XF86Config. (1) How do I tell the GRUB to bring up Linux in command line mode? (2) Anyone know the vertical and horizontal refresh rates for a BenQ FP791? I called their tech service line and only got the useful tidbit that it does work with Linux--even though they don't support Linux. Jack Surek -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050215/b4aa8f6d/attachment.htm From strayf at freeshell.org Tue Feb 15 11:10:35 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Tue Feb 15 11:16:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. In-Reply-To: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> Message-ID: <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> On Tue, Feb 15, 2005 at 09:53:38AM -0600, Jack Surek wrote: > (1) How do I tell the GRUB to bring up Linux in command line mode? At the grub command line try "linux single"? Or, once X has started switch to a different virtual terminal with ctrl-alt-n, where "n" is a number from 1 to 6. Usually X is running on virtual terminal 7, so ctrl-alt-7 will take you back to that. > (2) Anyone know the vertical and horizontal refresh rates for a BenQ > FP791? ? Try booting from a Knoppix live cd and see if that sets it up correctly. If it does then copy the relevant bits from the XF86Config file. From pablo at nothing.com Tue Feb 15 11:18:37 2005 From: pablo at nothing.com (Paul Fierro) Date: Tue Feb 15 11:26:26 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Apple v. Apple (was "R.I.P. Microsoft?") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 02/13/2005 1:34 AM, Mike Miller wrote: > That is an interesting fact. It is interesting because before Apple > formed as a company, there was another company called Apple. It was owned > by the Beatles. When Apple computer started up, they were sued by Apple > recording. For those who don't already know, this is how the Mac's built-in sound 'Sosumi' came to be named. So sue me. Paul From narshe at gmail.com Tue Feb 15 12:18:18 2005 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Tue Feb 15 12:21:26 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. In-Reply-To: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> Message-ID: <4a0cafe205021510182f004beb@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:53:38 -0600, Jack Surek wrote: > > (2) Anyone know the > vertical and horizontal refresh rates for a BenQ FP791? http://www.benq.com/display/lcd_fp791_specs.html -Josh From andyzib at gmail.com Tue Feb 15 12:49:41 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Tue Feb 15 12:52:24 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Apple v. Apple (was "R.I.P. Microsoft?") In-Reply-To: References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: I am not a lawyer, but Apple has plenty of them on staff who helped think up ways around the Beatles settlement, and prepared a legal argument before whatever remnants of the Beatles (original members + benefactors of deceased) opened up a new lawsuit over iTunes, etc. From: http://www.legalzoom.com/articles/article_content/article11325.html The computer giant agreed that although it may be involved in digital music, it would not package, sell or distribute any physical music materials, such as CDs. Or it could be that Apple Corps just wants a slice of the digital music pie on their own terms, instead of Apple Computer's terms. Sue, then settle on a deal. *shrug* -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Feb 15 12:52:54 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Tue Feb 15 12:59:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Apple v. Apple (was "R.I.P. Microsoft?") In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, Paul Fierro wrote: > On 02/13/2005 1:34 AM, Mike Miller wrote: > >> That is an interesting fact. It is interesting because before Apple >> formed as a company, there was another company called Apple. It was owned >> by the Beatles. When Apple computer started up, they were sued by Apple >> recording. > > For those who don't already know, this is how the Mac's built-in sound > 'Sosumi' came to be named. So sue me. Interesting. There were three suits: (1) When Apple computer decided to use the name Apple and an apple as a logo, (2) when they added sound to their computers despite an earlier agreement that they would never get into the music business, and (3) when they decided to do iTunes/iPod despite the earlier agreement. It seems clear that they will lose every time. I wonder why they didn't just change their name to "Peach," or whatever! They chose Apple partly because they liked the Beatles' and the Beatle's Apple label. Mike From adam at whee.org Tue Feb 15 12:56:38 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Tue Feb 15 13:11:26 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Apple v. Apple (was "R.I.P. Microsoft?") In-Reply-To: References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > I am not a lawyer, but Apple has plenty of them on staff who helped > think up ways around the Beatles settlement, and prepared a legal > argument before whatever remnants of the Beatles (original members + > benefactors of deceased) opened up a new lawsuit over iTunes, etc. I wanna hear Yoko give testimony. If you play the court transcripts backwards, does it say "Steve is dead"? From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Feb 15 13:27:31 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Tue Feb 15 13:31:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Apple v. Apple (was "R.I.P. Microsoft?") In-Reply-To: References: <021220051716.29329.420E39D9000C755A0000729122058863600A0299019D0DD20D0A0B059D0E03@comcast.net> <200502121536.56409.jack@jacku.com> <420EC72F.8040908@visi.com> <200502130000.56968.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > I am not a lawyer, but Apple has plenty of them on staff who helped > think up ways around the Beatles settlement, and prepared a legal > argument before whatever remnants of the Beatles (original members + > benefactors of deceased) opened up a new lawsuit over iTunes, etc. > > From: http://www.legalzoom.com/articles/article_content/article11325.html > > The computer giant agreed that although it may be involved in digital > music, it would not package, sell or distribute any physical music > materials, such as CDs. > > Or it could be that Apple Corps just wants a slice of the digital music > pie on their own terms, instead of Apple Computer's terms. Sue, then > settle on a deal. *shrug* I don't know how old that article is (URL above) because it always has today's date on it! >From the article: The looming question up for courtroom debate is whether iTunes Music Store sells physical music materials, such as CDs. I think the answer is 'yes,' and the reason is that the iTunes technology, which could not have been predicted in 1991 (before the general population got on the internet) is competing directly with CD sales. The point of the agreement was certainly that Apple computer should not be a competitor in the music industry. Now they are a competitor. Thus, I think Apple recording will win this one too. Mike From gsker at comcast.net Tue Feb 15 15:31:20 2005 From: gsker at comcast.net (Gerry) Date: Tue Feb 15 15:36:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. In-Reply-To: <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, Steven Cayford wrote: > On Tue, Feb 15, 2005 at 09:53:38AM -0600, Jack Surek wrote: >> (1) How do I tell the GRUB to bring up Linux in command line mode? > > At the grub command line try "linux single"? At the grub menu screen, move to the line you want to boot Press "E" to edit that entry At the command menu screen (usually 3 lines) move to the line starting with "kernel" Press "E" to edit that line. At the end of the line put a " 3" For runlevel 3. Press Enter Press "B" to boot that kernel. -- Gerry Skerbitz gsker@comcast.net From justin.kremer at gmail.com Tue Feb 15 16:17:17 2005 From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer) Date: Tue Feb 15 16:21:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. In-Reply-To: <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> Message-ID: <27e6356a05021514172971cee8@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:10:35 -0600, Steven Cayford wrote: > Or, once X has started switch to a different virtual terminal with > ctrl-alt-n, where "n" is a number from 1 to 6. Usually X is running on > virtual terminal 7, so ctrl-alt-7 will take you back to that. That is what I was going to suggest as well, but note that the proper keys to press are ctrl-alt-Fn So, if the computer boots up to a blank screen after changing monitors, chances are that hitting ctrl-alt-F1 will bring you to a console login prompt. -- Justin Kremer From josh at joshwelch.com Tue Feb 15 16:31:50 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Tue Feb 15 16:36:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Digi Acceleport Xp Message-ID: <20050215163150.w5dde9qq9jpc0k0c@moose.joshwelch.com> Has anyone gotten a digi multi serial port card working with a 2.6 kernel on Debian Sarge? I'm trying to move our fax server from a somewhat crippled machine running Red Hat 7.1 to a much newer and less likely to catch on fire machine running Debian Sarge with a 2.6.8 Kernel. Digi's driver isn't building, I'm having issues getting the native epca driver to work, and I'm starting to think I am overlooking the obvious. Any help on this would be appreciated. Thanks, Josh From strayf at freeshell.org Tue Feb 15 17:02:47 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Tue Feb 15 17:06:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. In-Reply-To: <27e6356a05021514172971cee8@mail.gmail.com> References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> <27e6356a05021514172971cee8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050215230247.GA18913@callisto> On Tue, Feb 15, 2005 at 04:17:17PM -0600, Justin Kremer wrote: > On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:10:35 -0600, Steven Cayford wrote: > > Or, once X has started switch to a different virtual terminal with > > ctrl-alt-n, where "n" is a number from 1 to 6. Usually X is running on > > virtual terminal 7, so ctrl-alt-7 will take you back to that. > > That is what I was going to suggest as well, but note that the proper > keys to press are ctrl-alt-Fn Doh. I always forget which is which and end up trying both. -Steve From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Feb 15 20:48:45 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Feb 15 20:51:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502160248.j1G2mj508905@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Laptops I have acquired 7 laptops $30.00 each Compaq Armada 1700 Model 6233/t/400/D/M/1 12-inch diagonal display 800x600 full screen will do 1024x768 external. Pentium II 233 32mb RAM can go to 128mb 4gig HD CDROM bootable FDD bootable Serial, Printer, VGA, PS/2, IR, and USB 2 PCMCIA Sound ESS 1869 Video C&T No OS, boots to DOS. Compaq system setup partition is intact. Tested; in good working condition, some cosmetic flaws Seller Email address: smac at visi dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From seg at haxxed.com Wed Feb 16 06:42:16 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Wed Feb 16 06:49:43 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] NetBSD 2.0 In-Reply-To: <20050214231008.GQ3913@momentum.poptix.net> References: <421112EB.6040408@veldy.net> <20050214215653.GP3913@momentum.poptix.net> <20050214231008.GQ3913@momentum.poptix.net> Message-ID: <1108557736.324.64.camel@bigtime> > Luckily I still have my linux laptop (that NetBSD wouldn't even manage > to boot on), and a windows desktop (which NetBSD doesn't support half > the hardware in) to keep me on-net while my Mac is in the shop. Ummm, yeah. In my experience, NetBSD's claim of "runs on everything" is a complete joke. NetBSD may support a few obscure and/or stone age archs (anyone still running a VAX?) that linux doesn't, but Linux supports anything anyone is likely to actually have, and usually has better driver support. I recently tried booting Linux on a big pile of various m68k macs, and it ran with full driver support for everything but sound on every one of them. And I even got it running on a NuBus PPC. (Sadly the solid mac68k support is a decade too late at this point...) I've even run Linux on my Dreamcast... I gave BSD a try about a year ago. The victim: An old compaq 486 laptop with 8mb RAM. FreeBSD wouldn't even boot. So I tried NetBSD. Long story short, NetBSD is stone age. Stone knives and bearskins, and how! Its non-modular kernel is pathetic. The "stripped down" kernel still ate 6mb RAM for itself, leaving a useless 2mb left over for userspace and disk space. Not to mention it doesn't support SVGALib or an fbcon, so there's no way in hell to get graphics out of it short of running X. Which wasn't going to happen in 2mb! Oh, and its filesystem has no way of mapping out bad sectors, of which the drive in the POS laptop apparently had a few after getting dropped... And there's no tool to detect them out of the box. The manpages just babble on about some convoluted method of mapping out sectors on a PDP-11 RK-whatever diskpack. WTF? How anyone can claim NetBSD is at all suitable for embedded use, I don't know. Its absurd. I ended up giving up and putting Debian on it. Linux's dynamic module loading allows you to easily load just the drivers you need, no recompiling needed. The Linux kernel happily lives in 2mb RAM, leaving a much more useful 6mb for userspace. It supports fbdev and svgalib, and you can even squeeze X in 6mb RAM, thus I could play Doom and use it as a VNC terminal... And Linux has 'badblocks', which after a few runs was apparently able to convince the drive's firmware to map out the bad sectors, and the drive has worked fine ever since. I'm currently putting the finishing touches on my custom firmware for Belkin F5D7230-4 / F5D7231-4 802.11g wireless routers. Thanks to busybox, dropbear, uclibc, and squashfs, I have a full environment with ssh server/client, caching DNS server, DHCP server/client, NTP client, and HTTP server with CGI support, in 2mb of flash with space left over. I've still got over 1mb left to play with. Hmmm, OpenVPN, ipsec, ipv6 maybe... NetBSD is a pathetic stone age anachronism. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050216/f25b5d51/attachment.pgp From adam at whee.org Wed Feb 16 07:27:39 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Wed Feb 16 07:46:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Digi Acceleport Xp In-Reply-To: <20050215163150.w5dde9qq9jpc0k0c@moose.joshwelch.com> References: <20050215163150.w5dde9qq9jpc0k0c@moose.joshwelch.com> Message-ID: Could you post the output of the build failing? Someone here may be able to figure it out. IIRC, someone I know used to write unix drivers for Digi boards. Dieman, I know he did SCO, do you think he'd know anything about the Linux driver? On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > Has anyone gotten a digi multi serial port card working with a 2.6 kernel on > Debian Sarge? > I'm trying to move our fax server from a somewhat crippled machine running Red > Hat 7.1 to a much newer and less likely to catch on fire machine running Debian > Sarge with a 2.6.8 Kernel. Digi's driver isn't building, I'm having issues > getting the native epca driver to work, and I'm starting to think I am > overlooking the obvious. > > Any help on this would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > Josh > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From jsievert at jsievert.net Wed Feb 16 08:18:10 2005 From: jsievert at jsievert.net (Jason Sievert) Date: Wed Feb 16 08:16:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] xfs kernel panic when trying to mount a drive Message-ID: <1108563490.25913.4.camel@fileserv.jsievert.net> Hello all! I am trying to mount a usb drive with a XFS filesystem on it and I get this message on two computers. Has anybody seen this? What can I do to try and at least get the data off of it? The kernel versions on the two computers are 2.6.10-gentoo-r5 and 2.6.10-gentoo-r7. XFS mounting filesystem sda3 Starting XFS recovery on filesystem: sda3 (dev: sda3) ------------[ cut here ]------------ kernel BUG at fs/xfs/linux-2.6/xfs_buf.c:505! invalid operand: 0000 [#1] Modules linked in: usb_storage ohci_hcd ehci_hcd uhci_hcd via_agp agpgart snd_pcm_oss snd_mixer_oss snd_seq_oss snd_seq_midi_event snd_seq snd_via82xx snd_ac97_codec snd_pcm snd_timer snd_page_alloc gameport snd_mpu401_uart snd_rawmidi snd_seq_device snd usbcore via_rhine mii CPU: 0 EIP: 0060:[] Not tainted VLI EFLAGS: 00010206 (2.6.10-gentoo-r5) EIP is at _pagebuf_find+0x195/0x1e0 eax: 00000200 ebx: c3d512e0 ecx: 00000009 edx: 00000040 esi: 00000000 edi: 00008000 ebp: 00000080 esp: d775ba3c ds: 007b es: 007b ss: 0068 Process mount (pid: 32495, threadinfo=d775a000 task=d1abfa20) Stack: 00000282 3b9ac991 1580c890 00000000 c02ae220 c15d2f60 000000d0 cd97f580 c3d512e0 00004001 00004001 00000080 c02b0985 c94cc200 00000000 00000040 00000000 00004001 c3d512e0 ce778c60 00004001 00000000 c02b0a84 c94cc200 Call Trace: [] kmem_zone_alloc+0x90/0xc0 [] xfs_buf_get_flags+0x65/0x130 [] xfs_buf_read_flags+0x34/0x90 [] xlog_recover_do_inode_trans+0x122/0xb50 [] schedule+0x283/0x500 [] __up_wakeup+0x7/0xc [] kmem_alloc+0x5f/0xf0 [] xlog_recover_do_trans+0x120/0x180 [] xlog_recover_commit_trans+0x39/0x50 [] xlog_recover_process_data+0x193/0x220 [] xlog_do_recovery_pass+0x6d0/0xb30 [] xlog_do_log_recovery+0x8f/0xd0 [] xlog_do_recover+0x3b/0x180 [] xlog_recover+0xec/0x100 [] xfs_log_mount+0x91/0x130 [] xfs_mountfs+0x7d7/0xfe0 [] xfs_readsb+0x1a8/0x240 [] xfs_ioinit+0x1b/0x30 [] xfs_mount+0x3b8/0x690 [] linvfs_fill_super+0xb3/0x210 [] snprintf+0x27/0x30 [] disk_name+0x62/0xd0 [] sb_set_blocksize+0x2e/0x60 [] get_sb_bdev+0xe0/0x150 [] linvfs_get_sb+0x2f/0x40 [] linvfs_fill_super+0x0/0x210 [] do_kern_mount+0x63/0xf0 [] do_new_mount+0x9e/0x100 [] do_mount+0x19f/0x1c0 [] copy_mount_options+0x60/0xc0 [] sys_mount+0x9a/0xe0 [] sysenter_past_esp+0x52/0x75 Code: c0 2c 8b 11 89 42 04 8b 4c 24 48 89 51 2c 8b 54 24 18 89 50 04 89 02 8b 44 24 48 83 c4 20 5b 5e 5f 5d c3 ff 05 20 74 54 c0 eb ec <0f> 0b f9 01 e7 67 42 c0 8b 4c 24 34 31 d2 21 fa 8b 41 14 89 d1 From sfertch at gmail.com Wed Feb 16 10:24:05 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Wed Feb 16 10:26:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID issues revisited Message-ID: <67f3084a050216082424551764@mail.gmail.com> Thanks to everyone for the help regarding the LVM on RAID question I had the other day. There's another issue with it that I'm trying to resolve, and that is getting the RAID5 to initialize on startup. Problem history review: Originally, it was a RAID0 (not my design) and converted to RAID5 (yay!) after the owners suffered a disk failure. On bootup, all other RAID devices initialize. However, this RAID5 doesn't. >From my understanding, this line in the /etc/raidtab is required for it to be read and initialized on bootup: persistent-superblock 1 Again, here's the /etc/raidtab relevant info: raiddev /dev/md4 raid-level 5 nr-raid-disks 3 chunk-size 64k persistent-superblock 1 parity-algorithm left-symmetric nr-spare-disks 0 device /dev/sdc1 raid-disk 0 device /dev/sdd1 raid-disk 1 device /dev/sde1 raid-disk 2 After bootup, I can initialize the /dev/md4 device and then mount filesystems by hand and it works. If I wanted to, I could throw it into the rc.local script, but that's a hack and not the way I want to do it. I do have a call into RH for support on this, however, they're being extremely slow to respond... I've googled this, but so far am not finding much that's helpful. Further thoughts? -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From josh at joshwelch.com Wed Feb 16 10:34:19 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Wed Feb 16 10:41:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Digi Acceleport Xp In-Reply-To: References: <20050215163150.w5dde9qq9jpc0k0c@moose.joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <20050216103419.6gqsax8xwubk0og4@moose.joshwelch.com> Quoting Adam Maloney : > Could you post the output of the build failing? Someone here may be able > to figure it out. > > IIRC, someone I know used to write unix drivers for Digi boards. Dieman, > I know he did SCO, do you think he'd know anything about the Linux driver? > ./configure runs without any issues. Below I've posted the output of make. It's obvious from the error that there is an issue in the file dgdm_tty.c, and I've tried to look at it, but I might as well be reading a newspaper in Athens. I no make code go work. FWIW I've fired off a note to Digi as well. I'm not sure if they are still actively developing for this product or not. host38:~/digi/dgdm-1.1# make all (cd driver; make all) make[1]: Entering directory `/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver' make -C /lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686-smp/build SUBDIRS=$PWD modules make[2]: Entering directory `/usr/src/kernel-headers-2.6.8-2-686-smp' CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_driver.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_fileio.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_mgmt.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_trace.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_audiotap.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_eqm.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_isdn.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_proc.o CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.o /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c: In function `dgdm_tty_open': /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c:1527: error: structure has no member named `session' /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c: In function `block_til_ready': /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c:1603: error: structure has no member named `session' make[3]: *** [/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.o] Error 1 make[2]: *** [_module_/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver] Error 2 make[2]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/kernel-headers-2.6.8-2-686-smp' make[1]: *** [build] Error 2 make[1]: Leaving directory `/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver' make: *** [all] Error 2 From jsievert at jsievert.net Wed Feb 16 12:17:43 2005 From: jsievert at jsievert.net (Jason Sievert) Date: Wed Feb 16 12:21:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] xfs kernel panic when trying to mount a drive In-Reply-To: <1108563490.25913.4.camel@fileserv.jsievert.net> References: <1108563490.25913.4.camel@fileserv.jsievert.net> Message-ID: <1108577864.16393.33.camel@jsievert.rorke.com> I think I might have answered my own question. This drive is from my laptop which is a Athlon XP 64bit. The laptop is in the shop and I am trying to get the data off of it. I am trying to mount it on a variety of different computers, all x86. Is their a difference in the way a file system is written that would prevent me from mounting it on a x86 box if it was created on a 64bit OS? Sorry about being so short before but I was running late for work. Jason On Wed, 2005-02-16 at 08:18 -0600, Jason Sievert wrote: > Hello all! I am trying to mount a usb drive with a XFS filesystem on it > and I get this message on two computers. Has anybody seen this? What > can I do to try and at least get the data off of it? The kernel > versions on the two computers are 2.6.10-gentoo-r5 and 2.6.10-gentoo-r7. > > XFS mounting filesystem sda3 > Starting XFS recovery on filesystem: sda3 (dev: sda3) > ------------[ cut here ]------------ > kernel BUG at fs/xfs/linux-2.6/xfs_buf.c:505! > invalid operand: 0000 [#1] > Modules linked in: usb_storage ohci_hcd ehci_hcd uhci_hcd via_agp > agpgart snd_pcm_oss snd_mixer_oss snd_seq_oss snd_seq_midi_event snd_seq > snd_via82xx snd_ac97_codec snd_pcm snd_timer snd_page_alloc gameport > snd_mpu401_uart snd_rawmidi snd_seq_device snd usbcore via_rhine mii > CPU: 0 > EIP: 0060:[] Not tainted VLI > EFLAGS: 00010206 (2.6.10-gentoo-r5) > EIP is at _pagebuf_find+0x195/0x1e0 > eax: 00000200 ebx: c3d512e0 ecx: 00000009 edx: 00000040 > esi: 00000000 edi: 00008000 ebp: 00000080 esp: d775ba3c > ds: 007b es: 007b ss: 0068 > Process mount (pid: 32495, threadinfo=d775a000 task=d1abfa20) > Stack: 00000282 3b9ac991 1580c890 00000000 c02ae220 c15d2f60 000000d0 > cd97f580 > c3d512e0 00004001 00004001 00000080 c02b0985 c94cc200 00000000 > 00000040 > 00000000 00004001 c3d512e0 ce778c60 00004001 00000000 c02b0a84 > c94cc200 > Call Trace: > [] kmem_zone_alloc+0x90/0xc0 > [] xfs_buf_get_flags+0x65/0x130 > [] xfs_buf_read_flags+0x34/0x90 > [] xlog_recover_do_inode_trans+0x122/0xb50 > [] schedule+0x283/0x500 > [] __up_wakeup+0x7/0xc > [] kmem_alloc+0x5f/0xf0 > [] xlog_recover_do_trans+0x120/0x180 > [] xlog_recover_commit_trans+0x39/0x50 > [] xlog_recover_process_data+0x193/0x220 > [] xlog_do_recovery_pass+0x6d0/0xb30 > [] xlog_do_log_recovery+0x8f/0xd0 > [] xlog_do_recover+0x3b/0x180 > [] xlog_recover+0xec/0x100 > [] xfs_log_mount+0x91/0x130 > [] xfs_mountfs+0x7d7/0xfe0 > [] xfs_readsb+0x1a8/0x240 > [] xfs_ioinit+0x1b/0x30 > [] xfs_mount+0x3b8/0x690 > [] linvfs_fill_super+0xb3/0x210 > [] snprintf+0x27/0x30 > [] disk_name+0x62/0xd0 > [] sb_set_blocksize+0x2e/0x60 > [] get_sb_bdev+0xe0/0x150 > [] linvfs_get_sb+0x2f/0x40 > [] linvfs_fill_super+0x0/0x210 > [] do_kern_mount+0x63/0xf0 > [] do_new_mount+0x9e/0x100 > [] do_mount+0x19f/0x1c0 > [] copy_mount_options+0x60/0xc0 > [] sys_mount+0x9a/0xe0 > [] sysenter_past_esp+0x52/0x75 > Code: c0 2c 8b 11 89 42 04 8b 4c 24 48 89 51 2c 8b 54 24 18 89 50 04 89 > 02 8b 44 24 48 83 c4 20 5b 5e 5f 5d c3 ff 05 20 74 54 c0 eb ec <0f> 0b > f9 01 e7 67 42 c0 8b 4c 24 34 31 d2 21 fa 8b 41 14 89 d1 > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Jason Sievert From jsurek at mn.rr.com Wed Feb 16 12:32:32 2005 From: jsurek at mn.rr.com (Jack Surek) Date: Wed Feb 16 12:36:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> Message-ID: <000a01c51455$e3b039c0$655c1b41@surekhome> Gerry, This advice was dead-nuts on. Thanks. Jack ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gerry" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 3:31 PM Subject: Re: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. > On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, Steven Cayford wrote: > > > On Tue, Feb 15, 2005 at 09:53:38AM -0600, Jack Surek wrote: > >> (1) How do I tell the GRUB to bring up Linux in command line mode? > > > > At the grub command line try "linux single"? > > At the grub menu screen, move to the line you want to boot > Press "E" to edit that entry > At the command menu screen (usually 3 lines) move to the line starting with > "kernel" > Press "E" to edit that line. > At the end of the line put a " 3" For runlevel 3. > Press Enter > Press "B" to boot that kernel. > > > -- > Gerry Skerbitz > gsker@comcast.net > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jsurek at mn.rr.com Wed Feb 16 12:38:52 2005 From: jsurek at mn.rr.com (Jack Surek) Date: Wed Feb 16 12:48:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> <27e6356a05021514172971cee8@mail.gmail.com> <20050215230247.GA18913@callisto> Message-ID: <001701c51456$c3a4d630$655c1b41@surekhome> This approach should have worked...but I'm sure I tried these key combinations with no effect. Anyway, I got the GRUB to bypass loading X and fixed the refresh ranges. Thanks to all who responded. Jack Surek ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Cayford" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 5:02 PM Subject: Re: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. > On Tue, Feb 15, 2005 at 04:17:17PM -0600, Justin Kremer wrote: > > On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:10:35 -0600, Steven Cayford wrote: > > > Or, once X has started switch to a different virtual terminal with > > > ctrl-alt-n, where "n" is a number from 1 to 6. Usually X is running on > > > virtual terminal 7, so ctrl-alt-7 will take you back to that. > > > > That is what I was going to suggest as well, but note that the proper > > keys to press are ctrl-alt-Fn > > Doh. I always forget which is which and end up trying both. > > -Steve > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Wed Feb 16 12:50:40 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Wed Feb 16 12:56:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID issues revisited In-Reply-To: <67f3084a050216082424551764@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a050216082424551764@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 16 Feb 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > From my understanding, this line in the /etc/raidtab is required for it > to be read and initialized on bootup: > > persistent-superblock 1 <..> > After bootup, I can initialize the /dev/md4 device and then mount > filesystems by hand and it works. If I wanted to, I could throw it into > the rc.local script, but that's a hack and not the way I want to do it. Are the partition types 0xfd for all drives? What kernel version is running on this box? Even if the kernel doesn't autodetect it, most distros will run a raidtools init script on startup that will fire up the arrays. -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From sfertch at gmail.com Wed Feb 16 13:19:15 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Wed Feb 16 13:21:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID issues revisited In-Reply-To: References: <67f3084a050216082424551764@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a0502161119b4e1772@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:50:40 -0600 (CST), Nate Carlson wrote: > Are the partition types 0xfd for all drives? What kernel version is > running on this box? > > Even if the kernel doesn't autodetect it, most distros will run a > raidtools init script on startup that will fire up the arrays. Now we're back to Monday... I run LVM on /dev/md4. Therefore, when I partition it, it comes up as /dev/md4p1. Here's some output: [root@netman etc]# fdisk -l Disk /dev/sda: 9100 MB, 9100369920 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 1106 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sda1 * 1 13 104391 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sda2 14 111 787185 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sda3 112 175 514080 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sda4 176 1106 7478257+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sdb: 9100 MB, 9100369920 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 1106 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sdb1 * 1 13 104391 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sdb2 14 111 787185 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sdb3 112 175 514080 fd Linux raid autodetect /dev/sdb4 176 1106 7478257+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sdc: 18.2 GB, 18200739840 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 2212 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sdc1 * 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sdd: 18.2 GB, 18200739840 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 2212 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sdd1 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect Disk /dev/sde: 18.2 GB, 18200739840 bytes 254 heads, 63 sectors/track, 2221 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16002 * 512 = 8193024 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sde1 * 1 2221 17770189+ fd Linux raid autodetect [root@netman etc]# fdisk -l /dev/md4 Disk /dev/md4: 36.3 GB, 36388339712 bytes 2 heads, 4 sectors/track, 8883872 cylinders Units = cylinders of 8 * 512 = 4096 bytes Disk /dev/md4 doesn't contain a valid partition table [root@netman etc]# cat /etc/raidtab raiddev /dev/md3 raid-level 1 nr-raid-disks 2 chunk-size 64k persistent-superblock 1 nr-spare-disks 0 device /dev/sda4 raid-disk 0 device /dev/sdb4 raid-disk 1 raiddev /dev/md4 raid-level 5 nr-raid-disks 3 chunk-size 64k persistent-superblock 1 parity-algorithm left-symmetric nr-spare-disks 0 device /dev/sdc1 raid-disk 0 device /dev/sdd1 raid-disk 1 device /dev/sde1 raid-disk 2 raiddev /dev/md2 raid-level 1 nr-raid-disks 2 chunk-size 64k persistent-superblock 1 nr-spare-disks 0 device /dev/sda3 raid-disk 0 device /dev/sdb3 raid-disk 1 raiddev /dev/md0 raid-level 1 nr-raid-disks 2 chunk-size 64k persistent-superblock 1 nr-spare-disks 0 device /dev/sda1 raid-disk 0 device /dev/sdb1 raid-disk 1 raiddev /dev/md1 raid-level 1 nr-raid-disks 2 chunk-size 64k persistent-superblock 1 nr-spare-disks 0 device /dev/sda2 raid-disk 0 device /dev/sdb2 raid-disk 1 [root@netman etc]# cat /proc/mdstat Personalities : [raid0] [raid1] [raid5] read_ahead 1024 sectors Event: 5 md4 : active raid5 sde1[2] sdd1[1] sdc1[0] 35535488 blocks level 5, 64k chunk, algorithm 2 [3/3] [UUU] md0 : active raid1 sdb1[1] sda1[0] 104320 blocks [2/2] [UU] md1 : active raid1 sdb2[1] sda2[0] 787072 blocks [2/2] [UU] md2 : active raid1 sdb3[1] sda3[0] 513984 blocks [2/2] [UU] md3 : active raid1 sdb4[1] sda4[0] 7478144 blocks [2/2] [UU] unused devices: [root@netman etc]# Output from a raid device that does initialize on bootup: [root@netman etc]# fdisk -l /dev/md0 Disk /dev/md0: 106 MB, 106823680 bytes 2 heads, 4 sectors/track, 26080 cylinders Units = cylinders of 8 * 512 = 4096 bytes Disk /dev/md0 doesn't contain a valid partition table [root@netman etc]# uname -a Linux netman 2.4.21-27.0.1.ELsmp #1 SMP Mon Dec 20 18:47:45 EST 2004 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux All raid devices work with the exception of /dev/md4. md4 is the only RAID5 device, whereas the rest are RAID1. I created the RAID1 devices on install (RHELv3), and the RAID5 was created afterwards. I'm stumped... -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From jhawley at hissingdragon.net Wed Feb 16 13:15:52 2005 From: jhawley at hissingdragon.net (John Hawley) Date: Wed Feb 16 13:31:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Samba3+LDAP and W2K machine accounts Message-ID: <1108581353.2145.34.camel@steelix.hissingdragon.net> Anyone figure out how to get a W2K machine to join a samba3 domain thats using ldap? I'm on Debian/unstable which has: Samba 3.0.10-1 smbldap-tools 0.8.5-3-2 slapd 2.1.30-3 I've gone through the howto's on how to do Samba3+LDAP, and its working fine for a W98 machine (which of course doesn't need a machine account). smb.conf has these ldap related params: ### LDAP related additions ### ldap admin dn = "cn=smbadmin,ou=Services,dc=hissingdragon,dc=net" # ldap ssl = start tls passdb backend = ldapsam:ldap://localhost ldap delete dn = no ldap suffix = dc=hissingdragon,dc=net ldap machine suffix = ou=Users ldap user suffix = ou=Users ldap group suffix = ou=Groups ldap idmap suffix = ou=Idmap idmap uid = 10000-20000 idmap gid = 10000-20000 map acl inherit = Yes ldap filter = (&(uid=%u)(objectclass=sambaSamAccount)) ldap passwd sync = yes add user script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-useradd -a -m '%u' delete user script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-userdel '%u' add group script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-groupadd -p '%g' delete group script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-groupdel '%g' add user to group script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-groupmod -m '%u' '%g' delete user from group script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-groupmod -x '%u' '% g' set primary group script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-usermod -g '%g' '%u' add machine script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-useradd -w '%u' ... which creates this machine account in ldap automatically the first time I try to join the machine to the domain: dn: uid=nidoqueen$,ou=Computers,dc=hissingdragon,dc=net objectClass: top objectClass: inetOrgPerson objectClass: posixAccount cn: nidoqueen$ sn: nidoqueen$ uid: nidoqueen$ uidNumber: 1035 gidNumber: 513 homeDirectory: /dev/null loginShell: /bin/false description: Computer gecos: Computer -- account is created in "Computers" ou, even though my smb.conf says to use "Users". Read somewhere that there is a bug in Samba3 that requires that the machine account go in the same ou as users. (I did try manually changing it to Users, but no good.) ... here's some of the log output (near the end, it was rather lengthy): Feb 16 12:53:35 steelix slapd[5304]: conn=1824 op=5 SRCH base="dc=hissingdragon,dc=net" scope=2 filter="(&(&(uid=NIDOQUEEN $)(objectClass=sambaSamAccount))(objectClass=sa\ mbaSamAccount))" Feb 16 12:53:35 steelix slapd[5304]: conn=1824 op=5 SRCH attr=uid uidNumber gidNumber homeDirectory sambaPwdLastSet sambaPwdCanChange sambaPwdMustChange sambaLogonTime s\ ambaLogoffTime sambaKickoffTime cn displayName sambaHomeDrive sambaHomePath sambaLogonScript sambaProfilePath description sambaUserWorkstations sambaSID sambaPrimaryGrou\ pSID sambaLMPassword sambaNTPassword sambaDomainName objectClass sambaAcctFlags sambaMungedDial sambaBadPasswordCount sambaBadPasswordTime sambaPasswordHistory modifyTim\ estamp sambaLogonHours modifyTimestamp Feb 16 12:53:35 steelix slapd[5304]: conn=1824 op=5 SEARCH RESULT tag=101 err=0 nentries=0 text= Feb 16 12:53:35 steelix smbd[4093]: [2005/02/16 12:53:35, 0] rpc_server/srv_netlog_nt.c:get_md4pw(244) Feb 16 12:53:35 steelix smbd[4093]: get_md4pw: Workstation NIDOQUEEN$: no account in domain ... it looks suppicious that its looking to objectClass=sambaSamAccount, when this nidoqueen$ is a posixAccount. I've tried this: add machine script = /usr/sbin/smbldap-useradd -a '%u' so that it is a sambaSamAccount thats created, but that doesn't work either. Any ideas? Someone willing to post the LDIF dump of a working machine account? Thanks. John Hawley | Unix? What's that? Is that like Linux? Network Admin (CCNA) | --Jurgen Botz Linux Sys Admin (LPIC-1) | jhawley@hissingdragon.net | From bradyh at bitstream.net Wed Feb 16 13:26:43 2005 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Wed Feb 16 13:32:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. In-Reply-To: <001701c51456$c3a4d630$655c1b41@surekhome> References: <000201c51378$571a6cc0$655c1b41@surekhome> <20050215171035.GB31572@callisto> <27e6356a05021514172971cee8@mail.gmail.com> <20050215230247.GA18913@callisto> <001701c51456$c3a4d630$655c1b41@surekhome> Message-ID: <1108582003.32477.127.camel@localhost.localdomain> One way to boot into command line mode: edit the file /etc/inittab and change the line id:5:initdefault: to id:3:initdefault: It will boot to command mode. Then when you're done change it back to 5. > This approach should have worked...but I'm sure I tried these key > combinations with no effect. > Anyway, I got the GRUB to bypass loading X and fixed the refresh ranges. > Thanks to all who responded. > > Jack Surek > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Steven Cayford" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 5:02 PM > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] questions about GRUB and a new monitor. > > > > On Tue, Feb 15, 2005 at 04:17:17PM -0600, Justin Kremer wrote: > > > On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:10:35 -0600, Steven Cayford > wrote: > > > > Or, once X has started switch to a different virtual terminal with > > > > ctrl-alt-n, where "n" is a number from 1 to 6. Usually X is running on > > > > virtual terminal 7, so ctrl-alt-7 will take you back to that. > > > > > > That is what I was going to suggest as well, but note that the proper > > > keys to press are ctrl-alt-Fn > > > > Doh. I always forget which is which and end up trying both. > > > > -Steve > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Brady Hegberg From random at argle.org Wed Feb 16 15:58:53 2005 From: random at argle.org (random@argle.org) Date: Wed Feb 16 16:01:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Digi Acceleport Xp In-Reply-To: <20050216103419.6gqsax8xwubk0og4@moose.joshwelch.com> References: <20050215163150.w5dde9qq9jpc0k0c@moose.joshwelch.com> <20050216103419.6gqsax8xwubk0og4@moose.joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 16 Feb 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > Quoting Adam Maloney : > >> Could you post the output of the build failing? Someone here may be able >> to figure it out. >> >> IIRC, someone I know used to write unix drivers for Digi boards. Dieman, >> I know he did SCO, do you think he'd know anything about the Linux >> driver? >> > > ./configure runs without any issues. Below I've posted the output of make. > It's > obvious from the error that there is an issue in the file dgdm_tty.c, and > I've > tried to look at it, but I might as well be reading a newspaper in Athens. I > no > make code go work. > > FWIW I've fired off a note to Digi as well. I'm not sure if they are still > actively developing for this product or not. > > host38:~/digi/dgdm-1.1# make all > (cd driver; make all) > make[1]: Entering directory `/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver' > make -C /lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686-smp/build SUBDIRS=$PWD modules > make[2]: Entering directory `/usr/src/kernel-headers-2.6.8-2-686-smp' > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_driver.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_fileio.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_mgmt.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_trace.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_audiotap.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_eqm.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_isdn.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_proc.o > CC [M] /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.o > /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c: In function `dgdm_tty_open': > /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c:1527: error: structure has no member > named > `session' > /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c: In function `block_til_ready': > /root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.c:1603: error: structure has no member > named > `session' > make[3]: *** [/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver/dgdm_tty.o] Error 1 > make[2]: *** [_module_/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver] Error 2 > make[2]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/kernel-headers-2.6.8-2-686-smp' > make[1]: *** [build] Error 2 > make[1]: Leaving directory `/root/digi/dgdm-1.1/driver' > make: *** [all] Error 2 I used to be a driver maintainer. This is a fairly common problem that you see when there is a change to the kernel interface. I'd need to look at the sources, but I'd bet that both of those errors are off a structure of the same type, and it is just a "small matter of code" to fix it so it isn't dependent on the "session" element, or uses whatever that element changed to. -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. From josh at joshwelch.com Wed Feb 16 16:02:38 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Wed Feb 16 16:06:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Digi Acceleport Xp In-Reply-To: References: <20050215163150.w5dde9qq9jpc0k0c@moose.joshwelch.com> <20050216103419.6gqsax8xwubk0og4@moose.joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <20050216160238.p5l939zaj3wgsw4g@moose.joshwelch.com> Quoting random@argle.org: > > I used to be a driver maintainer. This is a fairly common problem that you > see when there is a change to the kernel interface. > > I'd need to look at the sources, but I'd bet that both of those > errors are off > a structure of the same type, and it is just a "small matter of code" to fix > it so it isn't dependent on the "session" element, or uses whatever > that element > changed to. > > -- Daniel Taylor > random@argle.org > Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. > Well if you get bored the code is on their FTP site, http://ftp1.digi.com/support/driver/40002059_h.tar.gz. However, Digi actually gave me a beta of a new driver they have been working on and I'm trying to get that to work, still having issues but they are different issues now. It's always nice to see a company willing to work with you on something 3 years after you bought it without having to keep a high dollar maintenance agreement with them. Josh From seg at haxxed.com Wed Feb 16 20:17:49 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Wed Feb 16 20:21:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] xfs kernel panic when trying to mount a drive In-Reply-To: <1108577864.16393.33.camel@jsievert.rorke.com> References: <1108563490.25913.4.camel@fileserv.jsievert.net> <1108577864.16393.33.camel@jsievert.rorke.com> Message-ID: <1108606669.324.70.camel@bigtime> On Wed, 2005-02-16 at 12:17 -0600, Jason Sievert wrote: > I think I might have answered my own question. This drive is from my > laptop which is a Athlon XP 64bit. The laptop is in the shop and I am > trying to get the data off of it. I am trying to mount it on a variety > of different computers, all x86. Is their a difference in the way a > file system is written that would prevent me from mounting it on a x86 > box if it was created on a 64bit OS? Sorry about being so short before > but I was running late for work. Possibly, and its likely a bug. I know squashfs hit a bug like this: "All releases of Squashfs prior to 2.0 generate incorrect filesystems on amd64 machines. Filesystems created on amd64 machines work correctly on amd64 machines, but cannot be mounted on non-amd64 machines. Likewise, filesystems created on non-amd64 machines cannot be mounted on amd64 machines. This bug is caused by the different size of the "time_t" definition used in SquashFS filesystem structures." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050216/b5169fc7/attachment.pgp From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Thu Feb 17 05:23:28 2005 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Thu Feb 17 05:26:43 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Like spam? You'll love spit. Message-ID: <20050217112328.GA10455@mail.el-swifto.com> http://www.theregister.com/2005/02/17/spam_gets_vocal_with_voip/ Egads, why didn't I see this coming? Upcoming TCLUG meeting topic: "Building a Firewall for your Phone." -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota From adam at whee.org Thu Feb 17 07:53:34 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Thu Feb 17 08:10:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Like spam? You'll love spit. In-Reply-To: <20050217112328.GA10455@mail.el-swifto.com> References: <20050217112328.GA10455@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, John J. Trammell wrote: > http://www.theregister.com/2005/02/17/spam_gets_vocal_with_voip/ > > Egads, why didn't I see this coming? Upcoming TCLUG meeting topic: > "Building a Firewall for your Phone." Luckily a challenge-response system is much more feasible in real-time than it is in e-mail. "You've reached Adam's phone. Please press 421 to leave a message." As long as the message is in your own words, and your own voice, I don't think it's likely that current voice analysis software could automate this. I could've instead said, "421 is the code to leave a message". I could blow the "efffffff" in 4 into the speaker. Or "hit 4, then half of that, then half of that". Or "The 1st 3 powers of two, in reverse, ending with 2^0" Or "Hit 42, and Bob's-your-uncle if you then hit one." This is only 2 digits away from whatever cell company has the "press 1 to leave a voicemail" thing today. And brute forcing 999 combinations should drive the per-spam cost up enough to make this infeasible. More concerning is the case where they actually reach you instead of leaving a message. And then setup the software to immediately call back if you hang up before the sales pitch is done? Maybe the "is it human?" test has to happen before your phone will ring. My home phone rings off the hook day and night. I pay $telco for the "privelege" of owning a land line. Then marketers pay $telco for my name and phone number. Then I pay $telco for an unlisted number. Then the marketers pay $telco more for my name and number. Then I pay $telco for privacy plus. And smaller companies not using auto-dialers STILL GET THROUGH. Yeah, I can't wait for this to happen on my cellphone. Hey, let's just shut it all off. Ted Kaczinsky's ideal world isn't looking so bad. From smac at visi.com Thu Feb 17 08:49:30 2005 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Thu Feb 17 08:51:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Like spam? You'll love spit. In-Reply-To: References: <20050217112328.GA10455@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: <1108651770.4214aefa2e11e@my.visi.com> I have found that telling the marketing callers to... "Never call this number again or I will contact the state attorney general?s office" Be firm but don't yell. Works very well, if they call again, call the attorney generals office and complain telling them the caller?s name, company, and their phone number. If you are asked to send a letter of complant, send it! This means the company in question is being investigated. Minnesota has strict laws regarding phone marketing, use them to your advantage. The marketing callers must have a list of people that take the time to contact the attorney generals office because we do not get calls any more. Dinner time is nice, we get to talk about our day. Sam. From jima at beer.tclug.org Thu Feb 17 09:43:28 2005 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Thu Feb 17 09:46:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Like spam? You'll love spit. In-Reply-To: <1108651770.4214aefa2e11e@my.visi.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 smac@visi.com wrote: > I have found that telling the marketing callers to... > > "Never call this number again or I will contact the state attorney general?s > office" Be firm but don't yell. That's all fine and good for "honest" telemarketers, but it doesn't quite hold up against recordings (grrr) or when the callers decide to not be so honest. Spammers already obfuscate the origin of their email messages; why would they be forthcoming about the source of their calls? IIRC, the technology as it lies is prone to spoofing, so I suspect we'll have something similar to the spam battle ahead of us. Joy. Hmm. SpitAssassin.org isn't registered yet. Pity. Jima From dan at dandrake.org Thu Feb 17 11:21:37 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake) Date: Thu Feb 17 11:26:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Like spam? You'll love spit. In-Reply-To: References: <20050217112328.GA10455@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: <20050217172137.GA3992@dandrake.org> On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 at 07:53AM -0600, Adam Maloney wrote: > Or "hit 4, then half of that, then half of that". As a math TA at the U, I can guarantee that very few authentic callers would be able to get "421" from that. :) Hell, most days *I* wouldn't be able to figure it out I wasn't expecting to hear an arithmetic problem... Dan -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050217/7d04da25/attachment.pgp From adam at whee.org Thu Feb 17 11:28:15 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Thu Feb 17 11:43:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Like spam? You'll love spit. In-Reply-To: <20050217172137.GA3992@dandrake.org> References: <20050217112328.GA10455@mail.el-swifto.com> <20050217172137.GA3992@dandrake.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Dan Drake wrote: > > As a math TA at the U, I can guarantee that very few authentic callers > would be able to get "421" from that. :) When I read that the first time through I thought I screwed up the math and you were correcting me...just like my old math TA's. > Hell, most days *I* wouldn't be able to figure it out I wasn't expecting > to hear an arithmetic problem... To leave a voice message, please press the atomic numbers for Beryllium, Helium, and Hydrogen. From natecars at real-time.com Thu Feb 17 12:22:08 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Thu Feb 17 12:26:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID issues revisited In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0502161119b4e1772@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a050216082424551764@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0502161119b4e1772@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 16 Feb 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > Now we're back to Monday... I run LVM on /dev/md4. Therefore, when I > partition it, it comes up as /dev/md4p1. > /dev/sdc1 * 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect > /dev/sdd1 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect > /dev/sde1 * 1 2221 17770189+ fd Linux raid autodetect OK, that's what I was looking for. > [root@netman etc]# uname -a > Linux netman 2.4.21-27.0.1.ELsmp #1 SMP Mon Dec 20 18:47:45 EST 2004 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux Ah - if I recall correctly, 2.4.x kernels can't do autodetect for RAID5. I could very well be recalling incorrectly, though. Is mdadm or raidtools being started on bootup? (Check your init scripts.) That should be able to figure out the array and get it going, even if the kernel autostart didn't. If you're using raidtools, you might want to switch to mdadm - it has the nifty ability to e-mail you when a drive goes belly-up. -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From wylnewland at gmail.com Thu Feb 17 13:38:23 2005 From: wylnewland at gmail.com (Wyl Newland) Date: Thu Feb 17 13:41:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Like spam? You'll love spit. In-Reply-To: References: <20050217112328.GA10455@mail.el-swifto.com> <20050217172137.GA3992@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <15eea73205021711382ccf593a@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 11:28:15 -0600 (CST), Adam Maloney wrote: > On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Dan Drake wrote: > To leave a voice message, please press the atomic numbers for Beryllium, > Helium, and Hydrogen ...otherwise please continue listening to this voice recording in this black hole of a spitoon message spoken without pauses that will eat you alive with long distance charges if you are outside Minnesota or if you are domiciled in Minnesota then this will give plenty of time to trace this call because if you were a person you would have gotten the point by now and since your are still on the line and may be calling from inside Minnesota you are surely in violation of Minnesota state law that requires all marketing calls to be preceeded by a live operator so now please listen to me read you from my favorite book and I will speak in a monotone without pauses now once upon a time in the kingdom of stupid people there lived a spammer... ...otherwise please leave your message with all of your identifying information so I can attach your voice message to an email automatically sent from me to the Minnesota Attorney General's office. I ask you, how long and how often will a spitter call before the costs eat them alive and/or any Minnesota relay points are raided and the owner jailed. From sfertch at gmail.com Thu Feb 17 14:32:34 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Thu Feb 17 14:36:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID issues revisited In-Reply-To: References: <67f3084a050216082424551764@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0502161119b4e1772@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a0502171232269e9e6b@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:22:08 -0600 (CST), Nate Carlson wrote: > On Wed, 16 Feb 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > > Now we're back to Monday... I run LVM on /dev/md4. Therefore, when I > > partition it, it comes up as /dev/md4p1. > > > /dev/sdc1 * 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect > > /dev/sdd1 1 2212 17767858+ fd Linux raid autodetect > > /dev/sde1 * 1 2221 17770189+ fd Linux raid autodetect > > OK, that's what I was looking for. > > > [root@netman etc]# uname -a > > Linux netman 2.4.21-27.0.1.ELsmp #1 SMP Mon Dec 20 18:47:45 EST 2004 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux > > Ah - if I recall correctly, 2.4.x kernels can't do autodetect for RAID5. I > could very well be recalling incorrectly, though. > > Is mdadm or raidtools being started on bootup? (Check your init scripts.) > That should be able to figure out the array and get it going, even if the > kernel autostart didn't. > > If you're using raidtools, you might want to switch to mdadm - it has the > nifty ability to e-mail you when a drive goes belly-up. > 2.4 supports the RAID5 kernel and, I'm using raidtools which startup. Again, all of the RAID1 devices would startup, it was only the RAID5 that wouldn't on system initialization. What it wound up being was that I had to run: mkinitrd -v --preload=raid5 /boot/initrd-test.img `uname -r` Then tell grub to boot using that, and it seems to be working for the moment. Red Hat finally came thru on the support with that. I need to figure out the various options for mkinitrd as everytime I try to upgrade my kernel it blows up on me... Thanks for the help Nate, as well as others who have contributed! -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Thu Feb 17 18:48:02 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Thu Feb 17 18:51:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Ethernet funkiness on MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R Message-ID: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> Hi, Just thought I'd mine the collective consciousness and see if anyone has been having the same trouble I'm experiencing. I had to swap motherboards recently because my other one went fubar (I blame solar flares ;-) but my new(er) MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R with an Athlon 3000+, which I bought around the end of 2003, has also been showing weird behavior. When I'm streaming data or (sometimes) making big downloads, the Ethernet connection conks out, so I have to do an ifdown/ifup to get things flowing again (and the connection is often lost in this process). I don't need to reload the driver, which surprises me a bit, it just requires whatever reset that doing ifup/ifdown causes. The interesting thing is that this happens both when I'm using the onboard Broadcom BCM5788 Gigabit adapter (tg3.ko) and my venerable 3c905 Boomerang Fast Ethernet card (3c59x.ko). I guess this is the first board of mine to have an IO-APIC that actually works, so that might have something to do with it. It has a VIA KT600 chipset, which may or may not be A Good Thing(TM). At least there's a good radio station in town now, so my streaming requirements have been reduced dramatically ;-) Anyway, PCI and IRQ listings below, if they're relevant: lspci -v: 0000:00:00.0 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8377 [KT400/KT600 AGP] Host Bridge (rev 80) Subsystem: VIA Technologies, Inc.: Unknown device 0000 Flags: bus master, 66MHz, medium devsel, latency 8 Memory at e0000000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=128M] Capabilities: [80] AGP version 3.5 Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 0000:00:01.0 PCI bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8237 PCI Bridge (prog-if 00 [Normal decode]) Flags: bus master, 66MHz, medium devsel, latency 0 Bus: primary=00, secondary=01, subordinate=01, sec-latency=0 Memory behind bridge: dee00000-dfefffff Prefetchable memory behind bridge: dad00000-decfffff Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 0000:00:06.0 Multimedia video controller: Brooktree Corporation Bt878 Video Capture (rev 11) Subsystem: Unknown device 7063:2000 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 169 Memory at dedfe000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=4K] Capabilities: [44] Vital Product Data Capabilities: [4c] Power Management version 2 0000:00:06.1 Multimedia controller: Brooktree Corporation Bt878 Audio Capture (rev 11) Subsystem: Unknown device 7063:2000 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 169 Memory at dedff000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=4K] Capabilities: [44] Vital Product Data Capabilities: [4c] Power Management version 2 0000:00:07.0 Multimedia audio controller: Creative Labs SB Live! EMU10k1 (rev 07) Subsystem: Creative Labs SBLive! Player 5.1 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 177 I/O ports at e800 [size=32] Capabilities: [dc] Power Management version 1 0000:00:07.1 Input device controller: Creative Labs SB Live! MIDI/Game Port (rev 07) Subsystem: Creative Labs Gameport Joystick Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32 I/O ports at ec00 [size=8] Capabilities: [dc] Power Management version 1 0000:00:08.0 Ethernet controller: 3Com Corporation 3c905 100BaseTX [Boomerang] Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 185 I/O ports at e400 [size=64] Expansion ROM at dfff0000 [disabled] [size=64K] 0000:00:0b.0 Ethernet controller: Broadcom Corporation NetXtreme BCM5788 Gigabit Ethernet (rev 03) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 590c Flags: bus master, 66MHz, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 185 Memory at dffe0000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=64K] Capabilities: [48] Power Management version 2 Capabilities: [50] Vital Product Data Capabilities: [58] Message Signalled Interrupts: 64bit+ Queue=0/3 Enable- 0000:00:0e.0 FireWire (IEEE 1394): VIA Technologies, Inc. IEEE 1394 Host Controller (rev 46) (prog-if 10 [OHCI]) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 590d Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 169 Memory at dffdb800 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=2K] I/O ports at e000 [size=128] Capabilities: [50] Power Management version 2 0000:00:0f.0 IDE interface: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C586A/B/VT82C686/A/B/VT823x/A/C PIPC Bus Master IDE (rev 06) (prog-if 8a [Master SecP PriP]) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 193 I/O ports at fc00 [size=16] Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 0000:00:10.0 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 I/O ports at d000 [size=32] Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 0000:00:10.1 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 I/O ports at d400 [size=32] Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 0000:00:10.2 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 I/O ports at d800 [size=32] Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 0000:00:10.3 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 I/O ports at dc00 [size=32] Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 0000:00:10.4 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. USB 2.0 (rev 86) (prog-if 20 [EHCI]) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 Memory at dffdb600 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=256] Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 0000:00:11.0 ISA bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8237 ISA bridge [K8T800 South] Subsystem: VIA Technologies, Inc.: Unknown device 0000 Flags: bus master, stepping, medium devsel, latency 0 Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 0000:00:11.5 Multimedia audio controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8233/A/8235/8237 AC97 Audio Controller (rev 60) Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 Flags: medium devsel, IRQ 209 I/O ports at cc00 [size=256] Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 0000:01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Matrox Graphics, Inc. MGA G550 AGP (rev 01) (prog-if 00 [VGA]) Subsystem: Matrox Graphics, Inc. Millennium G550 Dual Head DDR 32Mb Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 64, IRQ 217 Memory at dc000000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=32M] Memory at dfefc000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=16K] Memory at df000000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=8M] Expansion ROM at dfec0000 [disabled] [size=128K] Capabilities: [dc] Power Management version 2 Capabilities: [f0] AGP version 2.0 /proc/pci: CPU0 0: 723444435 IO-APIC-edge timer 1: 514299 IO-APIC-edge i8042 7: 2 IO-APIC-edge parport0 8: 9146082 IO-APIC-edge rtc 9: 0 IO-APIC-level acpi 12: 123 IO-APIC-edge i8042 14: 2650041 IO-APIC-edge ide0 15: 43471 IO-APIC-edge ide1 169: 356 IO-APIC-level ohci1394, bttv0, Bt87x audio 177: 553515 IO-APIC-level EMU10K1 185: 1502714 IO-APIC-level eth0 201: 28479703 IO-APIC-level uhci_hcd, uhci_hcd, uhci_hcd, uhci_hcd, ehci_hcd 209: 2829 IO-APIC-level VIA8233 NMI: 0 LOC: 723447393 ERR: 0 MIS: 0 -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050217/e8d8d207/attachment.pgp From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Thu Feb 17 19:49:53 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Thu Feb 17 19:51:50 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Ethernet funkiness on MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R In-Reply-To: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> References: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> Message-ID: <1108691393.4799.2242.camel@3po> Addendum: Oh, and I am running the Linux 2.6.9-2-k7 kernel on a Debian mostly-testing/partly-unstable box (uh, Debian 3.1 or something, according to /etc/issue). -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050217/7dc038fe/attachment.pgp From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Feb 17 19:55:38 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Thu Feb 17 19:59:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502180155.j1I1tcL13213@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Partial AMD64 System This is a partial AMD64-based machine. Contains the following: o Antec case (which has been partially painted!) o Chaintech VNF3-250 motherboard (nForce3-based) o AMD64-3000 CPU o 512MB Corsair PC3200 RAM o CDRW (I forget the speed, but pretty fast) o DVD-ROM o Antec TrueBlue 480W PSU with blue lights! o Many, many colourful fans! o Couple of round IDE cables. Basically, I guess this system's complete other than harddrives and a video card. I do have an nVidia ti4200 in there now but I'm not counting that cause the fan's a bit loud. Mmmm. $350? Seller Email address: tclcl at freakzilla dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From xpoverby at comcast.net Thu Feb 17 20:22:22 2005 From: xpoverby at comcast.net (Paul Overby) Date: Thu Feb 17 20:26:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT Java clasess Message-ID: <4215515E.7070802@comcast.net> Thinking about taking a JAVA programming class. Anyone have any recommendations? Paul Overby From ringert at consumption.net Fri Feb 18 14:17:48 2005 From: ringert at consumption.net (Torleiv Flatebo Ringer) Date: Fri Feb 18 14:21:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Ethernet funkiness on MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R In-Reply-To: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> References: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> Message-ID: I have had problems with this chipset: 0000:00:0f.0 IDE interface: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C586A/B/VT82C686/A/B/VT823x/A/C PIPC Bus Master IDE (rev 06) When I first bought my board (MSI KT7) I had problems when large amounts of data went across the PCI bus. Check syslog for messages like 'spurious interrupt'. If that is the case see if there is a BIOS update. Do you know if you have the 'B' rev of the VIA southbridge? If you have the 'A' rev, there is a known bug. torleiv what you said > Hi, > > Just thought I'd mine the collective consciousness and see if anyone has > been having the same trouble I'm experiencing. I had to swap > motherboards recently because my other one went fubar (I blame solar > flares ;-) but my new(er) MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R with an Athlon 3000+, > which I bought around the end of 2003, has also been showing weird > behavior. > > When I'm streaming data or (sometimes) making big downloads, the > Ethernet connection conks out, so I have to do an ifdown/ifup to get > things flowing again (and the connection is often lost in this > process). I don't need to reload the driver, which surprises me a bit, > it just requires whatever reset that doing ifup/ifdown causes. > > The interesting thing is that this happens both when I'm using the > onboard Broadcom BCM5788 Gigabit adapter (tg3.ko) and my venerable 3c905 > Boomerang Fast Ethernet card (3c59x.ko). > > I guess this is the first board of mine to have an IO-APIC that actually > works, so that might have something to do with it. It has a VIA KT600 > chipset, which may or may not be A Good Thing(TM). > > At least there's a good radio station in town now, so my streaming > requirements have been reduced dramatically ;-) > > Anyway, PCI and IRQ listings below, if they're relevant: > > lspci -v: > > 0000:00:00.0 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8377 [KT400/KT600 AGP] Host Bridge (rev 80) > Subsystem: VIA Technologies, Inc.: Unknown device 0000 > Flags: bus master, 66MHz, medium devsel, latency 8 > Memory at e0000000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=128M] > Capabilities: [80] AGP version 3.5 > Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:01.0 PCI bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8237 PCI Bridge (prog-if 00 [Normal decode]) > Flags: bus master, 66MHz, medium devsel, latency 0 > Bus: primary=00, secondary=01, subordinate=01, sec-latency=0 > Memory behind bridge: dee00000-dfefffff > Prefetchable memory behind bridge: dad00000-decfffff > Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:06.0 Multimedia video controller: Brooktree Corporation Bt878 Video Capture (rev 11) > Subsystem: Unknown device 7063:2000 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 169 > Memory at dedfe000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=4K] > Capabilities: [44] Vital Product Data > Capabilities: [4c] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:06.1 Multimedia controller: Brooktree Corporation Bt878 Audio Capture (rev 11) > Subsystem: Unknown device 7063:2000 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 169 > Memory at dedff000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=4K] > Capabilities: [44] Vital Product Data > Capabilities: [4c] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:07.0 Multimedia audio controller: Creative Labs SB Live! EMU10k1 (rev 07) > Subsystem: Creative Labs SBLive! Player 5.1 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 177 > I/O ports at e800 [size=32] > Capabilities: [dc] Power Management version 1 > > 0000:00:07.1 Input device controller: Creative Labs SB Live! MIDI/Game Port (rev 07) > Subsystem: Creative Labs Gameport Joystick > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32 > I/O ports at ec00 [size=8] > Capabilities: [dc] Power Management version 1 > > 0000:00:08.0 Ethernet controller: 3Com Corporation 3c905 100BaseTX [Boomerang] > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 185 > I/O ports at e400 [size=64] > Expansion ROM at dfff0000 [disabled] [size=64K] > > 0000:00:0b.0 Ethernet controller: Broadcom Corporation NetXtreme BCM5788 Gigabit Ethernet (rev 03) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 590c > Flags: bus master, 66MHz, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 185 > Memory at dffe0000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=64K] > Capabilities: [48] Power Management version 2 > Capabilities: [50] Vital Product Data > Capabilities: [58] Message Signalled Interrupts: 64bit+ Queue=0/3 Enable- > > 0000:00:0e.0 FireWire (IEEE 1394): VIA Technologies, Inc. IEEE 1394 Host Controller (rev 46) (prog-if 10 [OHCI]) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 590d > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 169 > Memory at dffdb800 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=2K] > I/O ports at e000 [size=128] > Capabilities: [50] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:0f.0 IDE interface: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C586A/B/VT82C686/A/B/VT823x/A/C PIPC Bus Master IDE (rev 06) (prog-if 8a [Master SecP PriP]) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 193 > I/O ports at fc00 [size=16] > Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:10.0 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 > I/O ports at d000 [size=32] > Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:10.1 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 > I/O ports at d400 [size=32] > Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:10.2 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 > I/O ports at d800 [size=32] > Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:10.3 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 81) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 > I/O ports at dc00 [size=32] > Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:10.4 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. USB 2.0 (rev 86) (prog-if 20 [EHCI]) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 201 > Memory at dffdb600 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=256] > Capabilities: [80] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:11.0 ISA bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8237 ISA bridge [K8T800 South] > Subsystem: VIA Technologies, Inc.: Unknown device 0000 > Flags: bus master, stepping, medium devsel, latency 0 > Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:00:11.5 Multimedia audio controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8233/A/8235/8237 AC97 Audio Controller (rev 60) > Subsystem: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd.: Unknown device 5901 > Flags: medium devsel, IRQ 209 > I/O ports at cc00 [size=256] > Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 > > 0000:01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Matrox Graphics, Inc. MGA G550 AGP (rev 01) (prog-if 00 [VGA]) > Subsystem: Matrox Graphics, Inc. Millennium G550 Dual Head DDR 32Mb > Flags: bus master, medium devsel, latency 64, IRQ 217 > Memory at dc000000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=32M] > Memory at dfefc000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=16K] > Memory at df000000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=8M] > Expansion ROM at dfec0000 [disabled] [size=128K] > Capabilities: [dc] Power Management version 2 > Capabilities: [f0] AGP version 2.0 > > /proc/pci: > > CPU0 > 0: 723444435 IO-APIC-edge timer > 1: 514299 IO-APIC-edge i8042 > 7: 2 IO-APIC-edge parport0 > 8: 9146082 IO-APIC-edge rtc > 9: 0 IO-APIC-level acpi > 12: 123 IO-APIC-edge i8042 > 14: 2650041 IO-APIC-edge ide0 > 15: 43471 IO-APIC-edge ide1 > 169: 356 IO-APIC-level ohci1394, bttv0, Bt87x audio > 177: 553515 IO-APIC-level EMU10K1 > 185: 1502714 IO-APIC-level eth0 > 201: 28479703 IO-APIC-level uhci_hcd, uhci_hcd, uhci_hcd, uhci_hcd, ehci_hcd > 209: 2829 IO-APIC-level VIA8233 > NMI: 0 > LOC: 723447393 > ERR: 0 > MIS: 0 > > -- One of the symptoms of an approaching nervous breakdown is the belief that one's work is terribly important. Don't be so confident - you are not that great. From chewie at wookimus.net Fri Feb 18 14:32:38 2005 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Fri Feb 18 14:41:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Ethernet funkiness on MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R In-Reply-To: References: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> Message-ID: <20050218203238.GJ7611@wookimus.net> Make sure you're running Linux 2.6.8 at least, and upgrade to 2.6.10 when you get a chance. I know the new chipsets didn't work for this machine either until I did upgrade. -- Chad Walstrom http://www.wookimus.net/ assert(expired(knowledge)); /* core dump */ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050218/8df75b4f/attachment.pgp From adam at askewview.net Fri Feb 18 15:32:47 2005 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Fri Feb 18 15:36:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server Message-ID: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> (I also posted this on scalug) A friend of mine has an interesting situation. Their DNS server gets around 2 to 3 million dns queries a day its running on a quad xeon system with 4 gigs of ram. Its running Bind 9.2.2. At least twice a week if not more their server will stop looking up domains that are not cached. They end up having to restart bind to get things working again. Any ideas? --Adam From drue at therub.org Fri Feb 18 15:55:47 2005 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Fri Feb 18 16:01:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> Message-ID: <20050218215547.GB19503@therub.org> On Fri, Feb 18, 2005 at 03:32:47PM -0600, Adam wrote: > (I also posted this on scalug) > A friend of mine has an interesting situation. Their DNS server gets > around 2 to 3 million dns queries a day its running on a quad xeon > system with 4 gigs of ram. Its running Bind 9.2.2. > At least twice a week if not more their server will stop looking up > domains that are not cached. > They end up having to restart bind to get things working again. Does anything show up in the logs? I had a problem where after a while in a caching name server it "couldn't find the root name servers", and spewed many log messages saying so. I had forwarders set up in named.conf - and from what I couuld figure is that the root name server list would get loaded when named started - but the forwarders would take care of requests for a week or so. But then say one of the forwarders didn't respond, it would try to look it up itself but for some reason that list of root servers is no longer in memory and it would go crazy and need to be restarted. The solution was to add "forward only;" to named.conf - and I havn't had a problem since. This was with bind 8. Dan From adam at whee.org Fri Feb 18 15:44:10 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Fri Feb 18 16:02:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Feb 2005, Adam wrote: > (I also posted this on scalug) > A friend of mine has an interesting situation. Their DNS server gets around 2 > to 3 million dns queries a day its running on a quad xeon system with 4 gigs > of ram. Its running Bind 9.2.2. > At least twice a week if not more their server will stop looking up domains > that are not cached. > They end up having to restart bind to get things working again. Have they done any debugging to narrow it down? Is named still getting CPU time after it stops? Is named sending out any queries to the root's? It sounds like maybe it has an older or bad root hints, and it's periodically picking a bad root address? Next time it happens, run ps a couple of times and confirm whether the CPU time is increasing for named, just to prove named is still running. Then run tcpdump or something on the box and see if named is sending queries out to the root's. If it's getting millions of queries per day, you should see a bunch of outgoing queries to the root's. If you see the outgoing queries but no responses, see if the IP it's sending to is valid and responding to queries. From nate at refried.org Fri Feb 18 15:59:43 2005 From: nate at refried.org (Nate Straz) Date: Fri Feb 18 16:02:10 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> Message-ID: <20050218215943.GA6125@refried.org> On Fri, Feb 18, 2005 at 03:32:47PM -0600, Adam wrote: > A friend of mine has an interesting situation. Their DNS server gets > around 2 to 3 million dns queries a day its running on a quad xeon > system with 4 gigs of ram. Its running Bind 9.2.2. /me jaw drops. IMHO, that's a beefy machine for DNS. Perhaps several smaller machines would be in order. Is this the only machine doing DNS on site? Is it an authorative server? > At least twice a week if not more their server will stop looking up > domains that are not cached. > They end up having to restart bind to get things working again. > > Any ideas? Try out dnscache from djbdns. :) http://cr.yp.to/djbdns.html Nate From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Feb 18 16:42:17 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Fri Feb 18 16:46:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Best way to find Video HW info? Message-ID: <20050218164217.00004f9c@prokofiev> Is there something in /proc that can tell me the following information about the installed video card? 1.) chipset 2.) onboard memory 3.) brand/model I inherited a system and I don't see anything on the card that indicates what kind of card it actually is. Trying to install Slackware 10.1 and I need this information to update my xorg.conf file. Thanks, Josh From adam at askewview.net Fri Feb 18 16:52:52 2005 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Fri Feb 18 17:01:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: <20050218215943.GA6125@refried.org> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> <20050218215943.GA6125@refried.org> Message-ID: <421671C4.4030503@askewview.net> Well dns was being run on a bunch of dell blades also doing inbound MX. there are 4 of these machines doing DNS from what i've gathered. 2x for non-static ips and 2x for static ip customers. Around 30,000 in total. Nate Straz wrote: >On Fri, Feb 18, 2005 at 03:32:47PM -0600, Adam wrote: > > >/me jaw drops. IMHO, that's a beefy machine for DNS. Perhaps several >smaller machines would be in order. Is this the only machine doing DNS >on site? Is it an authorative server? > > From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Fri Feb 18 17:13:34 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Fri Feb 18 17:17:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Ethernet funkiness on MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R In-Reply-To: <20050218203238.GJ7611@wookimus.net> References: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> <20050218203238.GJ7611@wookimus.net> Message-ID: <1108768414.4799.2257.camel@3po> On Fri, 2005-02-18 at 14:32, Chad Walstrom wrote: > Make sure you're running Linux 2.6.8 at least, and upgrade to 2.6.10 > when you get a chance. I know the new chipsets didn't work for this > machine either until I did upgrade. Thanks, as far as I can tell, I'm running the newest Debian-packaged version (2.6.9-something), so hopefully 2.6.10 or something will float out at some point. My BIOS is also aincent, so I'll have to get around to upgrading that too to see if it helps (someone suggested that in a personal note). -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050218/24441257/attachment.pgp From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Fri Feb 18 17:11:40 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Fri Feb 18 17:17:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Best way to find Video HW info? In-Reply-To: <20050218164217.00004f9c@prokofiev> References: <20050218164217.00004f9c@prokofiev> Message-ID: <1108768300.4799.2254.camel@3po> On Fri, 2005-02-18 at 16:42, Josh Trutwin wrote: > Is there something in /proc that can tell me the following information > about the installed video card? > > 1.) chipset > 2.) onboard memory > 3.) brand/model > > I inherited a system and I don't see anything on the card that > indicates what kind of card it actually is. Trying to install > Slackware 10.1 and I need this information to update my xorg.conf > file. Yeah, /proc/pci usually has that info. The lspci utility also usually has a more up-to-date and extensive database than the kernel ("lspci -v" gives verbose output). If you have really new hardware, things might not be in the system database, though you should be able to get the numeric PCI IDs somehow and then look them up online: http://pciids.sourceforge.net/ The amount of memory is usually listed in some funky way, but usually the X server doesn't need that info these days (mostly only under certain conditions, such as running dual-head). -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050218/20aa42c3/attachment.pgp From rclark at lakesplus.com Fri Feb 18 17:39:11 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Fri Feb 18 17:42:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Best way to find Video HW info? In-Reply-To: <20050218164217.00004f9c@prokofiev> Message-ID: Sometimes you can find numbers on the actual hardware ... put them into Google and you would be amazed that sometimes you come up with something. This is not in /proc ... but it is just looking at the hardware ... I have used chip numbers in the past to narrow the list of possible video cards. Just a thought. Randy -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Josh Trutwin Sent: Friday, February 18, 2005 4:42 PM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [tclug-list] Best way to find Video HW info? Is there something in /proc that can tell me the following information about the installed video card? 1.) chipset 2.) onboard memory 3.) brand/model I inherited a system and I don't see anything on the card that indicates what kind of card it actually is. Trying to install Slackware 10.1 and I need this information to update my xorg.conf file. Thanks, Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Fri Feb 18 17:31:28 2005 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Fri Feb 18 17:42:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Ethernet funkiness on MSI KT6 Delta FIS2R In-Reply-To: <1108768414.4799.2257.camel@3po> References: <1108687682.4799.2221.camel@3po> <20050218203238.GJ7611@wookimus.net> <1108768414.4799.2257.camel@3po> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Feb 2005, Mike Hicks wrote: > Thanks, as far as I can tell, I'm running the newest Debian-packaged > version (2.6.9-something), so hopefully 2.6.10 or something will float > out at some point. My BIOS is also aincent, so I'll have to get around > to upgrading that too to see if it helps (someone suggested that in a > personal note). 2.6.10 is in unstable, and works fine on testing. -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Feb 18 19:22:09 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Fri Feb 18 19:27:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Best way to find Video HW info? In-Reply-To: <1108768300.4799.2254.camel@3po> References: <20050218164217.00004f9c@prokofiev> <1108768300.4799.2254.camel@3po> Message-ID: <20050218192209.00001bdf@prokofiev> On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:11:40 -0600 Mike Hicks wrote: > Yeah, /proc/pci usually has that info. The lspci utility also > usually has a more up-to-date and extensive database than the kernel > ("lspci -v" gives verbose output). If you have really new hardware, > things might not be in the system database, though you should be > able to get the numeric PCI IDs somehow and then look them up > online: http://pciids.sourceforge.net/ > > The amount of memory is usually listed in some funky way, but > usually the X server doesn't need that info these days (mostly only > under certain conditions, such as running dual-head). Doh - thanks. Just what I needed. Josh From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Feb 18 20:26:06 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Feb 18 20:32:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PDAnet for Treo Message-ID: Has anyone tried this yet?... http://www.junefabrics.com/palmnet/index.php Any good? Are there competitors? (I have a Treo 600.) Mike From cschumann at twp-llc.com Sat Feb 19 09:29:05 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Sat Feb 19 09:32:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: OT Java classes In-Reply-To: <200502181800.j1II0e07029899@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200502191528.j1JFSZ07000563@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:22:22 -0600 > From: Paul Overby > Thinking about taking a JAVA programming class. > Anyone have any recommendations? I've taken Intertech's Java course having in mind certification. I found the class to be very useful, bought another study guide (recommended by the instructor Steve Close) and got certified pretty easily. Of course, I still haven't done any Java programming... yet. I think it was the Complete Java course. Intertech's prices are pretty standard, but they offer discounts if you buy a few. My tiny company buys 4 or 5 at a time to get a nice price break, and we can take them when our schedules permit. http://www.intertech-inc.com/ Chris Schumann From adam at whee.org Sat Feb 19 10:04:27 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Sat Feb 19 10:22:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: <421671C4.4030503@askewview.net> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> <20050218215943.GA6125@refried.org> <421671C4.4030503@askewview.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Feb 2005, Adam wrote: > Well dns was being run on a bunch of dell blades also doing inbound MX. > there are 4 of these machines doing DNS from what i've gathered. 2x for > non-static ips and 2x for static ip customers. Around 30,000 in total. That does seem rather overkill - 3M requests/day is about 30 requests/second. I would think 1 of those boxes in single-proc mode would handle it fine. From narshe at gmail.com Sat Feb 19 16:19:17 2005 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Sat Feb 19 16:28:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT Java clasess In-Reply-To: <4215515E.7070802@comcast.net> References: <4215515E.7070802@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4a0cafe205021914191d7f3259@mail.gmail.com> What is your purpose for taking Java? Do you know any languages already? -Josh On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:22:22 -0600, Paul Overby wrote: > Thinking about taking a JAVA programming class. > Anyone have any recommendations? > > Paul Overby > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sat Feb 19 16:24:48 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sat Feb 19 16:32:10 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502192224.j1JMOm706336@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: old books i was cleaning out my closet and decided to get rid of the following books: Mastering Visual C++ 6 (Sybex) ISBN: 0-7821-2273-6 Inside Visual C++ 5 (Microsoft Press) ISBN: 1-57231-565-2 Understanding ActiveX and OLE (Microsoft Press) ISBN: 1-57231-216-5 C++ Primer Plus (Waite Group) ISBN: 1-878739-02-6 Revolutionary Guide to Assembly Language (Wrox) ISBN: 1-874416-12-5 Windows 2000 Accelerated Training Kit (Microsoft Press) ISBN: 0-7356-1249-8 Microsoft SQL Server 2000 Database Design and Implementation (Microsoft Press) ISBN: 0-7356-1248-X sorry they're mostly ms based. i can meet between stillwater and minneapolis in the morning or after work. Seller Email address: intothefloodagain at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From adam at askewview.net Sat Feb 19 20:03:46 2005 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Sat Feb 19 20:10:21 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> <20050218215943.GA6125@refried.org> <421671C4.4030503@askewview.net> Message-ID: <4217F002.4010900@askewview.net> Yeah thats what I figured too. I guess since the Unix/linux admin is used to seeing Sun prices he went overkill heh Adam Maloney wrote: > On Fri, 18 Feb 2005, Adam wrote: > >> Well dns was being run on a bunch of dell blades also doing inbound MX. >> there are 4 of these machines doing DNS from what i've gathered. 2x >> for non-static ips and 2x for static ip customers. Around 30,000 in >> total. > > > That does seem rather overkill - 3M requests/day is about 30 > requests/second. I would think 1 of those boxes in single-proc mode > would handle it fine. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From hinman at visi.com Sun Feb 20 07:22:17 2005 From: hinman at visi.com (hinman) Date: Sun Feb 20 07:27:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: <4217F002.4010900@askewview.net> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> <20050218215943.GA6125@refried.org> <421671C4.4030503@askewview.net> <4217F002.4010900@askewview.net> Message-ID: <42188F09.1080603@visi.com> "overkill" being the key word. If this box is just doing DNS it would actually be faster to run it as a single processor box. Right now you are dividing the bandwidth to memory by 4. Also you could be spending a fair amount of time moving data between CPU's and you also have the problem that the data you want may be in another CPU's L2 cache. BTW how big are the zone files this DNS server is handling? -- Lee Adam wrote: > Yeah thats what I figured too. I guess since the Unix/linux admin is > used to seeing Sun prices he went overkill heh > > Adam Maloney wrote: > >> On Fri, 18 Feb 2005, Adam wrote: >> >>> Well dns was being run on a bunch of dell blades also doing inbound MX. >>> there are 4 of these machines doing DNS from what i've gathered. 2x >>> for non-static ips and 2x for static ip customers. Around 30,000 in >>> total. >> >> >> >> That does seem rather overkill - 3M requests/day is about 30 >> requests/second. I would think 1 of those boxes in single-proc mode >> would handle it fine. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From adam at whee.org Sun Feb 20 09:41:05 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Sun Feb 20 09:57:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server In-Reply-To: <4217F002.4010900@askewview.net> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> <20050218215943.GA6125@refried.org> <421671C4.4030503@askewview.net> <4217F002.4010900@askewview.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 19 Feb 2005, Adam wrote: > Yeah thats what I figured too. I guess since the Unix/linux admin is used to > seeing Sun prices he went overkill heh must...control...fist...of...death... From salexandre at tuxscout.com Sun Feb 20 16:04:02 2005 From: salexandre at tuxscout.com (Sharif J. Alexandre) Date: Sun Feb 20 16:12:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] TuxScout - Linux/OSS job search Message-ID: <200502201704.02826.salexandre@tuxscout.com> Hi, I'd like to let you know about a new job search site I recently developed that's dedicated to the Linux and Open Source community. The goal of TuxScout is to provide a comprehensive resource to job seekers and employers seeking to scratch their respective Open Source itches. The site includes almost everything you'd expect of a modern system such as a powerful and sophisticated search engine, discussion forums, news feeds, links to career resources, and an updated calendar of Linux/Open Source events. TuxScout is completely free to job seekers and employers which make it a great resource for many small businesses looking to hire top Linux talent. If you have a spare moment, I'd greatly appreciate it if you could check out the site and let me know what you think. ?If you find that it has some value, then please support this effort by spreading the word in any way you can. ?The site is only a few days old but it's already starting to gain some traction. ?With your help, TuxScout has the potential of being an employment hub for the entire Linux/Open Source community. Thanks, Sharif Alexandre http://tuxscout.com From cschumann at twp-llc.com Sun Feb 20 19:08:25 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Sun Feb 20 19:12:20 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] User Authentication In-Reply-To: <200502201800.j1KI0v07011625@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200502210107.j1L17o07012545@alpha.twp-llc.com> Hey all, I'm setting up Cyrus-imapd on my company server. Well, I'm trying to. I've got code built, installed and running, but I can't seem to log in or connect to the server using cyradm. Using imtest (the connection tester) works fine using plaintext authentication, but that's not going to fly. No other authentication method works (even though the server advertises that a few work), and I think that's because none of them are set up, and I don't know where to look for instructions for doing that. ANY pointers MUCH appreciated. Thanks, Chris Schumann From tanner at real-time.com Sun Feb 20 21:26:32 2005 From: tanner at real-time.com (Bob Tanner) Date: Sun Feb 20 21:30:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Large Caching DNS Server (UofM Admins?) In-Reply-To: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> References: <42165EFF.9010809@askewview.net> Message-ID: <200502202126.36133@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> On Friday 18 February 2005 03:32 pm, Adam wrote: > A friend of mine has an interesting situation. Their DNS server gets > around 2 to 3 million dns queries a day its running on a quad xeon > system with 4 gigs of ram. Its running Bind 9.2.2. Are the UofM Admins still on this list, I'm sure the topology handles at least this mean queries and they probably have lots of advise on scalability of DNS. -- Bob Tanner | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com, Minnesota, Linux | Fax : (952)943-8500 Key fingerprint = AB15 0BDF BCDE 4369 5B42 1973 7CF1 A709 2CC1 B288 From wilson at visi.com Mon Feb 21 09:14:54 2005 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Mon Feb 21 09:17:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] [OT] Easy Perl question Message-ID: Hey everybody, I'm a Perl newbie and I've having trouble with the following snippet of code. This code represents a part of what I'm trying to do to modify our district's Request Tracker system. (http://bestpractical.com/rt/) I have this: #!/usr/bin/perl my %watchers; $watchers{"ESC"} = qw/A B C/; $Building = "ESC"; @emails = $watchers{$Building}; foreach $email (@emails) { print "$email\n"; } And I get this: Tim-Wilsons-Computer:~/Desktop wilson$ ./test.pl C I was hoping to get: A B C I'm sure this is something obvious. Any suggestions? -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 blog: http://technosavvy.org/ From strayf at freeshell.org Mon Feb 21 09:44:34 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Mon Feb 21 09:46:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] [OT] Easy Perl question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050221154434.GA13922@crito> On Mon, Feb 21, 2005 at 09:14:54AM -0600, Tim Wilson wrote: > Hey everybody, > > I'm a Perl newbie and I've having trouble with the following snippet of > code. This code represents a part of what I'm trying to do to modify our > district's Request Tracker system. (http://bestpractical.com/rt/) > > I have this: > > #!/usr/bin/perl > > my %watchers; > $watchers{"ESC"} = qw/A B C/; You're assigning a list ("A", "B", "C") to a scalar $watchers{"ESC"} in that line. In this case the scalar takes on the last value in the list: "C". If you want $watchers{"ESC"} to be an array of values, try this instead $watchers{"ESC"} = ["A", "B", "C"]; The square brackets turns the list into a reference to an anonymous array. > $Building = "ESC"; > @emails = $watchers{$Building}; Here you'll want to convert your reference to an array back to a real array, so maybe something like this: @emails = @{$watchers{$Building}}; The @{} dereferences the contents as an array. Array and hash references were the hardest thing for me to learn in perl. -Steve From slushpupie at gmail.com Mon Feb 21 11:53:18 2005 From: slushpupie at gmail.com (slushpupie@gmail.com) Date: Mon Feb 21 11:57:26 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Quality LDAP schema for Mozilla/Outlook address books? In-Reply-To: <420A2273.6030706@veldy.net> References: <420A2273.6030706@veldy.net> Message-ID: The standard schemas that come with openldap work fine for us. Use the InetOrgPerson ObjectClass. On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 08:47:15 -0600, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > I am currently using OpenLDAP 2.2.19 for my mail configuration and I > would like to included a global address book as an option. I recall > attempting this in the past with limitted success. I recall having a > terrible time finding a working mozilla schema and then I also recall > that many attributes were missing from either the Outlook addressbook or > the Mozilla addressbook when I actually was viewing an entry. > > So, can anybody lead me to a quality schema[s] and perhaps a nice HOWTO > that actually works well? > > Thanks in advance. > > -- > Thomas T. Veldhouse > Key Fingerprint: 07C7 BF05 4176 F50B A083 4542 0118 1315 761F D300 > Spammers please contact me at renegade@veldy.net. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Jay Kline http://www.slushpupie.com/ From narshe at gmail.com Mon Feb 21 12:27:16 2005 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Feb 21 12:30:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT Java clasess In-Reply-To: <421A1BC2.7040401@comcast.net> References: <4215515E.7070802@comcast.net> <4a0cafe205021914191d7f3259@mail.gmail.com> <421A1BC2.7040401@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4a0cafe205022110272b743891@mail.gmail.com> Well, this is what I have to say about languages. It all depends on what you're doing. If you're doing linux scripting, I would suggest python. With knowing C/C++, you'll feel right at home. It's a very powerful language, and is very quick also. Google uses it for a lot of their work. Python also works in windows quite nicely. If you're doing web, java would definitely be the way to go. Java has a lot of nice features. Java classes will integrate with jsp pages seamlessely. Jsp has layers seperating business and presentation layers. You can write java applets. I also heard the newer java releases have been written to run a lot faster than before. Java is a very powerful tool. If you have Microsoft servers, C#/asp.net are definitely the way to. It integrates into anything MS related. It really depends on what you're doing I guess. Can you give some more insight into the direction you are heading? ....Have fun with the database administration. -Josh On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:34:58 -0600, Paul Overby wrote: > Good questions. I can get funding from the state to upgrade my skills and > deciding what makes the most sense. Java seems to be growing. I have > good experience with Shell scripting, Perl, C, and assembler. I also did > visual basic for a couple years but my strengths are in Unix and mainframe > environments doing administration and tools type development. > I am also thinking classes in database administration or systems > administration > might be more appropriate. From shanson at cruiskeen.com Mon Feb 21 12:57:52 2005 From: shanson at cruiskeen.com (Steve Hanson) Date: Mon Feb 21 13:02:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] User Authentication In-Reply-To: <200502210107.j1L17o07012545@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200502210107.j1L17o07012545@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <421A2F30.4030903@cruiskeen.com> Chris Schumann wrote: > Hey all, > > I'm setting up Cyrus-imapd on my company server. Well, I'm trying to. I've > got code built, installed and running, but I can't seem to log in or connect > to the server using cyradm. > > Using imtest (the connection tester) works fine using plaintext > authentication, but that's not going to fly. No other authentication method > works (even though the server advertises that a few work), and I think > that's because none of them are set up, and I don't know where to look for > instructions for doing that. > > ANY pointers MUCH appreciated. > Cyrus uses SASL for authentication, so you're really going to have to understand setting up SASL authentication methods. You don't say what exactly you're authenticating against - password database, LDAP, or ??? Anyway, a good starting point is http://www.sendmail.org/~ca/email/cyrus/sysadmin.html http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/download/imapd/faq.html or http://en.tldp.org/HOWTO/Cyrus-IMAP.html (though this one is VERY out of date). > Thanks, > Chris Schumann > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mjn at umn.edu Mon Feb 21 13:31:15 2005 From: mjn at umn.edu (mjn) Date: Mon Feb 21 13:50:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Postfix, DNS, and multiple hosts... Message-ID: We're looking to change how our mail system is set up and the problem we have is that there are two distinct hosts in our domain with two distinct sets of users/lists on them. We have a Groupwise system which contains all of the users and a FC3 system which is going to be running Postfix and handling all of our listserv (mailman and majordomo) traffic. As it is now, we've got Groupwise out front with aliases created for every single list alias (list, list-owner, etc) which redirects e-mail to those objects (2000+) over to the current linux system. Some upgrade problems with Groupwise made us want to ditch this setup as the possability of having to individually modify 2000+ objects was unreasonable to fix a temp problem. Both mailhosts send/receive as mail.domain.edu without issue What we'd like to do is move the linux system out front (adding ClamAV, etc) as most of our mail traffic is from lists and use Postfix for delivery. The thing that I am struggling with--and it may be a terminology problem--is how to setup the environment so that with one primary mailhost and a secondary so that mail which cannot be delivered to the linux box is passed along to Groupwise to look for a recipient without having to manage 1000's of aliases. Anyone have pointers/recommendations on what the best way to accomplish this might be? My searching has turned up little and anything remotely applicable and it is usually the opposite environment (multiple domains on a single host). Any ideas? Thanks. -- _______________________________________________ Mike Neuharth ADCS Technology Specialist http://www.umn.edu/adcs =============================================== E-Mail : mjn@umn.edu Page Mail : 6126486512@page.metrocall.com _______________________________________________ "What is important, it seems to me, is not so much to defend a culture whose existence has never kept a man from going hungry, as to extract, from what is called culture, ideas whose compelling force is identical with that of hunger." -Antonin Artaud From klinej at msoe.edu Mon Feb 21 17:03:06 2005 From: klinej at msoe.edu (Jonathan Kline) Date: Mon Feb 21 17:17:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Postfix, DNS, and multiple hosts... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <421A68AA.3020800@msoe.edu> Using postfix, have the linux box acceptemail for the entire domain, than using transport maps you set the final destination to be the griupwise box. Some down falls to this, unless you setup user maps, the groupwise box will bounce invalid messages, instead of having the postfix box bounce it during delivery. I can help you with this if you need the help. Cheers, ~J mjn wrote: > We're looking to change how our mail system is set up and the problem we > have is that there are two distinct hosts in our domain with two distinct > sets of users/lists on them. We have a Groupwise system which contains all > of the users and a FC3 system which is going to be running Postfix and > handling all of our listserv (mailman and majordomo) traffic. > > As it is now, we've got Groupwise out front with aliases created for every > single list alias (list, list-owner, etc) which redirects e-mail to those > objects (2000+) over to the current linux system. Some upgrade problems > with Groupwise made us want to ditch this setup as the possability of > having to individually modify 2000+ objects was unreasonable to fix a temp > problem. Both mailhosts send/receive as mail.domain.edu without issue > > What we'd like to do is move the linux system out front (adding ClamAV, > etc) as most of our mail traffic is from lists and use Postfix for > delivery. The thing that I am struggling with--and it may be a terminology > problem--is how to setup the environment so that with one primary mailhost > and a secondary so that mail which cannot be delivered to the linux box is > passed along to Groupwise to look for a recipient without having to manage > 1000's of aliases. > > Anyone have pointers/recommendations on what the best way to accomplish > this might be? My searching has turned up little and anything remotely > applicable and it is usually the opposite environment (multiple domains on > a single host). Any ideas? > > Thanks. > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Mike Neuharth > ADCS Technology Specialist > http://www.umn.edu/adcs > =============================================== > E-Mail : mjn@umn.edu > Page Mail : 6126486512@page.metrocall.com > _______________________________________________ > "What is important, it seems to me, is not so much to defend a culture > whose existence has never kept a man from going hungry, as to extract, > from what is called culture, ideas whose compelling force is identical > with that of hunger." -Antonin Artaud > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Jonathan Kline Milwaukee School of Engineering -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050221/14d44be1/signature.pgp From chrome at real-time.com Mon Feb 21 17:28:37 2005 From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom) Date: Mon Feb 21 17:32:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Postfix, DNS, and multiple hosts... In-Reply-To: ; from mjn@umn.edu on Mon, Feb 21, 2005 at 01:31:15PM -0600 References: Message-ID: <20050221172837.E8187@real-time.com> On 02/21 01:31 , mjn wrote: > What we'd like to do is move the linux system out front (adding ClamAV, > etc) as most of our mail traffic is from lists and use Postfix for > delivery. The thing that I am struggling with--and it may be a terminology > problem--is how to setup the environment so that with one primary mailhost > and a secondary so that mail which cannot be delivered to the linux box is > passed along to Groupwise to look for a recipient without having to manage > 1000's of aliases. I've seen a similar situation (due to bureacratic fiefdoms in a large city government); where every one of thousands of users had an alias in a mail proxy, directing their mail to one of a couple of mailservers, based on which departmental fiefdom you belonged to. The possibilities that occur to me are: - use a replicated LDAP server to store your aliases file. Each mailserver keeps a copy of it. If you're married to Groupwise, this would depend on that machine being able to use LDAP for its equivalent of the aliases file. - Set up a couple of Linux mail proxies, and let them do your spam/virus filtering. Copy your aliases file with rsync or the like. This may be the simplest solution, if it's possible to just throw hardware and money at the problem. -- Carl Soderstrom Systems Administrator Real-Time Enterprises www.real-time.com From seg at haxxed.com Mon Feb 21 18:15:38 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Mon Feb 21 18:17:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT Java clasess In-Reply-To: <4a0cafe205022110272b743891@mail.gmail.com> References: <4215515E.7070802@comcast.net> <4a0cafe205021914191d7f3259@mail.gmail.com> <421A1BC2.7040401@comcast.net> <4a0cafe205022110272b743891@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109031338.4829.1.camel@bigtime> > If you're doing web, java would definitely be the way to go. Java has > a lot of nice features. Java classes will integrate with jsp pages > seamlessely. Jsp has layers seperating business and presentation > layers. You can write java applets. I also heard the newer java > releases have been written to run a lot faster than before. Java is a > very powerful tool. If you want to get overpaid, sure. If you want to actually get anything done, PHP5 is a better option... (semi-troll) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050221/e88ca589/attachment.pgp From admin at lctn.org Mon Feb 21 19:49:46 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Mon Feb 21 19:52:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] what to use?? Message-ID: <33268.209.176.212.10.1109036986.squirrel@209.176.212.10> I am running sendmail with MailScanner and Spamassassin to filter spam and virus email. Although this set up seems to be working as expected,some porn is getting through. I have been looking for a way to use a keyword list with my setup to block the offensive content. There are 3rd party solutions, butI have not found docs on the sendmail or spamassassin sites (so far) pertaining to this. Not looking to discuss this on the list, just need to know if there is a link that will show how to incorporate keywords with my existing set up. Raymond From jima at beer.tclug.org Tue Feb 22 07:22:21 2005 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Tue Feb 22 07:27:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] what to use?? In-Reply-To: <33268.209.176.212.10.1109036986.squirrel@209.176.212.10> Message-ID: On Mon, 21 Feb 2005, Raymond Norton wrote: > I am running sendmail with MailScanner and Spamassassin to filter spam and > virus email. Although this set up seems to be working as expected,some > porn is getting through. I have been looking for a way to use a keyword > list with my setup to block the offensive content. There are 3rd party > solutions, butI have not found docs on the sendmail or spamassassin sites > (so far) pertaining to this. Not looking to discuss this on the list, > just need to know if there is a link that will show how to incorporate > keywords with my existing set up. Err, yeah. If you want to match on keywords, just make some custom SpamAssassin rules in your local.cf. This seems to touch lightly upon the process: http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/WritingRules Should give you the functionality you're looking for without glueing any more technology into your setup. Jima From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Tue Feb 22 08:25:43 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Tue Feb 22 08:12:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Even MORE Fun with PSCP Message-ID: <7FD89EB6354EB1145A3EE2F6F0CB9B70@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Here are some readouts from my Linux box. Maybe some of these settings are interfering in one form or another. I still get the exact same error - ssh_init: Connection timed out. I have tried all suggestions. Thank you all for your patience. I really appreciate it. I will get this issue resolved . . . soon! Last night I went through some settings on Linux, and listed anything I found that might be important. In YAST, under a host name and name server configuration menu, it says my host name is LINUX and my domain name is "local". It then lists domain search lists and name servers. All are blank. Current hosts listed in YAST are: IP Add. Name Alias 127.0.0.1 localhost 192.168.1.1 WINBOX Grafxbox 192.168.1.2 LINUX.local LINUX Then it lists some rather odd ip addresses. ::1 localhost ipv6-localhost (somethin, somethin) fe00:0 ff00:0 Putty launches but it still gives a "connection timed out" error. Also, what is an NIS Client? Do I need this? Should I care? I'm technically about THIS close (show fingers) to asking someone to come out and fix the prob for me for a small fee, but I figure I can learn more if I can do it myself. But like I've said before, I've got a ton of important info on my Linux box that's basically stuck there. So several projects are waiting on my lack of networking abilities! Thanks again for all your help, people! Sincerely, Nick Scholtes ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps charities. Make a Difference: Tell car makers to clean up their act - http://www.care2.com/go/z/cleancars From narshe at gmail.com Tue Feb 22 11:05:50 2005 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Tue Feb 22 11:12:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT Java clasess In-Reply-To: <1109031338.4829.1.camel@bigtime> References: <4215515E.7070802@comcast.net> <4a0cafe205021914191d7f3259@mail.gmail.com> <421A1BC2.7040401@comcast.net> <4a0cafe205022110272b743891@mail.gmail.com> <1109031338.4829.1.camel@bigtime> Message-ID: <4a0cafe205022209053a8db0f8@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:15:38 -0600, Callum Lerwick wrote: > If you want to get overpaid, sure. If you want to actually get anything > done, PHP5 is a better option... I would have to completely disagree. PHP5 is a terrible language. Things "sometimes" work, as the devlopers say. I use php, but I've stuck with 4 do to problems. Also, anything you write in php can potentially be viewed via the web. It's an ok language for building web sites fast, but it has many, many drawbacks. I've run into many of them myself. If he's going to start a new language, might as well make it a good one. He knows C++, so classes will be familiar to him in java/C#. PHP5 classes are strange little things.... that once again, "sometimes" behave as desired. -Josh From ge.fischer at gmail.com Tue Feb 22 11:37:26 2005 From: ge.fischer at gmail.com (George Fischer) Date: Tue Feb 22 11:40:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card Message-ID: I finally got a wireless card to work in my thinkpad running Debian. After trying to find a card that used the prism chipset, I gave up and decided to use ndiswrapper. The third card I tried, a netgear wg511, actually works. Now my next problem is that since this card actually has the prism chipset (which does not work with the prism54.org drivers because of the softmac chipset, http://www.prism54.org/supported_cards.php) my hoptplug setup loads the prism54 drivers on insert. (I had to upgrade to 2.6.x to get my cardbus bridge to work). Right now I just $ modprobe -r prism54 $ modprobe ndiswrapper to get it to work, but I'd like the correct driver to load the first time. I have been unable to figure out if there is a way to easily change what hotplug loads. Anyone have any advice? -- George Fischer Minneapolis From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Feb 22 12:45:04 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Tue Feb 22 12:52:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Even MORE Fun with PSCP In-Reply-To: <7FD89EB6354EB1145A3EE2F6F0CB9B70@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> References: <7FD89EB6354EB1145A3EE2F6F0CB9B70@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: <67f3084a05022210452a78d1cf@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:25:43 -0600, Nick wrote: > Current hosts listed in YAST are: > > IP Add. Name Alias > 127.0.0.1 localhost > 192.168.1.1 WINBOX Grafxbox > 192.168.1.2 LINUX.local LINUX Are those names exactly the same way in your /etc/hosts file? I ask because of the uppercase letters. Try converting them to lowercase and see what happens. I've never seen capitol letters in a hosts file... -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From ge.fischer at gmail.com Tue Feb 22 13:14:27 2005 From: ge.fischer at gmail.com (George Fischer) Date: Tue Feb 22 13:17:37 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: References: <914f813c05022210025afb87e8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: George Fischer Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:10:11 -0600 Subject: Re: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card To: "John T. Hoffoss" I could be wrong (it's actually likely), but I don't think this is where I need to be. Since the wg511 is a 32 Cardbus card, my understanding is that the pcmcia stuff doesn't apply so much. Since the cardbus card is treated as a PCI device, I've been trying to get my head around /etc/hotplug/pci.agent and it seemed to me that the device database was built at the time the kernel was compiled (I'm using the stock Debian 2.6.10 kernel for i686). Now I'm looking at /lib/modules/2.6.10-1-686/modules.pcimap and I'm not so sure. If I change the line in modules.pcimap that lists my card prism54 0x00001260 0x00003890 0xffffffff 0xffffffff 0x00000000 0x00000000 0x0 to ndiswrapper 0x00001260 0x00003890 0xffffffff 0xffffffff 0x00000000 0x00000000 0x0 would that fix it? Is that the file that is read during the hotplug event? On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 12:02:12 -0600, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:37:26 -0600, George Fischer wrote: > > Right now I just > > $ modprobe -r prism54 > > $ modprobe ndiswrapper > > to get it to work, but I'd like the correct driver to load the first time. > > > > I have been unable to figure out if there is a way to easily change > > what hotplug loads. Anyone have any advice? > > Not sure, but for Gentoo there's a file, /etc/pcmcia/default[s?] that > lists each card ID and the module it will probe. Check there, or the > other miscellaneous configuration files associated with pcmcia-cs. > Once you find the entry for your card (lspci may help with this) you > should be able to change prism54 to ndiswrapper. > -- George Fischer Minneapolis -- George Fischer Minneapolis From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Feb 22 13:12:33 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Feb 22 13:20:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502221912.j1MJCXr09990@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Sharp Zaurus SL-6000L For Sale Hi, I'm selling my just-like-new Sharp Zaurus SL-6000L (Linux-based PDA). I purchased this in November and have used it very little since. Just not enough time. My loss is your gain - I bought tons of extras like: Mini-USB to USB adapters (mount a USB2 hard drive!), extra lithuim ion battery (retail $75), 1GB 60X SecureDigital (SD) card (retail $75), Pocketop IR keyboard (retail $90), and screen covers (retail $10). I have everything it originally came with plus what is outlined above. You will not be disappointed with the condition. Retails for $700 new, price is $550 for everything...must sell. Pick up only...I live/work in Saint Louis Park. Seller Email address: sk3tch at sk3tch dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From austad at signal15.com Tue Feb 22 14:15:04 2005 From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad) Date: Tue Feb 22 14:32:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] script to cleanup firewall rules Message-ID: <20050222201504.GA34550@tt.signal15.com> Does anyone know of a perl script that I can use to parse a Cisco PIX config file and have it suggest the creation of object groups and possibly summarize the ruleset? I've got a bunch of PIX configs that need to be cleaned up. Some are using conduits, some are using acl's. If nothing exists like this, does anyone have any suggestions for writing one in perl? I can't really think of a good way to go about it. For example, if I had this in the config: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.128 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2 It would suggest replacement with: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.2 Or if I had: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.1 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.2 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.3 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.4 It would suggest making an object-group for the 2.2.2.x addresses and replacing the rules with: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 object-group mygroup ~jay From josh at joshwelch.com Tue Feb 22 14:59:08 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Tue Feb 22 15:02:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] script to cleanup firewall rules In-Reply-To: <20050222201504.GA34550@tt.signal15.com> References: <20050222201504.GA34550@tt.signal15.com> Message-ID: <20050222145908.31lk3xfxa8008ks0@moose.joshwelch.com> Quoting Jay Austad : > Does anyone know of a perl script that I can use to parse a Cisco PIX > config file and have it suggest the creation of object groups and > possibly summarize the ruleset? > > I've got a bunch of PIX configs that need to be cleaned up. Some are > using conduits, some are using acl's. > > If nothing exists like this, does anyone have any suggestions for > writing one in perl? I can't really think of a good way to go about > it. For example, if I had this in the config: > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2 > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.128 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2 > > It would suggest replacement with: > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.2 > > Or if I had: > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.1 > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.2 > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.3 > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.4 > > It would suggest making an object-group for the 2.2.2.x addresses and > replacing the rules with: > access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 object-group mygroup > > ~jay > Cisco has a output interpreter that you can use for this type of thing. You do need a CCO login to get at it: https://www.cisco.com/cgi-bin/Support/OutputInterpreter/home.pl Josh From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Tue Feb 22 15:11:46 2005 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Tue Feb 22 15:17:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] script to cleanup firewall rules Message-ID: Jay, I was going to suggest loading the rules into a data structure that suggests a solution, but after thinking about that, I don't see how to work it either. So...load the rules in a dumb data structure (an array of arrays) and create subs that look for the common bits in each rule (the host part in example 1 and the rule in example 2) and consolidate them there. Perhaps prepend each sub array in the data structure with an undef value and fill that value with the row number of the consolidated rule: @rules = ( [undef, qw(access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2)], [undef, qw(access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.128 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2)], ); becomes: @rules = ( [2, qw(access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2)], [2, qw(access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.128 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2)], [undef, qw(access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.2)], ); The object-group stuff may need to be handled differently. Doh! Since Josh pointed out that Cisco already has this, I'd see what they have. :-) Troy >>> Jay Austad 02/22/05 2:15 PM >>> Does anyone know of a perl script that I can use to parse a Cisco PIX config file and have it suggest the creation of object groups and possibly summarize the ruleset? I've got a bunch of PIX configs that need to be cleaned up. Some are using conduits, some are using acl's. If nothing exists like this, does anyone have any suggestions for writing one in perl? I can't really think of a good way to go about it. For example, if I had this in the config: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.128 255.255.255.128 host 2.2.2.2 It would suggest replacement with: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.2 Or if I had: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.1 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.2 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.3 access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 host 2.2.2.4 It would suggest making an object-group for the 2.2.2.x addresses and replacing the rules with: access-list outside_in permit ip 1.1.1.0 255.255.255.0 object-group mygroup From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Feb 22 16:12:02 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Feb 22 16:15:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502222212.j1MMC2K13308@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: 1U HP 15in LCD Keyboard Trackball Selling a HP TFT5600 RKM 15" LCD and keyboard/trackball integrated in a 1U package. Screen has some problems with black, but it is usable. If you know LCDs you could fix this. $75 firm. Pick up only, I live/work in Saint Louis Park. Search google for TFT5600 and you will find more info from HP's website! Thanks! Seller Email address: sk3tch at sk3tch dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From andyzib at gmail.com Tue Feb 22 16:45:05 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Tue Feb 22 16:50:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Unless I'm misreading the prism54.org page, the wg511 is a supported card. There is just a disclaimer about the soft MAC thing. The trick with prism54 cards is that you have to setup hotplug to load the card's firmware onto the cards RAM. Don't know if it was a price point issue or what, but the memory in the prism54 cards only hold information while they have power. If you haven't tried this yet, you don't know for sure the issue you're running into is the SoftMAC issue. I tossed up what I did to get my prism54 card working in the prism54.org forums. http://www.prism54.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=677 I would look at the configuration on my Linux box, but it went up in smoke so...I can't. :) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From ge.fischer at gmail.com Tue Feb 22 17:17:53 2005 From: ge.fischer at gmail.com (George Fischer) Date: Tue Feb 22 17:22:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'm sure the prism54 driver won't work. The card (which is in the slot at the moment, so I can't check) is a ver 4 of the wg511. When I first plugged it in and the prism54 module was loaded, I tried my best to get it to work. I tried several different revisions of the firmware (linked from prism54.org) and it was no go. I'm pretty sure I found a message somewhere from someone else who never got ver 4 of the card to work either. The lesson I've learned from trying six different cards is that there are no prism chipset cards that work anymore. (which is why, I assume, the website hasn't seen much activity since June of last year) But that's fine, since the ndiswrapper works great. I'd have to use non-Free software either way. The only thing I want is the ndiswrapper module to be loaded on insert, instead of the prism54 module. On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:45:05 -0600, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > Unless I'm misreading the prism54.org page, the wg511 is a supported > card. There is just a disclaimer about the soft MAC thing. > > The trick with prism54 cards is that you have to setup hotplug to load > the card's firmware onto the cards RAM. Don't know if it was a price > point issue or what, but the memory in the prism54 cards only hold > information while they have power. If you haven't tried this yet, you > don't know for sure the issue you're running into is the SoftMAC > issue. > > I tossed up what I did to get my prism54 card working in the prism54.org forums. > http://www.prism54.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=677 > > I would look at the configuration on my Linux box, but it went up in > smoke so...I can't. :) > > -- > Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us > A password is like your underwear; Change it > frequently, don't share it with others, and > don't ask to borrow someone else's. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- George Fischer Minneapolis From jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org Wed Feb 23 08:36:42 2005 From: jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org (Joseph Key) Date: Wed Feb 23 08:42:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000201c519b5$17c30940$0439a8c0@Kurama> -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of George Fischer Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 5:18 PM Cc: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: Re: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card I'm sure the prism54 driver won't work. The card (which is in the slot at the moment, so I can't check) is a ver 4 of the wg511. When I first plugged it in and the prism54 module was loaded, I tried my best to get it to work. I tried several different revisions of the firmware (linked from prism54.org) and it was no go. I'm pretty sure I found a message somewhere from someone else who never got ver 4 of the card to work either. The lesson I've learned from trying six different cards is that there are no prism chipset cards that work anymore. (which is why, I assume, the website hasn't seen much activity since June of last year) But that's fine, since the ndiswrapper works great. I'd have to use non-Free software either way. The only thing I want is the ndiswrapper module to be loaded on insert, instead of the prism54 module. -----End Original Message----- If you add the prism54 driver to the hotplug blacklist it should stop trying to load the prism54 driver so you can load the correct driver. Joseph Key From ge.fischer at gmail.com Wed Feb 23 09:25:55 2005 From: ge.fischer at gmail.com (George Fischer) Date: Wed Feb 23 09:32:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: <000201c519b5$17c30940$0439a8c0@Kurama> References: <000201c519b5$17c30940$0439a8c0@Kurama> Message-ID: I hadn't thought of that. I did modify the line in modules.pcimap, and it loads the ndiswrapper instead of the prism54 module. So I'm happy. I don't really have a better understanding of how all these programs interact to load the kernel modules, but it works, so I can live with it. On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:36:42 -0600, Joseph Key wrote: > > > -----Original Message----- > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of George Fischer > Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 5:18 PM > Cc: tclug-list@mn-linux.org > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card > > I'm sure the prism54 driver won't work. The card (which is in the > slot at the moment, so I can't check) is a ver 4 of the wg511. When I > first plugged it in and the prism54 module was loaded, I tried my best > to get it to work. I tried several different revisions of the > firmware (linked from prism54.org) and it was no go. I'm pretty sure > I found a message somewhere from someone else who never got ver 4 of > the card to work either. The lesson I've learned from trying six > different cards is that there are no prism chipset cards that work > anymore. (which is why, I assume, the website hasn't seen much > activity since June of last year) > > But that's fine, since the ndiswrapper works great. I'd have to use > non-Free software either way. The only thing I want is the > ndiswrapper module to be loaded on insert, instead of the prism54 > module. > -----End Original Message----- > > If you add the prism54 driver to the hotplug blacklist it should stop trying > to load the prism54 driver so you can load the correct driver. > > Joseph Key > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- George Fischer Minneapolis From tanner at real-time.com Wed Feb 23 09:50:53 2005 From: tanner at real-time.com (Bob Tanner) Date: Wed Feb 23 09:55:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] DFS and Linux Message-ID: <200502230950.53826@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> Anyone worked with the DFS clients for Linux? Did you find an open source version or use commercial version? Did you find -any- version what works on any other distro besides RH AS/EL/ES? How well do they work with Win32 servers? Curious minds want to know. :-) -- Bob Tanner | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com, Minnesota, Linux | Fax : (952)943-8500 Key fingerprint = AB15 0BDF BCDE 4369 5B42 1973 7CF1 A709 2CC1 B288 From sk3tch at sk3tch.net Wed Feb 23 15:39:30 2005 From: sk3tch at sk3tch.net (sk3tch@sk3tch.net) Date: Wed Feb 23 15:47:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: Price drop! Will sell for $500. C'mon guys...this is a beautiful PDA, in mint condition. Full-color VGA resolution screen, 802.11b wireless, runs Linux (2.4 kernel), has SD slot (I am including a 1GB SD card) and CF slot, and comes with tons of extras! Unit itself retailed for $700...accessories put the whole package's value over $1000. Thanks!!! -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org on behalf of TCLUG Classifieds Sent: Tue 2/22/2005 1:12 PM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Sharp Zaurus SL-6000L For Sale Hi, I'm selling my just-like-new Sharp Zaurus SL-6000L (Linux-based PDA). I purchased this in November and have used it very little since. Just not enough time. My loss is your gain - I bought tons of extras like: Mini-USB to USB adapters (mount a USB2 hard drive!), extra lithuim ion battery (retail $75), 1GB 60X SecureDigital (SD) card (retail $75), Pocketop IR keyboard (retail $90), and screen covers (retail $10). I have everything it originally came with plus what is outlined above. You will not be disappointed with the condition. Retails for $700 new, price is $550 for everything...must sell. Pick up only...I live/work in Saint Louis Park. Seller Email address: sk3tch at sk3tch dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Wed Feb 23 15:53:15 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Wed Feb 23 16:12:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 sk3tch@sk3tch.net wrote: > Price drop! Will sell for $500. > > C'mon guys...this is a beautiful PDA, in mint condition. Full-color VGA > resolution screen, 802.11b wireless, runs Linux (2.4 kernel), has SD > slot (I am including a 1GB SD card) and CF slot, and comes with tons of > extras! Cue Sk3tch doing his best Dan Akroid impression, ala Bass-o-matic. From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Thu Feb 24 08:28:55 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Thu Feb 24 08:17:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP (Is there an end in sight??) Message-ID: <45E953F6CA91E084193C6720B24A6312@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Hello all, Okay. I suspect I've narrowed down the problem. As per someone's suggestion I typed /etc/init.d/sshd start The result was: "Starting ssh daemon Could not load host keys Could not load host keys /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key Could not load host keys /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key Disabling protocol version 1: Could not load host key Disabling protocol version 2: Could not load host key Sshd: no hostkeys available - exiting" Does this mean anything? Take care, Nick Scholtes ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps charities. Make a Difference: Tell car makers to clean up their act - http://www.care2.com/go/z/cleancars From jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org Thu Feb 24 09:09:07 2005 From: jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org (Joseph Key) Date: Thu Feb 24 09:12:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP (Is there an end in sight??) In-Reply-To: <45E953F6CA91E084193C6720B24A6312@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: <000201c51a82$c9c02290$0439a8c0@Kurama> -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Nick Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2005 8:29 AM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP (Is there an end in sight??) Hello all, Okay. I suspect I've narrowed down the problem. As per someone's suggestion I typed /etc/init.d/sshd start The result was: "Starting ssh daemon Could not load host keys Could not load host keys /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key Could not load host keys /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key Disabling protocol version 1: Could not load host key Disabling protocol version 2: Could not load host key Sshd: no hostkeys available - exiting" Does this mean anything? Take care, Nick Scholtes "Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim." ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps charities. Make a Difference: Tell car makers to clean up their act - http://www.care2.com/go/z/cleancars _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list ----End Original Message----- Slackware has this in the /etc/rc.d/rc.sshd script to create the ssh keys if they are not present. Try running each one separately and see if a key is generated. # Create host keys if needed. if [ ! -r /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa1 -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key -N '' fi if [ ! -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t dsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key -N '' fi if [ ! -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key -N '' fi Running them separately might work or highlight what is wrong. Joseph Key From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Thu Feb 24 09:17:59 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Thu Feb 24 09:23:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP (Is there an end in sight??) In-Reply-To: <45E953F6CA91E084193C6720B24A6312@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> References: <45E953F6CA91E084193C6720B24A6312@bellsoffreedom.animail.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 24 Feb 2005, Nick wrote: > Okay. I suspect I've narrowed down the problem. As per someone's > suggestion I typed /etc/init.d/sshd start > > The result was: > > "Starting ssh daemon > Could not load host keys > Could not load host keys /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key > Could not load host keys /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key > Disabling protocol version 1: Could not load host key > Disabling protocol version 2: Could not load host key > Sshd: no hostkeys available - exiting" > > Does this mean anything? Yes. run this command: man sshd Look for the section that reads something like this: /etc/ssh2/hostkey Contains the private part of the host key. This file is normally created automatically by "make install", but can also be created manually using ssh-keygen2(1). This file should only be owned by root, readable only by root, and not accessible to others. /etc/ssh2/hostkey.pub Contains the public part of the host key. This file is normally created automatically by "make install", but can also be created manually. This file should be world-readable but writable only by root. Its contents should match the private part. You may have a different sshd than I have, but there will be some sort of keygen program. If that program is called "ssh-keygen2" you would next type this command: man ssh-keygen2 and follow the instructions. I'm no expert on this stuff, but someone on this list surely knows exactly what you need to do. Mike From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Feb 24 21:14:59 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Thu Feb 24 21:17:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502250314.j1P3Exr15717@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Laptop Gateway Solo 9100 & Docking Station $45.00 Pentium 166mmx 96MB Ram 2gig HD FDD boots CDROM works, does not boot 14" diaginal display 1024x768 24bit windows 2 USB ports 2 PCMCIA slots Printer, VGA Serial, IR, Sound, game Keyboard or mouse port Issue; the front HD cover is broken but with the unit. Docking Station FDD Mouse, kbd, serial, printer,vga, game 3Com EtherLink III ISA (3c509b-TPC) Seller Email address: smac at visi dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From josh at joshwelch.com Fri Feb 25 08:28:57 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Fri Feb 25 08:33:00 2005 Subject: Fwd: Re: [tclug-list] Digi Acceleport Xp Message-ID: <20050225082857.crgx5wd8a9s0scg4@moose.joshwelch.com> In case you were really interested in the plight of my Digi multiport card, Digi support was able to provide me with a new beta of their driver. The tcl based gui admin tools does not build, but other than that it seems to be working just fine now. So my new Debian faxserver is up and running. Yippie. Josh From larry.pint at ntuminc.com Fri Feb 25 09:32:34 2005 From: larry.pint at ntuminc.com (Larry Pint) Date: Fri Feb 25 09:41:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux Message-ID: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> I'm running Redhat Linux 9.1. I am mounting a shared drive on my Windows XP Pro machine using a "mount -t smbfs" command. I'm then using tar (with compression) to try to backup the Linux system to that hard disk on my computer. Tar fails when the file size of the tar file exceeds 2 Gbytes. This is a 200 Gb drive with at least 90 Gb available. Backup Exec is also backing up to this drive and its files are 4 Gb to 20 Gb in size, so I don't think it's a limit from the Windows side. Does anybody have any ideas as to why I'm hitting this limitation? Does "mount" limit you to 2 Gb file sizes? I doubt tar has that limitation. (Does it?) The mount command is: mount -t smbfs -o username=xxxxxxxxx,password=xxxxxxxxx,rw,debug=4,fmask=777,dmask=777 //larryxp/lrp_removable /mnt/lrp the tar command is: tar --create --verbose --file=/mnt/lrp/veritas/ntux.tar --gzip --total --exclude-from=etc/ntuxexcl * Both are being run from the root directory (and with a root login). These commands are in an executable script file that gets run by cron every weeknight. I am currently only backing up selected directories to keep the tar file size below the 2 Gb limit and that is working correctly. TIA Larry Pint National Truck Underwriting Managers, Inc. From strayf at freeshell.org Fri Feb 25 10:21:37 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Fri Feb 25 10:28:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux In-Reply-To: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> References: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: <20050225162137.GA12550@callisto> On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 09:32:34AM -0600, Larry Pint wrote: > Does anybody have any ideas as to why I'm hitting this limitation? Does > "mount" limit you to 2 Gb file sizes? I doubt tar has that limitation. > (Does it?) tar used to have a 2GB limit, but gnu tar on redhat shouldn't. Could it be a limitation of the gzip compression? -Steve From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Fri Feb 25 10:49:49 2005 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Fri Feb 25 10:53:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux In-Reply-To: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> References: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: <20050225104949.A19735@baker.space.umn.edu> On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 09:32:34AM -0600, Larry Pint wrote: > Does anybody have any ideas as to why I'm hitting this limitation? Does > "mount" limit you to 2 Gb file sizes? I doubt tar has that limitation. > (Does it?) What kernel are you running? Older kernels (2.4.xx and earlier?) had this limitation, but I would have guessed that the default kernel for Red Hat 9.1 would have been a 2.6 kernel. Also, what filesystem are you running on the XP box? XP defaults to ntfs, but if you are using vfat, it has the 2GB limit as well. -- Jim Crumley | From bellsoffreedom at animail.net Fri Feb 25 12:05:53 2005 From: bellsoffreedom at animail.net (Nick) Date: Fri Feb 25 11:53:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP Needs To Be Shot . . . Message-ID: Here is the original message. I tried this last night. Typed: /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa1 -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key -N '' fi It worked! Linux responded by saying the key was saved. However, PSCP still doesn't work. Same "Connection timed out" error. And these other two commands below did not work. /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t dsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key -N '' fi /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key -N '' fi Both came back with the response "Failed. Passphrase too short. Have 2 bytes, need > 4" Any ideas? I just started reading an exam cram book for LCP's, but it doesn't cover much about networking. Nick ************** Original Message ******************* Slackware has this in the /etc/rc.d/rc.sshd script to create the ssh keys if they are not present. Try running each one separately and see if a key is generated. # Create host keys if needed. if [ ! -r /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa1 -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key -N '' fi if [ ! -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t dsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key -N '' fi if [ ! -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key -N '' fi Running them separately might work or highlight what is wrong. ?Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.? ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps charities. Make a Difference: Tell car makers to clean up their act - http://www.care2.com/go/z/cleancars From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Fri Feb 25 12:07:06 2005 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Fri Feb 25 12:13:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP Needs To Be Shot . . . Message-ID: Nick, Do not include the: fi at the end of the command. In the example it is used on a separate line to end an 'if' statement. Your command is trying to use it as a passphrase, which is something you don't want on the host keys. Troy >>> "Nick" 02/25/05 12:05 PM >>> Here is the original message. I tried this last night. Typed: /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa1 -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key -N '' fi It worked! Linux responded by saying the key was saved. However, PSCP still doesn't work. Same "Connection timed out" error. And these other two commands below did not work. /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t dsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key -N '' fi /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key -N '' fi Both came back with the response "Failed. Passphrase too short. Have 2 bytes, need > 4" Any ideas? I just started reading an exam cram book for LCP's, but it doesn't cover much about networking. Nick ************** Original Message ******************* Slackware has this in the /etc/rc.d/rc.sshd script to create the ssh keys if they are not present. Try running each one separately and see if a key is generated. # Create host keys if needed. if [ ! -r /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa1 -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key -N '' fi if [ ! -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t dsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key -N '' fi if [ ! -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key ]; then /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key -N '' fi Running them separately might work or highlight what is wrong. "Take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim." ~ Elie Wiesel View my blog & artwork! *********************** http://artandprose.blogspot.com/ http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps charities. Make a Difference: Tell car makers to clean up their act - http://www.care2.com/go/z/cleancars _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com Fri Feb 25 12:08:36 2005 From: jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Fri Feb 25 12:13:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux In-Reply-To: <20050225104949.A19735@baker.space.umn.edu> References: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> <20050225104949.A19735@baker.space.umn.edu> Message-ID: There is no such animal as RedHat 9.1 RedHat 9.0 shipped with the 2.4.21 kernel (patched to hell as part of the RedHat Way(tm)) Also, google is your friend: There's a limitation in the smbfs driver in that kernel that doesn't allow files larger than 2 GB. http://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2003-July/070033.html -- jeremy On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:49:49 -0600, Jim Crumley wrote: > On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 09:32:34AM -0600, Larry Pint wrote: > > Does anybody have any ideas as to why I'm hitting this limitation? Does > > "mount" limit you to 2 Gb file sizes? I doubt tar has that limitation. > > (Does it?) > > What kernel are you running? Older kernels (2.4.xx and > earlier?) had this limitation, but I would have guessed that the > default kernel for Red Hat 9.1 would have been a 2.6 kernel. > > Also, what filesystem are you running on the XP box? XP defaults > to ntfs, but if you are using vfat, it has the 2GB limit as well. > > -- > Jim Crumley | > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From strayf at freeshell.org Fri Feb 25 12:19:24 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Fri Feb 25 12:23:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] PSCP Needs To Be Shot . . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050225181924.GA18314@callisto> On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 12:05:53PM -0600, Nick wrote: > Here is the original message. I tried this last night. > > Typed: > /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa1 -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_key -N '' fi > > It worked! Linux responded by saying the key was saved. However, > PSCP still doesn't work. Same "Connection timed out" error. And > these other two commands below did not work. Were you able to start the ssh daemon successfully after generating the key? Were you able to get an ssh connection on the localhost? Hopefully you didn't include the 'fi' at the end of the line there in your actual command. That's part of the shell script, not an ssh-keygen option. If you did, that might explain why the other two didn't work. > > /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t dsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_dsa_key -N '' fi > > /usr/bin/ssh-keygen -t rsa -f /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key -N '' fi > > Both came back with the response "Failed. Passphrase too short. Have > 2 bytes, need > 4" > > Any ideas? I just started reading an exam cram book for LCP's, but > it doesn't cover much about networking. > > Nick > From ringert at consumption.net Fri Feb 25 12:26:49 2005 From: ringert at consumption.net (Torleiv Flatebo Ringer) Date: Fri Feb 25 12:29:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux In-Reply-To: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> References: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: Is there a reason why you need to create a file? You can use tar as a "pass-through" to create a mirror. Or you could use rsync. bash$ cd /dirtobackup bash$ tar c * | tar x -C /mnt/lrp This will copy files from your linux box to your windows machine, preserving time stamps. Use rsync: bash$ cd / bash$ rsync -rltv /dirtobackup/ /mnt/lrp If you use rsync, you can run this as many times as you like, and it will compare the source with the target. Note that you will not be able to back up all files when the system is running. (/var/run, /lib, etc.) torleiv what you said > I'm running Redhat Linux 9.1. I am mounting a shared drive on my > Windows XP Pro machine using a "mount -t smbfs" command. I'm then using > tar (with compression) to try to backup the Linux system to that hard > disk on my computer. Tar fails when the file size of the tar file > exceeds 2 Gbytes. This is a 200 Gb drive with at least 90 Gb > available. Backup Exec is also backing up to this drive and its files > are 4 Gb to 20 Gb in size, so I don't think it's a limit from the > Windows side. > > Does anybody have any ideas as to why I'm hitting this limitation? Does > "mount" limit you to 2 Gb file sizes? I doubt tar has that limitation. > (Does it?) > > The mount command is: > > mount -t smbfs -o > username=xxxxxxxxx,password=xxxxxxxxx,rw,debug=4,fmask=777,dmask=777 > //larryxp/lrp_removable /mnt/lrp > > the tar command is: > > tar --create --verbose --file=/mnt/lrp/veritas/ntux.tar --gzip --total > --exclude-from=etc/ntuxexcl * > > Both are being run from the root directory (and with a root login). > These commands are in an executable script file that gets run by cron > every weeknight. I am currently only backing up selected directories to > keep the tar file size below the 2 Gb limit and that is working correctly. > > TIA > > Larry Pint > National Truck Underwriting Managers, Inc. > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- One of the symptoms of an approaching nervous breakdown is the belief that one's work is terribly important. Don't be so confident - you are not that great. From andyzib at gmail.com Fri Feb 25 13:33:07 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Fri Feb 25 13:38:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux In-Reply-To: References: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: I do tar backups in a similar fashion and haven't hit problems, buuuuut... My tar backups go into a temporary loctation on the local drive, and then I copy them to the Windows server using smbclient, then delete the tar files on the local drive. It's all scripted. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From seg at haxxed.com Fri Feb 25 14:40:15 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Fri Feb 25 14:43:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux In-Reply-To: References: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> <20050225104949.A19735@baker.space.umn.edu> Message-ID: <1109364015.17534.20.camel@bigtime> > Also, google is your friend: There's a limitation in the smbfs driver > in that kernel that doesn't allow files larger than 2 GB. Heh, beat me to it. You could try patching your kernel with the new CIFS driver: http://linux-cifs.samba.org/ Another alternative is to use netcat, or perhaps rsync as someone else suggested. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050225/72b3a009/attachment.pgp From seg at haxxed.com Fri Feb 25 16:05:23 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Fri Feb 25 16:08:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1109369123.17534.25.camel@bigtime> Beware, I can't for the life of me find where this is listed, but most new Prism54 cards are "SoftMAC", which means they don't have a microcontroller onboard anymore and handle things using the main CPU. This isn't such a bad thing, but there's no Linux support for these cards yet. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050225/42cca1db/attachment.pgp From ge.fischer at gmail.com Fri Feb 25 16:41:24 2005 From: ge.fischer at gmail.com (George Fischer) Date: Fri Feb 25 16:48:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: <1109369123.17534.25.camel@bigtime> References: <1109369123.17534.25.camel@bigtime> Message-ID: I actually mentioned that in my original question. The Prism54 direvers don't work, but ndiswrapper works fine. It's a kernel module that actually uses the WinXP drivers to interface with the card. Now that I've gotten it to load ndiswrapper on insert, and I have set up ifscheme, I'm hopping from hotspot to hotspot around Minneapolis with no troubles whatsoever. On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:05:23 -0600, Callum Lerwick wrote: > Beware, I can't for the life of me find where this is listed, but most > new Prism54 cards are "SoftMAC", which means they don't have a > microcontroller onboard anymore and handle things using the main CPU. > This isn't such a bad thing, but there's no Linux support for these > cards yet. > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > -- George Fischer Minneapolis From tclug at beitsahour.net Fri Feb 25 17:07:55 2005 From: tclug at beitsahour.net (Munir Nassar) Date: Fri Feb 25 17:13:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mounting windows drives under Linux In-Reply-To: References: <421F4512.3030305@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: <421FAFCB.6040306@beitsahour.net> Torleiv Flatebo Ringer wrote: > Is there a reason why you need to create a file? You can use tar as a > "pass-through" to create a mirror. Or you could use rsync. > > bash$ cd /dirtobackup > bash$ tar c * | tar x -C /mnt/lrp > > This will copy files from your linux box to your windows machine, > preserving time stamps. > > Use rsync: > > bash$ cd / > bash$ rsync -rltv /dirtobackup/ /mnt/lrp > > If you use rsync, you can run this as many times as you like, and it > will compare the source with the target. > > Note that you will not be able to back up all files when the system is > running. (/var/run, /lib, etc.) there is nothing on a linux system that would prevent you (unlike windows). so to say that you not be able to is incorrect. as to if you should... well, that is a different beast, but linux being what it is it can be done without too much harm. In fact i have many times done a tar over netcat to dupe systems while they are running, yes some daemons complain at the next power on for the new system and if not using dhcp then an IP conflict occurs, but otherwise the duping process works like a charm. the only caveat is that you will want to --exclude /proc and create a new /proc on the target system. -- Munir Nassar From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Fri Feb 25 22:37:47 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (SDALAN04@smumn.edu) Date: Fri Feb 25 22:43:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Any Gentoo+chroot users online. Message-ID: <20050226043747250144dc28@mail.smumn.edu> Any Gentoo+chroot users online, I would like some light assistance on chroot managebility :) If so, can I pm you on MSN Messenger...? DAve From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Sat Feb 26 15:15:28 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Sat Feb 26 15:23:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wrong kernel module loaded for wireless card In-Reply-To: References: <1109369123.17534.25.camel@bigtime> Message-ID: <914f813c05022613154e32059f@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:41:24 -0600, George Fischer wrote: > I actually mentioned that in my original question. The Prism54 > direvers don't work, but ndiswrapper works fine. It's a kernel module > that actually uses the WinXP drivers to interface with the card. > > Now that I've gotten it to load ndiswrapper on insert, and I have set > up ifscheme, I'm hopping from hotspot to hotspot around Minneapolis > with no troubles whatsoever. That's great! Are you able to put it in monitor mode and sniff traffic and whatnot, as well? As for your "I'm still not sure how this all works" comment, neither am I, but from what I can gather, your system detects the hardware, probes the device looking for manufacturer/device/model IDs, which end up being one (or several) of the numbers that followed the line you modified to get your card working. By modifying the module name to ndiswrapper, you told the kernel to use a different driver to handle that hardware. But this is guessing/assumption, and quite obviously not anywhere near specific, but it's the general concept, as I understand it. From sfertch at gmail.com Sat Feb 26 15:41:18 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Sat Feb 26 15:48:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Any Gentoo+chroot users online. In-Reply-To: <20050226043747250144dc28@mail.smumn.edu> References: <20050226043747250144dc28@mail.smumn.edu> Message-ID: <67f3084a050226134115beb050@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 22:37:47 -0600, SDALAN04@smumn.edu wrote: > Any Gentoo+chroot users online, I would like some light assistance on chroot managebility :) If so, can I pm you on MSN Messenger...? Can't help you really, but in things like this, at times it's better to discuss it over the mailing list. Things get archived, and become searchable therefore benefitting others in the future if they decide to do a search. Also, it helps you in that there are more people involved in the discussion, as well as you and others can pick up little tips/tricks from said discussion. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From pclinux at charter.net Sat Feb 26 15:54:42 2005 From: pclinux at charter.net (Carl Zeilon) Date: Sat Feb 26 15:58:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Monitor out of sync In-Reply-To: <3rr769$p1b2le@mxip12a.cluster1.charter.net> References: <3rr769$p1b2le@mxip12a.cluster1.charter.net> Message-ID: <6.2.0.14.0.20050226154150.02a32480@pop.charter.net> I recently changed monitors on my son's SUSE 9.2 box. I went from a 19" to a 15". Upon boot-up the monitor just flashed all it's lights indicating that it was unhappy with the current resolution or refresh rate. This made sense to me & I modified the X Window files for the new monitor accordingly. Now the monitor blinks it's lights at boot time until X Windows starts, then it's fine. Where are the files that control the monitor in text mode? What do I need to change? Thanks. From jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org Sat Feb 26 16:28:33 2005 From: jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org (Joseph Key) Date: Sat Feb 26 16:33:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Monitor out of sync In-Reply-To: <6.2.0.14.0.20050226154150.02a32480@pop.charter.net> Message-ID: <000001c51c52$820d1a80$0439a8c0@Kurama> -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Carl Zeilon Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2005 3:55 PM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [tclug-list] Monitor out of sync I recently changed monitors on my son's SUSE 9.2 box. I went from a 19" to a 15". Upon boot-up the monitor just flashed all it's lights indicating that it was unhappy with the current resolution or refresh rate. This made sense to me & I modified the X Window files for the new monitor accordingly. Now the monitor blinks it's lights at boot time until X Windows starts, then it's fine. Where are the files that control the monitor in text mode? What do I need to change? Thanks. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -----End Original Message----- Before the change did you get a penguin in the upper left of the screen. If you did that means the frame buffer device was used for the screen output. You will need to change the fbdev setting in lilo.conf or grub to match the new monitor size. Joseph Key From cschumann at twp-llc.com Sat Feb 26 17:46:13 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Sat Feb 26 17:48:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: Any Gentoo+chroot users online. In-Reply-To: <200502261801.j1QI1c07002136@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200502262345.j1QNjD07002812@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 22:37:47 -0600 > From: SDALAN04@smumn.edu > Any Gentoo+chroot users online, I would like some light > assistance on chroot managebility :) If so, can I pm you on > MSN Messenger...? You might try the gentoo IRC chatrooms: http://www.gentoo.org/main/en/irc.xml From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Feb 27 17:14:41 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Feb 27 17:18:25 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200502272314.j1RNEfX20315@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: Subject: Lead UNIX Admin I was contacted by a recruiter about a job opportunity for a Lead Unix Adminstrator. The position requires leading a team of 5 administrators in addition to performing hands-on UNIX admin tasks. This is all I know. If you are interested let me know and I will put you in touch. I have known this recruiter for 10 years; she found me the job that helped me relocate back to Minneapolis from New Hampshire. -Jeff Seller Email address: jnmnus at yahoo dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Sun Feb 27 20:29:21 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (SDALAN04) Date: Sun Feb 27 20:33:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. Message-ID: <200502280229217301450d2a@mail.smumn.edu> First and foremost, I would like to thank those who always find time to help myself and others! Second, I am in need of help to emerge Bind (in chroot) on a Gentoo box. I have created the user and home directories for ---> "named". An example is /home/named, within I have created the needed directories in order for bind to work. My next step was to run emerge -p -v bind with the result of [ebuild N ] net-dns/bind-9.2.2-r3. I am confused with the [ ebuild N ]...? I have no USE variables since it is just a plain server. Then I copied and viewed the bind-9.2.2-r3 file, here is were I need your help. The file can be accessed at the link below. http://www.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/net-dns/bind/bind-9.2.2-r3.ebuild Where neccessarily do I need to edit this to have a successful emerge. Again, I have (example)* /home/named. Sorry for my poor grammar but I am really tired. Any ideas? Thanks ya'll, David From pclinux at charter.net Sun Feb 27 20:33:49 2005 From: pclinux at charter.net (Carl Zeilon) Date: Sun Feb 27 20:38:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Monitor out of sync In-Reply-To: <3rr0ks$jdvcvh@mxip05a.cluster1.charter.net> References: <3rr0ks$jdvcvh@mxip05a.cluster1.charter.net> Message-ID: <6.2.0.14.0.20050227202634.03351b80@pop.charter.net> At 12:02 PM 2/27/2005, you wrote: >Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:28:33 -0600 >From: "Joseph Key" >Subject: RE: [tclug-list] Monitor out of sync > >[mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Carl Zeilon >Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2005 3:55 PM >To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org >Subject: [tclug-list] Monitor out of sync > >I recently changed monitors on my son's SUSE 9.2 box. I went from a 19" to >a 15". Upon boot-up the monitor just flashed all it's lights indicating >that it was unhappy with the current resolution or refresh rate. This made >sense to me & I modified the X Window files for the new monitor >accordingly. Now the monitor blinks it's lights at boot time until X >Windows starts, then it's fine. Where are the files that control the >monitor in text mode? What do I need to change? Thanks. > >-----End Original Message----- > >Before the change did you get a penguin in the upper left of the screen. If >you did that means the frame buffer device was used for the screen output. >You will need to change the fbdev setting in lilo.conf or grub to match the >new monitor size. > >Joseph Key Many thanks, I modified the vga=xxxxx line in grub & it works great. :-) Carl From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Mon Feb 28 01:36:05 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (David Alanis) Date: Mon Feb 28 01:38:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. Message-ID: <200502280736058001451143@mail.smumn.edu> I would like to install bind, but I want it to be in chroot (jail) I have looked around and I have not found any information regarding chroot+bind within a Gentoo system. I mentioned that I created a unique folder and user for named. To have the merge work properly in chroot I have to edit the file that the link takes you to. Any ideas, help....! This is to a mysterious reply I got from someone who said they did not understand! Dave From scotjenkins at gmail.com Mon Feb 28 01:52:35 2005 From: scotjenkins at gmail.com (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Feb 28 01:58:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. In-Reply-To: <200502280736058001451143@mail.smumn.edu> References: <200502280736058001451143@mail.smumn.edu> Message-ID: On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:36:05 -0600, David Alanis wrote: > I would like to install bind, but I want it to be in chroot (jail) I have looked around and I have not found any information regarding chroot+bind within a Gentoo system. I mentioned that I created a unique folder and user for named. To have the merge work properly in chroot I have to edit the file that the link takes you to. Any ideas, help....! RTFM: http://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-HOWTO/Chroot-BIND-HOWTO.html google is you friend: search string "bind chroot linux howto" Try it sometime. Gentoo can't be all that different from other Linux distros. The above doc should be all that you need. Scot From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Mon Feb 28 01:58:55 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (David Alanis) Date: Mon Feb 28 02:08:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. Message-ID: <200502280758551501451261@mail.smumn.edu> Thanks Scott, trust me I have dug deep, but maybe not deep enough. The material you have given me (link) was my first reference to initiate my project of getting bind installed in chroot. My problem is getting help to edit this file to emerge bind within chroot. http://www.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/net-dns/bind/bind-9.2.2-r3.ebuild Dave >RTFM: >http://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-HOWTO/Chroot-BIND-HOWTO.html > >google is you friend: >search string "bind chroot linux howto" > >Try it sometime. > >Gentoo can't be all that different from other Linux distros. The >above doc should be all that you need. > >Scot From kevin.lombardo at gmail.com Mon Feb 28 14:21:17 2005 From: kevin.lombardo at gmail.com (Kevin Lombardo) Date: Mon Feb 28 14:23:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ps output Message-ID: hello- i have a RHE system, kernel 2.4.9. when i run ps on it, i see a number of processes with the STIME of 2004. that's fine except the last reboot command indicates the machine was restarted on Feb 1 of this year. why are these processes listed with STIME from last year? also, i read once that each thread in linux gets a PID. when i run ps on this machine, i see many java processes, all seem to be threads from the same JVM. however, when looking at a Fedora FC3 2.6 .10.x, it seems that all the java threads under one JVM share the same PID. is that something that changed in the 2.6 kernel? or am i missing something? thanks kevin From rclark at lakesplus.com Mon Feb 28 15:02:15 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Mon Feb 28 15:03:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Uptime and power supply Message-ID: I had to physically move my office on Saturday ... then on Sunday I moved my server as well ... having to shut it down after 275 days of uptime *sniff* *sniff* Odd issue though ... I opened the system and blew it out with a compressed cleaner ... then ... when I went to reboot ... the system would not start back up ... pressing the power button on occasion resulted in CPU fan spinning a time or two ... but then nothing ... no startup. I found it rather odd that it ran for 275 days ... then would not restart. I did check all the power connectors, etc. - none of that made a difference. I then just replaced the power supply and it fired up right away. Thoughts ... comments on what might have caused it to die/not restart? System: PII 450 MHz, basic cheap case, etc. Had a Deere power supply (nothing fancy I know) Randy From sfertch at gmail.com Mon Feb 28 15:17:34 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Feb 28 15:23:37 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] OT: Uptime and power supply In-Reply-To: <67f3084a05022813135877f650@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a05022813135877f650@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a050228131731ba72a2@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:02:15 -0600, Randy Clarksean wrote: > I found it rather odd that it ran for 275 days ... then would not restart. > I did check all the power connectors, etc. - none of that made a difference. > I then just replaced the power supply and it fired up right away. > > Thoughts ... comments on what might have caused it to die/not restart? > It takes less power to keep a system running than it does to power one up. Your P/S was going out, it just hadn't reached the point of failure on a running system. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Mon Feb 28 17:07:39 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Feb 28 17:17:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. In-Reply-To: <200502280758551501451261@mail.smumn.edu> References: <200502280758551501451261@mail.smumn.edu> Message-ID: <914f813c05022815075c36f538@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:36:05 -0600, David Alanis wrote: > I would like to install bind, but I want it to be in chroot (jail) I have looked around and I have not found any information regarding chroot+bind within a Gentoo system. I mentioned that I created a unique folder and user for named. To have the merge work properly in chroot I have to edit the file that the link takes you to. Any ideas, help....! > > This is to a mysterious reply I got from someone who said they did not understand! This may or may not have been the "mysterious reply" Dave refers to, but this was my reply from earlier, for the list. On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:32:50 -0600, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > The "N" signified the fact that it is a New package (I think that's > what it stands for...) This is normal, and the fact that `emerge bind > -pv` results in just that listing means that nothing else will be > installed, as far as dependencies. Now remove the "p" (Pretend) from > that command, and it will install. As for chroot setup, I am not > certain. I would consult some of the Gentoo docs, forums (search for > "chroot bind" to see if someone posted instructions on setting all of > this up) or #gentoo-help on irc.freenode.net > > Good luck! So then this comes down the pipe: On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:58:55 -0600, David Alanis wrote: > Thanks Scott, trust me I have dug deep, but maybe not deep enough. The material you have given me (link) was my first reference to initiate my project of getting bind installed in chroot. My problem is getting help to edit this file to emerge bind within chroot. > http://www.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/net-dns/bind/bind-9.2.2-r3.ebuild Unless I'm reading things wrong, you want to install Bind and run it chroot. The problem you are having is installing Bind itself. Two things: you do not need to install 9.2.2-r3 from CVS. You need to run "emerge sync" to synchronize your ports tree, then execute `emerge bind`, like I said already, then make your configuration changes (i.e. /etc/conf.d/bind) so it runs chroot. This is how you install stuff in Gentoo. If you didn't understand this, how on earth did you get Gentoo installed in the first place? From smac at visi.com Mon Feb 28 17:17:07 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Mon Feb 28 17:18:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Uptime and power supply In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4223A673.8050807@visi.com> I also had a PS that ran off and on for over 7 years, I finally went to ATX and got rid of the AT case and PS. When it comes to PS you never know how long they will last. Sam. Randy Clarksean wrote: >I had to physically move my office on Saturday ... then on Sunday I moved my >server as well ... having to shut it down after 275 days of uptime *sniff* >*sniff* > >Odd issue though ... I opened the system and blew it out with a compressed >cleaner ... then ... when I went to reboot ... the system would not start >back up ... pressing the power button on occasion resulted in CPU fan >spinning a time or two ... but then nothing ... no startup. > >I found it rather odd that it ran for 275 days ... then would not restart. >I did check all the power connectors, etc. - none of that made a difference. >I then just replaced the power supply and it fired up right away. > >Thoughts ... comments on what might have caused it to die/not restart? > >System: PII 450 MHz, basic cheap case, etc. Had a Deere power supply >(nothing fancy I know) > >Randy > > > > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.0 - Release Date: 2/25/2005 From kfuchs at winternet.com Mon Feb 28 20:55:30 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Mon Feb 28 20:58:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Uptime and power supply In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200503010255.j212tUM21048@ecstasy1.winternet.com> >I then just replaced the power supply and it fired up right away. >Thoughts ... comments on what might have caused it to die/not restart? >System: PII 450 MHz, basic cheap case, etc. Had a Deere power supply >(nothing fancy I know) Your PS was getting old. A PS will more likely die when under maximum stress - booting up. Plus your system didn't under go this boot up stress for 275 days. :) Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Mon Feb 28 22:54:45 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (David Alanis) Date: Mon Feb 28 22:58:41 2005 Subject: cc: Re: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. Message-ID: <200503010454457801453c65@mail.smumn.edu> Ok John, I have mainly wanting to emerge Bind within chroot and thats what the configuration file linky is for :) Thank you, I will have to do it this way! BTW, I am the Gentoo Master Instaler. Dave On Monday, February 28, 2005 5:07 PM, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > >Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 17:07:39 -0600 >From: John T. Hoffoss >To: David Alanis >Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. > >On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:36:05 -0600, David Alanis wrote: >> I would like to install bind, but I want it to be in chroot (jail) I have looked around and I have not found any information regarding chroot+bind within a Gentoo system. I mentioned that I created a unique folder and user for named. To have the merge work properly in chroot I have to edit the file that the link takes you to. Any ideas, help....! >> >> This is to a mysterious reply I got from someone who said they did not understand! > >This may or may not have been the "mysterious reply" Dave refers to, >but this was my reply from earlier, for the list. > >On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:32:50 -0600, John T. Hoffoss > wrote: >> The "N" signified the fact that it is a New package (I think that's >> what it stands for...) This is normal, and the fact that `emerge bind >> -pv` results in just that listing means that nothing else will be >> installed, as far as dependencies. Now remove the "p" (Pretend) from >> that command, and it will install. As for chroot setup, I am not >> certain. I would consult some of the Gentoo docs, forums (search for >> "chroot bind" to see if someone posted instructions on setting all of >> this up) or #gentoo-help on irc.freenode.net >> >> Good luck! > >So then this comes down the pipe: >On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:58:55 -0600, David Alanis wrote: >> Thanks Scott, trust me I have dug deep, but maybe not deep enough. The material you have given me (link) was my first reference to initiate my project of getting bind installed in chroot. My problem is getting help to edit this file to emerge bind within chroot. >> http://www.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/net-dns/bind/bind-9.2.2-r3.ebuild > >Unless I'm reading things wrong, you want to install Bind and run it >chroot. The problem you are having is installing Bind itself. Two >things: you do not need to install 9.2.2-r3 from CVS. You need to run >"emerge sync" to synchronize your ports tree, then execute `emerge >bind`, like I said already, then make your configuration changes (i.e. >/etc/conf.d/bind) so it runs chroot. > >This is how you install stuff in Gentoo. If you didn't understand >this, how on earth did you get Gentoo installed in the first place? > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list A project is a problem scheduled for a solution. J.M. Juran : "Cuanta estupidez en tan poco cerebro!" From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Mon Feb 28 20:02:24 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (David Alanis) Date: Tue Mar 1 22:14:55 2005 Subject: bcc: Re: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. Message-ID: <20050301020224630145397c@mail.smumn.edu> Ok Jeff, I have mainly wanting to emerge Bind within chroot and thats what the configuration file linky is for :) Thank you, I will have to do it this way! Dave On Monday, February 28, 2005 5:07 PM, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > >Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 17:07:39 -0600 >From: John T. Hoffoss >To: David Alanis >Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Chroot + Bind 9 (Gentoo) help. > >On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:36:05 -0600, David Alanis wrote: >> I would like to install bind, but I want it to be in chroot (jail) I have looked around and I have not found any information regarding chroot+bind within a Gentoo system. I mentioned that I created a unique folder and user for named. To have the merge work properly in chroot I have to edit the file that the link takes you to. Any ideas, help....! >> >> This is to a mysterious reply I got from someone who said they did not understand! > >This may or may not have been the "mysterious reply" Dave refers to, >but this was my reply from earlier, for the list. > >On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:32:50 -0600, John T. Hoffoss > wrote: >> The "N" signified the fact that it is a New package (I think that's >> what it stands for...) This is normal, and the fact that `emerge bind >> -pv` results in just that listing means that nothing else will be >> installed, as far as dependencies. Now remove the "p" (Pretend) from >> that command, and it will install. As for chroot setup, I am not >> certain. I would consult some of the Gentoo docs, forums (search for >> "chroot bind" to see if someone posted instructions on setting all of >> this up) or #gentoo-help on irc.freenode.net >> >> Good luck! > >So then this comes down the pipe: >On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:58:55 -0600, David Alanis wrote: >> Thanks Scott, trust me I have dug deep, but maybe not deep enough. The material you have given me (link) was my first reference to initiate my project of getting bind installed in chroot. My problem is getting help to edit this file to emerge bind within chroot. >> http://www.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/net-dns/bind/bind-9.2.2-r3.ebuild > >Unless I'm reading things wrong, you want to install Bind and run it >chroot. The problem you are having is installing Bind itself. Two >things: you do not need to install 9.2.2-r3 from CVS. You need to run >"emerge sync" to synchronize your ports tree, then execute `emerge >bind`, like I said already, then make your configuration changes (i.e. >/etc/conf.d/bind) so it runs chroot. > >This is how you install stuff in Gentoo. If you didn't understand >this, how on earth did you get Gentoo installed in the first place? A project is a problem scheduled for a solution. J.M. Juran : "Cuanta estupidez en tan poco cerebro!" From seg at haxxed.com Mon Feb 28 21:07:47 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Thu Mar 3 03:24:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ps output In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1109646467.21145.11.camel@bigtime> > also, i read once that each thread in linux gets a PID. when i run ps > on this machine, i see many java processes, all seem to be threads > from the same JVM. however, when looking at a Fedora FC3 2.6 .10.x, it > seems that all the java threads under one JVM share the same PID. is > that something that changed in the 2.6 kernel? or am i missing > something? ps itself changed. ps and top stopped listing threads by default back around RH7 or 8. Really annoying, because it doesn't seem to add up the CPU time used by threads. Sometimes your CPU will be pegged at 100% and your system will be chugging, but 'top' doesn't show anything using CPU time because its some random subthread. I can never remember what the arcane option to turn on thread listing is for 'top'. That, and the move to NPTL, in I believe RH9, completely changed the way threads are done. This affected Java in particular. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050228/0b7c9ca3/attachment.pgp