From bhartm at visi.com Mon Aug 1 04:20:53 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Mon Aug 1 04:18:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: <914f813c05080101407861cf13@mail.gmail.com> References: <200507070041.j670fF615996@crusader.real-time.com> <200507070458.j674wco07913@ecstasy1.winternet.com> <42CD5211.5050002@visi.com> <42CF32B9.2010305@visi.com> <914f813c05080101407861cf13@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42EDE975.5040309@visi.com> The Sun Ultra One that I advertised is indeed sold and out of my hands and purview. If you search through past posts, you will find that one of the interested parties values privacy, while emailing the list instead of me. ?-) Whether or not he/she picked it up is something I will not get into commenting on at this time. ps. Aimee Mann was great at the Zoo last night. John T. Hoffoss wrote: > Did K** pick this up then? > -John > From sfertch at gmail.com Mon Aug 1 08:24:33 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Aug 1 08:26:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar Message-ID: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> I'm working on getting a backup script to work that uses gnu tar and the --exclude option. Here's my script: mt -f /dev/st0 rewind cd / tar cpf /dev/st0 --directory / --exclude /proc --exclude /mnt . mt -f /dev/st0 rewind tar tvf /dev/st0 >> /home/shawnf/backup.log mt -f /dev/st0 offline When looking at the tvf output, I'm seeing the excluded filesystems still within the tarball: drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-05-01 21:59:52 ./mnt/ drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2002-03-16 01:34:43 ./mnt/hd/ drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2002-03-16 01:34:43 ./mnt/floppy/ -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/igmp -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rt_acct -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rt_cache -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/route -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/arp -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/tr_rif -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/psched -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/dev_mcast -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/wireless dr-xr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/drivers/ -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/softnet_stat -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/dev dr-xr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rpc/ -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rpc/nfs -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/netlink dr-xr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/stat/ -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/stat/rt_cache -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/stat/arp_cache -r-------- root/root 671027200 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/kcore I cut the list of /proc down to show some of what's in there. Layout of the box is I have multiple disks across to volume groups. The root filesystem is outside of LVM control. All filesystems are reiserfs (on Slackware), except for the couple of RHEL boxes that are ext3. Ideally, I'd like a script portable between all version of Linux. Any better suggestions than what I'm trying to do? I've looked at a few different scripts, but this one seems to be more of what I'm looking for. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From josh at joshwelch.com Mon Aug 1 09:26:29 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Aug 1 09:30:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> Shawn Fertch wrote: > I'm working on getting a backup script to work that uses gnu tar and > the --exclude option. > > Here's my script: > > mt -f /dev/st0 rewind > cd / > tar cpf /dev/st0 --directory / --exclude /proc --exclude /mnt . > mt -f /dev/st0 rewind > tar tvf /dev/st0 >> /home/shawnf/backup.log > mt -f /dev/st0 offline > > > When looking at the tvf output, I'm seeing the excluded filesystems > still within the tarball: > > drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-05-01 21:59:52 ./mnt/ > drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2002-03-16 01:34:43 ./mnt/hd/ > drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2002-03-16 01:34:43 ./mnt/floppy/ > > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/igmp > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rt_acct > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rt_cache > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/route > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/arp > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/tr_rif > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/psched > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/dev_mcast > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/wireless > dr-xr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/drivers/ > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/softnet_stat > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/dev > dr-xr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rpc/ > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/rpc/nfs > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/netlink > dr-xr-xr-x root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/stat/ > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/stat/rt_cache > -r--r--r-- root/root 0 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/net/stat/arp_cache > -r-------- root/root 671027200 2005-07-28 10:53:50 ./proc/kcore > > I cut the list of /proc down to show some of what's in there. > > Layout of the box is I have multiple disks across to volume groups. > The root filesystem is outside of LVM control. All filesystems are > reiserfs (on Slackware), except for the couple of RHEL boxes that are > ext3. > > Ideally, I'd like a script portable between all version of Linux. > > Any better suggestions than what I'm trying to do? I've looked at a > few different scripts, but this one seems to be more of what I'm > looking for. > I've had lousy luck using the exclude option from the command line. I have had luck with creating a file containing a list of directories to exclude and using the exclude-from option. This works for me: tar -cvf /backup/backup.tar / --exclude-from /backup/exclude.txt exclude.txt looks like this: /backup /dev /proc /sys If you really wanted to make it a single script, you could do something that echos lines out to a file before running the tar command, kind of a hack but the best answer that I have. Josh From bgilbertson at stonel.com Mon Aug 1 12:57:19 2005 From: bgilbertson at stonel.com (Bob Gilbertson) Date: Mon Aug 1 12:58:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Novell vs SCO case Message-ID: <42EE627F.5020505@stonel.com> Some developments in Novell vs. SCO case. Appears Novell may be tiring of the game and is going to whup this pup. Hope it happens, it's about time. http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1841965,00.asp Bob From lists at turbobit.com Mon Aug 1 18:07:47 2005 From: lists at turbobit.com (Karl Bongers) Date: Mon Aug 1 22:24:24 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050801230747.GB17614@dad1> On Mon, Aug 01, 2005 at 08:24:33AM -0500, Shawn Fertch wrote: > I'm working on getting a backup script to work that uses gnu tar and > the --exclude option. > > Here's my script: > > mt -f /dev/st0 rewind > cd / > tar cpf /dev/st0 --directory / --exclude /proc --exclude /mnt . Man page shows --exclude=PATTERN (with the equal sign). > mt -f /dev/st0 rewind > tar tvf /dev/st0 >> /home/shawnf/backup.log > mt -f /dev/st0 offline > > When looking at the tvf output, I'm seeing the excluded filesystems > still within the tarball: > From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Aug 2 05:37:53 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Tue Aug 2 05:38:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> On 8/1/05, Josh Welch wrote: > I've had lousy luck using the exclude option from the command line. I > have had luck with creating a file containing a list of directories to > exclude and using the exclude-from option. This works for me: > > tar -cvf /backup/backup.tar / --exclude-from /backup/exclude.txt > > exclude.txt looks like this: > > /backup > /dev > /proc > /sys > > If you really wanted to make it a single script, you could do something > that echos lines out to a file before running the tar command, kind of a > hack but the best answer that I have. Thanks, Josh. I tried that with the -X option instead of typing out the full --exclude-from, but it's still picking up the excluded directories. I'll give it a go with fully specifying the --exclude-from option. Karl Bongers wrote: >Man page shows --exclude=PATTERN (with the equal sign). Karl, I'm not sure what version of man pages you're looking at. I'm looking at the man pages on both Slackware 10.1 and RHELv3 systems with the following specifications: --exclude FILE exclude file FILE -X, --exclude-from FILE exclude files listed in FILE When I was googling for information on how I wanted the tar exclusions to work, I did see what you're referencing. However, in cross comparison to the man pages it didn't match up. I will admit that I did give it a try, just in case, but it did not work correctly. I was hoping to be able to use the exclude option instead of having to specify which filesystems to backup. Excluding seems like a more simplistic path, as well as being able to restore more in a bare-metal recovery procedure from tape instead of having to rely upon incrementals to do so. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Aug 2 09:57:58 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Tue Aug 2 09:58:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > I'm looking at the man pages on both Slackware 10.1 and RHELv3 systems > with the following specifications: > > --exclude FILE > exclude file FILE > -X, --exclude-from FILE > exclude files listed in FILE Thus "FILE" is a plain text file containing a list of directories or files that are not to be backed up. I think that is different from your original interpretation. Mike From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Aug 2 10:35:41 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Tue Aug 2 10:36:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> On 8/2/05, Mike Miller wrote: > On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > > > I'm looking at the man pages on both Slackware 10.1 and RHELv3 systems > > with the following specifications: > > > > --exclude FILE > > exclude file FILE > > -X, --exclude-from FILE > > exclude files listed in FILE > > Thus "FILE" is a plain text file containing a list of directories or files > that are not to be backed up. I think that is different from your > original interpretation. > No, there is a distinct difference between the man pages I am looking at, and what was mentioned by Karl: What Karl mentioned: Man page shows --exclude=PATTERN (with the equal sign). What I originally stated that is within the man pages: --exclude FILE exclude file FILE -X, --exclude-from FILE exclude files listed in FILE The distinct difference is the context in which they are used. The one Karl mentioned would be used in a way similar to: tar cpf /dev/st0 --directory / --exclude=/proc . (please note the equal sign and not white space between the option and it's parameter). I am aware of the list of directories and files as quoted in the man pages on the "-X" or "--exclude-from" statement where it reads a text file of things to exclude. So far, neither of these seem to be working. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From tclug at natecarlson.com Tue Aug 2 12:13:28 2005 From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Tue Aug 2 12:14:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > tar cpf /dev/st0 --directory / --exclude=/proc . (please note the equal > sign and not white space between the option and it's parameter). > I am aware of the list of directories and files as quoted in the man > pages on the "-X" or "--exclude-from" statement where it reads a text > file of things to exclude. Debian man pages: --exclude=PATTERN exclude files matching PATTERN -X, --exclude-from=FILE exclude files matching patterns listed in FILE Apparently, that's where it's coming from. Have you tried specifying your exclude's first thing? IE, tar --exclude /proc -cpf /dev/st0 --directory / . I just tried: tar --exclude /proc -czvf blah.tar /proc /boot and it excluded /proc successfully. (Debian's tar, again.) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | nate carlson | natecars@natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com | | depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981 | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Aug 2 12:42:49 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Tue Aug 2 12:44:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a0508021042751faccc@mail.gmail.com> On 8/2/05, Nate Carlson wrote: > On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > > tar cpf /dev/st0 --directory / --exclude=/proc . (please note the equal > > sign and not white space between the option and it's parameter). > > > I am aware of the list of directories and files as quoted in the man > > pages on the "-X" or "--exclude-from" statement where it reads a text > > file of things to exclude. > > Debian man pages: > > --exclude=PATTERN > exclude files matching PATTERN > -X, --exclude-from=FILE > exclude files matching patterns listed in FILE > > Apparently, that's where it's coming from. > > Have you tried specifying your exclude's first thing? > > IE, > > tar --exclude /proc -cpf /dev/st0 --directory / . > > I just tried: > tar --exclude /proc -czvf blah.tar /proc /boot > > and it excluded /proc successfully. (Debian's tar, again.) That was it. I had them out of order, and it seems to be working at the moment. It doesn't make any sense as to why the syntax is different between the man pages. It's all gnu tar isn't it? It doesn't make any sense as to how Debian wrote the man pages the way they did, it's very confusing to say the least. Thanks Nate and everyone else for the help! -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Aug 2 14:17:44 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Tue Aug 2 14:19:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: > On 8/2/05, Mike Miller wrote: >> On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Shawn Fertch wrote: >> >>> I'm looking at the man pages on both Slackware 10.1 and RHELv3 systems >>> with the following specifications: >>> >>> --exclude FILE >>> exclude file FILE >>> -X, --exclude-from FILE >>> exclude files listed in FILE >> >> Thus "FILE" is a plain text file containing a list of directories or files >> that are not to be backed up. I think that is different from your >> original interpretation. > > No, there is a distinct difference between the man pages I am looking > at, and what was mentioned by Karl: I see ... in the bit I quoted above, "FILE" is used in two different ways. I agree that some of the differences between distros don't make sense. Is Slackware all GNU or are some of the utilities modified? Mike From david.johnson at usfamily.net Tue Aug 2 16:18:40 2005 From: david.johnson at usfamily.net (David Johnson) Date: Tue Aug 2 16:20:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar In-Reply-To: <1123017227.11933.0.camel@speedy.home> References: <1123017227.11933.0.camel@speedy.home> Message-ID: <1123017520.11933.3.camel@speedy.home> Change your exclude file to contain: /backup/* /dev/* /proc/* /sys/* > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 05:37:53 -0500 > From: Shawn Fertch > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery > planning) > To: TCLUG Mailing List > Message-ID: <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > On 8/1/05, Josh Welch wrote: > > I've had lousy luck using the exclude option from the command line. I > > have had luck with creating a file containing a list of directories to > > exclude and using the exclude-from option. This works for me: > > > > tar -cvf /backup/backup.tar / --exclude-from /backup/exclude.txt > > > > exclude.txt looks like this: > > > > /backup > > /dev > > /proc > > /sys > > > > If you really wanted to make it a single script, you could do something > > that echos lines out to a file before running the tar command, kind of a > > hack but the best answer that I have. > > > Thanks, Josh. I tried that with the -X option instead of typing out > the full --exclude-from, but it's still picking up the excluded > directories. I'll give it a go with fully specifying the > --exclude-from option. --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! --- From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Tue Aug 2 19:14:27 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Tue Aug 2 19:14:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0508021042751faccc@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0508021042751faccc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1123028067.29192.28.camel@3po.thodt.net> On Tue, 2005-08-02 at 12:42 -0500, Shawn Fertch wrote: > On 8/2/05, Nate Carlson wrote: > > Debian man pages: > > > > --exclude=PATTERN > > exclude files matching PATTERN > > -X, --exclude-from=FILE > > exclude files matching patterns listed in FILE > > > > Apparently, that's where it's coming from. > > > > Have you tried specifying your exclude's first thing? > > > > IE, > > > > tar --exclude /proc -cpf /dev/st0 --directory / . > > > > I just tried: > > tar --exclude /proc -czvf blah.tar /proc /boot > > > > and it excluded /proc successfully. (Debian's tar, again.) > > That was it. I had them out of order, and it seems to be working at the moment. Heh, it's worth noting that we're talking about at least two, and possibly three different upstream versions of tar here, and each of them probably has distro-specific patches added on to that. For instance, the Debian man page is different because of their patch (see http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=146196), which in part makes the man page consistent with the info page, apparently. (The info page for the version of tar on Slackware 10.1 shows the syntax that Nate mentions above). I'm running Debian testing, and I've got tar 1.14 (er, 1.14-2 in Debian-speak), and that's probably the same thing that's in Sarge (the current stable release). A search at rpmfind.net indicates that RHEL comes with tar 1.13.25-13, while the Slackware website says 10.1 has tar 1.15.1. I actually tried a command similar to Shawn's original tar command (with parameters in basically the same sequence), and it seems to work okay: [mike@3po][~]$ find foo foo foo/bar foo/baz foo/ook foo/var foo/usr foo/proc foo/sys foo/mnt [mike@3po][~]$ tar cvf foo.tar --directory foo --exclude proc --exclude mnt . ./ ./bar/ ./baz/ ./ook/ ./var/ ./usr/ ./sys/ So maybe this is just a tar 1.13.x issue? Glancing through Debian's patch, I didn't see anything changing the actual exclude code, just the manual page. Conversely, I suppose tar 1.15.x could have gotten more picky... -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050802/00176b83/attachment.pgp From ron.e.nelson at gmail.com Wed Aug 3 14:54:31 2005 From: ron.e.nelson at gmail.com (Ron Nelson) Date: Wed Aug 3 14:54:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) In-Reply-To: <1123028067.29192.28.camel@3po.thodt.net> References: <67f3084a0508010624371e23f2@mail.gmail.com> <42EE3115.1040706@joshwelch.com> <67f3084a050802033718b2abdf@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0508020835b1084b6@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0508021042751faccc@mail.gmail.com> <1123028067.29192.28.camel@3po.thodt.net> Message-ID: What I usually do is take advantage of cpio's ability to output in tar format [--format=tar]. I then use find (and grep if needed) to send my list of files through standard-in to cpio. That works better for me, anyways... Ron On 8/2/05, Mike Hicks wrote: > Heh, it's worth noting that we're talking about at least two, and > possibly three different upstream versions of tar here, and each of them > probably has distro-specific patches added on to that. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Wed Aug 3 15:50:05 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Wed Aug 3 15:52:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508032050.j73Ko5n03764@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Dell 1400SC with 1.1 GB RAM Lightly used Dell 1400 SC server. CPU: PIII 1.13 GHz/512K Cache - dual capable RAM: 1.1 GB (512+512+128) PC133 ECC Two PCI busses, 64 bits/66 MHz IO: Dual Channel Ultra160 SCSI DISK: Fujitsu U160 18 GB/8MB Cache CDROM: 24x (2x writable) NETWORK: Intel 10/100 onboard VIDEO: ATI RAGE 4 MB onboard A great little server! Asking $175 Seller Email address: florin+tclug at iucha dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From admin at lctn.org Wed Aug 3 15:54:09 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Wed Aug 3 15:54:50 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ifconfig Message-ID: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> I am having trouble using ifconfig to set my network adapter to 100/Full Duplex. I am using Fedora 3 if that makes a difference. Anyone have the proper syntax? From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Wed Aug 3 16:24:25 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Wed Aug 3 16:24:52 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <9d6c82530508031424eeb701f@mail.gmail.com> References: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <9d6c82530508031424eeb701f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> Are you using ethtool or mii-tool to make the settings? I think the standard is now ethtool. On Debian, I just add a 'up mii-diag -F 100baseTx-FD eth0' line after the gateway. Otherwise find the command and create a startup script. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050803/81b00ca0/attachment.htm From admin at lctn.org Wed Aug 3 16:46:33 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Wed Aug 3 16:46:49 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> References: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <9d6c82530508031424eeb701f@mail.gmail.com> <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> > Are you using ethtool or mii-tool to make the settings? > I tried using ethtool,but get the folowing: ethtool -s eth0 speed 100 duplex full autoneg off Cannot get current device settings: Operation not supported not setting speed not setting duplex not setting autoneg From bhartm at visi.com Wed Aug 3 17:23:12 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Wed Aug 3 17:06:48 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> References: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <9d6c82530508031424eeb701f@mail.gmail.com> <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> Message-ID: <42F143D0.7060908@visi.com> Not all chips/drivers are mii compliant. Even newer ones. You should be able to get info on yours from scyld.com. Raymond Norton wrote: >>Are you using ethtool or mii-tool to make the settings? >> >> >> > > >I tried using ethtool,but get the folowing: > >ethtool -s eth0 speed 100 duplex full autoneg off >Cannot get current device settings: Operation not supported > not setting speed > not setting duplex > not setting autoneg > > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > From admin at lctn.org Wed Aug 3 18:21:36 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Wed Aug 3 18:22:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <200508032147.j73LlhCN021456@trojan.software.umn.edu> References: <200508032147.j73LlhCN021456@trojan.software.umn.edu> Message-ID: <44729.209.176.212.10.1123111296.squirrel@209.176.212.10> > That should be automatic. If it isn't, then you may have cable issues, or > only a 10Mbit hub/switch. > I have the attached cisco switch set to 100/Full. This brought throughput to a drizzle. I may need to replace the cable or card. From kc0iog at gmail.com Wed Aug 3 18:30:01 2005 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Wed Aug 3 18:30:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <44729.209.176.212.10.1123111296.squirrel@209.176.212.10> References: <200508032147.j73LlhCN021456@trojan.software.umn.edu> <44729.209.176.212.10.1123111296.squirrel@209.176.212.10> Message-ID: <2c6699da05080316307986d4d9@mail.gmail.com> On 8/3/05, Raymond Norton wrote: > I have the attached cisco switch set to 100/Full. This brought throughput > to a drizzle. I may need to replace the cable or card. What kind of NIC is it? I've seen certain 3c905B's exhibit this behavior. My solution was to replace it with either a 3c905C or an Intel. -Brian From bhartm at visi.com Wed Aug 3 19:32:06 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Wed Aug 3 19:14:50 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <2c6699da05080316307986d4d9@mail.gmail.com> References: <200508032147.j73LlhCN021456@trojan.software.umn.edu> <44729.209.176.212.10.1123111296.squirrel@209.176.212.10> <2c6699da05080316307986d4d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F16206.5030607@visi.com> Certain versions of Intel's e100/1000 and the first Broadcom gig if's gave me great hassles while connecting to supposedly auto-negotiating 3com switches and Extreme Alpines. Gotcha's from CompaQ/HP. That's how I got into this mii-diag thing-- hacking ZENworks imaging CDs and PXE. These if's were mii compatible, thankfully. Brian Wall wrote: >On 8/3/05, Raymond Norton wrote: > > > >>I have the attached cisco switch set to 100/Full. This brought throughput >>to a drizzle. I may need to replace the cable or card. >> >> > >What kind of NIC is it? I've seen certain 3c905B's exhibit this >behavior. My solution was to replace it with either a 3c905C or an >Intel. > >-Brian > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > From sfertch at gmail.com Wed Aug 3 19:39:56 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Wed Aug 3 19:40:50 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> References: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <9d6c82530508031424eeb701f@mail.gmail.com> <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> Message-ID: <67f3084a05080317395ad684de@mail.gmail.com> On 8/3/05, Raymond Norton wrote: > > Are you using ethtool or mii-tool to make the settings? > > > > > I tried using ethtool,but get the folowing: > > ethtool -s eth0 speed 100 duplex full autoneg off > Cannot get current device settings: Operation not supported > not setting speed > not setting duplex > not setting autoneg > What I've found is that not all cards are supported mii-tool, nor under ethtool. It's typically one, or the other. That being said, I try running both: mii-tool (This will give status of all ethernet devices) ethtool ethX (required to have an eth device specified) Commands to lock at 100FD for both mii-tool and ethtool: #ethtool -s eth0 speed 100 duplex full autoneg off #mii-tool -F 100baseTx-FD eth0 (in case ethtool doesn't work/display) -Put whichever of these these entries into the rc.local file If you have one end of the port set to 100FD for example, and the other end is set to auto-neg, you'll hose your speed. Both need to be set the same for optimal performance. At work, we lock all ports to 100FD. At home, I run everything on auto-neg because my switches and hubs are not managed. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Wed Aug 3 19:46:09 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Wed Aug 3 19:46:50 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508040046.j740k9e08452@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: Want to Buy Subject: Book - The C Programming Language (ANSI) looking to buy a used copy of this (or something similar..). currently using library copy(which was published in 1988 but still useful). Seller Email address: ces dot fci at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From poptix at poptix.net Wed Aug 3 19:46:17 2005 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Wed Aug 3 19:48:50 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <44729.209.176.212.10.1123111296.squirrel@209.176.212.10> References: <200508032147.j73LlhCN021456@trojan.software.umn.edu> <44729.209.176.212.10.1123111296.squirrel@209.176.212.10> Message-ID: <1123116377.2830.24.camel@littleboy.poptix.net> Hello Ray, On Wed, 2005-08-03 at 18:21 -0500, Raymond Norton wrote: > I have the attached cisco switch set to 100/Full. This brought throughput > to a drizzle. I may need to replace the cable or card. > Forcing a Cisco (or any other, really) to any speed/duplex is going to turn off auto negotiation, your ethernet card has most likely failed autonegotiation and is now sitting at 100/half. Turn autoneg back on, give it a whirl, if it doesn't work install a new NIC (or find the driver module parameters to force speed/duplex) From trieff at greencaremankato.com Thu Aug 4 10:03:15 2005 From: trieff at greencaremankato.com (Thomas Rieff) Date: Thu Aug 4 10:01:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] xserver won't load In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Good Morning, I have a Gateway Solo 2550 with a bad cdrom. Win 98 took a turn for the worse. I took the HD and put it in another machine and loaded Mepis on it. I am having trouble getting the X-Server to load. Any thoughts??? Tom Thomas Rieff 1717 3rd Avenue Mankato, MN 56001 (507) 344-8314 Office (507) 344-8316 Fax -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of tclug-list-request@mn-linux.org Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 7:17 PM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 4 Send tclug-list mailing list submissions to tclug-list@mn-linux.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://shadowknight.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to tclug-list-request@mn-linux.org You can reach the person managing the list at tclug-list-owner@mn-linux.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of tclug-list digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) (Ron Nelson) 2. New TCLUG Classified Ad (TCLUG Classifieds) 3. ifconfig (Raymond Norton) 4. Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig (Jeff Rasmussen) 5. Re: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig (Raymond Norton) 6. Re: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig (Bob Hartmann) 7. Re: ifconfig (Raymond Norton) 8. Re: ifconfig (Brian Wall) 9. Re: ifconfig (Bob Hartmann) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 14:54:31 -0500 From: Ron Nelson Subject: Re: [tclug-list] exclude option in tar (Bare metal recovery planning) To: Twin Cities Linux Users Group Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 What I usually do is take advantage of cpio's ability to output in tar format [--format=tar]. I then use find (and grep if needed) to send my list of files through standard-in to cpio. That works better for me, anyways... Ron On 8/2/05, Mike Hicks wrote: > Heh, it's worth noting that we're talking about at least two, and > possibly three different upstream versions of tar here, and each of them > probably has distro-specific patches added on to that. ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 15:50:05 -0500 From: TCLUG Classifieds Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Message-ID: <200508032050.j73Ko5n03764@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Dell 1400SC with 1.1 GB RAM Lightly used Dell 1400 SC server. CPU: PIII 1.13 GHz/512K Cache - dual capable RAM: 1.1 GB (512+512+128) PC133 ECC Two PCI busses, 64 bits/66 MHz IO: Dual Channel Ultra160 SCSI DISK: Fujitsu U160 18 GB/8MB Cache CDROM: 24x (2x writable) NETWORK: Intel 10/100 onboard VIDEO: ATI RAGE 4 MB onboard A great little server! Asking $175 Seller Email address: florin+tclug at iucha dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 15:54:09 -0500 (CDT) From: Raymond Norton Subject: [tclug-list] ifconfig To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Message-ID: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 I am having trouble using ifconfig to set my network adapter to 100/Full Duplex. I am using Fedora 3 if that makes a difference. Anyone have the proper syntax? ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 16:24:25 -0500 From: Jeff Rasmussen Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig To: TCLUG Mailing List Message-ID: <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Are you using ethtool or mii-tool to make the settings? I think the standard is now ethtool. On Debian, I just add a 'up mii-diag -F 100baseTx-FD eth0' line after the gateway. Otherwise find the command and create a startup script. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050803/ 81b00ca0/attachment-0001.htm ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 16:46:33 -0500 (CDT) From: Raymond Norton Subject: Re: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig To: "Jeff Rasmussen" Cc: TCLUG Mailing List Message-ID: <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 > Are you using ethtool or mii-tool to make the settings? > I tried using ethtool,but get the folowing: ethtool -s eth0 speed 100 duplex full autoneg off Cannot get current device settings: Operation not supported not setting speed not setting duplex not setting autoneg ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 17:23:12 -0500 From: Bob Hartmann Subject: Re: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Message-ID: <42F143D0.7060908@visi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Not all chips/drivers are mii compliant. Even newer ones. You should be able to get info on yours from scyld.com. Raymond Norton wrote: >>Are you using ethtool or mii-tool to make the settings? >> >> >> > > >I tried using ethtool,but get the folowing: > >ethtool -s eth0 speed 100 duplex full autoneg off >Cannot get current device settings: Operation not supported > not setting speed > not setting duplex > not setting autoneg > > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 18:21:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Raymond Norton Subject: Re: [tclug-list] ifconfig To: "Bryan J Duff" Cc: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Message-ID: <44729.209.176.212.10.1123111296.squirrel@209.176.212.10> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 > That should be automatic. If it isn't, then you may have cable issues, or > only a 10Mbit hub/switch. > I have the attached cisco switch set to 100/Full. This brought throughput to a drizzle. I may need to replace the cable or card. ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 18:30:01 -0500 From: Brian Wall Subject: Re: [tclug-list] ifconfig To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Message-ID: <2c6699da05080316307986d4d9@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On 8/3/05, Raymond Norton wrote: > I have the attached cisco switch set to 100/Full. This brought throughput > to a drizzle. I may need to replace the cable or card. What kind of NIC is it? I've seen certain 3c905B's exhibit this behavior. My solution was to replace it with either a 3c905C or an Intel. -Brian ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 19:32:06 -0500 From: Bob Hartmann Subject: Re: [tclug-list] ifconfig Cc: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Message-ID: <42F16206.5030607@visi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Certain versions of Intel's e100/1000 and the first Broadcom gig if's gave me great hassles while connecting to supposedly auto-negotiating 3com switches and Extreme Alpines. Gotcha's from CompaQ/HP. That's how I got into this mii-diag thing-- hacking ZENworks imaging CDs and PXE. These if's were mii compatible, thankfully. Brian Wall wrote: >On 8/3/05, Raymond Norton wrote: > > > >>I have the attached cisco switch set to 100/Full. This brought throughput >>to a drizzle. I may need to replace the cable or card. >> >> > >What kind of NIC is it? I've seen certain 3c905B's exhibit this >behavior. My solution was to replace it with either a 3c905C or an >Intel. > >-Brian > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list End of tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 4 **************************************** From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Thu Aug 4 10:51:38 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Thu Aug 4 10:53:01 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <67f3084a05080317395ad684de@mail.gmail.com> References: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <9d6c82530508031424eeb701f@mail.gmail.com> <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <67f3084a05080317395ad684de@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d6c82530508040851529f113b@mail.gmail.com> Is it necessary with current hardware to lock down auto-negotiation? Our network engineer is enphatic that everything has to be locked down at 100FD. He says that auto-negotiation will slow down the network with extra traffic. However, I can't find anything on the web that says why auto-negotiation wouldn't work, as long as the standard is adhered to and the only reason it shouldn't be adhered to is if the equipment is pre-1997. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050804/86a4ee3d/attachment.htm From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Thu Aug 4 10:53:43 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Thu Aug 4 10:55:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] xserver won't load In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9d6c825305080408537519522c@mail.gmail.com> Make sure that the graphics drivers are loaded. Memphis is a Debian distro so you should have a 'modconf' command to add modules. Run 'lspci' to find out what type of hardware your system has. If you email us the output of 'lspci' we can help. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050804/1cfe9c6b/attachment-0001.htm From trieff at greencaremankato.com Thu Aug 4 11:29:07 2005 From: trieff at greencaremankato.com (Thomas Rieff) Date: Thu Aug 4 11:28:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 5 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Jeff, lspci... 0000:00:00.0 Host Bridge: Intel Corp. 440 BX/ZX/DX - 82443BX /ZX/DX Host bridge (rev 03) 0000:00:01.0 PCI Bridge: Intel Corp. 440 BX/ZX/DX - 82443BX /ZX/DX AGP bridge (rev 03) 0000:00:07.0 Bridge: Intel Corp. 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 ISA (rev 02) 0000:00:07.1 IDE interface: Intel Corp. 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 IDE (rev 01) 0000:00:07.2 USB Controller: Intel Corp. 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 USB (rev 01) 0000:00:07.3 Bridge: Intel Corp. 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 ACPI (rev 02) 0000:00:0a.0 CardBus bridge: Texas Instruments PCI1225 (rev 01) 0000:00:0a.1 CardBus bridge: Texas Instruments PCI1225 (rev 01) 0000:00:0e.0 Multimedia audio controller: ESS Technology ES1978 Maestro 2E (rev 10) 0000:00:10.0 Communication controller: Lucent Microelectronics WinModem 56K (rev 01) 0000:01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Silicon Motion, Inc. SM710 LynxEM (rev a3) 0000:02:00.0 Ethernet controller: 3Com Corporation 3cCFE575CT CardBus [Cyclone] (rev 10) Thanks for help!!! Tom Message: 6 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 10:53:43 -0500 From: Jeff Rasmussen Subject: Re: [tclug-list] xserver won't load To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Message-ID: <9d6c825305080408537519522c@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Make sure that the graphics drivers are loaded. Memphis is a Debian distro so you should have a 'modconf' command to add modules. Run 'lspci' to find out what type of hardware your system has. If you email us the output of 'lspci' we can help. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050804/ 1cfe9c6b/attachment.htm ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list End of tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 5 **************************************** From josh at joshwelch.com Thu Aug 4 11:42:24 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Thu Aug 4 11:45:01 2005 Subject: Fwd: [tclug-list] ifconfig In-Reply-To: <9d6c82530508040851529f113b@mail.gmail.com> References: <42153.64.8.149.194.1123102449.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <9d6c82530508031424eeb701f@mail.gmail.com> <9d6c8253050803142476b9a0e9@mail.gmail.com> <45449.64.8.149.194.1123105593.squirrel@64.8.149.194> <67f3084a05080317395ad684de@mail.gmail.com> <9d6c82530508040851529f113b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F24570.1070801@joshwelch.com> Jeff Rasmussen wrote: > Is it necessary with current hardware to lock down auto-negotiation? > Our network engineer is enphatic that everything has to be locked down > at 100FD. He says that auto-negotiation will slow down the network with > extra traffic. > > However, I can't find anything on the web that says why auto-negotiation > wouldn't work, as long as the standard is adhered to and the only reason > it shouldn't be adhered to is if the equipment is pre-1997. > > -- > Jeff Rasmussen > GPG public key 0x9686C12F > > Like most standards, there can be issues with implementation. If you ask person A and person B to develop the same thing according to the same set of standards, you probably won't get two things exactly alike. If you ask two companies to do it, you definetly won't get two things alike. I let my workstations autoneg, it's good enough for them. Servers and interswitch links I prefer to hard code. Josh From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Thu Aug 4 13:19:40 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Thu Aug 4 13:21:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 5 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9d6c825305080411197b96be28@mail.gmail.com> The important line is quoted below: On 8/4/05, Thomas Rieff wrote: > > > 0000:01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Silicon Motion, Inc. SM710 LynxEM > (rev a3) > I did a quick google search and found this webpage http://www.x.org/X11R6.8.2/doc/siliconmotion.4.html which says that the SM710 is supported using the siliconmotion x.org driver. Another website says that siliconmotion is not supported in Xfree86 4.1 ( http://the.earth.li/XFree86/4.0.1/Status29.html) I couldn't figure out what module needs to be loaded for it to work. But you might just try running 'dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86' (as root) and see if you can choose siliconmotion as a possible driver. Run 'dpkg -l xserver-xfree86' to find out what version of xfree86 you are running. You might have to try running Ubuntu (another Debian based distro) that uses x.org . Or you could have a go at Debian's unstable branch which has just included x.org . -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050804/ca40da9e/attachment.htm From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Aug 4 15:11:32 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Thu Aug 4 15:13:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508042011.j74KBWr22316@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: 3U Rack mount cases with 300WPS plus other stuff I have three 3U rack mount cases for sale. each has a 300W PS. asking $165 each or $450 for all 3. contact me via email. I also have 36GB SCSI HD's, SCSI controllers, misc. parts. sales@bbwh.com Seller Email address: sales at bbwh dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Thu Aug 4 19:09:16 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Thu Aug 4 19:11:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 5 In-Reply-To: <9d6c825305080411197b96be28@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d6c825305080411197b96be28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1123200556.24771.4.camel@3po.thodt.net> On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 13:19 -0500, Jeff Rasmussen wrote: > > I couldn't figure out what module needs to be loaded for it to work. > But you might just try running 'dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86' (as > root) and see if you can choose siliconmotion as a possible driver. > If there doesn't seem to be any applicable driver, 'vesa' is usually a workable fallback. It's not very fast, but it gets the job done and works with 90+% of the stuff out there. -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050804/1756c4ed/attachment.pgp From ston0235 at umn.edu Fri Aug 5 15:04:04 2005 From: ston0235 at umn.edu (Ian Stoner) Date: Fri Aug 5 15:05:18 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] installing a dvd burner Message-ID: <20050805150404.2c8a3624.ston0235@umn.edu> Hi folks, I was just given a DVD burner as gift, and after a day of fruitless fiddling around, I realize I have no idea how to set it up. Right now, it works perfectly when reading and writing data and audio CDs. I don't have blank DVDs or data DVDs to play with, yet. But if I try to play a DVD movie in Xine, I get two error messages. One says: The source can't be read. Maybe you don't have enough rights for this, or source doesn't contain data (e.g: not disc in drive). (/dev/dvd) and the other reads: There is no input plugin available to handle 'dvd:/'. Maybe MRL syntax is wrong or file/stream source doesn't exist. Following the suggestion of the Xine website, I linked /dev/hdc to /dev/dvd, but the Xine error messages were the same before and after I made the link. Do I need to manually load some modules? Is there code that needs to be compiled in to the kernel? Never having had anything other than a CD burner, I'm at a loss for what to do for DVD support. The drive is a Toshiba SD-R6372, and I'm running Debian Etch. Thanks, Ian -- Ian Stoner Philosophy Department University of Minnesota http://www.tc.umn.edu/~ston0235/ From justin.kremer at gmail.com Fri Aug 5 15:26:59 2005 From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer) Date: Fri Aug 5 15:27:18 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] installing a dvd burner In-Reply-To: <20050805150404.2c8a3624.ston0235@umn.edu> References: <20050805150404.2c8a3624.ston0235@umn.edu> Message-ID: <27e6356a050805132675f2481@mail.gmail.com> > Right now, it works perfectly when reading and writing data and audio > CDs. So you PROBABLY have proper permissions to use the device. Just to make sure, do a "ls -l /dev/hdc" and see who owns it. If it's like my system it'll be root:cdrom, both with rw access. Verify that you are in the proper group to access it, and make changes as needed. > There is no input plugin available to handle 'dvd:/'. Maybe MRL syntax > is wrong or file/stream source doesn't exist. > > Following the suggestion of the Xine website, I linked /dev/hdc to > /dev/dvd, but the Xine error messages were the same before and after I > made the link. Instead of doing that, I went into the Xine preferences, and made the change so that I could access "Advanced" preferences, and somewhere in there, you have the option to change the device that is used by default for certain things. I just pointed the DVD section to /dev/hdc. After that, get yourself libdvdcss2 and/or libdvdread3, iirc. I believe you will need non-us sources to get those. With those things taken care of, my computer was capable of playing DVD's for me. -- Justin Kremer "We seem to have an insatiable appetite for wanting to lump incongruous activities onto the complex task of driving." - Autoweek From obelin23 at gmail.com Fri Aug 5 17:14:45 2005 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Fri Aug 5 17:15:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] problem - my CD burner works Message-ID: <72278d105080515143368283b@mail.gmail.com> So why is it a problem that my CD burner works? This is Debian sarge, installed last fall, 2.4.26 kernel. CD burner with K3B works just fine. The problem is, I don't have ide-scsi turned on anywhere; the CD is still at /dev/hdc. If I go to the command line and do cdrecord -scanbus, I do not get any valid devices. If I look at K3B setup I don't see any special parameters. I thought you needed scsi emulation to use a CD burner in the 2.4 series kernel. Can someone explain to me why this is working with K3B? Thanks, Charlie From jeremy at rosengren.org Fri Aug 5 17:41:36 2005 From: jeremy at rosengren.org (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Fri Aug 5 17:43:20 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] problem - my CD burner works In-Reply-To: <72278d105080515143368283b@mail.gmail.com> References: <72278d105080515143368283b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F3EB20.10703@rosengren.org> Charlie O wrote: >So why is it a problem that my CD burner works? > >This is Debian sarge, installed last fall, 2.4.26 kernel. CD burner >with K3B works just fine. > >The problem is, I don't have ide-scsi turned on anywhere; the CD is >still at /dev/hdc. > >If I go to the command line and do cdrecord -scanbus, I do not get any >valid devices. If I look at K3B setup I don't see any special >parameters. > >I thought you needed scsi emulation to use a CD burner in the 2.4 series kernel. > >Can someone explain to me why this is working with K3B? > > You don't *need* ide-scsi, it was just the most stable driver for a quite some time. k3b uses cdrecord, and newer versions of cdrecord, combined with driver enhancements in the 2.4 kernel enable CD burning to work quite well without the ide-scsi interface. Granted, there isn't a good document somewhere that says, "Great news! You no longer need to use ide-scsi to burn CDs in the 2.4 kernel!" (http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/IDE_CD_Writer being the closest), however I was able to find the answer after 5-10 minutes with Google. -- jeremy From random at argle.org Fri Aug 5 17:42:04 2005 From: random at argle.org (Daniel Taylor) Date: Fri Aug 5 17:43:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] problem - my CD burner works In-Reply-To: <72278d105080515143368283b@mail.gmail.com> References: <72278d105080515143368283b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F3EB3C.70206@argle.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Charlie O wrote: > So why is it a problem that my CD burner works? > > This is Debian sarge, installed last fall, 2.4.26 kernel. CD burner > with K3B works just fine. > > The problem is, I don't have ide-scsi turned on anywhere; the CD is > still at /dev/hdc. > > If I go to the command line and do cdrecord -scanbus, I do not get any > valid devices. If I look at K3B setup I don't see any special > parameters. > > I thought you needed scsi emulation to use a CD burner in the 2.4 series kernel. > > Can someone explain to me why this is working with K3B? > Most of the CD burning software for Linux now supports burning directly to IDE devices through one mechanism or another. It is mostly application level changes, so your kernel doesn't matter that much as long as it doesn't get in the way. - -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFC8+s88/QSptFdBtURAgcnAJ4msrnNZAGQVisX/dBL4L6lwhFeHACfXn1A LrWHwExH9WAtljCfBHg2MLk= =l/Gm -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From dan at dandrake.org Sat Aug 6 17:14:06 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (dan) Date: Sat Aug 6 17:15:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] mounting encrypted dmg files in Linux? Message-ID: <20050806221406.GA7500@dandrake.org> I'd like to mount an encrypted .dmg file in Linux. I know Linux handles unencrypted disk images no problem, but I have an encrypted one I created on my Powerbook. In OS X, it's all pointy-clicky joy -- I just type in the password, and it gets mounted. I've tried using the loop-aes modules and losetup and whatnot (as detailed in [1]) but it demands at least a 20-character password! My password is only 8 characters. Is there a way to unencrypt my disk image? Is there any information on the type of AES encryption used, or how they turn the password into an encryption key? And (of course) can I do this in Linux? Thanks, Dan 1. http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/81 -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050806/26c44a1d/attachment.pgp From dan at dandrake.org Sat Aug 6 17:16:29 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (dan) Date: Sat Aug 6 17:19:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] the sync option in fstab Message-ID: <20050806221629.GA7522@dandrake.org> I have entries in my fstab file for: an iPod, a USB flash drive, and a USB hard drive enclosure. All of these have the 'sync' option. I forget if I put that there, or if some other program put it there, or if I read you're supposed to use it... Should I use the sync option for these devices? High performance isn't necessary; I don't use these devices that much. Safety of my data is more important. Does the sync option help that? Is it appropriate? Thanks, Dan -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050806/74b667c7/attachment.pgp From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Sat Aug 6 21:38:16 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Sat Aug 6 21:39:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] the sync option in fstab In-Reply-To: <20050806221629.GA7522@dandrake.org> References: <20050806221629.GA7522@dandrake.org> Message-ID: <1123382296.23838.14.camel@3po.thodt.net> On Sat, 2005-08-06 at 17:16 -0500, dan wrote: > I have entries in my fstab file for: an iPod, a USB flash drive, and a > USB hard drive enclosure. All of these have the 'sync' option. I forget > if I put that there, or if some other program put it there, or if I read > you're supposed to use it... > > Should I use the sync option for these devices? High performance isn't > necessary; I don't use these devices that much. Safety of my data is > more important. Does the sync option help that? Is it appropriate? Yes, you should use the sync option if you are concerned about keeping the data in a sane state. The option turns on synchronous writes, which makes sure that when a write() operation returns, the data has actually been sent to the device. If the sync option is not set, data is buffered, which makes the process of writing data more efficient, but it is not guaranteed that the files will actually be written/copied in a timely manner (ie, before you yank the plug from your USB port). -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050806/6640355b/attachment.pgp From seg at haxxed.com Mon Aug 8 13:27:48 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Mon Aug 8 13:30:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] problem - my CD burner works In-Reply-To: <42F3EB3C.70206@argle.org> References: <72278d105080515143368283b@mail.gmail.com> <42F3EB3C.70206@argle.org> Message-ID: <1123525668.2875.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> Try 'cdrecord -scanbus dev=ATA:' ? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050808/db0487c9/attachment.pgp From seg at haxxed.com Mon Aug 8 13:36:34 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Mon Aug 8 13:38:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] WRT54G - Which flash software did you use? In-Reply-To: <741dcbb805072615413929c30b@mail.gmail.com> References: <741dcbb805072615413929c30b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1123526194.2875.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-07-26 at 17:41 -0500, Brock Noland wrote: > I have two WRT54G's and I want to flash them so that I can ssh to > them.. Which flash package did you use? Do you recommend it? There are two main firmwares. There's http://www.sveasoft.com/ , which made a highly controversial switch to a subscription service a while back. Its feature packed and based directly on the Linksys firmware and retains its web configuration. But it doesn't come free. Then there's http://openwrt.org/ , which is free but is intended to be a minimal base to build on. You can add on packages for most anything. However it still lacks web based configuration. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050808/7662ec45/attachment.pgp From shanson at cruiskeenconsulting.com Mon Aug 8 13:45:12 2005 From: shanson at cruiskeenconsulting.com (Steve Hanson) Date: Mon Aug 8 13:57:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] WRT54G - Which flash software did you use? In-Reply-To: <1123526194.2875.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <741dcbb805072615413929c30b@mail.gmail.com> <1123526194.2875.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <42F7A838.2000109@cruiskeenconsulting.com> Callum Lerwick wrote: > On Tue, 2005-07-26 at 17:41 -0500, Brock Noland wrote: > >>I have two WRT54G's and I want to flash them so that I can ssh to >>them.. Which flash package did you use? Do you recommend it? > > > There are two main firmwares. There's http://www.sveasoft.com/ , which > made a highly controversial switch to a subscription service a while > back. Its feature packed and based directly on the Linksys firmware and > retains its web configuration. But it doesn't come free. > However - if you're willing to not be running the latest cutting-edge version of the software it IS free at http://www.wrt54g.net - you can download alchemy 1.0 there. > Then there's http://openwrt.org/ , which is free but is intended to be a > minimal base to build on. You can add on packages for most anything. > However it still lacks web based configuration. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rclark at lakesplus.com Tue Aug 9 09:39:01 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Tue Aug 9 09:40:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition Message-ID: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> I am in the process of making a major move from a Win2000 box to a Fedora Core 3 box for the majority of my work related activities. I do some work for a virtual engineering firm and I access their system for email, etc. through a terminal server application. On FC3, I am presently using tsclient to access their system. On the Win2000 box the local printer was automatically detected, allowing me to print documents locally. The FC3 system and tsclient of course does not seem to allow access to a printer. Has anyone our there been through this issue and found a way to resolve it? At present, there is NOT a printer hooked up locally to the FC3 system, but there are two printers attached that work fine. I can easily make one local and connected to the lpt1 port if that is all that is needed, but before making hardware changes I thought I would as the wisdom of this group. I believe the protocol is RDPv5.(?) Or ... is there another piece of software that will work better? Randy From tclug at natecarlson.com Tue Aug 9 10:07:51 2005 From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Tue Aug 9 10:08:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition In-Reply-To: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> References: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, Randy Clarksean wrote: > The FC3 system and tsclient of course does not seem to allow access to a > printer. Has anyone our there been through this issue and found a way > to resolve it? At present, there is NOT a printer hooked up locally to > the FC3 system, but there are two printers attached that work fine. I > can easily make one local and connected to the lpt1 port if that is all > that is needed, but before making hardware changes I thought I would as > the wisdom of this group. I believe the protocol is RDPv5.(?) > > Or ... is there another piece of software that will work better? rdesktop allows printer redirection; -r option. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | nate carlson | natecars@natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com | | depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981 | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From andyzib at gmail.com Tue Aug 9 11:04:35 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Tue Aug 9 11:06:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition In-Reply-To: References: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> Message-ID: tsclient is a front end for rdesktop and VNC, made to look like the Remote Desktop Connection you find on windows. Make sure you have the printer mapping option checked in tsclient. If that doesn't do it, open a terminal and try: # export PRINTER=printername # tsclient & And if that doesn't do it, my last guess is that you need to setup your printer under samba. Or you could Read The Fine Manual. :) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From admin at lctn.org Tue Aug 9 15:38:29 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Tue Aug 9 15:40:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] hardware detection Message-ID: <56282.64.8.149.194.1123619909.squirrel@64.8.149.194> Is there a boot disk around that can identify what hardware is installed on a PC? I have a number of boxes with mystery peripherals that I need to find (windows)drivers for. I would prefer not to dismantle each box to find the chip set, etc being used. Raymond From ston0235 at umn.edu Tue Aug 9 15:51:52 2005 From: ston0235 at umn.edu (Ian Stoner) Date: Tue Aug 9 15:53:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] slow dvd playback In-Reply-To: <27e6356a050805132675f2481@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050805150404.2c8a3624.ston0235@umn.edu> <27e6356a050805132675f2481@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050809155152.1b81d10f.ston0235@umn.edu> Hi folks, I have made a bit of progress on getting my DVD burner to work. Using Totem with the gstreamer backend, I can now *sort of* watch a DVD movie. The sound and images both decode, but they decode so slowly that they are unwatchable. Totem prints the following message when run from the command line: No accelerated IMDCT transform found Can this account for the slow playback, and if so, how do I get accelerated IMDCT transformations? I still can't play DVD movies in either Xine or mplayer, and neither player even makes the drive light up when I invoke it. Mplayer give the following messages: Playing dvd://. libdvdread: Using libdvdcss version 1.2.8 for DVD access Reading disc structure, please wait... libdvdread: Can't open file VIDEO_TS.IFO. Can't open VMG info! And Xine is still giving the two errors I mentioned before. Namely: The source can't be read. Maybe you don't have enough rights for this, or source doesn't contain data (e.g: not disc in drive). (/dev/dvd) and There is no input plugin available to handle 'dvd:/'. Maybe MRL syntax is wrong or file/stream source doesn't exist. My system is a 1gig Celeron, with a 16 meg Nvidia card using the Nvidia proprietary drivers. So I'm pretty sure the slowness problem has to do with the software, and not the hardware/drivers. Thanks, Ian From erikerik at gmail.com Tue Aug 9 15:56:03 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Tue Aug 9 15:56:18 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] hardware detection In-Reply-To: <56282.64.8.149.194.1123619909.squirrel@64.8.149.194> References: <56282.64.8.149.194.1123619909.squirrel@64.8.149.194> Message-ID: On 8/9/05, Raymond Norton wrote: > Is there a boot disk around that can identify what hardware is installed > on a PC? I have a number of boxes with mystery peripherals that I need to > find (windows)drivers for. I would prefer not to dismantle each box to > find the chip set, etc being used. Knoppix comes to mind, though any livecd that includes the "lspci" command should do nicely. From andyzib at gmail.com Tue Aug 9 23:03:58 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Tue Aug 9 23:04:21 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] hardware detection In-Reply-To: References: <56282.64.8.149.194.1123619909.squirrel@64.8.149.194> Message-ID: Ubuntu Live http://www.ubuntulinux.org/ Knoppix http://www.knoppix.org/ LNX-BBC http://www.lnxbbc.org/ Good stuffs. I think on 2.4 kernels you can do cat /proc/pci...but I don't have a 2.4 kernel running to check. :) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Tue Aug 9 23:39:31 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Tue Aug 9 23:40:21 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] slow dvd playback In-Reply-To: <20050809155152.1b81d10f.ston0235@umn.edu> References: <20050805150404.2c8a3624.ston0235@umn.edu> <27e6356a050805132675f2481@mail.gmail.com> <20050809155152.1b81d10f.ston0235@umn.edu> Message-ID: <1123648771.23838.38.camel@3po.thodt.net> On Tue, 2005-08-09 at 15:51 -0500, Ian Stoner wrote: > Hi folks, > [snip] > No accelerated IMDCT transform found > > Can this account for the slow playback, and if so, how do I get > accelerated IMDCT transformations? You mentioned at the end of your note that you have a 1GHz Celeron. That should be fast enough to decode without IMDCT support (which is a hardware-assist method for decoding MPEG video). You may not have XVideo (Xv) support enabled in your X server, which provides for hardware scaling of video (allowing you to zoom full-screen without CPU penalty). Try running 'xvinfo' and sending us the output, which should show whether it's working or not. > I still can't play DVD movies in either Xine or mplayer, and neither > player even makes the drive light up when I invoke it. Mplayer give the > following messages: [snip disc read problems] Can you tell us what permissions and ownership (user/group) you see when you do 'ls -l /dev/dvd' (and on the device that the location is symlinked to, if it is)? -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050809/dafaf179/attachment.pgp From rclark at lakesplus.com Wed Aug 10 07:55:40 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Wed Aug 10 07:56:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition In-Reply-To: References: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1123678540.10023.12.camel@localhost> I must be looking in all the wrong places as I do not see a spot to select printer mapping. If I also go to the man pages for rdesktop, there is an option for redirecting - but - only for sound - no mention of printers at this stage. I have version 1.4.1 ... which the website says is the latest version. Am I missing something here? I tried your commands below ... no go as well. What about redirecting back through my firewall to a printer on a local Linux box? In theory I should be able to do that .. or not? Randy On Tue, 2005-08-09 at 11:04 -0500, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > tsclient is a front end for rdesktop and VNC, made to look like the > Remote Desktop Connection you find on windows. Make sure you have the > printer mapping option checked in tsclient. If that doesn't do it, > open a terminal and try: > > # export PRINTER=printername > # tsclient & > > And if that doesn't do it, my last guess is that you need to setup > your printer under samba. > > Or you could Read The Fine Manual. :) > From strayf at freeshell.org Wed Aug 10 07:55:50 2005 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steve Cayford) Date: Wed Aug 10 07:56:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] slow dvd playback In-Reply-To: <20050809155152.1b81d10f.ston0235@umn.edu> References: <20050805150404.2c8a3624.ston0235@umn.edu> <27e6356a050805132675f2481@mail.gmail.com> <20050809155152.1b81d10f.ston0235@umn.edu> Message-ID: <20050810125550.GA12436@isaiah> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 03:51:52PM -0500, Ian Stoner wrote: > Hi folks, > > I have made a bit of progress on getting my DVD burner to work. > > Using Totem with the gstreamer backend, I can now *sort of* watch a DVD > movie. The sound and images both decode, but they decode so slowly that > they are unwatchable. My only suggestion is make sure DMA is on for the drive. -Steve From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Aug 10 11:11:54 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Wed Aug 10 11:12:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition In-Reply-To: <1123678540.10023.12.camel@localhost> References: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> <1123678540.10023.12.camel@localhost> Message-ID: I looked at the docs, and Ubuntu is using a dated version of rdesktop. (1.3.1). Check which version Fedora is using. 1.4.1 is the current version of rdesktop, and it looks like better support for printer redirection has been introduced, but you may have to use rdesktop with the proper command line switches instead of the pretting tsclient front end. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From josh at joshwelch.com Wed Aug 10 11:20:03 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Wed Aug 10 11:24:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast Message-ID: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> Not directly Linux related, sorry. Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout that software they want you to install. Thanks, Josh From erikerik at gmail.com Wed Aug 10 11:33:26 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Wed Aug 10 11:34:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> References: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On 8/10/05, Josh Welch wrote: > Not directly Linux related, sorry. > > Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to > connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to > do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no > experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout > that software they want you to install. I've never had to install it...but I've had some friend that *did* have to install their software to get things going. I dunno - maybe I just got lucky. From trieff at greencaremankato.com Wed Aug 10 11:48:31 2005 From: trieff at greencaremankato.com (Thomas Rieff) Date: Wed Aug 10 11:46:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 5 In-Reply-To: <9d6c825305080411197b96be28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/gif Size: 4266 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050810/7ee087f2/attachment.gif From j_wrocky at comcast.net Wed Aug 10 11:45:08 2005 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry Weihrauch) Date: Wed Aug 10 11:46:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> References: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <42FA2F14.2050106@comcast.net> Josh, No, as long as DCHP is activated and you have an account with Comcast, you should be all right. I run Firefox and the "preferred" browser by the tech help is IE. Comcast runs on Firefox and most of the other browsers. I don't run Comcasts craptacular on Windows either. Only issue I had even with Windows was that when I got a newer Cable Modem I had to call tech support and they had to enter the model and serial number of the cable modem. Jerry Josh Welch wrote: >Not directly Linux related, sorry. > >Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to >connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to >do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no >experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout >that software they want you to install. > >Thanks, >Josh > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > From cschumann at twp-llc.com Wed Aug 10 11:49:37 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Wed Aug 10 11:52:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <200508101628.j7AGSUHc002261@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200508101628.j7AGSUHc002261@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <37303.192.28.2.17.1123692577.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> > From: Josh Welch > Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to > connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to > do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no > experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout > that software they want you to install. I use Comcast broadband, and have not installed any of their software. I have a LinkSys cable modem, then a LinkSys router, and behind that is a public server (Linux) and another router. Behind that is my private network with Linux and Windows machines, and it works perfectly. (A little annoying to set up BitTorrent, but big wup.) Chris From wilson at visi.com Wed Aug 10 12:16:52 2005 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Wed Aug 10 12:18:36 2005 Subject: BitTorrent behind firewall, was: Re: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <37303.192.28.2.17.1123692577.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200508101628.j7AGSUHc002261@delta.twp-llc.com> <37303.192.28.2.17.1123692577.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <14FC5ED9-7B36-4A58-9466-ABE163FF9E92@visi.com> On Aug 10, 2005, at 11:49 AM, Chris Schumann wrote: > Behind that is my private > network with Linux and Windows machines, and it works perfectly. (A > little > annoying to set up BitTorrent, but big wup.) That is annoying. Does anyone have a good solution for using BitTorrent on multiple computers behind a NATed firewall? I have port forwarding set up, but it all goes to one internal IP address. *lightning bolt* Ah, would this work? Can I just forward 6881-6882, say, to one internal IP address and 6883-6884 to another, etc. -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 blog: http://technosavvy.org From daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com Wed Aug 10 12:18:31 2005 From: daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com (Dan Armbrust) Date: Wed Aug 10 12:18:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> References: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <42FA36E7.5020509@gmail.com> Josh Welch wrote: >Not directly Linux related, sorry. > >Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to >connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to >do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no >experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout >that software they want you to install. > >Thanks, >Josh > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > If you are doing a new setup (or a new cable modem) you most likely need to register your cable modem with their system. Comcasts craptacular software does this as one of the setup steps. When I was first setup, the tech used the software (on my pc), and it took me about a day to get all the remnants of the garbage off of my pc (windows only, at the time, by the way). When I had to have a cable modem replaced at a later point and the tech wanted a windows pc to run through the install again, I refused. He relented, and registered the cable modem through a non-publicized route. Basically, you need to find out from tech support what the address is for the web page that you need to go to to initially register your cable modem with their system. Once the cable modem is registered, and assigned an ip address, then it doesn't matter what kind of pc you plug into it, so long as it knows how to dhcp. No software required, from that point. Dan -- **************************** Daniel Armbrust Biomedical Informatics Mayo Clinic Rochester daniel.armbrust(at)mayo.edu http://informatics.mayo.edu/ From rharding at msufame.msu.edu Wed Aug 10 11:57:32 2005 From: rharding at msufame.msu.edu (Richard Harding) Date: Wed Aug 10 12:22:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> References: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <1123693052.5475.5.camel@localhost> On Wed, 2005-08-10 at 11:20 -0500, Josh Welch wrote: > Not directly Linux related, sorry. > > Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to > connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to > do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no > experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout > that software they want you to install. > > Thanks, > Josh It used to be no, you could just plug in and go. When I moved to Clarkston back in June I could not get it to work until I borrowed my fiance's windows laptop to run the software. I guess there is some code in there to grab info from the modem and set it up on their system. Without that happending no network connection. I fussed at their support line about it, but you can imagine how much understanding there was. Rick From ron.e.nelson at gmail.com Wed Aug 10 12:25:58 2005 From: ron.e.nelson at gmail.com (Ron Nelson) Date: Wed Aug 10 12:26:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> References: <42FA2933.7080904@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: Nah, not required at all. Ron On 8/10/05, Josh Welch wrote: > Not directly Linux related, sorry. > > Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to > connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to > do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no > experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout > that software they want you to install. > > Thanks, > Josh > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From auditodd at comcast.net Wed Aug 10 13:26:34 2005 From: auditodd at comcast.net (auditodd@comcast.net) Date: Wed Aug 10 13:28:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast Message-ID: <081020051826.19218.42FA46DA000B386800004B1222007481840B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> I replaced my cable modem with Comcast back at the beginning of the year. I was leasing the modem and Comcast refused to simply "give" me the modem as was their current promotion at the time for new users. So a functional, but 3 year old modem is probably now on a scrap pile some where. Anyway, when I went to register the new modem with Comcast Tech Support, I simply hooked up a laptop directly to the modem and opened a browser, then they walked me through going to a web site that registered the modem with Comcast. No software install required. I think I used a Windows laptop (with a software firewall), but I don't see why a Linux machine couldn't do the same thing, unless their modem registration depends on something within IE that won't work with Firefox/Mozilla. -- ---- ------ Todd Young > On Wed, 2005-08-10 at 11:20 -0500, Josh Welch wrote: > > Not directly Linux related, sorry. > > > > Is it necessary to run Comcast's craptacular software in order to > > connect to their cable network? Is there something magical you need to > > do in order to get on their network without that software? I have no > > experience with Comcast directly, but I have not heard good things aout > > that software they want you to install. > > > > Thanks, > > Josh > > It used to be no, you could just plug in and go. When I moved to > Clarkston back in June I could not get it to work until I borrowed my > fiance's windows laptop to run the software. I guess there is some code > in there to grab info from the modem and set it up on their system. > Without that happending no network connection. > > I fussed at their support line about it, but you can imagine how much > understanding there was. > > Rick > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rharding at msufame.msu.edu Wed Aug 10 13:35:20 2005 From: rharding at msufame.msu.edu (Richard Harding) Date: Wed Aug 10 13:36:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <081020051826.19218.42FA46DA000B386800004B1222007481840B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> References: <081020051826.19218.42FA46DA000B386800004B1222007481840B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> Message-ID: <1123698920.5475.8.camel@localhost> On Wed, 2005-08-10 at 18:26 +0000, auditodd@comcast.net wrote: > I replaced my cable modem with Comcast back at the beginning of the year. I was leasing the modem and Comcast refused to simply "give" me the modem as was their current promotion at the time for new users. So a functional, but 3 year old modem is probably now on a scrap pile some where. > > Anyway, when I went to register the new modem with Comcast Tech Support, I simply hooked up a laptop directly to the modem and opened a browser, then they walked me through going to a web site that registered the modem with Comcast. No software install required. I think I used a Windows laptop (with a software firewall), but I don't see why a Linux machine couldn't do the same thing, unless their modem registration depends on something within IE that won't work with Firefox/Mozilla. > > -- > ---- > ------ > Todd Young That's odd, for mine they had a CD rom with a .exe I had to run through and enter things like my account number and such. The test actually left without knowing if my modem was up because I didn't have a windows machine to set it up with. It was actually a couple days later after trying to talk to tech support I broke down and borrowed my fiance's laptop. I guess I just ran into stubborn people that wouldn't tell me the "web way". Rick From rclark at lakesplus.com Wed Aug 10 15:20:15 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Wed Aug 10 15:21:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition In-Reply-To: References: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> <1123678540.10023.12.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1123705215.4061.11.camel@localhost> I have to be missing the boat here. I have installed 1.4.1 The man pages list this information for rdesktop and redirection (see below). -r Enable redirection of the specified device on the client, such that it appears on the server. The only device currently sup- ported is "sound" (requires Windows XP or newer). Note that the allowed redirections may be restricted by the server con- figuration. I see nothing about printer support. Randy On Wed, 2005-08-10 at 11:11 -0500, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > I looked at the docs, and Ubuntu is using a dated version of rdesktop. > (1.3.1). Check which version Fedora is using. 1.4.1 is the current > version of rdesktop, and it looks like better support for printer > redirection has been introduced, but you may have to use rdesktop with > the proper command line switches instead of the pretting tsclient > front end. > From srcfoo at gmail.com Wed Aug 10 15:39:33 2005 From: srcfoo at gmail.com (EP) Date: Wed Aug 10 15:40:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OpenGroupware or Kolab Message-ID: <579c6fd305081013391916a834@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I'm implementing a groupware service at our office and I'm wondering what other people are using and what degree of success they have had with their solution. I have a little experience with Kolab and it was fine, but a little cumbersome to configure from what I remember. Opengroupware looks promising, but I have no experience with it. I installed Citadel which was very easy to make operable, but it's a little too cartoony and basic for me. I definitely need something that I can connect to from other pieces of software to do things like share contacts and company information. I will for sure need to share contact information with dotProject and I will need to easily keep the two in sync if I can't make them use the same database. Thanks, Eric From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Aug 10 16:06:49 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Wed Aug 10 16:08:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition In-Reply-To: <1123705215.4061.11.camel@localhost> References: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> <1123678540.10023.12.camel@localhost> <1123705215.4061.11.camel@localhost> Message-ID: According to the change log: rdesktop (1.4.0) * Basic disk-, parallel-, printer- and serial-redirection Perhaps the man pages haven't been updated. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From rclark at lakesplus.com Wed Aug 10 17:59:22 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Wed Aug 10 18:00:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Terminal Server - Printer Addition In-Reply-To: References: <1123598341.12175.20.camel@localhost> <1123678540.10023.12.camel@localhost> <1123705215.4061.11.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1123714762.4061.24.camel@localhost> man pages were apparently not updated. when I typed the command incorrectly - all of the options, etc. were listed on the screen ... gee ... that would have been quicker and easier *laffs* I was able to get it to redirect without a problem rdesktop -u user -p password -g 1024x768 -r printer:DEC_PCL terminal.addy.com It somehow selected a driver on the other system, a test page did print (PS printer driver), but I went in and changed the driver to the one that was for the printer ... and it worked fine as well - or as least as good as it did before. Thanks for the patience with me ... I appreciate the help as I now have it working. Randy On Wed, 2005-08-10 at 16:06 -0500, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > According to the change log: > > rdesktop (1.4.0) > * Basic disk-, parallel-, printer- and serial-redirection > > Perhaps the man pages haven't been updated. > > From chewie at wookimus.net Wed Aug 10 19:14:39 2005 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Wed Aug 10 19:16:35 2005 Subject: BitTorrent behind firewall, was: Re: [tclug-list] OT - Comcast In-Reply-To: <14FC5ED9-7B36-4A58-9466-ABE163FF9E92@visi.com> References: <200508101628.j7AGSUHc002261@delta.twp-llc.com> <37303.192.28.2.17.1123692577.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <14FC5ED9-7B36-4A58-9466-ABE163FF9E92@visi.com> Message-ID: <20050811001439.9C68E340A@skuld.wookimus.net> Tim Wilson wrote: > *lightning bolt* > > Ah, would this work? Can I just forward 6881-6882, say, to one > internal IP address and 6883-6884 to another, etc. Yes, and you can choose any range you want. The bittorrent client allows you to specify which ports you want to use. I wonder if the new bittorrent beta can do multiple connections on one port. It should be able to. I'm not sure why Bram chose to have multiple ports anyway. Perhaps it was easier to implement originally, but from what I understand about TCP sockets, not THAT much easier. *shrug* -- Chad Walstrom http://www.wookimus.net/ assert(expired(knowledge)); /* core dump */ From dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us Thu Aug 11 10:51:02 2005 From: dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us (Dana S. Millaway) Date: Thu Aug 11 10:54:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] How to name computers you plan to reference on dns server Message-ID: <001501c59e8c$7fdd0b50$c560000a@tcat> I am sure this is an easy question for most of you but I have tried various Google searches and searches in the Cobalt archives and either it is so simple a question, no one has asked or I am not using the right combination of search terms. :p I have a Cobalt Qube Pro3 running as our dns (and email and webserver) for the school. The initial setup was easy because the only server we needed to point our users to was the Qube and I was able to use the admin gui (the OS is a modified RedHat 6 or 7 from Sun). However, now I need to add several servers to the dns records - mostly web-based applications for gradebooks and student curriculum. These services are running on Win2K server, Win 2003 server (but we don't run a domain controller), Novell 6.5, and Linux. When I try to add forward and reverse records to the primary services in the gui, it insists on using our domain and accepts the settings when I save. I thought it was working but it is just my computer that works - perhaps because I have accessed several of the servers from My Network Places. The other windows and mac machines I have tried the links with cannot find the server. Is there something special to how I have to name the servers when I am configuring them? Is it possible to make a workgroup for the windows servers that would be named like our domain name? Is there some other file on the Qube I need to edit? I would really prefer to have the dns method work because as we grow, some of the servers may change and my users don't get how to change the ip address in the web address bar of their browser. I apologize for the cross-posting but I need to also install security certificates on some of the servers and I cannot do that until I am sure I have the servers named appropriately. Thanks in advance for any pointers, fixes or well-wishes. ;) (And I understand if I draw a few flames/RTM responses). Dana S. Millaway District Technology Coordinator Holdingford Public Schools 900 5th Street, P.O. Box 250 320-746-2221 x467 dmillaway@holdingford.k12.mn.us From sac at cheesecake.org Thu Aug 11 11:15:23 2005 From: sac at cheesecake.org (Sidney Cammeresi) Date: Thu Aug 11 11:16:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Equipment for free or sale Message-ID: <20050811161523.GA11672@cheesecake.org> Hello, I'm a long-time Linux user, first-time poster. I have some computer equipment of which I need to get rid. Athlon workstation -- AMD Athlon XP 1600, motherboard with onboard everything, GeForce4 Ti 4200 video card, 1GB RAM, Tekram 390F UW SCSI card, 36GB UW SCSI disk, some crappy IDE disk, floppy drive, Zip drive, case, power supply. It crashes every once in a while, but if nothing else has some good parts. (Also, the power button on the case failed about two years ago. Do not ask me why the power button failed because I have no idea. I fixed the problem by making my own power button out of one of those jumper connectors and a switch I bought at Radio Shack, but I accidentally bought a push-to-toggle switch instead of a momentary contact switch, so you click the switch twice to turn the machine on and click-wait-click to turn it off. (This machine has serious character.)) Sony CRT -- A Sony CPD-G500 21-inch virtually flat CRT. If you run it at 1600x1200, you will have to choose between good contrast or convergence. Lower resolutions are probably better. Please note that this monitor is very big and VERY HEAVY, about 80 lbs. Please mail me at sac@cheesecake.org and tell me (1) what you want and (2) a non-negative integer number of dollars you are willing to pay. Because I want to get rid of this stuff, I will accept bids of $0. Delivery is possible if needed, but will lower your priority if there are multiple bids; let me know if you need it. -- Sidney CAMMERESI http://www.cheesecake.org/sac/ From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Thu Aug 11 11:20:54 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Thu Aug 11 11:21:24 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] How to name computers you plan to reference on dns server In-Reply-To: <001501c59e8c$7fdd0b50$c560000a@tcat> References: <001501c59e8c$7fdd0b50$c560000a@tcat> Message-ID: <9d6c82530508110920ab64d9d@mail.gmail.com> What are you using to test the dns settings? Linux uses the 'host' command and 'dig', Windows uses nslookup. In either case run 'nslookup server dnsserver-ip' to see what the database has associated with the name. My guess is that the Windows computers aren't set up to use the correct domain to add the ending part automatically. Have you tried pinging using the full dns name (i.e. server.domain.org versus server) I believe there are two ways to add a domain to Windows computers: Go to the TCP/IP Network options for the LAN interface and click on the DNS tab. Choose Append these DNS suffixes and add the suffix of domain there. Or go to System control panel and the Computer Name tab. Click on change... and more... and add the Primary DNS suffix for the domain... reboot. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050811/a7596c59/attachment.htm From smac at visi.com Thu Aug 11 11:57:03 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Thu Aug 11 12:16:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] How to name computers you plan to reference on dns server In-Reply-To: <001501c59e8c$7fdd0b50$c560000a@tcat> References: <001501c59e8c$7fdd0b50$c560000a@tcat> Message-ID: <42FB835F.6000206@visi.com> Check the FQDN on the windows boxes right click my computer + network identification tab check your network settings and go in to the advanced settings and look at DNS settings. Sam. Dana S. Millaway wrote: >I am sure this is an easy question for most of you but I have tried >various Google searches and searches in the Cobalt archives and either >it is so simple a question, no one has asked or I am not using the right >combination of search terms. :p > >I have a Cobalt Qube Pro3 running as our dns (and email and webserver) >for the school. The initial setup was easy because the only server we >needed to point our users to was the Qube and I was able to use the >admin gui (the OS is a modified RedHat 6 or 7 from Sun). However, now I >need to add several servers to the dns records - mostly web-based >applications for gradebooks and student curriculum. These services are >running on Win2K server, Win 2003 server (but we don't run a domain >controller), Novell 6.5, and Linux. When I try to add forward and >reverse records to the primary services in the gui, it insists on using >our domain and accepts the settings when I save. I thought it was >working but it is just my computer that works - perhaps because I have >accessed several of the servers from My Network Places. The other >windows and mac machines I have tried the links with cannot find the >server. > >Is there something special to how I have to name the servers when I am >configuring them? Is it possible to make a workgroup for the windows >servers that would be named like our domain name? Is there some other >file on the Qube I need to edit? I would really prefer to have the dns >method work because as we grow, some of the servers may change and my >users don't get how to change the ip address in the web address bar of >their browser. > >I apologize for the cross-posting but I need to also install security >certificates on some of the servers and I cannot do that until I am sure >I have the servers named appropriately. > >Thanks in advance for any pointers, fixes or well-wishes. ;) >(And I understand if I draw a few flames/RTM responses). > >Dana S. Millaway >District Technology Coordinator >Holdingford Public Schools >900 5th Street, P.O. Box 250 >320-746-2221 x467 >dmillaway@holdingford.k12.mn.us > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > From dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us Thu Aug 11 14:49:46 2005 From: dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us (Dana S. Millaway) Date: Thu Aug 11 14:52:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: How to name computers you plan to reference on dns server Message-ID: <002601c59ead$d9e32500$c560000a@tcat> >: -----Original Message----- >: From: Dana S. Millaway [mailto:dmillaway@holdingford.k12.mn.us] >: Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 10:51 AM >: To: technology MSET (technology@mset.k12.mn.us); TC Lug >: (tclug-list@mn-linux.org); MEMO SID >: (memo-it@lists.hopkins.k12.mn.us); (scalug-list@mn-linux.org) >: Subject: How to name computers you plan to reference on dns server >: >: >: I am sure this is an easy question for most of you but I >: have tried various Google searches and searches in the >: Cobalt archives and either it is so simple a question, no >: one has asked or I am not using the right combination of >: search terms. :p >: >: I have a Cobalt Qube Pro3 running as our dns (and email and >: webserver) for the school. The initial setup was easy >: because the only server we needed to point our users to was >: the Qube and I was able to use the admin gui (the OS is a >: modified RedHat 6 or 7 from Sun). However, now I need to >: add several servers to the dns records - mostly web-based >: applications for gradebooks and student curriculum. These >: services are running on Win2K server, Win 2003 server (but >: we don't run a domain controller), Novell 6.5, and Linux. >: When I try to add forward and reverse records to the >: primary services in the gui, it insists on using our domain >: and accepts the settings when I save. I thought it was >: working but it is just my computer that works - perhaps >: because I have accessed several of the servers from My >: Network Places. The other windows and mac machines I have >: tried the links with cannot find the server. >: >: Is there something special to how I have to name the >: servers when I am configuring them? Is it possible to make >: a workgroup for the windows servers that would be named >: like our domain name? Is there some other file on the Qube >: I need to edit? I would really prefer to have the dns >: method work because as we grow, some of the servers may >: change and my users don't get how to change the ip address >: in the web address bar of their browser. >: >: I apologize for the cross-posting but I need to also >: install security certificates on some of the servers and I >: cannot do that until I am sure I have the servers named >: appropriately. >: >: Thanks in advance for any pointers, fixes or well-wishes. ;) >: (And I understand if I draw a few flames/RTM responses). >: >: A couple of clarifications for those who responded: 1. I have only 1 dns server within our system and it is running primary services only. It gets its dns information when necessary from another server upstream from us. 2. Our dns server IS NOT a windows box and I don't intend to put dns on a windoze box. :P A development in the saga: I tried pinging the family info server using just its hostname and got the server not found message. But when I pinged it with our domain name after it, it responded. So I specified the full name in the web address and voila!, it worked on both a mac and a win98 machine. I setup records for another of our app servers in the dns and it worked too. Yippee. So my remaining concern would be how to fill in the names of these app servers when I purchase my SSL certs. Do I use just the host name or the full name - ie - myserver.mydomain.k12.mn.us ? From sac at cheesecake.org Thu Aug 11 15:31:07 2005 From: sac at cheesecake.org (Sidney Cammeresi) Date: Thu Aug 11 15:32:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Equipment gone In-Reply-To: <20050811161523.GA11672@cheesecake.org> References: <20050811161523.GA11672@cheesecake.org> Message-ID: <20050811203107.GA12664@cheesecake.org> Equipment is spoken for; I sent mail to the recipients. Thanks, guys. -- Sidney CAMMERESI http://www.cheesecake.org/sac/ From cschumann at twp-llc.com Thu Aug 11 16:18:37 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Thu Aug 11 16:18:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fedora Cyrus Help Needed In-Reply-To: <200507251726.j6PHQcCD013788@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200507251726.j6PHQcCD013788@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <29552.192.28.2.17.1123795117.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Hey guys, I ran "yum update" on my server last night. Now cyrus-imapd is not working at all. Here's a bit of my /var/log/maillog: Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[9931]: about to exec /usr/lib/cyrus-imapd/imapd Aug 11 16:06:45 public imaps[9931]: DBERROR ^DA^K^H: db4 Aug 11 16:06:45 public imaps[9931]: DBERROR: critical database situation Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[9932]: about to exec /usr/lib/cyrus-imapd/lmtpd Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[9933]: about to exec /usr/lib/cyrus-imapd/notifyd Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[9934]: about to exec /usr/lib/cyrus-imapd/imapd Aug 11 16:06:45 public lmtpunix[9932]: DBERROR ??<81> ^H: db4 Aug 11 16:06:45 public lmtpunix[9932]: DBERROR: critical database situation Aug 11 16:06:45 public notify[9933]: DBERROR DO^H^H: db4 Aug 11 16:06:45 public notify[9933]: DBERROR: critical database situation Aug 11 16:06:45 public imap[9934]: DBERROR ^DA^K^H: db4 Aug 11 16:06:45 public imap[9934]: DBERROR: critical database situation Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[9935]: about to exec /usr/lib/cyrus-imapd/imapd Aug 11 16:06:45 public imaps[9935]: DBERROR ^DA^K^H: db4 Aug 11 16:06:45 public imaps[9935]: DBERROR: critical database situation Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: process 9930 exited, status 75 Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: service imap pid 9930 in READY state: terminated abnormally Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: process 9931 exited, status 75 Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: service imaps pid 9931 in READY state: terminated abnormally Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: process 9932 exited, status 75 Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: service lmtpunix pid 9932 in READY state: terminated abnormally Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: process 9933 exited, status 75 Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: service notify pid 9933 in READY state: terminated abnormally Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: process 9934 exited, status 75 Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: service imap pid 9934 in READY state: terminated abnormally Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: process 9935 exited, status 75 Aug 11 16:06:45 public master[32001]: service imaps pid 9935 in READY state: terminated abnormally My e-mail server is down, and I'm stuck. It doesn't look like db4 was updated, but what should I do about the "critical database situation"? Thanks, Chris From dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us Thu Aug 11 20:51:19 2005 From: dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us (Dana S. Millaway) Date: Thu Aug 11 20:54:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Thanks for helping (was RE: How to name computers you plan to reference on dns server) Message-ID: <000401c59ee0$5be9d080$c560000a@tcat> I think I have it working thanks to all of the responses both on and off the lists I used. I even had couple of those "Aha" moments when another piece of the puzzle fell into place regarding dns domains. For the record for the Linux groups - my comment about windoze was to my friend who is a windows guru. She keeps trying to convert me. :) Next time I post, I will try to be more specific and concise in my questions and clarifying responses. Sometimes I think in pretty general layman terms as I don't have a lot of formal geek training - and what I have is aging. Thanks again and have a great weekend. Dana From josh at joshwelch.com Thu Aug 11 23:05:03 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Thu Aug 11 23:06:53 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: How to name computers you plan to reference on dns server In-Reply-To: <002601c59ead$d9e32500$c560000a@tcat> References: <002601c59ead$d9e32500$c560000a@tcat> Message-ID: <42FC1FEF.5090603@joshwelch.com> Dana S. Millaway wrote: > > A couple of clarifications for those who responded: > > 1. I have only 1 dns server within our system and it is running primary > services only. It gets its dns information when necessary from another > server upstream from us. > > 2. Our dns server IS NOT a windows box and I don't intend to put dns on > a windoze box. :P > > A development in the saga: > > I tried pinging the family info server using just its hostname and got > the server not found message. But when I pinged it with our domain name > after it, it responded. So I specified the full name in the web address > and voila!, it worked on both a mac and a win98 machine. I setup > records for another of our app servers in the dns and it worked too. > Yippee. > > So my remaining concern would be how to fill in the names of these app > servers when I purchase my SSL certs. Do I use just the host name or > the full name - ie - myserver.mydomain.k12.mn.us ? > You should specify the full domain name in a certificate, so yes use myserver.mydomain.k12.mn.us. From jus at krytosvirus.com Fri Aug 12 05:44:54 2005 From: jus at krytosvirus.com (Justin Krejci) Date: Fri Aug 12 05:47:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RE: How to name computers you plan to reference on =?iso-8859-1?q?dns=09server?= In-Reply-To: <16461933.1123819883627.JavaMail.root@sniper34> References: <002601c59ead$d9e32500$c560000a@tcat> <16461933.1123819883627.JavaMail.root@sniper34> Message-ID: <200508120544.55531.jus@krytosvirus.com> On Thursday 11 August 2005 11:05 pm, Josh Welch wrote: > Dana S. Millaway wrote: > > A couple of clarifications for those who responded: > > > > 1. I have only 1 dns server within our system and it is running primary > > services only. It gets its dns information when necessary from another > > server upstream from us. > > > > 2. Our dns server IS NOT a windows box and I don't intend to put dns on > > a windoze box. :P > > > > A development in the saga: > > > > I tried pinging the family info server using just its hostname and got > > the server not found message. But when I pinged it with our domain name > > after it, it responded. So I specified the full name in the web address > > and voila!, it worked on both a mac and a win98 machine. I setup > > records for another of our app servers in the dns and it worked too. > > Yippee. > > > > So my remaining concern would be how to fill in the names of these app > > servers when I purchase my SSL certs. Do I use just the host name or > > the full name - ie - myserver.mydomain.k12.mn.us ? > > You should specify the full domain name in a certificate, so yes use > myserver.mydomain.k12.mn.us. > Yes, the primary thing you want to make sure you have correct is the "Common Name" in the SSL certificate as the "Common Name" field is what you will have in the URL for people to go to.... ie https://common-name.domain.com or whatever it is. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Fri Aug 12 08:32:52 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Fri Aug 12 08:33:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508121332.j7CDWqn18835@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: UPS Battery Backup - APC 725va Brand new in the box. $50 obo. Email jsanborn at earthlink dot net (live in NW burbs) Seller Email address: jsanborn at earthlink dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From brockn at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 10:04:13 2005 From: brockn at gmail.com (Brock Noland) Date: Fri Aug 12 10:04:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks Message-ID: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> I live near a corporate coffee shop which offers free wireless access. I can use there signal in the portion of my house which is nearest the coffee shop. *If* I wanted to boost their signal so that I could use it throughout my house, what is the best way? I could setup a proxy in that part of the host, but I would prefer a "store bought" solution. A quick search of Google for wireless range extender and wireless signal amplifier does not lead to productive results. Any ideas? Thanks Brock From cschumann at twp-llc.com Fri Aug 12 10:26:40 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Fri Aug 12 10:27:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Fedora Cyrus SOLVED In-Reply-To: <200508121050.j7CAo9DE004792@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200508121050.j7CAo9DE004792@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <12521.192.28.2.17.1123860400.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 16:18:37 -0500 (CDT) > From: "Chris Schumann" > Hey guys, I ran "yum update" on my server last night. Now cyrus-imapd is > not working at all. Here's a bit of my /var/log/maillog: > /usr/lib/cyrus-imapd/imapd Aug 11 16:06:45 public imaps[9931]: DBERROR > ^DA^K^H: db4 It turns out this has been solved before. The db4 database got corrupted somehow, perhaps after an update of software opened the file. Anyway, simply running db42_recover on the database files made it all work again. I found the solution using Google on a forum somewhere. Chris From tclug at natecarlson.com Fri Aug 12 10:27:28 2005 From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Fri Aug 12 10:28:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks In-Reply-To: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> References: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, Brock Noland wrote: > I live near a corporate coffee shop which offers free wireless access. I > can use there signal in the portion of my house which is nearest the > coffee shop. *If* I wanted to boost their signal so that I could use it > throughout my house, what is the best way? First of all, ask for permission first. > I could setup a proxy in that part of the host, but I would prefer a > "store bought" solution. A quick search of Google for wireless range > extender and wireless signal amplifier does not lead to productive > results. Any ideas? I know you can use these as repeaters: http://www.dlink.com/products/?sec=1&pid=292 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | nate carlson | natecars@natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com | | depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981 | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rwh at visi.com Fri Aug 12 10:38:50 2005 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Fri Aug 12 10:41:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks In-Reply-To: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> References: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FCC28A.1040606@visi.com> Linksys and a couple of others offer range extenders which appear to be WAPs running in bridged mode that basically act as repeaters. If you can place one in your house that can hit the coffee shop and provides wireless coverage for the rest of your house, you should be good to go. The other option is to get better antennae for the wireless units in other parts of your house but that seems less interesting. For range extenders take a look at: http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=10403629&loc=101&sp=1 http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=10381274&loc=101&sp=1 http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Satellite?childpagename=US%2FLayout&packedargs=c%3DL_Promotion_C1%26cid%3D1121121186018&pagename=Linksys%2FCommon%2FVisitorWrapper And I think Apple's little wireless unit can operate in bridge mode as well, http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/ I would also think that it would be possible to grab one of the cheap Linksys WAPs and load up one of the replacement firmware packages to run it in bridge mode. That said, you may want to consider whether you want to do the 'free rider' thing or not. Its probably legal but it certainly isn't without issues. --rick Brock Noland wrote: >I live near a corporate coffee shop which offers free wireless access. >I can use there signal in the portion of my house which is nearest the >coffee shop. *If* I wanted to boost their signal so that I could use >it throughout my house, what is the best way? > >I could setup a proxy in that part of the host, but I would prefer a >"store bought" solution. A quick search of Google for wireless range >extender and wireless signal amplifier does not lead to productive >results. Any ideas? > >Thanks > >Brock > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > From brockn at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 11:02:39 2005 From: brockn at gmail.com (Brock Noland) Date: Fri Aug 12 11:04:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks In-Reply-To: <42FCC28A.1040606@visi.com> References: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> <42FCC28A.1040606@visi.com> Message-ID: <741dcbb805081209021ac8b62c@mail.gmail.com> Thanks everyone! I think I am going to go for the "Hawking Wireless-G Range Extender - HWUR54G." ( I want something my girlfriend can figure out while I am not around.) Thanks Again, Brock PS For those interested, I did ask permission and was granted permission by the employee on duty (cashier). So I am taking that as is and running with it! On 8/12/05, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > Linksys and a couple of others offer range extenders which appear to be > WAPs running in bridged mode that basically act as repeaters. If you can > place one in your house that can hit the coffee shop and provides > wireless coverage for the rest of your house, you should be good to go. > The other option is to get better antennae for the wireless units in > other parts of your house but that seems less interesting. > > For range extenders take a look at: > > http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=10403629&loc=101&sp=1 > http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=10381274&loc=101&sp=1 > http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Satellite?childpagename=US%2FLayout&packedargs=c%3DL_Promotion_C1%26cid%3D1121121186018&pagename=Linksys%2FCommon%2FVisitorWrapper > > And I think Apple's little wireless unit can operate in bridge mode as > well, http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/ I would also think that it > would be possible to grab one of the cheap Linksys WAPs and load up one > of the replacement firmware packages to run it in bridge mode. > > That said, you may want to consider whether you want to do the 'free > rider' thing or not. Its probably legal but it certainly isn't without > issues. > > --rick > > > Brock Noland wrote: > > >I live near a corporate coffee shop which offers free wireless access. > >I can use there signal in the portion of my house which is nearest the > >coffee shop. *If* I wanted to boost their signal so that I could use > >it throughout my house, what is the best way? > > > >I could setup a proxy in that part of the host, but I would prefer a > >"store bought" solution. A quick search of Google for wireless range > >extender and wireless signal amplifier does not lead to productive > >results. Any ideas? > > > >Thanks > > > >Brock > > > >_______________________________________________ > >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > >tclug-list@mn-linux.org > >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > From david.fawcett at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 11:03:22 2005 From: david.fawcett at gmail.com (David Fawcett) Date: Fri Aug 12 11:05:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian Install - NIC Card Question Message-ID: I have installed FC3 on another machine, but I am doing my first Debian install. I am putting it on a Dell 1400SC server with an onboard Ethernet card. The Debian installer is asking for the name of the driver. Do I need to specify a driver if port is on the motherboard? Thanks, David. From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 12 11:13:25 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 12 11:15:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks In-Reply-To: <741dcbb805081209021ac8b62c@mail.gmail.com> References: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> <42FCC28A.1040606@visi.com> <741dcbb805081209021ac8b62c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, Brock Noland wrote: > For those interested, I did ask permission and was granted permission by > the employee on duty (cashier). So I am taking that as is and running > with it! Good one. But don't they shut it off after hours? I guess that wouldn't be a problem if they are open long enough hours! Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 12 11:25:15 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 12 11:27:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems Message-ID: I want to put together a 64-bit Linux server system using AMD chips (I'm assuming that would give maximum bang for the buck). I guess I could run Fedora Core 4 x64 version with multiple CPUs. What do you all think? Is FC4 a good choice? Is there another Linux distro that can use the 64-bit system? For information about CPUs, someone directed me here: > Here is a very good site to look at for AMD Opteron chips. It has a list > of all current AMD Opteron chips, single- and dual-core, 130nm and 90nm > processes, 1-way, 2-way, and 8-way CPUs. > > http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118_8796_9240,00.html It is an excellent site. Also, they have links to useful performance benchmarks. I guess what I'm seeing is basically what I'd expect -- the dual cores are faster than single cores, but not twice as fast. The dual cores cost more than twice as much as the single cores. But the 4-socket mobo costs a lot more than the 2-socket mobo, so there is some trade off as you go up the price ladder by adding more CPUs to your machine. Here are some numbers for 8xx processors (up to eight per mobo): Processor Speed core price (pricewatch.com) --------- ------ ------ ----- Model 852 2.6GHz single $1350 Model 850 2.4GHz single $1100 Model 848 2.2GHz single $ 847 Model 875 2.2GHz dual $2350 Model 846 2.0GHz single $ 623 Model 870 2.0GHz dual $2155 Model 844 1.8GHz single $ 690 Model 865 1.8GHz dual $1520 The 846 at only $615 + S/H is a steal. Here are some numbers for 2xx processors (up to two per mobo): Processor Speed core price (pricewatch.com) --------- ------ ------ ----- Model 248 2.2GHz single $ 349 Model 275 2.2GHz dual $ 856 Model 246 2.0GHz single $ 225 Model 270 2.0GHz dual $ 856 Model 244 1.8GHz single $ 194 Model 265 1.8GHz dual $ 855 A Tyan S4882 Thunder K8QS Pro Motherboard with four Opteron 846 single-core CPUs would cost about $3642 (4 x $623 + $1150). But a Tyan S2881G2NR Dual Socket 940 Opteron Motherboard with two Opteron 275 dual-core CPUs would probably be about 90% as fast (60-70% faster per cpu for the dual cores and 10% more for the faster clock rate), but it would cost only $2162 (2 x $856 + $450). Interesting. I'll have to check to see how much money I can afford to blow on this. For 8-socket boards, it looks like Tyan Thunder K8QW (S4881) is out, but you seem to need to put two of them together to get 8 sockets, so I think we're talking about $3800 or so just for the mobo for 8-sockets. Hmmm... the more I think about it, the better the two dual-cores at 2.2 GHz for about $2200 is looking. After that you start to pay a lot more to get a little improvement. Any tips on this stuff would be greatly appreciated. Are any of you running a 64-bit Linux OS on a multi-processor Opteron machine? Thanks in advance for any ideas you can share. Best, Mike -- Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Division of Epidemiology and Community Health and Institute of Human Genetics University of Minnesota http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ From brockn at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 11:27:47 2005 From: brockn at gmail.com (Brock Noland) Date: Fri Aug 12 11:29:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks In-Reply-To: References: <741dcbb805081208043e00318d@mail.gmail.com> <42FCC28A.1040606@visi.com> <741dcbb805081209021ac8b62c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <741dcbb805081209273a90c1dd@mail.gmail.com> You would think so, but they don't!! Seems like alot the wireless in coffee shops around here is done by a handful of "service providers" instead of the coffee shops themselves. I guess they could turn it off with features similar to those on the WRT54G, but apparently they don't want to configure that for each shops hours.. Thanks again! Brock On 8/12/05, Mike Miller wrote: > On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, Brock Noland wrote: > > > For those interested, I did ask permission and was granted permission by > > the employee on duty (cashier). So I am taking that as is and running > > with it! > > Good one. But don't they shut it off after hours? I guess that wouldn't > be a problem if they are open long enough hours! > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From brockn at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 11:36:11 2005 From: brockn at gmail.com (Brock Noland) Date: Fri Aug 12 11:37:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <741dcbb8050812093639076c87@mail.gmail.com> SuSe has support for 64 bit processors. We use that on about 200 64bit boxes. Stable as ever! Brock On 8/12/05, Mike Miller wrote: > I want to put together a 64-bit Linux server system using AMD chips (I'm > assuming that would give maximum bang for the buck). I guess I could run > Fedora Core 4 x64 version with multiple CPUs. What do you all think? Is > FC4 a good choice? Is there another Linux distro that can use the 64-bit > system? > > For information about CPUs, someone directed me here: > > > Here is a very good site to look at for AMD Opteron chips. It has a list > > of all current AMD Opteron chips, single- and dual-core, 130nm and 90nm > > processes, 1-way, 2-way, and 8-way CPUs. > > > > http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118_8796_9240,00.html > > It is an excellent site. Also, they have links to useful performance > benchmarks. I guess what I'm seeing is basically what I'd expect -- the > dual cores are faster than single cores, but not twice as fast. The dual > cores cost more than twice as much as the single cores. But the 4-socket > mobo costs a lot more than the 2-socket mobo, so there is some trade off > as you go up the price ladder by adding more CPUs to your machine. > > Here are some numbers for 8xx processors (up to eight per mobo): > > Processor Speed core price (pricewatch.com) > --------- ------ ------ ----- > Model 852 2.6GHz single $1350 > Model 850 2.4GHz single $1100 > Model 848 2.2GHz single $ 847 > Model 875 2.2GHz dual $2350 > Model 846 2.0GHz single $ 623 > Model 870 2.0GHz dual $2155 > Model 844 1.8GHz single $ 690 > Model 865 1.8GHz dual $1520 > > The 846 at only $615 + S/H is a steal. > > Here are some numbers for 2xx processors (up to two per mobo): > > Processor Speed core price (pricewatch.com) > --------- ------ ------ ----- > Model 248 2.2GHz single $ 349 > Model 275 2.2GHz dual $ 856 > Model 246 2.0GHz single $ 225 > Model 270 2.0GHz dual $ 856 > Model 244 1.8GHz single $ 194 > Model 265 1.8GHz dual $ 855 > > > A Tyan S4882 Thunder K8QS Pro Motherboard with four Opteron 846 > single-core CPUs would cost about $3642 (4 x $623 + $1150). But a Tyan > S2881G2NR Dual Socket 940 Opteron Motherboard with two Opteron 275 > dual-core CPUs would probably be about 90% as fast (60-70% faster per cpu > for the dual cores and 10% more for the faster clock rate), but it would > cost only $2162 (2 x $856 + $450). > > Interesting. I'll have to check to see how much money I can afford to > blow on this. > > For 8-socket boards, it looks like Tyan Thunder K8QW (S4881) is out, but > you seem to need to put two of them together to get 8 sockets, so I think > we're talking about $3800 or so just for the mobo for 8-sockets. > > Hmmm... the more I think about it, the better the two dual-cores at 2.2 > GHz for about $2200 is looking. After that you start to pay a lot more to > get a little improvement. > > Any tips on this stuff would be greatly appreciated. Are any of you > running a 64-bit Linux OS on a multi-processor Opteron machine? > > Thanks in advance for any ideas you can share. > > Best, > > Mike > > -- > Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. > Assistant Professor > Division of Epidemiology and Community Health > and Institute of Human Genetics > University of Minnesota > http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From sac at cheesecake.org Fri Aug 12 11:42:07 2005 From: sac at cheesecake.org (Sidney Cammeresi) Date: Fri Aug 12 11:43:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050812164207.GA15775@cheesecake.org> On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 at 11.25.15 -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > Any tips on this stuff would be greatly appreciated. Are any of you > running a 64-bit Linux OS on a multi-processor Opteron machine? I am running SuSE 9.3 on a few two-way Sun V40z machines. The machine and the OS seem fine, although my stuff isn't anywhere near CPU intensive enough to challenge these machines at all. (I did not choose this vastly overpowered hardware.) The only problems I've had are from stuff I insist on building myself (like Python add-ons) which gets confused about whether to put its goodies in lib or lib64 subdirectories. -- Sidney CAMMERESI http://www.cheesecake.org/sac/ From cncole at earthlink.net Fri Aug 12 12:07:39 2005 From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole) Date: Fri Aug 12 12:09:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks In-Reply-To: <741dcbb805081209273a90c1dd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I've checked and used a bunch of coffee shop and restaurant free hotspots after hours just by parking my van in the parking lot. None I've checked or heard of turn off the WiFi after hours. One reason may be that most units have no way other than power off and being off that long makes the router forget its special SSID and other settings for that provider (eg, most SurfThing cases). Chuck > -----Original Message----- > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Brock Noland > > You would think so, but they don't!! Seems like alot the wireless in > coffee shops around here is done by a handful of "service providers" > instead of the coffee shops themselves. I guess they could turn it off > with features similar to those on the WRT54G, but apparently they > don't want to configure that for each shops hours.. > > Thanks again! > > Brock > > On 8/12/05, Mike Miller wrote: > > On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, Brock Noland wrote: > > > > > For those interested, I did ask permission and was granted permission by > > > the employee on duty (cashier). So I am taking that as is and running > > > with it! > > > > Good one. But don't they shut it off after hours? I guess that wouldn't > > be a problem if they are open long enough hours! > > > > Mike From ringert at consumption.net Fri Aug 12 12:10:49 2005 From: ringert at consumption.net (Torleiv Flatebo Ringer) Date: Fri Aug 12 12:13:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: tclug-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 17 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: what you said > Message: 7 > Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:03:22 -0500 > From: David Fawcett > Subject: [tclug-list] Debian Install - NIC Card Question > To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > I have installed FC3 on another machine, but I am doing my first > Debian install. I am putting it on a Dell 1400SC server with an > onboard Ethernet card. > > The Debian installer is asking for the name of the driver. Do I need > to specify a driver if port is on the motherboard? > > Thanks, > > David. Do an lspci, which will tell you the type of NIC, then you will need to google for the kernel driver to load using modprobe. -- As fast as it ever got, it never got fast enough for me. Hunter S. Thompson From josh at joshwelch.com Fri Aug 12 12:11:20 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Fri Aug 12 12:14:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian Install - NIC Card Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42FCD838.9020709@joshwelch.com> David Fawcett wrote: > I have installed FC3 on another machine, but I am doing my first > Debian install. I am putting it on a Dell 1400SC server with an > onboard Ethernet card. > > The Debian installer is asking for the name of the driver. Do I need > to specify a driver if port is on the motherboard? > > Thanks, > > David. > Doesn't matter where the port is, still need a driver to run it. That dell should have an Intel Pro 100 NIC, which is the eepro100 driver IIRC. Josh From florin at iucha.net Fri Aug 12 12:29:33 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Fri Aug 12 12:31:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian Install - NIC Card Question In-Reply-To: <42FCD838.9020709@joshwelch.com> References: <42FCD838.9020709@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <20050812172933.GB3206@iucha.net> On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 12:11:20PM -0500, Josh Welch wrote: > > I have installed FC3 on another machine, but I am doing my first > > Debian install. I am putting it on a Dell 1400SC server with an > > onboard Ethernet card. > > > > The Debian installer is asking for the name of the driver. Do I need > > to specify a driver if port is on the motherboard? Even if the device is on the motherboard, it is still connected via the PCI or ISA bus. The system/driver does not care. > Doesn't matter where the port is, still need a driver to run it. That > dell should have an Intel Pro 100 NIC, which is the eepro100 driver IIRC. The eepro100 is the old (Donald Becker) driver. Use e100 instead as it is the new driver developed with help from Intel. It has higher performance and supports power management. florin -- Don't question authority: they don't know either! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050812/b47c3f7e/attachment.pgp From david.fawcett at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 13:34:23 2005 From: david.fawcett at gmail.com (David Fawcett) Date: Fri Aug 12 13:35:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian Install - NIC Card Question In-Reply-To: <20050812172933.GB3206@iucha.net> References: <42FCD838.9020709@joshwelch.com> <20050812172933.GB3206@iucha.net> Message-ID: It was an issue of the onboard controller being disabled in the bios. Thanks! On 8/12/05, Florin Iucha wrote: > On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 12:11:20PM -0500, Josh Welch wrote: > > > I have installed FC3 on another machine, but I am doing my first > > > Debian install. I am putting it on a Dell 1400SC server with an > > > onboard Ethernet card. > > > > > > The Debian installer is asking for the name of the driver. Do I need > > > to specify a driver if port is on the motherboard? > > Even if the device is on the motherboard, it is still connected via > the PCI or ISA bus. The system/driver does not care. > > > Doesn't matter where the port is, still need a driver to run it. That > > dell should have an Intel Pro 100 NIC, which is the eepro100 driver IIRC. > > The eepro100 is the old (Donald Becker) driver. Use e100 instead as it > is the new driver developed with help from Intel. It has higher > performance and supports power management. > > florin > > -- > > Don't question authority: they don't know either! > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFC/Nx9ND0rFCN2b1sRAnrUAJ9/s0KRfOjoOSRsksSgPZQGKcjOBgCfZyDx > WdlcFjMO4e2+JBH+pmr+9v4= > =BjKq > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > From david.fawcett at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 13:37:15 2005 From: david.fawcett at gmail.com (David Fawcett) Date: Fri Aug 12 13:39:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Extending Wireless Networks In-Reply-To: References: <741dcbb805081209273a90c1dd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Just beware of recent cases in other states where people have been arrested for 'stealing' wifi from outside of the building. On 8/12/05, Chuck Cole wrote: > I've checked and used a bunch of coffee shop and restaurant free hotspots after hours just by parking my van in the parking lot. > None I've checked or heard of turn off the WiFi after hours. One reason may be that most units have no way other than power off and > being off that long makes the router forget its special SSID and other settings for that provider (eg, most SurfThing cases). > > Chuck > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org > > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Brock Noland > > > > You would think so, but they don't!! Seems like alot the wireless in > > coffee shops around here is done by a handful of "service providers" > > instead of the coffee shops themselves. I guess they could turn it off > > with features similar to those on the WRT54G, but apparently they > > don't want to configure that for each shops hours.. > > > > Thanks again! > > > > Brock > > > > On 8/12/05, Mike Miller wrote: > > > On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, Brock Noland wrote: > > > > > > > For those interested, I did ask permission and was granted permission by > > > > the employee on duty (cashier). So I am taking that as is and running > > > > with it! > > > > > > Good one. But don't they shut it off after hours? I guess that wouldn't > > > be a problem if they are open long enough hours! > > > > > > Mike > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From dan at dandrake.org Fri Aug 12 13:41:58 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (dan) Date: Fri Aug 12 13:43:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050812184158.GA7242@dandrake.org> On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 at 11:25AM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > I want to put together a 64-bit Linux server system using AMD chips > (I'm assuming that would give maximum bang for the buck). I guess I > could run Fedora Core 4 x64 version with multiple CPUs. What do you > all think? Is FC4 a good choice? Is there another Linux distro that > can use the 64-bit system? Debian unstable works just fine with 64-bit systems, from what I've heard. Maybe testing or stable, too. For CPUs, are you looking at Athlon 64s? Those are nice too, but I don't know how they compare to Opterons, price- and performance-wise. The math department here has a lab of Athlon 64s running FC3. They're fast -- they're 2200 MHz single-processor machines, and they beat out the dual-processor 2133 MHz Athlons in another lab here. Dan -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050812/f3e43fc4/attachment.pgp From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Fri Aug 12 14:53:47 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Fri Aug 12 14:55:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42FCFE4B.3030503@mchsi.com> Mike Miller wrote: > I want to put together a 64-bit Linux server system using AMD chips (I'm > assuming that would give maximum bang for the buck). I guess I could > run Fedora Core 4 x64 version with multiple CPUs. What do you all > think? Is FC4 a good choice? Is there another Linux distro that can > use the 64-bit system? I rum Gentoo on and AMD64 2800+ w/ 1gb ram and I must say it kicks ass. I am impressed beyond belief. (definitely prefer it to my damned athlon 4 1600+ laptop that turns off because of heat issues when doing a kernel compile!!!) Anyway, I do believe I have read on the gentoo lists and #gentoo-amd64 on freenode that it supports multi proc machines and dual core single or dual core multi proc machines just fine, too. that's what I know, feel free to write with any questions, or if you would like help installing, I can bring a amd64 gentoo install cd and my brain, (the cd may be of more help.. :p) nick > > For information about CPUs, someone directed me here: > >> Here is a very good site to look at for AMD Opteron chips. It has a >> list of all current AMD Opteron chips, single- and dual-core, 130nm >> and 90nm processes, 1-way, 2-way, and 8-way CPUs. >> >> http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118_8796_9240,00.html >> > > > It is an excellent site. Also, they have links to useful performance > benchmarks. I guess what I'm seeing is basically what I'd expect -- the > dual cores are faster than single cores, but not twice as fast. The > dual cores cost more than twice as much as the single cores. But the > 4-socket mobo costs a lot more than the 2-socket mobo, so there is some > trade off as you go up the price ladder by adding more CPUs to your > machine. > > Here are some numbers for 8xx processors (up to eight per mobo): > > Processor Speed core price (pricewatch.com) > --------- ------ ------ ----- > Model 852 2.6GHz single $1350 > Model 850 2.4GHz single $1100 > Model 848 2.2GHz single $ 847 > Model 875 2.2GHz dual $2350 > Model 846 2.0GHz single $ 623 > Model 870 2.0GHz dual $2155 > Model 844 1.8GHz single $ 690 > Model 865 1.8GHz dual $1520 > > The 846 at only $615 + S/H is a steal. > > Here are some numbers for 2xx processors (up to two per mobo): > > Processor Speed core price (pricewatch.com) > --------- ------ ------ ----- > Model 248 2.2GHz single $ 349 > Model 275 2.2GHz dual $ 856 > Model 246 2.0GHz single $ 225 > Model 270 2.0GHz dual $ 856 > Model 244 1.8GHz single $ 194 > Model 265 1.8GHz dual $ 855 > > > A Tyan S4882 Thunder K8QS Pro Motherboard with four Opteron 846 > single-core CPUs would cost about $3642 (4 x $623 + $1150). But a Tyan > S2881G2NR Dual Socket 940 Opteron Motherboard with two Opteron 275 > dual-core CPUs would probably be about 90% as fast (60-70% faster per > cpu for the dual cores and 10% more for the faster clock rate), but it > would cost only $2162 (2 x $856 + $450). > > Interesting. I'll have to check to see how much money I can afford to > blow on this. > > For 8-socket boards, it looks like Tyan Thunder K8QW (S4881) is out, but > you seem to need to put two of them together to get 8 sockets, so I > think we're talking about $3800 or so just for the mobo for 8-sockets. > > Hmmm... the more I think about it, the better the two dual-cores at 2.2 > GHz for about $2200 is looking. After that you start to pay a lot more > to get a little improvement. > > Any tips on this stuff would be greatly appreciated. Are any of you > running a 64-bit Linux OS on a multi-processor Opteron machine? > > Thanks in advance for any ideas you can share. > > Best, > > Mike > -- ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------ From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 18:47:04 2005 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Fri Aug 12 18:47:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: <42FCFE4B.3030503@mchsi.com> References: <42FCFE4B.3030503@mchsi.com> Message-ID: On 8/12/05, Nicholas Thompson wrote: > > I rum Gentoo on and AMD64 2800+ w/ 1gb ram and I must say it kicks ass. > I am impressed beyond belief. (definitely prefer it to my damned athlon > 4 1600+ laptop that turns off because of heat issues when doing a kernel > compile!!!) > I was going to pipe up with a Gentoo recommendation as well (I <3 Gentoo), but I have not actually installed the 64 bit version, I just know there is one. > > that's what I know, feel free to write with any questions, or if you > would like help installing, I can bring a amd64 gentoo install cd and my > brain, (the cd may be of more help.. :p) hehe, I know what you mean ;) I have been working with Gentoo for years and I still learn new things about it almost everyday. -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) From tpenney at gmail.com Fri Aug 12 18:46:47 2005 From: tpenney at gmail.com (Tom Penney) Date: Fri Aug 12 18:47:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] strange network problem Message-ID: <5c596d0e05081216462760a179@mail.gmail.com> I have new fedora core 3 box which I am having a strange network problem with. I can not get out to the net while logged in. I can get to the machine via ssh and apache is serving pages to the outside world but while logged into the machine I can not get this page: [tomp@highwire ~]$ wget http://localhost --16:38:59-- http://localhost/ => `index.html' Resolving localhost... 127.0.0.1 Connecting to localhost[127.0.0.1]:80... failed: Permission denied. Retrying. Names resolve, ping works but I cant get out: [root@highwire ~]# ping google.com PING google.com (216.239.57.99) 56(84) bytes of data. 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99: icmp_seq=0 ttl=242 time=78.1 ms 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99: icmp_seq=1 ttl=242 time=77.9 ms 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99: icmp_seq=2 ttl=242 time=77.9 ms --- google.com ping statistics --- 3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time 2001ms rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 77.912/78.019/78.194/0.345 ms, pipe 2 [root@highwire ~]# telnet 216.239.57.99 80 Trying 216.239.57.99... telnet: connect to address 216.239.57.99: Permission denied telnet: Unable to connect to remote host: Permission denied I get the same type of error when I ssh out. although I can ssh into the box fine. [root@highwire ~]# ssh samba.circussoftware.com ssh: connect to host samba.circussoftware.com port 22: Permission denied I don't think it's a local firewall but it sure seems like it: [root@highwire ~]# iptables -L Chain INPUT (policy ACCEPT) target prot opt source destination Chain FORWARD (policy ACCEPT) target prot opt source destination Chain OUTPUT (policy ACCEPT) target prot opt source destination Does anyone have any Idea what could be going on here? -- Tom Penney From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 12 18:57:38 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 12 18:59:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: <20050812184158.GA7242@dandrake.org> References: <20050812184158.GA7242@dandrake.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, dan wrote: > On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 at 11:25AM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: >> I want to put together a 64-bit Linux server system using AMD chips >> (I'm assuming that would give maximum bang for the buck). I guess I >> could run Fedora Core 4 x64 version with multiple CPUs. What do you >> all think? Is FC4 a good choice? Is there another Linux distro that >> can use the 64-bit system? > > Debian unstable works just fine with 64-bit systems, from what I've > heard. Maybe testing or stable, too. Ah... http://www.debian.org/ports/amd64/ Thanks! > For CPUs, are you looking at Athlon 64s? Those are nice too, but I don't > know how they compare to Opterons, price- and performance-wise. I thought the Athlons were for single-processor systems. Now I'm not sure. Anyone know? I think maybe I need Opteron to use SMP. Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 12 19:00:37 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 12 19:01:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: References: <42FCFE4B.3030503@mchsi.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, Loren H. Burlingame wrote: > I was going to pipe up with a Gentoo recommendation as well (I <3 > Gentoo), but I have not actually installed the 64 bit version, I just > know there is one. Nice... http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_AMD_64 So it looks like we have x64 versions of Fedora 4, Suse 9, Debian and Gentoo. Too many choices! There is also an x64 version of Win XP, but I won't be running that. My son is a 13-year-old gamer, so I did put XP x64 on his Athlon. It's working, definitely, and I have to admit that windows is better than it used to be, but that isn't saying much! Mike From florin at iucha.net Fri Aug 12 23:14:49 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Fri Aug 12 23:15:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: References: <42FCFE4B.3030503@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <20050813041449.GD3206@iucha.net> On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 07:00:37PM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > So it looks like we have x64 versions of Fedora 4, Suse 9, Debian and > Gentoo. Too many choices! U-bun-tu! U-bun-tu! florin -- Don't question authority: they don't know either! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050812/f692274f/attachment.pgp From kfuchs at winternet.com Fri Aug 12 23:43:33 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Fri Aug 12 23:45:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: (message from Mike Miller on Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:25:15 -0500 (CDT)) References: Message-ID: <200508130443.j7D4hX728957@ecstasy1.winternet.com> >Any tips on this stuff would be greatly appreciated. Are any of you >running a 64-bit Linux OS on a multi-processor Opteron machine? I run a dual Opteron system using LinuxBIOS with AMD64 Fedora Core 2 and now Fedora Core 3. I haven't installed Fedora Core 4 yet, but I'm positive that AMD64 Debian would be better and plan to install it next. A cluster of single core, dual (two socket) Opteron systems may be a lot cheaper than dual core Opterons on four or eight socket mainboards. Either way, Tyan is the best choice for multiple socket mainboards. They also have the best support for LinuxBIOS and will supply LinuxBIOS on all mainboards they sell. (Disclaimer: I have no connection with Tyan, other than using a few of their mainboards.) The Cell processor with its central PPC core and eight Synergistic Processing Units (SPU) is an interesting alternative to true multi-core CPUs. Linux runs on the central PPC core and the central core controls what the eight SPUs do. Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From jus at krytosvirus.com Sat Aug 13 04:50:31 2005 From: jus at krytosvirus.com (Justin Krejci) Date: Sat Aug 13 04:51:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 64-bit systems In-Reply-To: <3346095.1123890528961.JavaMail.root@Sniper26> References: <42FCFE4B.3030503@mchsi.com> <3346095.1123890528961.JavaMail.root@Sniper26> Message-ID: <200508130450.32061.jus@krytosvirus.com> On Friday 12 August 2005 06:47 pm, Loren H. Burlingame wrote: > On 8/12/05, Nicholas Thompson wrote: > > I rum Gentoo on and AMD64 2800+ w/ 1gb ram and I must say it kicks ass. > > I am impressed beyond belief. (definitely prefer it to my damned athlon > > 4 1600+ laptop that turns off because of heat issues when doing a kernel > > compile!!!) > > I was going to pipe up with a Gentoo recommendation as well (I <3 > Gentoo), but I have not actually installed the 64 bit version, I just > know there is one. > > > that's what I know, feel free to write with any questions, or if you > > would like help installing, I can bring a amd64 gentoo install cd and my > > brain, (the cd may be of more help.. :p) > > hehe, I know what you mean ;) I have been working with Gentoo for > years and I still learn new things about it almost everyday. I'll chime in with a vote for 64bit Gentoo. My brother and I pitched in together to get a nice AMD64 machine. We have a Athon64 3000+ it is like 1.8gig or something. 2 gigs of RAM and some big IDE hard drives. Sure beats up my desktop running Gentoo (athlon 1.3 gig with 768 megs RAM). It has been super stable and has never had a single reboot. We have had 64-bit UT2004 dedicated server running on it for 3 months straight. We also use it for streaming audio, IRC, simple web hosting, neverwinter nights serving, battle.net serving. Never had a single real problem with anything ever. Like the others I am sure, there is always really cool new things to learn regarding the Gentoo system. For example I started using this program called esearch.... wow does that speed up the "emerge -s WHATEVER" and especially the "emerge -S WHATEVER" Anyways... enjoy your new system when you get it with whatever OS you pick. From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Aug 13 12:19:03 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sat Aug 13 12:19:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu Message-ID: I want to do mostly scientific work plus email on a GNU/Linux server. Apparently all the major distros have 64-bit versions available, which helps. Now I'm trying to decide which distro will be best for my uses. I know that this is the kind of thing that starts "holy wars" and I really am not trying to start any such thing! ;-) If someone can give me comparative information about the distros that have been recommended, that would help. If you just want to say what you like or prefer, you can do that, but that kind of information is probably not going to help me much. If you can specify *why* you prefer one to another (and you actually have experience with both!), that would be really valuable information. So what are the biggest differences between these distros for a server class machine? Would these differences affect users much or mostly just administrators? To clarify what I'll be doing: Mostly numerical analysis (in statistical genetics) using specialized packages but also using Octave, R, and other standard GPL code. I will have about a dozen users all running VNC (Enterprise Edition) desktops on the server. I want to run postfix and apache and some kind of webmail server. So, I won't be doing things like playing DVDs or music or games, so any distro differences on that kind of stuff is irrelevant. Thanks in advance for any ideas you can share. Mike -- Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Division of Epidemiology and Community Health and Institute of Human Genetics University of Minnesota http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ From smac at visi.com Sat Aug 13 12:19:10 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sat Aug 13 12:39:18 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42FE2B8E.8030605@visi.com> I would look for the distro that has the most 64bit sience applications available. Sam. Mike Miller wrote: > I want to do mostly scientific work plus email on a GNU/Linux server. > Apparently all the major distros have 64-bit versions available, which > helps. Now I'm trying to decide which distro will be best for my uses. > > I know that this is the kind of thing that starts "holy wars" and I > really am not trying to start any such thing! ;-) If someone can > give me comparative information about the distros that have been > recommended, that would help. If you just want to say what you like > or prefer, you can do that, but that kind of information is probably > not going to help me much. If you can specify *why* you prefer one to > another (and you actually have experience with both!), that would be > really valuable information. > > So what are the biggest differences between these distros for a server > class machine? Would these differences affect users much or mostly > just administrators? > > To clarify what I'll be doing: Mostly numerical analysis (in > statistical genetics) using specialized packages but also using > Octave, R, and other standard GPL code. I will have about a dozen > users all running VNC (Enterprise Edition) desktops on the server. I > want to run postfix and apache and some kind of webmail server. So, I > won't be doing things like playing DVDs or music or games, so any > distro differences on that kind of stuff is irrelevant. > > Thanks in advance for any ideas you can share. > > Mike > From hitokiri at acm.cs.umn.edu Sat Aug 13 00:53:13 2005 From: hitokiri at acm.cs.umn.edu (James M. Greene) Date: Sat Aug 13 13:13:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] FREE monitors and professional server racks up for grabs! Message-ID: <3189.66.253.168.81.1123912393.squirrel@acm.cs.umn.edu> Hello there, ACMers and TCLUGians. For those of you who are UofM ACM members, you may notice that our humble hardware swap (which is very nice, by the way... come check it out if you haven't already!) was blessed by the donation of about seven very nice 15" Compaq Pressario CRT monitors, as well as a box of very randomly assorted PCI cards (including an encryption card...) and other crazy stuff. All of this was donated (to me) by a man who lives out in St. Michael, Minnesota (about 30-45 minutes from the Cities, just before Albertville) named Kevin LaCombe. If anyone is interested, Kevin has about 10 (?) more nice 15" Compaq Pressario CRT monitors (with all the appropriate cords), a few ATX and IBM monitors of about 15" (give or take), and a slew of 12" IBM boxy-monitors (good for "under-the-bed" servers) up for free that he is trying to get out of his garage. He also has a box of large keyboards and mice (non-USB, of course) and some old printers that he is trying to get rid of. The monitors especially are great for test boxes and playful "project" computers. Furthermore, Kevin also has a set of IBM AS/400 9406-730 professional server racks (gutted, of course) that he is trying to get rid of as well. These are very nice, but are (as most of you know) very large and heavy, but would be VERY nice to have. If you are interested in any of these items, email Kevin ASAP at the following address and he should get back to you within a day: klacombe2002@yahoo.com Thanks for reading! Sincerely, James Greene ********************************************* * James M. Greene - hitokiri@acm.cs.umn.edu * * * * Association for Computing Machinery (ACM) * * Vice President, EE/CSci Bldg., Room 2-204 * * University of Minnesota - Student Chapter * ********************************************* From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sat Aug 13 13:19:34 2005 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Sat Aug 13 13:21:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/13/05, Mike Miller wrote: > I want to do mostly scientific work plus email on a GNU/Linux server. > Apparently all the major distros have 64-bit versions available, which > helps. Now I'm trying to decide which distro will be best for my uses. > I am not sure about the other distros but Gentoo is primarily geared toward the Linux desktop market. That is not to say it does not make a great server (I use one at home for personal uses and it has run for years with no problem) but for a high availibility production environment I would probably be hesitant to go that route, probably favoring, instead, a well vetted distro like SuSE or Redhat/Fedora. -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) From brockn at gmail.com Sat Aug 13 13:31:14 2005 From: brockn at gmail.com (Brock Noland) Date: Sat Aug 13 13:31:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <741dcbb80508131131554ee03f@mail.gmail.com> I would use Gentoo. Its the easiest to work with non-standard packages and since all packages are built from source, you can complile them as you wish with the use of USE flags. Like Loren said, Gentoo is not made for production servers because its much more bleeding edge. That said, it does not sound like your use will be "production" in the sense that it absolutley cannot fail no matter what. I have been running ~3-5 Gentoo boxes since 2003 and I have never had one crash. Two of them are primary/secondary x500 authentication servers (Mike will know what they are). Brock On 8/13/05, Loren H. Burlingame wrote: > On 8/13/05, Mike Miller wrote: > > I want to do mostly scientific work plus email on a GNU/Linux server. > > Apparently all the major distros have 64-bit versions available, which > > helps. Now I'm trying to decide which distro will be best for my uses. > > > > I am not sure about the other distros but Gentoo is primarily geared > toward the Linux desktop market. That is not to say it does not make a > great server (I use one at home for personal uses and it has run for > years with no problem) but for a high availibility production > environment I would probably be hesitant to go that route, probably > favoring, instead, a well vetted distro like SuSE or Redhat/Fedora. > > -- > Loren H. Burlingame > GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F > "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." > -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Aug 13 14:11:57 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sat Aug 13 14:13:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] FREE monitors and professional server racks up for grabs! In-Reply-To: <3189.66.253.168.81.1123912393.squirrel@acm.cs.umn.edu> References: <3189.66.253.168.81.1123912393.squirrel@acm.cs.umn.edu> Message-ID: On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, James M. Greene wrote: > Hello there, ACMers and TCLUGians. > > For those of you who are UofM ACM members, you may notice that our > humble hardware swap (which is very nice, by the way... come check it > out if you haven't already!) Can faculty partake in this hardware swapping? Mike From kfuchs at winternet.com Sun Aug 14 01:34:19 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Sun Aug 14 01:35:23 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: (message from Mike Miller on Sat, 13 Aug 2005 12:19:03 -0500 (CDT)) References: Message-ID: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> >Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 12:19:03 -0500 (CDT) >From: Mike Miller >I want to do mostly scientific work plus email on a GNU/Linux server. >Apparently all the major distros have 64-bit versions available, which >helps. Now I'm trying to decide which distro will be best for my uses. Perhaps a more specialized Linux distribution would be more suitable like ... https://www.scientificlinux.org/ http://bioinformatics.org/biobrew/ http://dnalinux.com/ These are usually Live CDs, may be x86 only (as opposed to AMD64). As far as I know they are being actively developed and are useful in their specialty, but I have not used them. I still think a cluster is what you need. There are several Linux cluster distributions that are available on Live CDs that are easy to setup. They should also have hard drive install options. >I know that this is the kind of thing that starts "holy wars" and I really >am not trying to start any such thing! ;-) If someone can give me >comparative information about the distros that have been recommended, that >would help. If you just want to say what you like or prefer, you can do >that, but that kind of information is probably not going to help me much. >If you can specify *why* you prefer one to another (and you actually have >experience with both!), that would be really valuable information. One good reason to choose Debian over all others is the huge number of well supported packages available for it, the deb package format and apt-get. I also use Fedora Core 4, but there aren't nearly as many packages for it, the packages are in rpm format which is considered by many to be inferior to deb and yum doesn't seem to work as well as apt-get. SUSE is also an excellent distribution and will get much better do to the recent announcement of http://www.openSUSE.org/. >So what are the biggest differences between these distros for a server >class machine? Would these differences affect users much or mostly just >administrators? The most important difference is how difficult it will be to install missing software and configure the Linux distribution to do what you need it to do. There should not be much performance differences, since the Linux kernel and most of the software will be the same, except that it may be packaged differently. >To clarify what I'll be doing: Mostly numerical analysis (in statistical >genetics) using specialized packages but also using Octave, R, and other >standard GPL code. I will have about a dozen users all running VNC >(Enterprise Edition) desktops on the server. I want to run postfix and >apache and some kind of webmail server. So, I won't be doing things like >playing DVDs or music or games, so any distro differences on that kind of >stuff is irrelevant. Just use the distribution that includes most of the software you need. How well a cluster will work depends on how fast the interconnect is and how much information must flow between nodes? These same issues will be need to be addressed in a single system with several multi-core CPUs, although the interconnect is bound to be much faster in a single (non-cluster) system. Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From ntraxler at mn.rr.com Sun Aug 14 11:13:27 2005 From: ntraxler at mn.rr.com (Nick Traxler) Date: Sun Aug 14 11:15:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] strange network problem In-Reply-To: <5c596d0e05081216462760a179@mail.gmail.com> References: <5c596d0e05081216462760a179@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FF6DA7.40207@mn.rr.com> You might have a firewall that's allowing ICMP but not TCP, but you can't conclude much from the tests below. Tom Penney wrote: > I have new fedora core 3 box which I am having a strange network problem with. > > I can not get out to the net while logged in. I can get to the machine > via ssh and apache is serving pages to the outside world but while > logged into the machine I can not get this page: > > [tomp@highwire ~]$ wget http://localhost > --16:38:59-- http://localhost/ > => `index.html' > Resolving localhost... 127.0.0.1 > Connecting to localhost[127.0.0.1]:80... failed: Permission denied. > Retrying. Try using wget with the hostname the rest of the world uses. Also, Apache may be set up to reject requests from localhost. > Names resolve, ping works but I cant get out: > > [root@highwire ~]# ping google.com > PING google.com (216.239.57.99) 56(84) bytes of data. > 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99: icmp_seq=0 ttl=242 time=78.1 ms > 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99: icmp_seq=1 ttl=242 time=77.9 ms > 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99: icmp_seq=2 ttl=242 time=77.9 ms > > --- google.com ping statistics --- > 3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time 2001ms > rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 77.912/78.019/78.194/0.345 ms, pipe 2 > > [root@highwire ~]# telnet 216.239.57.99 80 > Trying 216.239.57.99... > telnet: connect to address 216.239.57.99: Permission denied > telnet: Unable to connect to remote host: Permission denied I'm pretty sure www.google.com will only respond on port 80; try a wget with www.google.com. (Unless I'm having a brain fart, "Permission denied" means there's nothing listening on the port.) nmap will also give you a lot of info. > I get the same type of error when I ssh out. although I can ssh into > the box fine. > [root@highwire ~]# ssh samba.circussoftware.com > ssh: connect to host samba.circussoftware.com port 22: Permission denied Do you know sshd is running on that host? If it is, I'd look again for a firewall blocking outbound TCP traffic. Traceroute is your friend. > I don't think it's a local firewall but it sure seems like it: > [root@highwire ~]# iptables -L > Chain INPUT (policy ACCEPT) > target prot opt source destination > > Chain FORWARD (policy ACCEPT) > target prot opt source destination > > Chain OUTPUT (policy ACCEPT) > target prot opt source destination > > > Does anyone have any Idea what could be going on here? Do you have a cable/DSL router? I'd check the settings in there. If the machine connects directly to the Internet, try exploring with traceroute and nmap. Hope this helps, if you haven't fixed it already. Nick From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Aug 14 11:35:20 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sun Aug 14 11:35:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] cell processor (was "64-bit systems") In-Reply-To: <200508130443.j7D4hX728957@ecstasy1.winternet.com> References: <200508130443.j7D4hX728957@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Aug 2005, Ken Fuchs wrote: > The Cell processor with its central PPC core and eight Synergistic > Processing Units (SPU) is an interesting alternative to true multi-core > CPUs. Linux runs on the central PPC core and the central core controls > what the eight SPUs do. I found this... http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/06/07/0257221&tid=136&tid=137&tid=106 ...and it makes me think that Linux on the cell processor will be very effective for some uses, but those are probably a few years in the future. Think so? I'm also wondering how it will work for I/O intensive apps. It looks like it could be a killer number cruncher if only a little memory is needed, but if a lot of memory is needed, won't the Power core have to feed the SPUs and there will be a bottleneck? I think it would be amazing for some kinds of analyses, but for many of the big memory-intensive jobs I do it it will not be better than other architectures. Just guessing - what do others think? Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Aug 14 12:22:49 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sun Aug 14 12:23:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux clusters (was "Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu") In-Reply-To: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Ken Fuchs wrote: > I still think a cluster is what you need. There are several Linux > cluster distributions that are available on Live CDs that are easy to > setup. They should also have hard drive install options. [snip] > How well a cluster will work depends on how fast the interconnect is and > how much information must flow between nodes? These same issues will be > need to be addressed in a single system with several multi-core CPUs, > although the interconnect is bound to be much faster in a single > (non-cluster) system. Why do I need a cluster? I don't fully understand how clusters can work for me, but I am very interested. In fact, I have been thinking that I would expand the system in the future to include other machines in a cluster configuration, but right now I think one might be enough. If I have a single machine with multiple sockets/cores, the OS will transparently handle the multiple jobs and level the load across the cores. So the single-machine-multiple-core setup is easy to work with. I'm not as confident about the cluster setup. In case someone on this list has some experience or knowledge in this area, here are some questions: (1) How are jobs handled in a Linux cluster? Obviously, someone logs into one machine and jobs are sent to that machine or to other machines, but how does the system decide where to send a job? To submit a job, does the user have to specify any parameters to determine where/how it will run? (2) If different nodes in the cluster have different amounts of RAM available, how does the system decide where the more memory-intensive jobs will run? If it does this automatically, ignoring memory requirements, is it possible to request that a certain job go to a certain node? In general, I need to understand job control in the cluster system to understand how that system can be used for the kind of work I do. Thanks! Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Aug 14 12:42:26 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sun Aug 14 12:43:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Ken Fuchs wrote: > Perhaps a more specialized Linux distribution would be more suitable > like ... > > https://www.scientificlinux.org/ > http://bioinformatics.org/biobrew/ > http://dnalinux.com/ That's some pretty neat stuff, but my needs are a little different from those of the developers of those packages. I'd still have to install almost everything I need, so I think I'll go with a more standard distro and install my genetics programs from source. > One good reason to choose Debian over all others is the huge number of > well supported packages available for it, the deb package format and > apt-get. I also use Fedora Core 4, but there aren't nearly as many > packages for it, the packages are in rpm format which is considered by > many to be inferior to deb and yum doesn't seem to work as well as > apt-get. SUSE is also an excellent distribution and will get much > better do to the recent announcement of http://www.openSUSE.org/. I'm also leaning toward Debian right now. I've always heard good things about apt-get. I also hear good things about Gentoo's package management. Can Debian automatically find and download updates to packages when they become available? I think Gentoo does that. >> So what are the biggest differences between these distros for a server >> class machine? Would these differences affect users much or mostly >> just administrators? > > The most important difference is how difficult it will be to install > missing software and configure the Linux distribution to do what you > need it to do. That's what I was thinking. Thanks. Mike From andyzib at gmail.com Sun Aug 14 14:17:17 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Sun Aug 14 14:17:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: If you're thinking Debian, I would go with Ubuntu myself. Ubuntu has a 6 month release cycle, where Debian has...well it's Debian so... :) Ubuntu is much easier to train someone new to Linux administration on as well. Lots of nice GUI stuff, where as it's all command line in Debian. For building from source, I reccomend using stow. Handy little perl script for managing software installation/uninstallation under /usr/local. I just recently setup Ubuntu on a Dell PowerEdge server, and it was slick. Runs great. The Ubuntu core packages don't always have everything you need, so expect to use universe and multiverse trees as well. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From cncole at earthlink.net Sun Aug 14 14:44:06 2005 From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole) Date: Sun Aug 14 14:45:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux clusters (was "Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Make a rough model of the dataflow graph of what you do, and then a rough estimate of the machine cycles for the "compute-intensive" portions of your work. Typical I/O coupled von-Neuman machines really stink at doing scalar matrix work (eg, y=mx+b correction of an B&W scientific image) and get really bad for complex arrays. The datflow graph of the arithmetic unit(s) is almost always a bottleneck since they cannot support pipelined operations with a result-per-clock for an array. Might be a few thousand times faster to look for a DMA-coupled, pipelined arithmetic unit that a a single processor can do "control flow" nursemaiding for. I/O coupled general-purpose machines are not especially good for problems that have some distinct dataflow graphs - especially those that might include complex variables. They are good if control flow and data graphs change at very high frequency so setup of one or more multi-stage, complex pipelined processors becomes a time-consumer. You may find some scientific job control packages for systems that have some special arithmetic units. May require manual job control for "favorite" dataflow graphs. Otherwise it may just be a cluster or circle jerk with trivial differences in intensive I/O churning between CPU, FPU, and other resources. I think job control is much less important than support for various "classic" dataflow graphs. Some architectures can make 4-10 thousand times differences in runtimes for matrix-intensive dataflows. If you can't make a factor of ten difference by architectural choices, the "which one" issue may be scientifically trivial... IMHO. Find a way to assess real "bang for the buck", and avoid the trivia and speculation. Chuck > -----Original Message----- > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Mike Miller > Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2005 12:23 PM > To: TCLUG List > Subject: [tclug-list] Linux clusters (was "Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu") > > > On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Ken Fuchs wrote: > > > I still think a cluster is what you need. There are several Linux > > cluster distributions that are available on Live CDs that are easy to > > setup. They should also have hard drive install options. > > [snip] > > > How well a cluster will work depends on how fast the interconnect is and > > how much information must flow between nodes? These same issues will be > > need to be addressed in a single system with several multi-core CPUs, > > although the interconnect is bound to be much faster in a single > > (non-cluster) system. > > Why do I need a cluster? I don't fully understand how clusters can work > for me, but I am very interested. In fact, I have been thinking that I > would expand the system in the future to include other machines in a > cluster configuration, but right now I think one might be enough. If I > have a single machine with multiple sockets/cores, the OS will > transparently handle the multiple jobs and level the load across the > cores. So the single-machine-multiple-core setup is easy to work with. > I'm not as confident about the cluster setup. > > In case someone on this list has some experience or knowledge in this > area, here are some questions: > > (1) How are jobs handled in a Linux cluster? Obviously, someone logs into > one machine and jobs are sent to that machine or to other machines, but > how does the system decide where to send a job? To submit a job, does the > user have to specify any parameters to determine where/how it will run? > > (2) If different nodes in the cluster have different amounts of RAM > available, how does the system decide where the more memory-intensive jobs > will run? If it does this automatically, ignoring memory requirements, is > it possible to request that a certain job go to a certain node? > > In general, I need to understand job control in the cluster system to > understand how that system can be used for the kind of work I do. > > Thanks! > > Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Aug 14 18:16:23 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Sun Aug 14 18:17:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > If you're thinking Debian, I would go with Ubuntu myself. Ubuntu has a 6 > month release cycle, where Debian has...well it's Debian so... :) I think I've read before about long waits for new Debian releases, but this is something I don't quite understand: What do I need to do when a new release comes out? What is new in a new release? I would guess this means that new versions of many programs are made available in the new release. If there is no kernel update, then can I just install the new software without a reboot? Is there any downtime with a new release? What am I missing if I skip new releases? > Ubuntu is much easier to train someone new to Linux administration on as > well. Lots of nice GUI stuff, where as it's all command line in Debian. That sounds good. > For building from source, I reccomend using stow. Handy little perl > script for managing software installation/uninstallation under > /usr/local. That also sounds good. I'd never heard of it, but I can see that it is based on a very clever scheme!: http://packages.ubuntu.com/hoary/admin/stow Well, it sounds like some former Debian users are finding that they now prefer Ubuntu/Kubuntu and that makes me wonder if I should be trying Ubuntu instead of Debian. So many decisions! Mike From kfuchs at winternet.com Sun Aug 14 19:05:50 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Sun Aug 14 19:07:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux clusters (was "Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu") In-Reply-To: (message from Mike Miller on Sun, 14 Aug 2005 12:22:49 -0500 (CDT)) References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: <200508150005.j7F05om21622@ecstasy1.winternet.com> >On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Ken Fuchs wrote: >> I still think a cluster is what you need. There are several Linux >> cluster distributions that are available on Live CDs that are easy to >> setup. They should also have hard drive install options. >> How well a cluster will work depends on how fast the interconnect is and >> how much information must flow between nodes? These same issues will be >> need to be addressed in a single system with several multi-core CPUs, >> although the interconnect is bound to be much faster in a single >> (non-cluster) system. Mike Miller wrote: >Why do I need a cluster? I don't fully understand how clusters can work >for me, but I am very interested. In fact, I have been thinking that I >would expand the system in the future to include other machines in a >cluster configuration, but right now I think one might be enough. I meant to say that I believe a cluster could meet your needs. The fact that you are considering adding machines in the future to form a small cluster suggests that you might find it worthwhile to temporarily convert a computer lab of networked x86 machines (any OS) into a Linux cluster as an experiment to see how well it may suit your application. Here are just a handful of Linux Cluster Live CD distributions: http://clusterix.livecd.net/ http://bofh.be/clusterknoppix/ http://pareto.uab.es/mcreel/ParallelKnoppix/ The last one may be the easiest to setup. >If I have a single machine with multiple sockets/cores, the OS will >transparently handle the multiple jobs and level the load across the >cores. So the single-machine-multiple-core setup is easy to work with. >I'm not as confident about the cluster setup. Clearly, if you have enough money to buy a single system to meet your needs and your application doesn't translate to a cluster efficiently, a cluster is not the right solution. >In case someone on this list has some experience or knowledge in this >area, here are some questions: > >(1) How are jobs handled in a Linux cluster? Obviously, someone logs into >one machine and jobs are sent to that machine or to other machines, but >how does the system decide where to send a job? To submit a job, does the >user have to specify any parameters to determine where/how it will run? > >(2) If different nodes in the cluster have different amounts of RAM >available, how does the system decide where the more memory-intensive jobs >will run? If it does this automatically, ignoring memory requirements, is >it possible to request that a certain job go to a certain node? > >In general, I need to understand job control in the cluster system to >understand how that system can be used for the kind of work I do. You might consider just devoting a handful of networked machines (preferably via 1Gbit Ethernet or faster) and run a Live CD cluster on it to see how it works first hand. Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From kcbnac at gmail.com Mon Aug 15 09:42:53 2005 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Aug 15 09:43:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Installfest Time Again Message-ID: <32fd45370508150742660515c3@mail.gmail.com> Well, it's been 4 months now since the last installfest, I'm thinking it's about that time again, to start figuring out where and when we're holding the next installfest. Some of you may remember Charlie from the October 2004 installfest, he brought the dual Opteron board that I think we played around with a bit. I know for a fact he's got some newer hardware that might be fun to play with (dual-core Pentium D, anyone?) if the chipset is supported yet, that is. Just figured it's been awhile, and it's time we did another one. Maybe this time I'll actually continue using the install(s) I (hopefully) finish :P Keith Bachman From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Mon Aug 15 11:59:59 2005 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Aug 15 12:01:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: <20050815115959.A8701@baker.space.umn.edu> On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 06:16:23PM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > > >If you're thinking Debian, I would go with Ubuntu myself. Ubuntu has a 6 > >month release cycle, where Debian has...well it's Debian so... :) > > I think I've read before about long waits for new Debian releases, but > this is something I don't quite understand: What do I need to do when a > new release comes out? What is new in a new release? > > I would guess this means that new versions of many programs are made > available in the new release. If there is no kernel update, then can I > just install the new software without a reboot? Is there any downtime > with a new release? What am I missing if I skip new releases? Yes, a new release is when the collection of software is officially put out. Debian has 3 main distribution at a given time: unstable, testing, and stable. Unstable has the newest versions of software packages, while stables are a bit older but better tested. Debian developers release new packages into unstable as new versions of software become available upstream. After a time in unstable if no serious bugs have been filed against a newly uploaded package it gets copied into the testing. Once in a blue moon, the testing release is frozen and then eventually released as a new stable version. Users with different needs get the best results from different distributions. Many people running servers are happy running stable releases because they don't need the latest and greatest software. Gaps of a year or two three between stable releases don't bother them. Many people (such as myself) with workstations, desktops or small servers are happy running unstable or testing. With these distributions you can easily track the latest software. When you upgrade things will break from time to time, but I rarely run into problems. Keeping up to date is easy with apt-get and its wrapper programs such as aptitude. You shouldn't have to reboot other kernel upgrades. Depending on which way you use Debian, new releases may not be that relevant to you at all. The one place where a new release is always relevant is new installs. New releases bring new versions of the installation programs. This is important for hardware support, since the drivers for relatively new devices might not be available if its been a year since the last release. This usually isn't a big problem, though, because you can install the release and just upgrade to a new kernel to get support for a new device. It is also not a big problem at the moment since Debian just had a release a couple of months ago. If you are running an unstable or testing system, a new release won't affect you very much. If you are running a stable system, then you will have the option to upgrade to the new version of stable, though you wouldn't have to. If you are happy of where your machine is at, then you might not have any reason to upgrade. The main drawback to not upgrading is that the old version of stable will no longer get security updates. By the way, if you get to the point where you need very heavy-duty computing power, then you should take a look at applying for time at the Minnesota Supercomputer Institute - http://www.msi.umn.edu/. Using their resources is much easier than building your own cluster, though I am not sure how their programs would fit with your needs. -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Aug 15 12:14:05 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Aug 15 12:15:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: <20050815115959.A8701@baker.space.umn.edu> References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> <20050815115959.A8701@baker.space.umn.edu> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Jim Crumley wrote: > By the way, if you get to the point where you need very heavy-duty > computing power, then you should take a look at applying for time at the > Minnesota Supercomputer Institute - http://www.msi.umn.edu/. Using their > resources is much easier than building your own cluster, though I am not > sure how their programs would fit with your needs. I have accounts on at least five of their machines. We are using them all the time. I use a Linux machine to connect (SSH) to the MSI machines and I use VNC to connect to the Linux machine (w/ either SSH tunnel or Enterprise VNC with encryption). I want a little more power on the Linux machine partly because MSI machines are not really fast though they have lots of memory and many processors available. Also, interactive jobs really should not be run on the MSI machines. Thanks for all the other tips about Debian. Debian still might be the way for me to go. I'll be pondering the distro issue for a few days. Mike From slushpupie at gmail.com Mon Aug 15 12:16:01 2005 From: slushpupie at gmail.com (slushpupie@gmail.com) Date: Mon Aug 15 12:18:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: On 8/14/05, Mike Miller wrote: > On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > > > If you're thinking Debian, I would go with Ubuntu myself. Ubuntu has a 6 > > month release cycle, where Debian has...well it's Debian so... :) > > I think I've read before about long waits for new Debian releases, but > this is something I don't quite understand: What do I need to do when a > new release comes out? What is new in a new release? We use Debian for a lot of research math/science things, and found it to be much easier to manage large numbers of systems. A "new release" of debian basically means they updated all the programs to a newer version. Otherwise, Debian Stable will not change versions of anything, they pretty much only patch major problems (like security holes). For some people, this is a real disadvantage as you dont have the bleeding edge software. For others, its nice, because you dont have to worry about change all that often. > I would guess this means that new versions of many programs are made > available in the new release. If there is no kernel update, then can I > just install the new software without a reboot? Is there any downtime > with a new release? What am I missing if I skip new releases? Debian does not lock you into any kernel. There are several available from the installer, but if you choose to use your own kernel after installing (a newer one for example), Debian has no complaints. I dont think many distro's do anymore. I have upgraded Debian systems without upgrades many times. I like to do a reboot on major upgrades like that anyway just to be sure the new startup scripts work properly, but if you cannot afford the downtime, it is certainly not required. > > > Ubuntu is much easier to train someone new to Linux administration on as > > well. Lots of nice GUI stuff, where as it's all command line in Debian. > > That sounds good. Ubuntu is a faster moving Debian. Same basic idea, but more modern software, faster release cycles, etc. The tradeoff is often newer software breaking because it is new. So there are more updates, and you will spend more time maintaining the system. > > For building from source, I reccomend using stow. Handy little perl > > script for managing software installation/uninstallation under > > /usr/local. > > That also sounds good. I'd never heard of it, but I can see that it is > based on a very clever scheme!: > > http://packages.ubuntu.com/hoary/admin/stow > > Well, it sounds like some former Debian users are finding that they now > prefer Ubuntu/Kubuntu and that makes me wonder if I should be trying > Ubuntu instead of Debian. So many decisions! If you want to use it as a Desktop, Ubuntu looks like a very nice option. If you are looking for a mostly maintenance free server, plain Debian is the way to go. -- Jay Kline http://www.slushpupie.com/ From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Aug 15 13:04:03 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Aug 15 13:05:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Aug 2005 slushpupie@gmail.com wrote: > Ubuntu is a faster moving Debian. Same basic idea, but more modern > software, faster release cycles, etc. The tradeoff is often newer > software breaking because it is new. So there are more updates, and you > will spend more time maintaining the system. Is it possible to just update certain packages when new versions become available and save the major updates for later? Seems like it would be possible, but I'm not familiar with the details of package updating. I like the idea of a low-maintenance solution with up-to-date versions of the most widely-used packages. Mike From slushpupie at gmail.com Mon Aug 15 13:14:05 2005 From: slushpupie at gmail.com (slushpupie@gmail.com) Date: Mon Aug 15 13:15:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/05, Mike Miller wrote: > On Mon, 15 Aug 2005 slushpupie@gmail.com wrote: > > > Ubuntu is a faster moving Debian. Same basic idea, but more modern > > software, faster release cycles, etc. The tradeoff is often newer > > software breaking because it is new. So there are more updates, and you > > will spend more time maintaining the system. > > Is it possible to just update certain packages when new versions become > available and save the major updates for later? Seems like it would be > possible, but I'm not familiar with the details of package updating. Of course, its a much more manual process if you want to pick and choose. By default updates do not happen automaticly, but there are packages to assist in automaticlly keeping your system up to date. You can often configure them to update everything, or just specific things, or just notify you when updates are availible. > I like the idea of a low-maintenance solution with up-to-date versions of > the most widely-used packages. Ive not done much of this, but you can mix different versions of Debian. You can install Debian Stable as a base, and install certain packagaes from Testing or Unstable. The dependancies of the packages sometimes end up installing more than you want, but this method works fairly well. And if you are not affraid of the extra work, you can often "backport" a newer package to an older version of Debian. -- Jay Kline http://www.slushpupie.com/ From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Mon Aug 15 13:36:21 2005 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Aug 15 13:37:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: <20050815133621.B8996@baker.space.umn.edu> On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 01:14:05PM -0500, slushpupie@gmail.com wrote: > On 8/15/05, Mike Miller wrote: > > On Mon, 15 Aug 2005 slushpupie@gmail.com wrote: > > > > > Ubuntu is a faster moving Debian. Same basic idea, but more modern > > > software, faster release cycles, etc. The tradeoff is often newer > > > software breaking because it is new. So there are more updates, and you > > > will spend more time maintaining the system. > > > > Is it possible to just update certain packages when new versions become > > available and save the major updates for later? Seems like it would be > > possible, but I'm not familiar with the details of package updating. > > Of course, its a much more manual process if you want to pick and > choose. By default updates do not happen automaticly, but there are > packages to assist in automaticlly keeping your system up to date. You > can often configure them to update everything, or just specific > things, or just notify you when updates are availible. > > > I like the idea of a low-maintenance solution with up-to-date versions of > > the most widely-used packages. > > Ive not done much of this, but you can mix different versions of > Debian. You can install Debian Stable as a base, and install certain > packagaes from Testing or Unstable. The dependancies of the packages > sometimes end up installing more than you want, but this method works > fairly well. And if you are not affraid of the extra work, you can > often "backport" a newer package to an older version of Debian. Yes, as new testing distribution develops testing diverges enough from unstable that it becomes more difficult to maintain a mix stable/testing or stable/unstable mixture. A current example of this divergence is the change-over to a new C++ api. As for backports, there are also lots of private sites out there that backport new versions of software to stable. It is very easy to add those repository to your apt-get config and track their versions of software. Of course, they are likely to be less well tested than the Debian versions, but everything has a trade-off. Anyway, there is lot of flexibility to run. You can try running stable and only update every year or so. You can run testing and update weekly or monthly. Or you can run unstable and update daily. Or some something in betwen. -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | From rick at real-time.com Mon Aug 15 14:23:41 2005 From: rick at real-time.com (Rick Tanner) Date: Mon Aug 15 14:23:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Installfest Time Again In-Reply-To: <200508151414.59074@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> References: <200508151414.59074@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> Message-ID: <200508151423.41924.rick@real-time.com> On Monday 15 August 2005 02:14 pm, Keith Bachman wrote: > Well, it's been 4 months now since the last installfest, I'm thinking > it's about that time again, to start figuring out where and when we're > holding the next installfest. New Horizons (formerly, Benchmark) in Edina has expressed interest in hosting an installfest for sometime in late September. How does this work or look for a time frame? -- Rick Tanner | Phone : (952) 943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952) 943-8500 From chewie at wookimus.net Mon Aug 15 15:06:25 2005 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Mon Aug 15 15:07:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Debian v. Gentoo v. Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <200508140634.j7E6YJC11983@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: <20050815200625.37A883398@skuld.wookimus.net> Mike Miller wrote: > Is it possible to just update certain packages when new versions > become available and save the major updates for later? Seems like > it would be possible, but I'm not familiar with the details of > package updating. Depending upon the newer package's dependencies on other packages, you may be able to use the pinning options in /etc/apt/preferences. The manpage is apt_preferences(5). You can then specify multiple archives in your /etc/apt/sources.list file without worrying about unstable being installed instead of stable for default installations. It allows you to do: apt-get install -t unstable PACKAGE You can see what score packages from each repository will have by using: apt-cache policy PACKAGE For example: $ apt-cache policy monotone monotone: Installed: 0.18-1 Candidate: 0.18-1 Version Table: 0.22-1 0 50 http://http.us.debian.org sid/main Packages *** 0.18-1 0 500 http://http.us.debian.org sarge/main Packages 100 /var/lib/dpkg/status This shows that sid (unstable) has version 0.22-1 available, but that it won't be installed automatically. Instead, 0.18-1 has a higher pin priority and will be installed by default. This isn't exactly fool-proof, and you'll run into conditions that the command-line apt-get calls won't be able to handle. In which case, you could always install a package manually with dpkg. > I like the idea of a low-maintenance solution with up-to-date > versions of the most widely-used packages. Many people tie apt_preferences with custom local archives to carry the latest-and-greatest. i.e. # /etc/apt/sources.list entry for local repository deb file:/LOCAL/PATH local main contrib non-free deb-src file:/LOCAL/PATH local main contrib non-free In local, you've perhaps created an archive with something mini-dinstall, a daemon for updating Debian packages in a repository, or reprepro, a debian package repository producer. Set up /etc/apt/preferences to pull from local by default, stable second in line. etc. -- Chad Walstrom http://www.wookimus.net/ assert(expired(knowledge)); /* core dump */ From chrome at real-time.com Mon Aug 15 16:20:38 2005 From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom) Date: Mon Aug 15 16:20:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail Message-ID: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> I keep telling people that I get about 500 mail messages a day; but I'd really like some hard figures (maybe even ones I can graph). the ideal would be to do this without installing any system-wide software on the server; so I'm thinking there's got to be a pretty trivial way to do a simple counter in procmail. even something as simple as: echo 1 >> mailcounter-`date +%F` in a procmail recipe would be easy to reckon up by running 'wc -l' on the resulting file, and would be adequate for my purposes. some quick experiments were not successful with this; but that's because I'm not a procmail guru. :) so has anyone done anything like this? or do you have an alternate method? I know the perl hax0rs will tell me to write a perl script and run it over my mbox files, then generate a pretty graph using some perl module and GD, but that's a bit more time-intensive than I care to be involved in right now. :) -- Carl Soderstrom Systems Administrator Real-Time Enterprises www.real-time.com From florin at iucha.net Mon Aug 15 16:51:39 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Aug 15 16:51:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> Message-ID: <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net> On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 04:20:38PM -0500, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote: > > I keep telling people that I get about 500 mail messages a day; but I'd > really like some hard figures (maybe even ones I can graph). the ideal would > be to do this without installing any system-wide software on the server; so > I'm thinking there's got to be a pretty trivial way to do a simple counter > in procmail. turn on logging with LOGFILE=procmail.log then cat procmail.log | sed -n -e '/From [^@]*@/ s/.* [^ ]* \([^ ]* [^ ]*\) .*/\1/p' | sort | uniq -c florin -- Don't question authority: they don't know either! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050815/988f10b3/attachment.pgp From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Aug 15 17:44:32 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Aug 15 17:45:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote: > I keep telling people that I get about 500 mail messages a day; but I'd > really like some hard figures (maybe even ones I can graph). the ideal > would be to do this without installing any system-wide software on the > server; so I'm thinking there's got to be a pretty trivial way to do a > simple counter in procmail. This should give you a nice count by date: egrep '^From ' ~/.procmail/log | gawk '{print $4" "$5", "$7}' | uniq -c (I'm assuming that you store your procmail log where I store mine.) Seeing this reminds me that I haven't rotated my log since February 1999. It is more than 61 MB. I've received 397,603 messages which is an average of 168 per day. Some of these go straight to /dev/null and I read a minority of them, at best, but that's how many come in. Mike From kcbnac at gmail.com Mon Aug 15 19:51:30 2005 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Aug 15 19:51:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Installfest Time Again In-Reply-To: <32fd4537050815175016abc51d@mail.gmail.com> References: <200508151414.59074@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> <200508151423.41924.rick@real-time.com> <32fd4537050815175016abc51d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <32fd453705081517515fa061de@mail.gmail.com> Sounds good to me. All the college students (well, all the others that get the summers off...) will be back at college, so we might even be able to snag some from the U etc, if we get in touch with their onsite geek groups. On 8/15/05, Rick Tanner wrote: > On Monday 15 August 2005 02:14 pm, Keith Bachman wrote: > > Well, it's been 4 months now since the last installfest, I'm thinking > > it's about that time again, to start figuring out where and when we're > > holding the next installfest. > > New Horizons (formerly, Benchmark) in Edina has expressed interest in hosting > an installfest for sometime in late September. > > How does this work or look for a time frame? > > -- > Rick Tanner | Phone : (952) 943-8700 > http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952) 943-8500 > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From bhartm at visi.com Mon Aug 15 22:33:17 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Mon Aug 15 22:36:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Installfest Time Again In-Reply-To: <32fd453705081517515fa061de@mail.gmail.com> References: <200508151414.59074@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> <200508151423.41924.rick@real-time.com> <32fd4537050815175016abc51d@mail.gmail.com> <32fd453705081517515fa061de@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43015E7D.5040203@visi.com> what the heck is an installfest? I thought I did that every week already. :) Not by commitee, tho. If it's a gathering for getting to meet the myriad distros, I'm there. I've only used ~5. I'll bring Agnula. And bars and jello salad. but seriously, what's it about? Keith Bachman wrote: >Sounds good to me. All the college students (well, all the others >that get the summers off...) will be back at college, so we might even >be able to snag some from the U etc, if we get in touch with their >onsite geek groups. > >On 8/15/05, Rick Tanner wrote: > > >>On Monday 15 August 2005 02:14 pm, Keith Bachman wrote: >> >> >>>Well, it's been 4 months now since the last installfest, I'm thinking >>>it's about that time again, to start figuring out where and when we're >>>holding the next installfest. >>> >>> >>New Horizons (formerly, Benchmark) in Edina has expressed interest in hosting >>an installfest for sometime in late September. >> >>How does this work or look for a time frame? >> >>-- >>Rick Tanner | Phone : (952) 943-8700 >>http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952) 943-8500 >> >>_______________________________________________ >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > From smac at visi.com Tue Aug 16 07:35:21 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Tue Aug 16 07:55:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Installfest Time Again In-Reply-To: <43015E7D.5040203@visi.com> References: <200508151414.59074@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> <200508151423.41924.rick@real-time.com> <32fd4537050815175016abc51d@mail.gmail.com> <32fd453705081517515fa061de@mail.gmail.com> <43015E7D.5040203@visi.com> Message-ID: <4301DD89.5090702@visi.com> Installfest Linux has come a long way from the floppy disk installations of the past, my first installfest 3 years ago. An install fest is where the LUG gets to gether to help new folks install Linux and get to know the people who are the LUG. Sam. Bob Hartmann wrote: > > what the heck is an installfest? I thought I did that every week > already. :) > Not by commitee, tho. If it's a gathering for getting to meet the > myriad distros, I'm there. I've only used ~5. I'll bring Agnula. > And bars and jello salad. but seriously, what's it about? > > > > > Keith Bachman wrote: > >> Sounds good to me. All the college students (well, all the others >> that get the summers off...) will be back at college, so we might even >> be able to snag some from the U etc, if we get in touch with their >> onsite geek groups. >> >> On 8/15/05, Rick Tanner wrote: >> >> >>> On Monday 15 August 2005 02:14 pm, Keith Bachman wrote: >>> >>> >>>> Well, it's been 4 months now since the last installfest, I'm thinking >>>> it's about that time again, to start figuring out where and when we're >>>> holding the next installfest. >>>> >>> >>> New Horizons (formerly, Benchmark) in Edina has expressed interest >>> in hosting >>> an installfest for sometime in late September. >>> >>> How does this work or look for a time frame? >>> >>> -- >>> Rick Tanner | Phone : (952) 943-8700 >>> http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952) 943-8500 >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >>> >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Tue Aug 16 08:06:26 2005 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Tue Aug 16 08:07:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> Message-ID: <20050816080626.A11585@baker.space.umn.edu> On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 04:20:38PM -0500, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote: > > I keep telling people that I get about 500 mail messages a day; but I'd > really like some hard figures (maybe even ones I can graph). the ideal would > be to do this without installing any system-wide software on the server; so > I'm thinking there's got to be a pretty trivial way to do a simple counter > in procmail. > > even something as simple as: > echo 1 >> mailcounter-`date +%F` > in a procmail recipe would be easy to reckon up by running 'wc -l' on the > resulting file, and would be adequate for my purposes. > > some quick experiments were not successful with this; but that's because I'm > not a procmail guru. :) > > so has anyone done anything like this? > or do you have an alternate method? I just use the mailstat script that comes with procmail. It reads the procmail log and gives info on number of messages to each mail folder. To get daily reports you could just put it in a cron job and have cron mail you the results. -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | From srcfoo at gmail.com Tue Aug 16 08:52:49 2005 From: srcfoo at gmail.com (EP) Date: Tue Aug 16 08:53:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Installfest Time Again In-Reply-To: <4301DD89.5090702@visi.com> References: <200508151414.59074@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> <200508151423.41924.rick@real-time.com> <32fd4537050815175016abc51d@mail.gmail.com> <32fd453705081517515fa061de@mail.gmail.com> <43015E7D.5040203@visi.com> <4301DD89.5090702@visi.com> Message-ID: <579c6fd305081606526090f90f@mail.gmail.com> So if we want to help out with the installfest shindig, do we need to sign-up or should we just show-up? I checked the TCLUG website, but I must have missed this part. _Eric From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Aug 16 11:05:37 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Aug 16 11:05:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508161605.j7GG5br31584@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: Laptop and Firewall Computer Free to good home: Compaq LTE Elite 4/75CX Notebook. 75mhz, 16 mg ram. No battery but comes with power cord. Running W95 wonderfully. ;-) HP Vectra (slim desktop) 133mhz, 64mg ram. Will boot from CD, has onboard NIC & a spare power supply. Was my firewall machine. Pick up in Apple Valley area. Seller Email address: pclinux at charter dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Aug 16 11:14:11 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Aug 16 11:19:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508161614.j7GGEBP32297@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: Want to Buy Subject: Power Supply for Linksys Switch I have inherited a Linksys EZXS55W 5 port switch with no power supply & a missing rubber foot. If you have any of these items available for low or no cost, it would be appreciated. At the very least, does any body know the correct voltage for one of these? Customer support gave two different answers (big surprise). Seller Email address: pclinux at charter dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From kfuchs at winternet.com Tue Aug 16 21:54:34 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Tue Aug 16 21:56:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad In-Reply-To: <200508161614.j7GGEBP32297@crusader.real-time.com> (message from TCLUG Classifieds on Tue, 16 Aug 2005 11:14:11 -0500) References: <200508161614.j7GGEBP32297@crusader.real-time.com> Message-ID: <200508170254.j7H2sYe17793@ecstasy1.winternet.com> >I have inherited a Linksys EZXS55W 5 port switch with no power supply & >a missing rubber foot. If you have any of these items available for >low or no cost, it would be appreciated. At the very least, does any >body know the correct voltage for one of these? Customer support gave >two different answers (big surprise). I have v2 of this unit. The PS is 7.5 VDC 700 mA. Any 7.5 VDC PS with at least 700 mA should work fine. BTW, my unit doesn't work reliably at 100 Mb/sec. It was probably full duplex when it was failing. Works great at 10 Mb/sec. :) I also have an 8 port Linksys which used to work fine at 100 Mb/sec full duplex, but lately one of the machines always hangs when it connects at full duplex and works fine at half duplex. I changed nothing except the ports the machines use and the problem remains with the same machine, so the full duplex fault is with the NIC (a Linksys as well). I've had good experiences with Linksys, other than the one 5 port unit and maybe one NIC. Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From bhartm at visi.com Wed Aug 17 00:29:28 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Wed Aug 17 00:24:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Installfest Time Again In-Reply-To: <32fd453705081521534892e2bc@mail.gmail.com> References: <200508151414.59074@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> <200508151423.41924.rick@real-time.com> <32fd4537050815175016abc51d@mail.gmail.com> <32fd453705081517515fa061de@mail.gmail.com> <43015E7D.5040203@visi.com> <32fd453705081521534892e2bc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4302CB38.5030909@visi.com> How cool!?! Crying while eating.. I imagined that Benchmark would offer a classroom full of systems, but if they offer a room with common ethernet, that's cool too. Or what. Maybe some debian/alsa guru can help me with my snd-usb. That's a year-old mess. Keith Bachman wrote: >Link: >http://www.tclug.org/installfest/ > >Basically you bring your box, and whatever info, skills and toys >you've got (spare hardware always comes in handy) and we install >Linux. We usually have people there who know pretty much >everything...we had a duplicator at the last one, they even printed >labels! > >Imagine a day of pizza, caffeine, lots of linux, some crying (when >someone discovers their winmodem is on the "bad list") and some >cheering (like when we finally got Linux to install on..oh >wait...pretty much everything I've brought, as I tend to bring some >obscure combination of hardware) > >So like your own 1-man installfest...but with the mailing list in the >same room as you, able to help you as you go. > >Keith Bachman > >On 8/15/05, Bob Hartmann wrote: > > >>what the heck is an installfest? I thought I did that every week >>already. :) >>Not by commitee, tho. If it's a gathering for getting to meet the >>myriad distros, I'm there. I've only used ~5. I'll bring Agnula. And >>bars and jello salad. >>but seriously, what's it about? >> >> >> >> >>Keith Bachman wrote: >> >> >> >>>Sounds good to me. All the college students (well, all the others >>>that get the summers off...) will be back at college, so we might even >>>be able to snag some from the U etc, if we get in touch with their >>>onsite geek groups. >>> >>>On 8/15/05, Rick Tanner wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>On Monday 15 August 2005 02:14 pm, Keith Bachman wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>Well, it's been 4 months now since the last installfest, I'm thinking >>>>>it's about that time again, to start figuring out where and when we're >>>>>holding the next installfest. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>New Horizons (formerly, Benchmark) in Edina has expressed interest in hosting >>>>an installfest for sometime in late September. >>>> >>>>How does this work or look for a time frame? >>>> >>>>-- >>>>Rick Tanner | Phone : (952) 943-8700 >>>>http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952) 943-8500 >>>> >>>>_______________________________________________ >>>>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>>>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>>>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>_______________________________________________ >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >> > > > From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Aug 17 11:29:18 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Wed Aug 17 11:30:10 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Podcast Message-ID: I have a nice D-Link USB tuner, that should be tunable with fmtools (http://www.stanford.edu/~blp/fmtools/). It dumps audio into the line in jack of my sound card. For for step 1, I'll be using cron and fmtools to tune and turn on the raidio, then record the audio and store in mp3 (or something) format. I've solicited this from TCLUG before and I still have that information, so not a big deal. But now that iTunes supports podcasts, I want to find something that can automatically generate an XML file for me so that I can subscribe iTunes on my Mac computer to my own XML feed, and thus get my recorded programs on my iPod. Does anyone know of software to produce the XML an automated fashion (runnign a script from cron) under Linux? -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From erikerik at gmail.com Wed Aug 17 12:22:44 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Wed Aug 17 12:24:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] traffic shaping by ip? Message-ID: I've been playing around with traffic shaping on my linux firewall/nat box at home. I'm trying to prioritize packets going to and from my VoIP box. All of the documentation I've found online has assumed you want to prioritize traffic *types*, not prioritize traffic going to/from certain ip addresses. Has anyone done this? Thanks- Erik From wilson at visi.com Wed Aug 17 12:47:27 2005 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Wed Aug 17 12:48:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Podcast In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <925901A0-92FF-406F-92CD-BC8CFC93926E@visi.com> On Aug 17, 2005, at 11:29 AM, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > Does anyone know of software to produce the XML an automated fashion > (runnign a script from cron) under Linux? You might be able to hack Dan Bricklin's ListGarden software to do it. (http://www.softwaregarden.com/products/listgarden/index.html) It runs on OS X, not Linux, but Audio Hijack Pro can be set up to record on a timed schedule. (http://www.rogueamoeba.com/ audiohijackpro/) For a hardware solution there's also Griffin's radio SHARK. (http://www.griffintechnology.com/products/radioshark/index.php) -Tim Listen to the Savvy Technologist Podcast at http:// feeds.feedburner.com/technosavvy/podcast/ -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 blog: http://technosavvy.org From tpenney at gmail.com Wed Aug 17 13:21:53 2005 From: tpenney at gmail.com (Tom Penney) Date: Wed Aug 17 13:22:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: strange network problem In-Reply-To: <5c596d0e05081216462760a179@mail.gmail.com> References: <5c596d0e05081216462760a179@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5c596d0e050817112170cb5a27@mail.gmail.com> Thanks to everyone who helped me out with this. The issue was with selinux. I'm not familiar with selinux. It was enabled, and blocking this traffic for some reason. I edited "/etc/sysconfig/selinux" and set "SELINUX=disabled", rebooted. - Tom On 8/12/05, Tom Penney wrote: > > I have new fedora core 3 box which I am having a strange network problem > with. > > I can not get out to the net while logged in. I can get to the machine > via ssh and apache is serving pages to the outside world but while > logged into the machine I can not get this page: > > [tomp@highwire ~]$ wget http://localhost > --16:38:59-- http://localhost/ > => `index.html' > Resolving localhost... 127.0.0.1 > Connecting to localhost[127.0.0.1 ]:80... failed: > Permission denied. > Retrying. > > > Names resolve, ping works but I cant get out: > > [root@highwire ~]# ping google.com > PING google.com (216.239.57.99 ) > 56(84) bytes of data. > 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99 : icmp_seq=0 ttl=242 > time=78.1 ms > 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99 : icmp_seq=1 ttl=242 > time=77.9 ms > 64 bytes from 216.239.57.99 : icmp_seq=2 ttl=242 > time=77.9 ms > > --- google.com ping statistics --- > 3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time 2001ms > rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 77.912/78.019/78.194/0.345 ms, pipe 2 > > [root@highwire ~]# telnet 216.239.57.99 80 > Trying 216.239.57.99... > telnet: connect to address 216.239.57.99 : > Permission denied > telnet: Unable to connect to remote host: Permission denied > > I get the same type of error when I ssh out. although I can ssh into > the box fine. > [root@highwire ~]# ssh samba.circussoftware.com > ssh: connect to host samba.circussoftware.comport 22: Permission denied > > > I don't think it's a local firewall but it sure seems like it: > [root@highwire ~]# iptables -L > Chain INPUT (policy ACCEPT) > target prot opt source destination > > Chain FORWARD (policy ACCEPT) > target prot opt source destination > > Chain OUTPUT (policy ACCEPT) > target prot opt source destination > > > Does anyone have any Idea what could be going on here? > -- > Tom Penney > -- Tom Penney -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050817/267ef629/attachment.htm From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Aug 17 15:14:44 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Wed Aug 17 15:16:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Podcast In-Reply-To: <925901A0-92FF-406F-92CD-BC8CFC93926E@visi.com> References: <925901A0-92FF-406F-92CD-BC8CFC93926E@visi.com> Message-ID: > For a hardware solution there's also Griffin's radio > SHARK. (http://www.griffintechnology.com/products/radioshark/index.php) Well I already have the hardware, and it's hardware that works in Linux. To clarify a bit, what I'm thinking of doing is recording a radio progarm and saving it as a mp3 saved in a directory that's served out by apache. What I need is to find something that can take the mp3s, who's files names will be something like YYYY-MM-DD_ShowName.mp3, and generate the Podcast XML file so I can just fire up iTunes as normal and my recorded radio shows show up as a Podcast. ListGarden might do it, but I'm still open to suggestions. :-) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Wed Aug 17 15:21:20 2005 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Wed Aug 17 15:22:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: strange network problem In-Reply-To: <5c596d0e050817112170cb5a27@mail.gmail.com> References: <5c596d0e05081216462760a179@mail.gmail.com> <5c596d0e050817112170cb5a27@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/17/05, Tom Penney wrote: > Thanks to everyone who helped me out with this. The issue was with selinux. > I'm not familiar with selinux. It was enabled, and blocking this traffic for > some reason. > > I edited "/etc/sysconfig/selinux" and set "SELINUX=disabled", rebooted. That is a new one on me. Good thing to know, though. Thanks for figuring that one out. -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) From jeremy at rosengren.org Wed Aug 17 16:02:43 2005 From: jeremy at rosengren.org (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Wed Aug 17 16:06:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Podcast In-Reply-To: References: <925901A0-92FF-406F-92CD-BC8CFC93926E@visi.com> Message-ID: <4303A5F3.4020809@rosengren.org> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050817/eb1a3234/attachment.htm From wilson at visi.com Wed Aug 17 16:20:06 2005 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Wed Aug 17 16:20:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Podcast In-Reply-To: <4303A5F3.4020809@rosengren.org> References: <925901A0-92FF-406F-92CD-BC8CFC93926E@visi.com> <4303A5F3.4020809@rosengren.org> Message-ID: <8D1D1D42-E148-42BD-BBBF-CE29A9FEDCFD@visi.com> On Aug 17, 2005, at 4:02 PM, Jeremy Rosengren wrote: > My understanding is that iTunes doesn't *need* special XML to > subscribe to a podcast, you just need some special XML tags in > order to use some of the nifty extras that iTunes supports. True. You can use iTunes to subscribe to any podcast feed. If you want to get your feed included in the iTunes directory, then you need to go to the extra work of including the iTunes-specific tags. -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 blog: http://technosavvy.org From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Wed Aug 17 20:10:05 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Wed Aug 17 20:10:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] traffic shaping by ip? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1124327405.27105.28.camel@3po.thodt.net> On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 12:22 -0500, Erik Anderson wrote: > I've been playing around with traffic shaping on my linux firewall/nat > box at home. I'm trying to prioritize packets going to and from my > VoIP box. All of the documentation I've found online has assumed you > want to prioritize traffic *types*, not prioritize traffic going > to/from certain ip addresses. > > Has anyone done this? Haven't done it, but it looks like this is what you're looking for: http://lartc.org/howto/lartc.qdisc.filters.html#LARTC.FILTERING.SIMPLE -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050817/00fe45cc/attachment.pgp From thaunderdog at gmail.com Wed Aug 17 21:45:10 2005 From: thaunderdog at gmail.com (ThaUnderDog) Date: Wed Aug 17 21:46:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] traffic shaping by ip? In-Reply-To: <1124327405.27105.28.camel@3po.thodt.net> References: <1124327405.27105.28.camel@3po.thodt.net> Message-ID: <4303F636.2000901@gmail.com> Mike Hicks wrote: > On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 12:22 -0500, Erik Anderson wrote: > >>I've been playing around with traffic shaping on my linux firewall/nat >>box at home. I'm trying to prioritize packets going to and from my >>VoIP box. All of the documentation I've found online has assumed you >>want to prioritize traffic *types*, not prioritize traffic going >>to/from certain ip addresses. >> >>Has anyone done this? > > > Haven't done it, but it looks like this is what you're looking for: > http://lartc.org/howto/lartc.qdisc.filters.html#LARTC.FILTERING.SIMPLE > I haven't done this either but looks possible: http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_Packet_Shaping The examples shows by types but I see no reason why you couldn't mark by --source/--destination as well. From chrome at real-time.com Thu Aug 18 08:19:14 2005 From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom) Date: Thu Aug 18 08:20:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net>; from florin@iucha.net on Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 04:51:39PM -0500 References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net> Message-ID: <20050818081914.I24983@real-time.com> On 08/15 04:51 , Florin Iucha wrote: > cat procmail.log | sed -n -e '/From [^@]*@/ s/.* [^ ]* \([^ ]* [^ ]*\) .*/\1/p' | sort | uniq -c I bow to your sed 1337ness. ;) -- Carl Soderstrom Systems Administrator Real-Time Enterprises www.real-time.com From chrome at real-time.com Thu Aug 18 08:21:35 2005 From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom) Date: Thu Aug 18 08:24:23 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050816080626.A11585@baker.space.umn.edu>; from crumley@belka.space.umn.edu on Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 08:06:26AM -0500 References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> <20050816080626.A11585@baker.space.umn.edu> Message-ID: <20050818082135.J24983@real-time.com> On 08/16 08:06 , Jim Crumley wrote: > I just use the mailstat script that comes with procmail. It > reads the procmail log and gives info on number of messages to > each mail folder. To get daily reports you could just put it in > a cron job and have cron mail you the results. whatddya know, someone solved the problem already! thanks for the tip. I should have googled for something like 'count incoming messages procmail' rather than immediately jump to the conclusion I needed to write a counter myself. -- Carl Soderstrom Systems Administrator Real-Time Enterprises www.real-time.com From chrome at real-time.com Thu Aug 18 08:37:48 2005 From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom) Date: Thu Aug 18 08:38:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net>; from florin@iucha.net on Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 04:51:39PM -0500 References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net> Message-ID: <20050818083748.M24983@real-time.com> thanks for the suggestions everyone. Looks like the mail load is higher than I thought; at least if spam is included (most of which goes to /dev/null anyway) here's Mike Miller's one-liner: [chrome@mailhost:~]$egrep '^From ' ~/Mail/procmail.log | gawk '{print $4" "$5", "$7}' | uniq -c 788 Aug 8, 2005 743 Aug 9, 2005 753 Aug 10, 2005 723 Aug 11, 2005 689 Aug 12, 2005 613 Aug 13, 2005 636 Aug 14, 2005 781 Aug 15, 2005 655 Aug 16, 2005 918 Aug 17, 2005 262 Aug 18, 2005 and here's Florin's one-liner: [chrome@mailhost:~]$cd Mail [chrome@mailhost:~/Mail]$ cat procmail.log | sed -n -e '/From [^@]*@/ s/.* [^ ]* \([^ ]* [^ ]*\) .*/\1/p' | sort | uniq -c 1531 Aug 753 Aug 10 723 Aug 11 689 Aug 12 613 Aug 13 636 Aug 14 781 Aug 15 655 Aug 16 918 Aug 17 262 Aug 18 looks like there's a bug somewhere in that line noise of a code that doesn't deal with single-digit dates properly. I'll probably stick with Mr. Miller's code (partly because I can understand it), but thanks for the suggestions everyone! -- Carl Soderstrom Systems Administrator Real-Time Enterprises www.real-time.com From florin at iucha.net Thu Aug 18 09:06:15 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Thu Aug 18 09:06:24 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050818083748.M24983@real-time.com> References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net> <20050818083748.M24983@real-time.com> Message-ID: <20050818140614.GK24823@iucha.net> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 08:37:48AM -0500, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote: > > thanks for the suggestions everyone. Looks like the mail load is higher than > I thought; at least if spam is included (most of which goes to /dev/null > anyway) > > here's Mike Miller's one-liner: > [chrome@mailhost:~]$egrep '^From ' ~/Mail/procmail.log | gawk '{print $4" > "$5", "$7}' | uniq -c > 788 Aug 8, 2005 > 743 Aug 9, 2005 > 753 Aug 10, 2005 > 723 Aug 11, 2005 > 689 Aug 12, 2005 > 613 Aug 13, 2005 > 636 Aug 14, 2005 > 781 Aug 15, 2005 > 655 Aug 16, 2005 > 918 Aug 17, 2005 > 262 Aug 18, 2005 > > > and here's Florin's one-liner: > > [chrome@mailhost:~]$cd Mail > [chrome@mailhost:~/Mail]$ cat procmail.log | sed -n -e '/From [^@]*@/ > s/.* [^ ]* \([^ ]* [^ ]*\) .*/\1/p' | sort | uniq -c > 1531 Aug > 753 Aug 10 > 723 Aug 11 > 689 Aug 12 > 613 Aug 13 > 636 Aug 14 > 781 Aug 15 > 655 Aug 16 > 918 Aug 17 > 262 Aug 18 > > looks like there's a bug somewhere in that line noise of a code that doesn't > deal with single-digit dates properly. > > I'll probably stick with Mr. Miller's code (partly because I can understand > it), but thanks for the suggestions everyone! My script looks for dates as they occur _two spaces_ after some variable piece of text [1]. The awk is more straight forward but can be thrown off by extra logging at the beginning, or spaces in names. Looking at th output, it seems that my paranthesis should be \([^ ]* [ 0-9]*\) as the single digit dates seem to be padded (my logfile was cut at the 12 so I did not see that case). florin 1: You can add custom log pieces to the log, to record which rule caused a piece of mail to be filed in a certain way. For example: :0 * ^Received: from 209.98.146.184 { LOG="SPAM: Spoofs my public IP " :0 spam/iucha/ } -- Don't question authority: they don't know either! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050818/da9d3e78/attachment.pgp From chap0230 at umn.edu Wed Aug 17 17:12:42 2005 From: chap0230 at umn.edu (Joe Chapman) Date: Thu Aug 18 15:47:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] yum, up2date problems after upgrading to FC4 Message-ID: Hey Everyone, I have recently upgraded from FC3 to FC4 via yum. (I will never do this again) And now neither yum or up2date works. I have tried everything that I know and need some advice on what to try next. Here are some things that I have done as well as some info that will hopefully help someone help me :) [root@www ~]# yum upgrade The yum libraries do not seem to be availableon your system for this version of python 2.4.1 (#1, May 16 2005, 15:19:29) [GCC 4.0.0 20050512 (Red Hat 4.0.0-5)] Please make sure the package you used to installyum was built for your install of python. [root@www ~]# up2date Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/sbin/up2date", line 11, in ? import rpm [root@www ~]# rpm -V up2date SM5....T c /etc/sysconfig/rhn/up2date S.5....T c /etc/sysconfig/rhn/up2date-uuid ..?..... /usr/share/rhn/__init__.py ..?..... /usr/share/rhn/actions/__init__.py ..?..... /usr/share/rhn/up2date_client/__init__.py [root@www ~]# rpm -V yum [root@www ~]# rpm -qa | grep ^rpm rpm-devel-4.4.1-22 rpm-python-4.3.2-21 rpm-build-4.3.2-21 rpm-libs-4.4.1-22 rpm-4.3.2-21 rpm-libs-4.3.2-21 [root@www ~]# rpm -e rpm-libs-4.3.2-21 error: Failed dependencies: librpm-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-4.3.2-21.i386 librpm-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-python-4.3.2-21.i386 librpm-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-build-4.3.2-21.i386 librpm-4.3.so is needed by (installed) net-snmp-5.2.1.2-FC3.1.i386 librpm-4.3.so is needed by (installed) net-snmp-utils-5.2.1.2 FC3.1.i386 librpmbuild-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmbuild-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-build-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmdb-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmdb-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-python-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmdb-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-build-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmdb-4.3.so is needed by (installed) net-snmp-5.2.1.2-FC3.1.i386 librpmdb-4.3.so is needed by (installed) net-snmp-utils-5.2.1.2-FC3.1.i386 librpmio-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmio-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-python-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmio-4.3.so is needed by (installed) rpm-build-4.3.2-21.i386 librpmio-4.3.so is needed by (installed) net-snmp-5.2.1.2-FC3.1.i386 librpmio-4.3.so is needed by (installed) net-snmp-utils-5.2.1.2-FC3.1.i386 [root@www ~]# if anyone has any ideas on what i can do it would be greatly appreciated! As I said before, i am stuck here :( Thanks! -Joe -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.10/73 - Release Date: 8/15/2005 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050817/57e1c645/attachment.htm From jwynia at pragmapool.com Thu Aug 18 08:30:37 2005 From: jwynia at pragmapool.com (J Wynia) Date: Thu Aug 18 15:48:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Podcast In-Reply-To: <4303A5F3.4020809@rosengren.org> References: <925901A0-92FF-406F-92CD-BC8CFC93926E@visi.com> <4303A5F3.4020809@rosengren.org> Message-ID: <43048D7D.50202@pragmapool.com> Jeremy Rosengren wrote: > http://internet.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=05/02/25/2148229&from=rss > is a general guide to creating podcasts under Linux. > > My understanding is that iTunes doesn't *need* special XML to > subscribe to a podcast, you just need some special XML tags in order > to use some of the nifty extras that iTunes supports. Search Google > for things like "podcasting linux" and similar, and then look for > discussion on ways to automatically generate the iTunes specific bits > with whatever tools you find. > If you use Feedburner (http://www.feedburner.com), they'll wrap and modify an existing RSS feed for iTunes and other special podcast tags for video, etc. Works fairly well. -- J Wynia The Glass is Too Big http://www.wynia.org j@wynia.org From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Thu Aug 18 16:00:38 2005 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Thu Aug 18 16:02:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] yum, up2date problems after upgrading to FC4 Message-ID: Joe, In this situation I might try a CDROM based upgrade install of the system from FC4 to FC4. The installer (anaconda) should be able to get your into working order. I have not tried it, so take my advice with a grain of salt. Good luck, Troy >>> "Joe Chapman" 08/17/05 5:12 PM >>> Hey Everyone, I have recently upgraded from FC3 to FC4 via yum. (I will never do this again) And now neither yum or up2date works. I have tried everything that I know and need some advice on what to try next. Here are some things that I have done as well as some info that will hopefully help someone help me :) ... if anyone has any ideas on what i can do it would be greatly appreciated! As I said before, i am stuck here :( Thanks! -Joe From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Thu Aug 18 16:22:44 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Thu Aug 18 16:24:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050818140614.GK24823@iucha.net> References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net> <20050818083748.M24983@real-time.com> <20050818140614.GK24823@iucha.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Florin Iucha wrote: > On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 08:37:48AM -0500, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote: >> >> here's Mike Miller's one-liner: >> [chrome@mailhost:~]$egrep '^From ' ~/Mail/procmail.log | gawk '{print $4" "$5", "$7}' | uniq -c >> >> and here's Florin's one-liner: >> [chrome@mailhost:~/Mail]$ cat procmail.log | sed -n -e '/From [^@]*@/ s/.* [^ ]* \([^ ]* [^ ]*\) .*/\1/p' | sort | uniq -c > > My script looks for dates as they occur _two spaces_ after some variable > piece of text [1]. The awk is more straight forward but can be thrown > off by extra logging at the beginning, or spaces in names. I don't understand how that command can be thrown off. It first egreps for the '^From ' lines, so it doesn't get extra lines and it doesn't miss lines, then it does the gawk on only those lines. Those lines have a uniform format. There are never "spaces in names" because the names are always email addresses that cannot have spaces in them. So the number of fields is always the same and the gawk will never fail. Mike From jay.christopherson at gmail.com Thu Aug 18 20:27:42 2005 From: jay.christopherson at gmail.com (Jay Christopherson) Date: Thu Aug 18 20:28:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Podcast In-Reply-To: <43048D7D.50202@pragmapool.com> References: <925901A0-92FF-406F-92CD-BC8CFC93926E@visi.com> <4303A5F3.4020809@rosengren.org> <43048D7D.50202@pragmapool.com> Message-ID: <58238db8050818182733248da0@mail.gmail.com> The September issue of Linux Journal has an article titled "Internet Radio to Podcast with Shell Tools". The author uses mplayer to do the capture and then created a perl program embedded in a bash script to create corresponding XML information. the resources for the article can be found at www.linuxjournal.com/article/8402 and if you have registered, the article http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/8171 - Jay From seg at haxxed.com Thu Aug 18 21:09:51 2005 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Thu Aug 18 21:10:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] yum, up2date problems after upgrading to FC4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1124417391.7558.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> > rpm-devel-4.4.1-22 > rpm-python-4.3.2-21 > rpm-build-4.3.2-21 > rpm-libs-4.4.1-22 > rpm-4.3.2-21 > rpm-libs-4.3.2-21 Your RPM is kinda broke there. You have two versions of rpm-libs installed. It did not upgrade to RPM 4.4 successfully. The upgrade to 4.4 worked fine on two of my machines, but on my own desktop system, it was a complete and total disaster. I don't know why it failed on this one machine but worked on the other two. They're identical. 4.4 would just die, complaining about being unable to get a lock on the database. Through an incredible amount of hacking and the fedora emergency boot CD, I eventually managed to get 4.3 and 4.4 installed simultaneously, by getting the librpm4.3 package from ATrpms, and using rpm2cpio to extract the rpm binary out of FC3 and put it in /bin/rpm4.3. This allowed me to continue using my system with rpm 4.3, and occasionally try using 4.4. One day, 4.4 just started working. Its still a complete mystery to me. RPM upgrades are voodoo. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050818/e7cfe74f/attachment.pgp From florin at iucha.net Fri Aug 19 08:46:04 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Fri Aug 19 08:46:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net> <20050818083748.M24983@real-time.com> <20050818140614.GK24823@iucha.net> Message-ID: <20050819134604.GN24823@iucha.net> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 04:22:44PM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Florin Iucha wrote: > >My script looks for dates as they occur _two spaces_ after some variable > >piece of text [1]. The awk is more straight forward but can be thrown > >off by extra logging at the beginning, or spaces in names. > > I don't understand how that command can be thrown off. It first egreps > for the '^From ' lines, so it doesn't get extra lines and it doesn't miss > lines, then it does the gawk on only those lines. Those lines have a > uniform format. There are never "spaces in names" because the names are > always email addresses that cannot have spaces in them. So the number of > fields is always the same and the gawk will never fail. I was thinking about "Florin Iucha" kind of spaces in names, but the log message can have (and in my case has) spaces. I was wrong in the second instance, but right in the first instance. Please look again at the snippet I've posted from my .procmailrc . florin -- "A little inaccuracy sometimes saves a ton of explanation." - H. H. Munro (Saki) (1870-1916) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050819/8d11b70f/attachment.pgp From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 19 09:21:26 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 19 09:22:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <20050819134604.GN24823@iucha.net> References: <20050815162038.O19875@real-time.com> <20050815215139.GD24823@iucha.net> <20050818083748.M24983@real-time.com> <20050818140614.GK24823@iucha.net> <20050819134604.GN24823@iucha.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Aug 2005, Florin Iucha wrote: > On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 04:22:44PM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: >> On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Florin Iucha wrote: >>> My script looks for dates as they occur _two spaces_ after some variable >>> piece of text [1]. The awk is more straight forward but can be thrown >>> off by extra logging at the beginning, or spaces in names. >> >> I don't understand how that command can be thrown off. It first egreps >> for the '^From ' lines, so it doesn't get extra lines and it doesn't >> miss lines, then it does the gawk on only those lines. Those lines >> have a uniform format. There are never "spaces in names" because the >> names are always email addresses that cannot have spaces in them. So >> the number of fields is always the same and the gawk will never fail. > > I was thinking about "Florin Iucha" kind of spaces in > names, but the log message can have (and in my case has) spaces. I was > wrong in the second instance, but right in the first instance. > > Please look again at the snippet I've posted from my .procmailrc . Can that be found here?... http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/2005-August/author.html It would be good to see someone else's log file I guess. Mine never has a space in an email address because it retains only the address itself, and that obviously cannot contain a space. I have 6.5 years of procmail log file and it contains no examples of extra spaces. Here's the proof: # egrep '^From ' .procmail/log | gawk '{print $3}' | sort | uniq -c 62533 Fri 61566 Mon 35030 Sat 36271 Sun 67671 Thu 66921 Tue 68171 Wed Other people might want to try that to see what their usage patterns look like (and to test for extra spaces). For me, it looks like Wednesday is the biggest email day, then Thursday, then Tuesday, but Monday and Friday get about 8% less than midweek and weekends get about 60% less than weekdays. Have a nice weekend! Mike From sos at zjod.net Fri Aug 19 10:09:51 2005 From: sos at zjod.net (Steve Siegfried) Date: Fri Aug 19 10:10:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: from "Mike Miller" at Aug 19, 2005 09:21:26 AM Message-ID: <200508191509.j7JF9qA15187@zjod.net> In part, Mike Miller wrote: > > It would be good to see someone else's log file I guess. Mine never has a > space in an email address because it retains only the address itself, and > that obviously cannot contain a space. I have 6.5 years of procmail log > file and it contains no examples of extra spaces. Here's the proof: > > # egrep '^From ' .procmail/log | gawk '{print $3}' | sort | uniq -c > 62533 Fri > 61566 Mon > 35030 Sat > 36271 Sun > 67671 Thu > 66921 Tue > 68171 Wed > > Other people might want to try that to see what their usage patterns look > like (and to test for extra spaces). For me, it looks like Wednesday is > the biggest email day, then Thursday, then Tuesday, but Monday and Friday > get about 8% less than midweek and weekends get about 60% less than > weekdays. > > Have a nice weekend! > > Mike Nice hack! My procmail logs only go back 2002, but yeah, Wednesday is the heaviest day for incoming: # egrep '^From ' procmail_log.200{2,3,4,5} | gawk '{print $3}' | sort | uniq -c 57837 Fri 59187 Mon 44542 Sat 45698 Sun 61966 Thu 61124 Tue 62476 Wed Slightly more interesting is how the volume of spam seems to be increasing: # egrep '^From ' procmail_log.200{2,3,4,5} | gawk '{print $4 " " $7 }' | uniq -c 2984 Jan 2002 3022 Feb 2002 3168 Mar 2002 2215 Apr 2002 3297 May 2002 3049 Jun 2002 2898 Jul 2002 3140 Aug 2002 3131 Sep 2002 3135 Oct 2002 2817 Nov 2002 3514 Dec 2002 3409 Jan 2003 3247 Feb 2003 4319 Mar 2003 5628 Apr 2003 5937 May 2003 6277 Jun 2003 7977 Jul 2003 7706 Aug 2003 11059 Sep 2003 13912 Oct 2003 17588 Nov 2003 17911 Dec 2003 9964 Jan 2004 8212 Feb 2004 7599 Mar 2004 8793 Apr 2004 7634 May 2004 8107 Jun 2004 7788 Jul 2004 13026 Aug 2004 13362 Sep 2004 14897 Oct 2004 18789 Nov 2004 16540 Dec 2004 18011 Jan 2005 16586 Feb 2005 17153 Mar 2005 15887 Apr 2005 14036 May 2005 13451 Jun 2005 14037 Jul 2005 7620 Aug 2005 (hey, it's only the 19'th today!) Thank God for spam filtering! -S From twakefield at stcloudstate.edu Fri Aug 19 10:25:53 2005 From: twakefield at stcloudstate.edu (Wakefield, Thad M.) Date: Fri Aug 19 10:26:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail Message-ID: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6D8D@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> > >> > >> here's Mike Miller's one-liner: > >> [chrome@mailhost:~]$egrep '^From ' ~/Mail/procmail.log | gawk '{print $4" "$5", "$7}' | uniq -c In my continuing endeavor to understand pipes, redirects and xargs, is there a reason why you used egrep instead of: gawk '/^From /{print $4,$5", "$7}' ~/Mail/procmail.log ...? Thad From brockn at gmail.com Fri Aug 19 10:43:35 2005 From: brockn at gmail.com (Brock Noland) Date: Fri Aug 19 10:44:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6D8D@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> References: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6D8D@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> Message-ID: <741dcbb8050819084355bddc16@mail.gmail.com> To me, it just looks like a style difference. With grep, awk, sed, wc,.... There are at least 10 million ways to skin a cat. Brock On 8/19/05, Wakefield, Thad M. wrote: > > >> > > >> here's Mike Miller's one-liner: > > >> [chrome@mailhost:~]$egrep '^From ' ~/Mail/procmail.log | gawk > '{print $4" "$5", "$7}' | uniq -c > > In my continuing endeavor to understand pipes, redirects and xargs, is > there a > reason why you used egrep instead of: gawk '/^From /{print $4,$5", "$7}' > ~/Mail/procmail.log ...? > > Thad > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 19 11:00:49 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 19 11:02:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6D8D@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> References: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6D8D@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Aug 2005, Wakefield, Thad M. wrote: >>>> >>>> here's Mike Miller's one-liner: >>>> [chrome@mailhost:~]$egrep '^From ' ~/Mail/procmail.log | gawk '{print $4" "$5", "$7}' | uniq -c > > In my continuing endeavor to understand pipes, redirects and xargs, is > there a > reason why you used egrep instead of: gawk '/^From /{print $4,$5", "$7}' ~/Mail/procmail.log ...? Yes. I didn't know you could do that with gawk!! ;-) Now that I know, I compare the two in a speed test on my clunky old Solaris SPARC box: # time ; gawk '/^From /{print $4,$5", "$7}' .procmail/log > /dev/null ; time 13.54u 4.91s 47:09.89 0.6% 47.36u 12.61s 48:13.93 2.0% # time ; egrep '^From ' .procmail/log | gawk '{print $4,$5", "$7}' > /dev/null ; time 47.36u 12.63s 48:49.93 2.0% 73.84u 18.61s 49:19.48 3.1% The egrep version took 30.15 s and the gawk-only version took 64.04 s. So I think egrep is faster than gawk, by far. Thus, this... egrep 'regexp' file ...appears to be faster than this... gawk '/regexp/{print $0}' ...though I think they do the same thing. By the way, thanks for reminding me that the OFS in gawk is a space. I did forget that and it is definitely easier to type a comma instead of " " repeatedly (I often have 5 or more space-delimited output fields). Mike From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 19 11:03:37 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 19 11:06:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] message counter in procmail In-Reply-To: <200508191509.j7JF9qA15187@zjod.net> References: <200508191509.j7JF9qA15187@zjod.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Aug 2005, Steve Siegfried wrote: > My procmail logs only go back 2002, but yeah, Wednesday is the heaviest > day for incoming: > > # egrep '^From ' procmail_log.200{2,3,4,5} | gawk '{print $3}' | sort | uniq -c > 57837 Fri > 59187 Mon > 44542 Sat > 45698 Sun > 61966 Thu > 61124 Tue > 62476 Wed I think your weekdays show exactly the same ordering as mine. Maybe we should have people do this instead.... # egrep '^From ' procmail_log | gawk '{print $3}' | sort | uniq -c | sort -n -k 1,1 ...so that we can quickly see how the days are sorted. People would just have to change the name of the procmail log file. Mike From tclug at greatlakedata.com Sat Aug 20 01:40:43 2005 From: tclug at greatlakedata.com (greg wm) Date: Sat Aug 20 01:42:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] =?utf-8?b?w7EgJm50aWxkZTsgw6cgJmNjZWRpbDs=?= Message-ID: <4306D06B.90602@greatlakedata.com> hi folks, feels rather like i've ventured into uncharted territory, but somebody out there somewhere must know the way.. i used wget to copy the entire http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org site to http://nvpf.org/np. the former is asp pages, the latter captured as html. for example, http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org/spanish/welcome.asp was captured to http://nvpf.org/np/spanish/welcome.asp.html as you can see, the capture is mostly fine, including spanish characters in the text (eg a?o), however the spanish characters in the menus didn't do quite so well (eg Misi?n) in the file a?o appears as año which is apparently "good", but Misi?n appears as Misi?n, which is apparently "bad". first question: why is that bad? if i tell galeon, instead of automatic encoding, use western iso-8859-1, or any of many others, presto, the page appears nicely. but i don't have to do that to see the original, nor do i have to do that for anybody else's pages, and of course i can't expect our audience to go and fiddle with that in their browsers. but really now, why isn't an ? an ?? right after the title the file says . why isn't that good enough? do i need to change some directive or setting in apache? second question: it looks like wget was inconsistent! why? likely hint: the menus are rendered out of some .asp database or whatever, differently than the rest of the text of the page. but, so what? why didn't wget capture something identical to what my browser shows? the command i ran was wget -ENKkrl19 -nH -w2 -owget.log http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org so anyway i sez hey no problem, i'll just find and replace. well ha. couldn't get either egrep nor sed to find an ? that was right under their noses. third question: what's the trick to find and replace these buggers? vim can find them, in interactive mode, so.. should i be trying to figger out how to use vim as a grep replacement.. uhh.. ..? fourth question: where should i be asking these questions, or, where do i look for the mysterical solution, and will i recognize it when i see it? tia, greg Greg Whitley Mott IT Coordinator NonviolentPeaceforce.org From random at argle.org Sat Aug 20 09:46:10 2005 From: random at argle.org (Daniel Taylor) Date: Sat Aug 20 09:46:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] =?UTF-8?B?w7EgJm50aWxkZTsgw6cgJmNjZWRpbDs=?= In-Reply-To: <4306D06B.90602@greatlakedata.com> References: <4306D06B.90602@greatlakedata.com> Message-ID: <43074232.9070101@argle.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Make sure your locale is set appropriately. A UTF-8 ? is a different character than it is under 8859-1. I've personally found that vim does really well editing files like this, as it does many of the conversions automatically. I would imagine that emacs does likewise. greg wm wrote: > hi folks, > > feels rather like i've ventured into uncharted territory, but somebody > out there somewhere must know the way.. > > i used wget to copy the entire http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org site to > http://nvpf.org/np. the former is asp pages, the latter captured as html. > > for example, http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org/spanish/welcome.asp was > captured to http://nvpf.org/np/spanish/welcome.asp.html > > as you can see, the capture is mostly fine, including spanish characters > in the text (eg a?o), however the spanish characters in the menus didn't > do quite so well (eg Misi?n) > > in the file a?o appears as año which is apparently "good", but > Misi?n appears as Misi?n, which is apparently "bad". > > first question: why is that bad? > > if i tell galeon, instead of automatic encoding, use western iso-8859-1, > or any of many others, presto, the page appears nicely. but i don't > have to do that to see the original, nor do i have to do that for > anybody else's pages, and of course i can't expect our audience to go > and fiddle with that in their browsers. > > but really now, why isn't an ? an ?? right after the title the file > says . why isn't that good enough? do i need to change > some directive or setting in apache? > > second question: it looks like wget was inconsistent! why? > > likely hint: the menus are rendered out of some .asp database or > whatever, differently than the rest of the text of the page. > > but, so what? why didn't wget capture something identical to what my > browser shows? the command i ran was > wget -ENKkrl19 -nH -w2 -owget.log http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org > > so anyway i sez hey no problem, i'll just find and replace. well ha. > couldn't get either egrep nor sed to find an ? that was right under > their noses. > > third question: what's the trick to find and replace these buggers? vim > can find them, in interactive mode, so.. should i be trying to figger > out how to use vim as a grep replacement.. uhh.. ..? > > fourth question: where should i be asking these questions, or, where do > i look for the mysterical solution, and will i recognize it when i see it? > > tia, > greg > > Greg Whitley Mott > IT Coordinator > NonviolentPeaceforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > - -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDB0Iy8/QSptFdBtURAuwOAJ9yo1UnPGizkWL58dXwBBe0A9ulkACfVSCl 6JiAyfX1eKiFT6YouXp9Xdc= =c0fp -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From tclug at greatlakedata.com Sun Aug 21 01:15:05 2005 From: tclug at greatlakedata.com (greg wm) Date: Sun Aug 21 01:17:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: meta http-equiv useless?? In-Reply-To: <430792C7.3090607@nvpf.org> References: <430792C7.3090607@nvpf.org> Message-ID: <43081BE9.2010003@greatlakedata.com> greg wm wrote: > i used wget to copy the entire http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org site to > http://nvpf.org/np. the former is in m$ asp, the latter captured as html. > > for example, http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org/spanish/welcome.asp was > captured to http://nvpf.org/np/spanish/welcome.asp.html > > as you can see, the capture is mostly fine, including spanish characters > in the text (eg a?o), however the spanish characters in the menus didn't > do quite so well (eg Misi?n) fixed! see below. > in the file a?o appears as año which is apparently "good", but > Misi?n appears as Misi?n, which is apparently "bad". > > first question: why is that bad? > > if i tell galeon, instead of automatic encoding, use western iso-8859-1, > then, presto, the page appears nicely. but i don't have to do that to > see the original, nor do i have to do that for anybody else's pages, and > of course i can't expect our audience to go and fiddle with that in > their browsers. > > second question: why doesn't the meta http-equiv header do anything? > > right after the title the file says content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">. why isn't that good enough? > why does it make no difference at all what i change it to? i tried > utf-8, Utf-8, UTF-8, Windows-1252, none have any effect tho i can see > them if i tell my browser to view source. overridden by apache's http headers, apparently. see below. > fourth question: can wget be tweaked to do better? > > i think those menus were rendered out of some .asp database or > whatever, differently than the rest of the text of the page. but so > what? why didn't wget capture something identical to what my > browser shows? > > the command i ran was > wget -ENKkrl19 -nH -w2 -owget.log http://nonviolentpeaceforce.org my locale is en_IE.UTF-8, so why did wget save in latin-1 format? the wget manual page mentions nothing at all about character sets. > well whatever, thunk i, no problem, i'll just find and replace. well > ha. i haven't yet managed to craft sed to capture the buggers! it's > all making me feel dang defeated.. Brian Foster wrote: > there are other alternatives. e.g., convert the page > (file) to UTF-8 (e.g., using iconv(1)), being sure to > change the meta charset setting to utf-8. > > finally, vim(1): vim confuses things here (I am _not_ > trying to start an editor war!). vim guesses what the > file's charset is, and adjusts accordingly so that you > can view/edit it in a locale using a different charset. > hence, a lot of things that cat displays as rubbish > display Ok in vim. if, in vim, you do a ?:set? command, > you'll probably see an entry like ?fileencoding=utf-8?. > that means vim thinks the file is UTF-8. (probably, > for the ISO-8859-1 files, it says ?fileencoding=latin1?; > Latin1 is a common informal(?) name for ISO-8859-1.) > ?:help fileencoding? for more information. thank you brian! perhaps iconv might have done the trick, anyway i used vim. vim :se fileencoding revealed that wget saved the files in latin-1, and :se fileencoding=utf-8 for each file cleaned up the mess. wasn't even a big job after using :map such that each file was fixed with a single keystroke. William A. Rowe, Jr. wrote: > What happens if you remove the defaultcharset entirely; have Apache > provide no hinting at the encoding; does the browser respect the meta > tag? > > The http headers are authoritative, and override any metadata. If you > rather control your encoding with meta tags, turn off charsets entirely. that is probably the winning answer. i already applied the above solution so i dunno for sure, but look.. wget --save-headers from the original m$ .asp server: HTTP/1.1 200 OK Server: Microsoft-IIS/5.0 Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 21:18:55 GMT Connection: keep-alive Connection: Keep-Alive Content-Length: 11003 Content-Type: text/html Set-Cookie: ASPSESSIONIDAQQBRDRA=KNIPOCMDJPKMMANLNHFMKMGH; path=/ Cache-control: private wget --save-headers from my apache server: HTTP/1.1 200 OK Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 04:10:34 GMT Server: Apache/2.0.52 (CentOS) Last-Modified: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 01:34:43 GMT ETag: "260261-2b33-9134b2c0" Accept-Ranges: bytes Content-Length: 11059 Connection: close Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 now i wouldn't have thought that the following httpd.conf directive would result in overriding the meta http-equiv headers, but, there does seem to be a strong odor.. # Specify a default charset for all pages sent out. This is # always a good idea and opens the door for future internationalisation # of your web site, should you ever want it. Specifying it as # a default does little harm; as the standard dictates that a page # is in iso-8859-1 (latin1) unless specified otherwise i.e. you # are merely stating the obvious. There are also some security # reasons in browsers, related to javascript and URL parsing # which encourage you to always set a default char set. # AddDefaultCharset UTF-8 greg > Greg Whitley Mott > IT Coordinator > NonviolentPeaceforce.org From Mrbizz4 at aol.com Sun Aug 21 06:22:00 2005 From: Mrbizz4 at aol.com (Mrbizz4@aol.com) Date: Sun Aug 21 06:23:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Problem with inetd Message-ID: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> I recently installed Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 on an HP Pavilion 310n. The problem I'm having is that inetd is spawning the telnet service. When I scan the ports on my computer, port 23 is actively listening for telnet connections. I have tried many things in order to close this port. I have tried using update-rc.d, etc. I have purged the telnet package, so I don't believe a telnet connection is possible, but even after all of this the port remains open! I have tried to edit inetd.conf. I have tried to comment out the telnet service in /etc/services, but all that does is change the identity of the service to "unknown", but anyone can tell it's telnet, because the specific port 23 is open and the computer is actively listening. I've looked at the how to on the Debian home page and tried all of the suggestions on it. How can I remove the inet daemon? Your help is greatly appreciated! Mike From chewie at wookimus.net Sun Aug 21 07:37:07 2005 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Sun Aug 21 07:39:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Problem with inetd In-Reply-To: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> References: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> Message-ID: <20050821123707.8A66734A1@skuld.wookimus.net> Install lsof and find out what is actually using that port. Then kill the process. I don't run telnet, but I do run SSH. Here's an example: lsof -iTCP:22 COMMAND PID USER FD TYPE DEVICE SIZE NODE NAME sshd 2621 root 3u IPv6 5928 TCP *:ssh (LISTEN) To kill the process, all you have to do is "kill -9 PID". Good luck. -- Chad Walstrom http://www.wookimus.net/ assert(expired(knowledge)); /* core dump */ From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Aug 21 10:43:04 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Aug 21 10:43:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508211543.j7LFh4f28196@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: HP laserjet 4mv HP laserjet 4mv with lower cassette tray (for 8.5x11 paper) and a tray for 11x17 paper. Has parallel port and HP jetdirect network module (BNC, 10baseT and localtalk). Lower tray connector has one pin missing - been using manual feed tray with Linux via parallel port - never have tested the HP JetDirect connection. Make offer. Seller Email address: john dot meier at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Aug 21 10:44:21 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Aug 21 10:45:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508211544.j7LFiLg28713@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: 12 port intel Express 100Base-TX stackable hub 12 port intel Express 100Base-TX stackable hub. Works fine! Make offer. Seller Email address: john dot meier at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Aug 21 10:46:21 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Aug 21 10:48:56 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508211546.j7LFkLU29225@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: 8 port KVM Apex Inc. Outlook Model 180DX 8port kvm with mounting rails and 4 cables of various lengths $70 or best offer. Seller Email address: john dot meier at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Aug 21 10:48:55 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Aug 21 10:51:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508211548.j7LFmtZ29752@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: apple IIe and color monitor apple IIe with 2 drives and color monitor. Had it up and running a year ago... don't have OS disks anymore. Seller Email address: john dot meier at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Aug 21 10:58:27 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Aug 21 10:59:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508211558.j7LFwRO30630@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: 2 oscilloscopes A bit off topic - but I have two scopes I need to part with. Heathkit Impscope Model ev-3 - this is a biological EKG type scope - hook it up to frog legs and send simulation pulses - great fun for the whole family. Vintage analog KS15512 L5AB scope - made by ITI Electronics. I've used it to trouble shoot my Juke box - works... No probes for either scope. Make offer or just take them :) Seller Email address: john dot meier at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Sun Aug 21 11:04:57 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Sun Aug 21 11:05:10 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Problem with inetd In-Reply-To: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> References: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> Message-ID: <1124640298.5870.4.camel@3po.thodt.net> On Sun, 2005-08-21 at 07:22 -0400, Mrbizz4@aol.com wrote: > I recently installed Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 on an HP Pavilion 310n. The > problem I'm having is that inetd is spawning the telnet service. When > I scan the ports on my computer, port 23 is actively listening for > telnet connections. [snip] I suspect that you may actually be running xinetd, which is configured with /etc/xinetd.conf and /etc/xinetd.d/* (though I thought it used inetd.conf as a source, but I suppose that's configurable...) Anyway, you can use that lsof command, or 'netstat -lp' will also show listening ports and print the program name (-p). -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050821/7cf244ff/attachment-0001.pgp From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Aug 21 14:03:57 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Aug 21 14:05:10 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508211903.j7LJ3vE02906@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: 486 Compag Desktop Hello, I have a Compaq Presario CDS 954 that I would like to get rid of. No cost... Here's the specs: 486 Intel Processor(100mhz or around there) 96mb of Simm Memory Hard-Drive(1gig) Cd-Rom Drive(Not sure of the speed) Floppy No Nic or Modem *It works, just too slow for what I was would use it for.* Let me know via email: blacknight_709@hotmail.com Thanks Seller Email address: blacknight_709 at hotmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Mon Aug 22 09:06:20 2005 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Aug 22 09:07:21 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Problem with inetd In-Reply-To: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> References: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> Message-ID: <20050822090620.A20906@pchelka.space.umn.edu> On Sun, Aug 21, 2005 at 07:22:00AM -0400, Mrbizz4@aol.com wrote: > I recently installed Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 on an HP Pavilion > 310n. The problem I'm having is that inetd is spawning the > telnet service. When I scan the ports on my computer, port 23 > is actively listening for telnet connections. I have tried > many things in order to close this port. I have tried using > update-rc.d, etc. I have purged the telnet package, so I don't > believe a telnet connection is possible, but even after all of Did you purge the telnetd package as well? -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | From dworden at gmail.com Mon Aug 22 17:18:10 2005 From: dworden at gmail.com (David Worden) Date: Mon Aug 22 17:19:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Problem with inetd In-Reply-To: <20050822090620.A20906@pchelka.space.umn.edu> References: <4D90FAEA.71A87B8C.0018FC56@aol.com> <20050822090620.A20906@pchelka.space.umn.edu> Message-ID: On 8/22/05, Jim Crumley wrote: > On Sun, Aug 21, 2005 at 07:22:00AM -0400, Mrbizz4@aol.com wrote: > > I recently installed Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 on an HP Pavilion > > 310n. The problem I'm having is that inetd is spawning the > > telnet service. When I scan the ports on my computer, port 23 > > is actively listening for telnet connections. I have tried > > many things in order to close this port. I have tried using > > update-rc.d, etc. I have purged the telnet package, so I don't > > believe a telnet connection is possible, but even after all of > > Did you purge the telnetd package as well? > Comment out the telnet port in /etc/services too............. From webmaster at mn-linux.org Mon Aug 22 19:15:55 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Aug 22 19:17:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508230015.j7N0Ft023520@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: PC Dual XP 2200 Home built PC: Motherboard: ASUS A7M266-D Processors: (2) Modified Xp 2200+ Memory: 512 MB (2 x 256) DDR Video Card: ATI Radeon 256 MB AGP HD: (1) 40 GB, (1) 10 GB CDR: Memorex 52x24x52 Yes it runs Linux, have run Fedora, Debian, and SuSE on it. Currently has Fedora installed. If you are wondering about the stability of the processors, I have been running one of them for roughly a year and the other I bought later on and it has been running for about 5 or 6 months, no problems, always recognizes as an MP. Make an offer and feel free to e-mail questions to evisuale@yahoo.com. Seller Email address: evisuale at yahoo dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From deschiff at gmail.com Tue Aug 23 08:39:36 2005 From: deschiff at gmail.com (David Schiff) Date: Tue Aug 23 08:39:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Grub booting iso images Message-ID: <63570b03050823063951ea01d0@mail.gmail.com> Hi all; Is it possible to set up a partition containing multiple iso images of various LiveCDs, and have grub boot your pick with a mount loop ? Then one could run off HD image and not take as big of a performance hit as when running off of CDROM. Any feedback, pointers or reference URLs would be most welcome. From tmarble at info9.net Tue Aug 23 10:30:53 2005 From: tmarble at info9.net (Tom Marble) Date: Tue Aug 23 10:31:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Registrar and Wildcard SSL certificate recommendations? Message-ID: <430B412D.9090703@info9.net> All: It's time to update various name related things and I want to ping the list for either positive (or negative) recommendations for the following: Registrars register.com: I currently use register.com and have been fairly happy with the service, although it is quite expensive. netsol : I've seen warnings on this list to avoid them godaddy.com : seems like a popular choice for this list others? I also need an SSL Certificate. I don't really need a Wildcard Certificate, but some of the prices (godaddy and freessl) are comparable to basic certs. Has anyone used and had success with Wildcard certs? One simple 128 bit SSL Certificate for 1-year verisign : outrageously priced thawte : $199 https://www.thawte.com/core/process?retail-enrollment.enrollment-type=new-ssl2 seems to have a very professional and easy to use site would help support free personal e-mail certs they offer entrust : $149 http://www.entrust.com/ssl-certificates/web_pricing.htm instantssl : $49 ($449 Wildcard) http://www.instantssl.com/ssl-certificate-products/ssl.html?currency=USD®ion=North%20America&country=US geotrust : $169 ($899 Wildcard) http://www.geotrust.com/web_security/index.htm digicert: $99 ($499 Wildcard) http://www.digicert.com/ssl-certificate.htm freessl: $49 ($175 Wildcard) http://www.freessl.com/chainedssl/chainedssl_wildcard.html godaddy: $29 ($199 Wildcard) https://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/ssl/compare.asp?se=%2B&ci=720 others? Thanks! --Tom From rharding at msufame.msu.edu Tue Aug 23 11:23:15 2005 From: rharding at msufame.msu.edu (Richard Harding) Date: Tue Aug 23 11:25:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Registrar and Wildcard SSL certificate recommendations? Message-ID: <1124814196.13981.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-08-23 at 10:30 -0500, Tom Marble wrote: > All: > > It's time to update various name related things and > I want to ping the list for either positive (or negative) > recommendations for the following: > > Registrars > register.com: I currently use register.com and have been fairly > happy with the service, although it is quite expensive. > netsol : I've seen warnings on this list to avoid them > godaddy.com : seems like a popular choice for this list > others? I've been using godaddy for about 6 or so domains for several years and never had a problem. Nice control and nothing bad to say at all. > I also need an SSL Certificate. I don't really need > a Wildcard Certificate, but some of the prices > (godaddy and freessl) are comparable to basic certs. > Has anyone used and had success with Wildcard certs? > > One simple 128 bit SSL Certificate for 1-year > verisign : outrageously priced > thawte : $199 > https://www.thawte.com/core/process?retail-enrollment.enrollment-type=new-ssl2 > seems to have a very professional and easy to use site > would help support free personal e-mail certs they offer > entrust : $149 > http://www.entrust.com/ssl-certificates/web_pricing.htm > instantssl : $49 ($449 Wildcard) > http://www.instantssl.com/ssl-certificate-products/ssl.html?currency=USD®ion=North%20America&country=US > geotrust : $169 ($899 Wildcard) > http://www.geotrust.com/web_security/index.htm > digicert: $99 ($499 Wildcard) > http://www.digicert.com/ssl-certificate.htm > freessl: $49 ($175 Wildcard) > http://www.freessl.com/chainedssl/chainedssl_wildcard.html > godaddy: $29 ($199 Wildcard) > https://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/ssl/compare.asp?se=%2B&ci=720 > others? I've been hanging around webhostingtalk.com as I'm hoping (if a project goes through) to be looking for a co-lo host and SSL cert and I've been hearing that ev1 has good SSL prices/setup. No personal experience yet, but that's the rumor. I've heard some bad things on that site about godaddy.com and SSL. Let me know how this goes though so I can pick up a tip on how things went for you. Rick From bfriedman at exstream.com Tue Aug 23 12:48:30 2005 From: bfriedman at exstream.com (Brent) Date: Tue Aug 23 12:49:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Question about Sun box and openboot Message-ID: <00c201c5a80a$dfc6e360$3200000a@exstream.com> I have a problem that I thought someone might have experienced before. I am trying to get the machine to boot from an install cd, but things aren't going as planned. I have a sun blade, with only USB keyboard/mouse input. It is currently running solaris 9, but it is flaky - meaning, when I try to open a shell console, CDE gets a black background, and no shell opens. The mouse and window manager remain responsive, but I can't get to a shell to init 0. Since there is no sun keyboard, stop-a isn't available. Ctrl-break should work, but it isn't working via the usb keyboard adapter. I tried the 'hit the power button after initial beep,' but that doesn't get me any closer to an openboot prompt. Any ideas? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050823/7a64f98a/attachment.htm From adam at whee.org Tue Aug 23 12:44:59 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Tue Aug 23 13:01:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Question about Sun box and openboot In-Reply-To: <00c201c5a80a$dfc6e360$3200000a@exstream.com> References: <00c201c5a80a$dfc6e360$3200000a@exstream.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Aug 2005, Brent wrote: > I have a sun blade, with only USB keyboard/mouse input. It is currently > running solaris 9, but it is flaky - meaning, when I try to open a shell > console, CDE gets a black background, and no shell opens. The mouse and > window manager remain responsive, but I can't get to a shell to init 0. How about booting with the video card removed, and a console cable plugged into the serial port? > Since there is no sun keyboard, stop-a isn't available. Ctrl-break > should work, but it isn't working via the usb keyboard adapter. Failing all else, I have the sun USB keyboard from my Blade 100, I'd be willing to lend it to you if you can pick up in Bloomington. From brockn at gmail.com Tue Aug 23 13:01:07 2005 From: brockn at gmail.com (Brock Noland) Date: Tue Aug 23 13:01:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Question about Sun box and openboot In-Reply-To: <00c201c5a80a$dfc6e360$3200000a@exstream.com> References: <00c201c5a80a$dfc6e360$3200000a@exstream.com> Message-ID: <741dcbb80508231101576f5c35@mail.gmail.com> I had the same problem about two years ago. I believe I used what this post says: http://sunportal.sunmanagers.org/pipermail/summaries/2003-October/004407.html Crtl # Brock On 8/23/05, Brent wrote: > > I have a problem that I thought someone might have experienced before. I am > trying to get the machine to boot from an install cd, but things aren't > going as planned. > > I have a sun blade, with only USB keyboard/mouse input. It is currently > running solaris 9, but it is flaky - meaning, when I try to open a shell > console, CDE gets a black background, and no shell opens. The mouse and > window manager remain responsive, but I can't get to a shell to init 0. > > Since there is no sun keyboard, stop-a isn't available. Ctrl-break should > work, but it isn't working via the usb keyboard adapter. > > I tried the 'hit the power button after initial beep,' but that doesn't get > me any closer to an openboot prompt. > > Any ideas? > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Aug 23 15:23:21 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Tue Aug 23 15:23:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200508232023.j7NKNLO08040@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: 19in Monitor Free 19" Gateway CRT monitor. Model EV910 with low mileage. However - occasionally makes a loud high voltage snapping noise & the screen blanks for a second. Perhaps you are electronically handy......... Pick up in Apple Valley area. Seller Email address: pclinux at charter dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org Tue Aug 23 16:01:56 2005 From: jkey at tomobiki.dyndns.org (Joseph Key) Date: Tue Aug 23 16:03:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Registrar and Wildcard SSL certificate recommendations? In-Reply-To: <430B412D.9090703@info9.net> Message-ID: <002e01c5a825$e5ffa580$0439a8c0@Kurama> > -----Original Message----- > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn- > linux.org] On Behalf Of Tom Marble > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 10:31 AM > To: TCLUG Mailing List > Subject: [tclug-list] Registrar and Wildcard SSL certificate > recommendations? > > All: > > It's time to update various name related things and > I want to ping the list for either positive (or negative) > recommendations for the following: > > Registrars > register.com: I currently use register.com and have been fairly > happy with the service, although it is quite expensive. > netsol : I've seen warnings on this list to avoid them > godaddy.com : seems like a popular choice for this list > others? > > I also need an SSL Certificate. I don't really need > a Wildcard Certificate, but some of the prices > (godaddy and freessl) are comparable to basic certs. > Has anyone used and had success with Wildcard certs? > > One simple 128 bit SSL Certificate for 1-year > verisign : outrageously priced > thawte : $199 > https://www.thawte.com/core/process?retail-enrollment.enrollment- > type=new-ssl2 > seems to have a very professional and easy to use site > would help support free personal e-mail certs they offer > entrust : $149 > http://www.entrust.com/ssl-certificates/web_pricing.htm > instantssl : $49 ($449 Wildcard) > http://www.instantssl.com/ssl-certificate- > products/ssl.html?currency=USD®ion=North%20America&country=US > geotrust : $169 ($899 Wildcard) > http://www.geotrust.com/web_security/index.htm > digicert: $99 ($499 Wildcard) > http://www.digicert.com/ssl-certificate.htm > freessl: $49 ($175 Wildcard) > http://www.freessl.com/chainedssl/chainedssl_wildcard.html > godaddy: $29 ($199 Wildcard) > https://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/ssl/compare.asp?se=%2B&ci=720 > others? > > Thanks! > > --Tom > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list Would CAcert work for your ssl certificate. The only problem is CAcert is not included in all the browsers so your users would have to import the root certificate from CAcert. This is a free certificate and a wildcard cert is the same price $0. They can be accessed at www.cacert.org The certificates are good for 6 months, but if you get assured they time goes to 2 years. Joseph Key From tmarble at info9.net Tue Aug 23 16:15:31 2005 From: tmarble at info9.net (Tom Marble) Date: Tue Aug 23 16:15:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Registrar and Wildcard SSL certificate recommendations? In-Reply-To: <002e01c5a825$e5ffa580$0439a8c0@Kurama> References: <002e01c5a825$e5ffa580$0439a8c0@Kurama> Message-ID: <430B91F3.9090806@info9.net> Joseph Key wrote: > Would CAcert work for your ssl certificate. The only problem is CAcert is > not included in all the browsers so your users would have to import the root > certificate from CAcert. For my application I need the "built in" chain of trust without having to approve the cert, for example: https://www.cacert.org/index.php?id=1 > This is a free certificate and a wildcard cert is > the same price $0. They can be accessed at www.cacert.org The certificates > are good for 6 months, but if you get assured they time goes to 2 years. This is certainly an important service to know about for other projects... Thanks for the pointer! Regards, --Tom From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Tue Aug 23 19:59:37 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Tue Aug 23 19:59:43 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Question about Sun box and openboot In-Reply-To: <00c201c5a80a$dfc6e360$3200000a@exstream.com> References: <00c201c5a80a$dfc6e360$3200000a@exstream.com> Message-ID: <1124845177.5870.73.camel@localhost> On Tue, 2005-08-23 at 13:48 -0400, Brent wrote: [snip] > I have a sun blade, with only USB keyboard/mouse input. It is > currently running solaris 9, but it is flaky - meaning, when I try to > open a shell console, CDE gets a black background, and no shell opens. > The mouse and window manager remain responsive, but I can't get to a > shell to init 0. Hmm. Reminds me of how X11 would sometimes behave if it ran out of colors in the 8-bit palette, but Blades are supposed to have 24-bit color, right? Heh, I suppose you could try loading Emacs and then run a shell from there ;-) > Since there is no sun keyboard, stop-a isn't available. Ctrl-break > should work, but it isn't working via the usb keyboard adapter. > > I tried the 'hit the power button after initial beep,' but that > doesn't get me any closer to an openboot prompt. From what I've read, it sounds like CTRL-Break should do the trick. If you end up using a serial console, some terminal emulators have special commands to allow you to send the Stop-A sequence. -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050823/aa0c2576/attachment.pgp From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Tue Aug 23 22:55:11 2005 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Tue Aug 23 22:55:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Grub booting iso images In-Reply-To: <63570b03050823063951ea01d0@mail.gmail.com> References: <63570b03050823063951ea01d0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1124855711.5870.85.camel@localhost> On Tue, 2005-08-23 at 08:39 -0500, David Schiff wrote: > Hi all; > Is it possible to set up a partition containing multiple iso images of > various LiveCDs, and have grub boot your pick with a mount loop ? > Then one could run off HD image and not take as big of a performance > hit as when running off of CDROM. > > Any feedback, pointers or reference URLs would be most welcome. I imagine it would take some tweaking on a per-disc basis. Some systems are designed to be copied onto the hard drive, such as Knoppix. There are some instructions on that here: http://www.penlug.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/GrubSecrets#Using_grub_to_boot_Knoppix_image Optimally, to get this working more broadly, you'd want grub to basically emulate an El Torito-aware BIOS, loading and remapping things in the same manner. Unfortunately, I don't think that's possible (not yet, anyway). Still, even if the boot image could load and run, the loaded operating system would probably start searching for a CD-ROM. It may or may not be possible to have the OS load a hard disk partition instead as the root device, C: drive, etc. Also, would the partition have to be iso9660, or could it be some other filesystem? Hard to say. You'll probably have to experiment with the systems you have available in order to figure things out. -- Mike Hicks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050823/7d05bda1/attachment-0001.pgp From jack at jacku.com Tue Aug 23 23:40:35 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Tue Aug 23 23:29:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Grub booting iso images In-Reply-To: <63570b03050823063951ea01d0@mail.gmail.com> References: <63570b03050823063951ea01d0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200508232340.36111.jack@jacku.com> On Tuesday 23 August 2005 08:39 am, David Schiff wrote: > Hi all; > Is it possible to set up a partition containing multiple iso images of > various LiveCDs, and have grub boot your pick with a mount loop ? > Then one could run off HD image and not take as big of a performance > hit as when running off of CDROM. > > Any feedback, pointers or reference URLs would be most welcome. I've been hacking on the GCT (an old Internet Appliance) with its Compact flash drive in the last couple of weeks and with that using a FAT partition and SYSLINUX has worked sort of. (Puppy Linux will load but I still haven't gotten DSL to load correctly.) This might be an option since ISOLINUX and SYSLINUX are essentially the same. You might be able to chain load the SYSLINUX partition from Grub. Just some stray thoughts. I'm sure others will come up with a reason or two why it won't work. ;-) Jack -- Jack Ungerleider The Ungerleider Group jack@jacku.com http://www.jacku.com From jima at beer.tclug.org Wed Aug 24 07:37:21 2005 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Wed Aug 24 07:37:50 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Tux T-shirts (fwd'd shameless plug) Message-ID: I got this via the email address on the LUG Counter site (http://lugww.counter.li.org/). Not sure what TCLUG's policy is IRT solicitation (do we even have one?), but the merchandise seems on-topic, at least. If nothing else, you might not be able to look at the butterfly the same way again. :) Jima ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 00:08:50 -0400 From: mike To: Subject: Attention LUG President, Officer or Represenative Attention LUG President, Officer or Represenative We are a group of developers (also members of the Athens Area LUG) who have started a business called TuxDelux.com, which sells t-shirts with Tux the Penguin on them. We want to reach as many Linux Users as possible, and as such, we are interested in reaching out your members. We want to abide by your LUG's policies and procedures on soliciting to members. If you have specific policies and procedures regarding solicitaion, please let us know the steps we need to take in order to reach your members. Thank you for your time and consideration. Michael McSteen Bryan Dumm TuxDelux.com ------------------------------------------------ btw- if you were wondering, we are starting this project to have some fun as well as help support our development project (http://projectamin.org). If you are interested in learning more about Project AMIN or xml administration we would be willing to present some of our ideas to your group, provided its not too far away or too cost prohibitive :) another btw- if you simply want to share information about TuxDelux.com with your members, below is a copy of our press release. If you have any questions and/or policies and procedures, please contact me at: support@tuxdelux.com or mike@bcpub.com Thanks again! ------------------------------------------------- FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Contact: Tux Delux LLC c/o Michael McSteen 175 Second Street Athens, Ohio 45701 support@tuxdelux.com Announcing a New Online Store for Tux T-shirts Still waiting to get that fabulous Tux t-shirt? Wait no more. Now you can get a Tux T-shirt and help out the Linux community! Introducing TuxDelux (http://tuxdelux.com), a new online store solely devoted to marketing and promoting Tux the Penguin. The brainchild of two Linux enthusiasts, Bryan Dumm and Michael McSteen, TuxDelux is an effort to increase public awareness of Linux by shamelessly marketing and promoting Tux the Penguin, the adopted mascot of the Linux community. "We don't see Tux as much as we should. We don't see it on the street, in the stores or in any media." said Dumm. "We want to change that." The two originally thought of the idea for Tux Delux while attending a recent conference. They saw a lot of logos and icons promoting individual software programs and corporations, but nothing promoting the Linux. "Mike and I always talk about the need for 'Place' (one of the four P's of marketing) for Linux. The same holds true for 'Promotion'," Dumm explained. Both Dumm and McSteen think one of the best ways to introduce the public to Linux is by introducing them to Tux the Penguin. They hope that the more the Linux community promotes Tux, the more the general public will be curious about Linux. "We want people to ask, 'hey, what's up with the penguin?' We want to peak people's curiosity about Tux and Linux," McSteen stated. "We think Tux is a fantastic image and that the Linux community needs to rally around him to market and promote Linux," Dumm added. Tuxdelux.com currently offers eight different Tux designs, including the original. The company plans to introduce several new designs over the next couple of months. Visit tuxdelux.com to find out more. If you have any questions, please contact Michael McSteen at: support@tuxdelux.com ### From cschumann at twp-llc.com Wed Aug 24 15:47:59 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Wed Aug 24 15:49:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted Message-ID: <49108.192.28.2.17.1124916479.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Hello all, I've got a LinkSys WPC54G, but haven't tried really hard to get it to run on FC4. Should I give it another go? Is it that easy? On a related note, I need a new 802.11G adapter anyway. It has to work in Linux and Windows. I've been pretty faithful to LinkSys so far, but I'm not married to the brand. Opine: Should I stick with what I know, or go for something better, easier, etc.? I would like to avoid buying anything made in a country without reasonably free and fair elections (like China) if at all possible. I will probably get the new card, my wife will get my WPC54G card, and her 802.11b card will go in an old beater laptop that will become the MP3 client. (It's a LinkSys WPC11v3, which works out of the box with FC4, but is moving to a Slackware system.) Thanks, Chris From thecubic at thecubic.net Wed Aug 24 16:21:55 2005 From: thecubic at thecubic.net (Dave Carlson) Date: Wed Aug 24 16:20:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted In-Reply-To: <49108.192.28.2.17.1124916479.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <49108.192.28.2.17.1124916479.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200508241621.58939.thecubic@thecubic.net> On Wednesday 24 August 2005 15:47, Chris Schumann wrote: > Hello all, > > I've got a LinkSys WPC54G, but haven't tried really hard to get it to run > on FC4. Should I give it another go? Is it that easy? I don't have any experience with the WPC54G, but the WMP54G works with ndiswrapper. I can send you some rpms if you have trouble building them. > On a related note, I need a new 802.11G adapter anyway. It has to work in > Linux and Windows. I've been pretty faithful to LinkSys so far, but I'm > not married to the brand. Opine: Should I stick with what I know, or go > for something better, easier, etc.? Do you have an empty MiniPCI slot in your laptop? When I got a new laptop (from someone who used an 802.11b 16-bit PC card), I put a MiniPCI wireless card from a dead linksys router in it, and it has worked like a charm (with ndiswrapper), both in windows and linux. > I would like to avoid buying anything made in a country without reasonably > free and fair elections (like China) if at all possible. Most boards are manufactured in Taiwan; does that count? > I will probably get the new card, my wife will get my WPC54G card, and her > 802.11b card will go in an old beater laptop that will become the MP3 > client. (It's a LinkSys WPC11v3, which works out of the box with FC4, but > is moving to a Slackware system.) > > Thanks, > Chris > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050824/e0771f86/attachment.pgp From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Aug 24 16:45:40 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Wed Aug 24 16:45:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted In-Reply-To: <200508241621.58939.thecubic@thecubic.net> References: <49108.192.28.2.17.1124916479.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <200508241621.58939.thecubic@thecubic.net> Message-ID: For best results, find one that doesn't need ndiswrapper! :) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0; 0 rows returned From thecubic at thecubic.net Wed Aug 24 17:27:53 2005 From: thecubic at thecubic.net (Dave Carlson) Date: Wed Aug 24 17:28:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted In-Reply-To: References: <49108.192.28.2.17.1124916479.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <200508241621.58939.thecubic@thecubic.net> Message-ID: <200508241728.00146.thecubic@thecubic.net> On Wednesday 24 August 2005 16:45, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > For best results, find one that doesn't need ndiswrapper! :) That hasn't been my experience. I was quite skeptical of ndiswrapper at first. I've run ndiswrapper on the following cards: Broadcom 4702 (MiniPCI) - no native linux drivers; ndiswrapper worked flawlessly RT2500 card (WMP54G) - linux driver exists but is buggy and has problems with newer kernels; ndiswrapper worked flawlessly Prism54 card - linux driver exists, never worked well in my case (would keep resetting itself); ndiswrapper worked flawlessly -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050824/3ea5e857/attachment.pgp From rwh at visi.com Wed Aug 24 20:59:57 2005 From: rwh at visi.com (rwh) Date: Wed Aug 24 21:01:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted In-Reply-To: <200508241728.00146.thecubic@thecubic.net> References: <49108.192.28.2.17.1124916479.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <200508241621.58939.thecubic@thecubic.net> <200508241728.00146.thecubic@thecubic.net> Message-ID: <430D261D.3050405@visi.com> I've used both a D-Link and Hawking 54G card with ndiswrapper on my laptop. They work fine for the most part except the D-Link needs to be cycled up and down once or twice a week but it isn't a major deal. On the other hand, I've yet to get my Linksys PCI card to work on my desktop with ndiswrapper and I'm about ready to pull a Linksys USB dongle off one of the Tivos to see if that will fly. --rick Dave Carlson wrote: >On Wednesday 24 August 2005 16:45, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > > >>For best results, find one that doesn't need ndiswrapper! :) >> >> > >That hasn't been my experience. I was quite skeptical of ndiswrapper at >first. > >I've run ndiswrapper on the following cards: > >Broadcom 4702 (MiniPCI) - no native linux drivers; ndiswrapper worked >flawlessly >RT2500 card (WMP54G) - linux driver exists but is buggy and has problems with >newer kernels; ndiswrapper worked flawlessly >Prism54 card - linux driver exists, never worked well in my case (would keep >resetting itself); ndiswrapper worked flawlessly > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > From cschumann at twp-llc.com Thu Aug 25 12:17:48 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Thu Aug 25 12:17:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted In-Reply-To: <200508251658.j7PGwXcR006422@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200508251658.j7PGwXcR006422@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <22232.192.28.2.17.1124990268.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:21:55 -0500 > From: Dave Carlson >> I've got a LinkSys WPC54G, but haven't tried really hard to get it to >> run on FC4. Should I give it another go? Is it that easy? > > I don't have any experience with the WPC54G, but the WMP54G works with > ndiswrapper. I can send you some rpms if you have trouble building > them. The issue in the past has been that I have to have kernel source, and it's been a pain. Maybe with a *little* hand-holding, I can get the WPC54G to work. I wouldn't have a problem buying another one then. I do have a wired card that works fine, so downloading packages and such is not a problem. >> On a related note, I need a new 802.11G adapter anyway. It has to work >> in Linux and Windows. I've been pretty faithful to LinkSys so far, but >> I'm not married to the brand. Opine: Should I stick with what I know, >> or go for something better, easier, etc.? > > Do you have an empty MiniPCI slot in your laptop? When I got a new > laptop (from someone who used an 802.11b 16-bit PC card), I put a > MiniPCI wireless card from a dead linksys router in it, and it has > worked like a charm (with ndiswrapper), both in windows and linux. I did add two internal antennae, but I was trying to move one, and pulled the connector off. Range was... not great with one antenna, and I needed to put back the modem in that slot to send a fax. A PC card is fine and is more flexible. >> I would like to avoid buying anything made in a country without >> reasonably free and fair elections (like China) if at all possible. > > Most boards are manufactured in Taiwan; does that count? Taiwan is on my OK list for now. They do seem to have elections. Also, anything used is OK. From ringert at consumption.net Thu Aug 25 12:50:36 2005 From: ringert at consumption.net (Torleiv Flatebo Ringer) Date: Thu Aug 25 12:52:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: what you said > From: "Chris Schumann" > Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted > > Hello all, > > I've got a LinkSys WPC54G, but haven't tried really hard to get it to run > on FC4. Should I give it another go? Is it that easy? > > On a related note, I need a new 802.11G adapter anyway. It has to work in > Linux and Windows. I've been pretty faithful to LinkSys so far, but I'm > not married to the brand. Opine: Should I stick with what I know, or go > for something better, easier, etc.? > > I would like to avoid buying anything made in a country without reasonably > free and fair elections (like China) if at all possible. I just got a DLink DWL-G520 card to work with these drivers: http://acx100.sourceforge.net/ torleiv From thecubic at thecubic.net Thu Aug 25 13:28:12 2005 From: thecubic at thecubic.net (Dave Carlson) Date: Thu Aug 25 13:28:08 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] 802.11G Card Recommendations Wanted In-Reply-To: <22232.192.28.2.17.1124990268.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200508251658.j7PGwXcR006422@delta.twp-llc.com> <22232.192.28.2.17.1124990268.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200508251328.15614.thecubic@thecubic.net> On Thursday 25 August 2005 12:17, Chris Schumann wrote: > > Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:21:55 -0500 > > From: Dave Carlson > > > >> I've got a LinkSys WPC54G, but haven't tried really hard to get it to > >> run on FC4. Should I give it another go? Is it that easy? > > > > I don't have any experience with the WPC54G, but the WMP54G works with > > ndiswrapper. I can send you some rpms if you have trouble building > > them. > > The issue in the past has been that I have to have kernel source, and it's > been a pain. Maybe with a *little* hand-holding, I can get the WPC54G to > work. I wouldn't have a problem buying another one then. by no means fully complete or bulletproof: 0) be root (sudo su -) 1) Make sure kernel devel is installed for your kernel (and the build utilities) (run 'rpm -q kernel kernel-devel') 2) download latest ndiswrapper 'curl http://umn.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/ndiswrapper/ndiswrapper-1.3rc1.tar.gz | tar xzv' cd ndiswrapper-1.3rc1 make rpm then (for me with a minipci card): rpm -Uvh /usr/src/redhat/RPMS/i386/ndiswrapper-1.3rc1-1.i386.rpm /usr/src/redhat/RPMS/i386/kernel-module-ndiswrapper-2.6.12-1.1398_FC4-1.3rc1-1.i386.rpm ndiswrapper -i (your ini file) ndiswrapper -l (check for 'driver present, hardware present') ndiswrapper -m ndiswrapper -hotplug (you may want to run 'kudzu' here or just reboot, but don't configure the device - you just want system-config-network to be aware of it) then run system-config-network, create a new wireless connection, select the newly shown card, configure to your liking, enjoy. -dave -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050825/7fe5f5d7/attachment.pgp From slinabery at worldcycling.com Thu Aug 25 11:28:33 2005 From: slinabery at worldcycling.com (Steve Linabery) Date: Thu Aug 25 13:49:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] linux webcam recommendation Message-ID: <20050825162832.GD7619@steve.worldcycling.com> Hi tclug amigos, OK, fyi I have grepped the list archives from 2005 before asking this, in case this is a tired topic. I picked up a cheapie logitech usb webcam at nano (logitech quickcam communicate, 046d:08f5) and have been unable to get it working with motion under fc2. I have googled until my eyes bled; no luck with qc-usb-messenger-0.8. Can anyone recommend a readily available, inexpensive (< $40 each, used ok), usb webcam with working drivers for 2.6.x kernel? I'm trying to build an on-the-cheap security camera system for my home. Ideally with 3 or 4 cameras (yes, I have multiple usb cards). As always, thanks. -- Steve Linabery B94B C3C7 8A27 FF09 3C9D E992 5A20 2492 D5F5 EE51 From jima at beer.tclug.org Thu Aug 25 14:14:28 2005 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Thu Aug 25 14:15:17 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] linux webcam recommendation In-Reply-To: <20050825162832.GD7619@steve.worldcycling.com> References: <20050825162832.GD7619@steve.worldcycling.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Aug 2005, Steve Linabery wrote: > OK, fyi I have grepped the list archives from 2005 before asking this, > in case this is a tired topic. I don't remember anything particularly recent, so I don't think you're rehashing anything that shouldn't be. > I picked up a cheapie logitech usb webcam at nano (logitech quickcam > communicate, 046d:08f5) and have been unable to get it working with > motion under fc2. I have googled until my eyes bled; no luck with > qc-usb-messenger-0.8. I think I made that mistake with the QuickCam Messenger (I don't think there was any driver development under way for it at the time); after Googling for a better-supported model, I took it back to Microcenter and got the QuickCam Web. > Can anyone recommend a readily available, inexpensive (< $40 each, used > ok), usb webcam with working drivers for 2.6.x kernel? Anything listed as supported here might do the job well: http://qce-ga.sourceforge.net/ > I'm trying to build an on-the-cheap security camera system for my home. > Ideally with 3 or 4 cameras (yes, I have multiple usb cards). That's crossed my mind before. Let us know how it goes! (Including its weaknesses! Err...) Sounds like a fun project. Jima From christophermsmith at gmail.com Thu Aug 25 14:54:11 2005 From: christophermsmith at gmail.com (Christopher Smith) Date: Thu Aug 25 14:54:16 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] linux webcam recommendation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <430e21de.01aedeb3.5ced.77f1@mx.gmail.com> I've been thinking about this one for a while. Biggest problem I can see is having to run long lengths of USB or multiple computers. I have 1 wireless (802.11b) linksys cam, and was trying to decide if I could afford more of those, or go the route you are talking about.. Keep us posted! Chris -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Jima Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:14 PM To: Steve Linabery Cc: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: Re: [tclug-list] linux webcam recommendation On Thu, 25 Aug 2005, Steve Linabery wrote: > OK, fyi I have grepped the list archives from 2005 before asking this, > in case this is a tired topic. I don't remember anything particularly recent, so I don't think you're rehashing anything that shouldn't be. > I picked up a cheapie logitech usb webcam at nano (logitech quickcam > communicate, 046d:08f5) and have been unable to get it working with > motion under fc2. I have googled until my eyes bled; no luck with > qc-usb-messenger-0.8. I think I made that mistake with the QuickCam Messenger (I don't think there was any driver development under way for it at the time); after Googling for a better-supported model, I took it back to Microcenter and got the QuickCam Web. > Can anyone recommend a readily available, inexpensive (< $40 each, > used ok), usb webcam with working drivers for 2.6.x kernel? Anything listed as supported here might do the job well: http://qce-ga.sourceforge.net/ > I'm trying to build an on-the-cheap security camera system for my home. > Ideally with 3 or 4 cameras (yes, I have multiple usb cards). That's crossed my mind before. Let us know how it goes! (Including its weaknesses! Err...) Sounds like a fun project. Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From whiterabbit1 at gmail.com Thu Aug 25 15:15:59 2005 From: whiterabbit1 at gmail.com (Ryan) Date: Thu Aug 25 15:16:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] linux webcam recommendation In-Reply-To: <20050825162832.GD7619@steve.worldcycling.com> References: <20050825162832.GD7619@steve.worldcycling.com> Message-ID: <307a337f05082513155902dcfa@mail.gmail.com> On 8/25/05, Steve Linabery wrote: > Hi tclug amigos, > Snip > > I'm trying to build an on-the-cheap security camera system for my home. Ideally with 3 or 4 cameras (yes, I have multiple usb cards). One thing I've heard and maybe that doesn't matter to you is that you need a certain resolution camera to be admissable as evidence in court. From kfuchs at winternet.com Thu Aug 25 17:40:22 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Thu Aug 25 17:42:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] What Linux anti-virus would you use to protect MS Windows clients? Message-ID: <200508252240.j7PMeM9Y028327@tundra.winternet.com> I would use or recommend ClamAV. However, placed ClamAV at dead last (detecting only 1 of 6 viruses) of about eleven MS Windows anti-virus programs tested by AV-Test.org. Does anyone know about AV-Test.org? Do they conduct fair tests? It looks like they get paid by others to perform the tests ... Are they as independent as their web site declares they are? Of course, the PC Mag article tested anti-virus programs that run on MS Windows rather than Linux, but it still bothers me that ClamAV was ranked lowest out of ten competitors. The top ranked anti-virus program was BitDefender. The company happens to have a freeware BitDefender for Linux: This is closed source with a free Linux license. Does anyone have an opinion of BitDefender, Linux Edition? Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From kfuchs at winternet.com Thu Aug 25 17:42:58 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Thu Aug 25 17:48:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] What Linux anti-virus would you use to protect MS Windows clients? Message-ID: <200508252242.j7PMgwCI028339@tundra.winternet.com> [Please ignore the previous post - this one corrects the BitDefender URL] I would use or recommend ClamAV. However, placed ClamAV at dead last (detecting only 1 of 6 viruses) of about eleven MS Windows anti-virus programs tested by AV-Test.org. Does anyone know about AV-Test.org? Do they conduct fair tests? It looks like they get paid by others to perform the tests ... Are they as independent as their web site declares they are? Of course, the PC Mag article tested anti-virus programs that run on MS Windows rather than Linux, but it still bothers me that ClamAV was ranked lowest out of ten competitors. The top ranked anti-virus program was BitDefender. The company happens to have a freeware BitDefender for Linux: This is closed source with a free Linux license. Does anyone have an opinion of BitDefender, Linux Edition? Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From kfuchs at winternet.com Thu Aug 25 17:44:22 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Thu Aug 25 17:49:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] What Linux anti-virus would you use to protect MS Windows clients? Message-ID: <200508252244.j7PMiMQw028342@tundra.winternet.com> [Please ignore the previous two posts - corrects the BitDefender URL again!] I would use or recommend ClamAV. However, placed ClamAV at dead last (detecting only 1 of 6 viruses) of about eleven MS Windows anti-virus programs tested by AV-Test.org. Does anyone know about AV-Test.org? Do they conduct fair tests? It looks like they get paid by others to perform the tests ... Are they as independent as their web site declares they are? Of course, the PC Mag article tested anti-virus programs that run on MS Windows rather than Linux, but it still bothers me that ClamAV was ranked lowest out of ten competitors. The top ranked anti-virus program was BitDefender. The company happens to have a freeware BitDefender for Linux: This is closed source with a free Linux license. Does anyone have an opinion of BitDefender, Linux Edition? Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From bhartm at visi.com Thu Aug 25 20:22:50 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Thu Aug 25 20:22:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] What Linux anti-virus would you use to protect MS Windows clients? In-Reply-To: <200508252244.j7PMiMQw028342@tundra.winternet.com> References: <200508252244.j7PMiMQw028342@tundra.winternet.com> Message-ID: <430E6EEA.5060700@visi.com> Yeah, I'd like to second that Q. Many (all) of my freelance clients are stuck with McAfee or nothing or Norton. I'll set them up with FireFox and T-Bird and they send me flowers and candy. But I always tell them to spend the $72 or whatever for the established AV protection. I'm not so brazen as to force Debian, even on good friends. Ken Fuchs wrote: >[Please ignore the previous two posts - corrects the BitDefender URL again!] > >I would use or recommend ClamAV. > >However, >placed ClamAV at dead last (detecting only 1 of 6 viruses) of >about eleven MS Windows anti-virus programs tested by AV-Test.org. > >Does anyone know about AV-Test.org? Do they conduct fair tests? >It looks like they get paid by others to perform the tests ... >Are they as independent as their web site declares they are? > >Of course, the PC Mag article tested anti-virus programs that run on >MS Windows rather than Linux, but it still bothers me that ClamAV >was ranked lowest out of ten competitors. > >The top ranked anti-virus program was BitDefender. The company >happens to have a freeware BitDefender for Linux: > >This is closed source with a free Linux license. Does anyone have an >opinion of BitDefender, Linux Edition? > >Sincerely, > >Ken Fuchs > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > From kfuchs at winternet.com Fri Aug 26 15:06:35 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Fri Aug 26 15:08:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Closed source BitDefender - best anti-virus on Linux? Message-ID: <200508262006.j7QK6ZCD003253@tundra.winternet.com> I ran across a PC magazine on-line article that reported AV-Test rating BitDefender as the best and ClamAV as the worst anti-virus software running on MS Windows. I thought ClamAV was the best anti-virus system. Could cygwin be part of the problem? Any comments? Anyone have an opinion about AV-Test.org? BitDefender has a free, closed source, version for Linux: Is BitDefender on Linux as good as BitDefender on MS Windows? Does anyone have experience with BitDefender on Linux? Sincerely, Ken Fuchs P.S. I posted something similar thrice yesterday. Probably due to the lame Subject line and the repetition, most people ignored it. I apologize for wasting your time yesterday, but hope you will respond to this more carefully crafted post. Thank you! From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Aug 26 15:33:10 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Aug 26 15:34:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Closed source BitDefender - best anti-virus on Linux? In-Reply-To: <200508262006.j7QK6ZCD003253@tundra.winternet.com> References: <200508262006.j7QK6ZCD003253@tundra.winternet.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 26 Aug 2005, Ken Fuchs wrote: > I ran across a PC magazine on-line article > that reported > AV-Test rating BitDefender as the best and > ClamAV as the worst anti-virus software running on MS Windows. > > I thought ClamAV was the best anti-virus system. Could cygwin be part > of the problem? Any comments? Here's another comparison... http://www.linuxpipeline.com/166400446 But how to compare the comparisons? I would love to see a thorough, expert review that compares products objectively on several important variables. Rapid detection of new variants is a good thing. Fast scanning of email messages is also very important to me. Mike From sk3tch at sk3tch.net Fri Aug 26 15:48:02 2005 From: sk3tch at sk3tch.net (sk3tch@sk3tch.net) Date: Fri Aug 26 15:48:24 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Closed source BitDefender - best anti-virus on Linux? Message-ID: It all depends if you want realtime scanning or not. There are only a few products out there currently for Linux that feature realtime scanning for AV, currently Trend Micro ServerProtect for Linux (SPLX), Sophos, and McAfee I believe. With Symantec's product in beta right now. The problem with realtime scanning on Linux is that it requires a kernel hooking module (KHM) in order to properly scan in realtime. What this means is that for EVERY new kernel (no matter how small the variation) a new KHM must be released in order for realtime to continue to function properly. This is pretty ridiculous...and could be solved if Red Hat (and other vendors) offered some kind of API like Microsoft offers with Windows to accomodate this. But they refuse (I manage the SPLX product on a Red Hat corporate desktop soon to be on 300K+ workstations) access to this or the creation of this (at least to Trend Micro - who is a big 3 vendor in AV). If you want on-demand scanning only (as BitDefender offers) - then surely BitDefender rates highly. I, myself, would choose Kaspersky for Linux. It is updated quite often and it supports the most packers. On the Windows side, AVG and ClamAV are just terrible. Even ClamAV on *nix is not a true AV product...but it works (well) and it is free. It lacks heuristics and only goes on file by file based detection. Whereas "standard" AV will actually be able to detect variants in some cases because they don't have quite a simplistic scanning methodology. If you want more info on what is good and bad on Windows, drop me a line off list. I have a paper that will be published in October for Virus Bulletin 2005. My research was using XP honeypots with only AV for protection...before the whole MS "honeymonkey" term was coined I had a similar setup running (albeit for a different purpose). -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org on behalf of Ken Fuchs Sent: Fri 8/26/2005 3:06 PM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [tclug-list] Closed source BitDefender - best anti-virus on Linux? I ran across a PC magazine on-line article that reported AV-Test rating BitDefender as the best and ClamAV as the worst anti-virus software running on MS Windows. I thought ClamAV was the best anti-virus system. Could cygwin be part of the problem? Any comments? Anyone have an opinion about AV-Test.org? BitDefender has a free, closed source, version for Linux: Is BitDefender on Linux as good as BitDefender on MS Windows? Does anyone have experience with BitDefender on Linux? Sincerely, Ken Fuchs P.S. I posted something similar thrice yesterday. Probably due to the lame Subject line and the repetition, most people ignored it. I apologize for wasting your time yesterday, but hope you will respond to this more carefully crafted post. Thank you! _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Sat Aug 27 21:48:00 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Sat Aug 27 21:48:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux laptop recommendations: two parted, $400 range $700 range $more than that i wish i had the money Message-ID: <431125E0.9080405@mchsi.com> Hello tclugers, Haven't posted in a bit, anyway, to anyone running any linux distro on a laptop that fits into these three categories, could you post the models and experiencs? used ok, as long as one can be obtained currently ebay for the same. anyway, whatever i am sleepy sorry for requesting so much, just any linux laptop recommendations would be cool. nick -- ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------ From smac at visi.com Sun Aug 28 11:52:02 2005 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Sun Aug 28 12:14:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux laptop recommendations: two parted, $400 range $700 range $more than that i wish i had the money In-Reply-To: <431125E0.9080405@mchsi.com> References: <431125E0.9080405@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <4311EBB2.4060005@visi.com> I have installed and used Linux on sever laptops successfully, I stick with the newer machines that would be found on eBay. *Compaq Armada e500 PIII 600MHz, 256mb RAM, DVD/CD, FDD, Sound* Ubuntu - This distro was a little scarry, the screen went crazy durring the installation but worked fine when I just walked away from it for a while FC3 - This distro installed without any problems Free BSD - (Not Linux) I'm struggling with the network and sound I think the network is somewhat functional (lights blink and such) I'm not getting conectivity. I'm getting an error about the sound not working. I just need to work through it to get it to work :-) *Compaq Armada M700 PIII 450MHz, 256mb RAM, DVD/CD, Sound, USB FDD* Ubuntu - This distro was a little scarry, the screen went crazy durring the installation but worked fine when I just walked away from it for a while FC3 - This distro installed without any problems *Compaq Armada 7400 PII 366mhZ, 256mb RAM, CD, FDD, Sound* FC2 - Installed without any problem Sam. Nicholas Thompson wrote: > Hello tclugers, > > Haven't posted in a bit, anyway, to anyone running any linux distro > on a laptop that fits into these three categories, could you post the > models and experiencs? used ok, as long as one can be obtained > currently ebay for the same. anyway, whatever i am sleepy sorry for > requesting so much, just any linux laptop recommendations would be cool. > > nick > From cschumann at twp-llc.com Sun Aug 28 21:12:45 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Sun Aug 28 21:12:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux laptop recommendations In-Reply-To: <200508281656.j7SGu9OG018650@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <200508290207.j7T27Hd6018768@delta.twp-llc.com> > Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:48:00 -0500 > From: Nicholas Thompson > Haven't posted in a bit, anyway, to anyone running any > linux distro on a laptop that fits into these three > categories, could you post the models and experiencs? used > ok, as long as one can be obtained currently ebay for the > same. anyway, whatever i am sleepy sorry for requesting so > much, just any linux laptop recommendations would be cool. Nick, I have to recommend a ThinkPad. It's all I'll buy. Well built, parts priced well and available, and a user community that cannot be topped. ThinkPad mailing list; Linux-ThinkPad mailing list; and thinkwiki.org, a whole site dedicated to getting Linux to run on a ThinkPad. I just went to eBay and searched for completed auctions. In the $375 to $425 range, 379 items came up. T2X, A2x, X2x, G40, even a few 600X (modded). >From $650 to $750, 186 came up. X3x, T3x, T40, T42, R51, etc. Any new ThinkPad is going to be a luxury. Myself? My wife and I both use a 600X (PIII). I got a 560E for a buck (166 PMMX). Needs a keyboard, that I bought NEW for $8. I got a 570 (333 PII) for $40, just missing a hard disk. The 560E, 570 and my 600X all have Linux. (The 600X has Windows XP too.) Chris From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Sun Aug 28 21:24:14 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Sun Aug 28 21:24:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux laptop recommendations (Compaq Armada M700 I got...) In-Reply-To: <200508290207.j7T27Hd6018768@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200508290207.j7T27Hd6018768@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <431271CE.4040604@mchsi.com> Chris Schumann wrote: >>Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:48:00 -0500 >>From: Nicholas Thompson > > >> Haven't posted in a bit, anyway, to anyone running any >>linux distro on a laptop that fits into these three >>categories, could you post the models and experiencs? used >>ok, as long as one can be obtained currently ebay for the >>same. anyway, whatever i am sleepy sorry for requesting so >>much, just any linux laptop recommendations would be cool. > > > Nick, I have to recommend a ThinkPad. It's all I'll buy. > > Well built, parts priced well and available, and a user community > that cannot be topped. ThinkPad mailing list; Linux-ThinkPad > mailing list; and thinkwiki.org, a whole site dedicated to getting > Linux to run on a ThinkPad. > > I just went to eBay and searched for completed auctions. > In the $375 to $425 range, 379 items came up. T2X, A2x, X2x, > G40, even a few 600X (modded). > >>From $650 to $750, 186 came up. X3x, T3x, T40, T42, R51, etc. > > Any new ThinkPad is going to be a luxury. > > Myself? My wife and I both use a 600X (PIII). I got a 560E for > a buck (166 PMMX). Needs a keyboard, that I bought NEW for $8. > I got a 570 (333 PII) for $40, just missing a hard disk. The 560E, > 570 and my 600X all have Linux. (The 600X has Windows XP too.) > > Chris > > chris, thanks so much for all the time you took looking and the time writing. I had 371.41 in my paypal account, and I got myself a laptop tonight. A Compaq Armada M700. I got a good deal on it, and was able to get it after my recent ebay purge of crap from the garage. Yay! thanks nick -- ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------ From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Mon Aug 29 06:21:17 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Mon Aug 29 06:23:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Compaq Armada M700 experiences Message-ID: <4312EFAD.6040607@mchsi.com> Hi again guys, I know there are many different models of M700s in terms of cpu, but besides that the chipsets should be the same. So anyone who has one, or knows someone who has one who could pass on an email or my address, ANY info appreciated. Even the person who already replied about putting ubuntu on one, please reply again and give more details, like did sound work, etc. Or maybe I remember you saying no problems. Hmm. Either way, whatever you know, I would love to know. nick -- ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. looking for unix job in the mpls/st. paul, well within an hour area. :) ------------------------------ From ringert at consumption.net Mon Aug 29 08:09:46 2005 From: ringert at consumption.net (Torleiv Flatebo Ringer) Date: Mon Aug 29 08:11:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Linux laptop recommendations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: what you said > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:48:00 -0500 > From: Nicholas Thompson > Subject: [tclug-list] Linux laptop recommendations: two parted, $400 > range $700 range $more than that i wish i had the money > > Hello tclugers, > > Haven't posted in a bit, anyway, to anyone running any linux distro on > a laptop that fits into these three categories, could you post the > models and experiencs? used ok, as long as one can be obtained currently > ebay for the same. anyway, whatever i am sleepy sorry for requesting so > much, just any linux laptop recommendations would be cool. > > nick I just bought one of these: eMachines M5310 Wide Laptop AMD Athlon XP 2400+ 1.8-Ghz They go for $500ish on eBay and are great machines. Was able to get all drivers working in about four hours except for the modem. I didn't even try that. Running debian 3.1, stock 2.6.8 kernel. Wireless works great with ndis wrapper. -- As fast as it ever got, it never got fast enough for me. Hunter S. Thompson From srcfoo at gmail.com Mon Aug 29 09:13:15 2005 From: srcfoo at gmail.com (EP) Date: Mon Aug 29 09:15:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] memory.c bad pmd Message-ID: <579c6fd305082907137c3e3e77@mail.gmail.com> Kernel is reporting this error. Searched Google, but haven't found anything that really states what causes this error. My guess is that it's either a kernel bug or I actually have a problem with my RAM. Since it hasn't happened until last week after a years worth of running, I'm leaning more towards a hardware problem than a software problem. Before I wasted my time and the customers time, I thought I'd see if anyone had any ideas on this one. Otherwise, I think I'll have them run memtest to see if the RAM has any errors. Thanks, Eric From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Mon Aug 29 09:22:06 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Mon Aug 29 09:23:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection Message-ID: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> Hi, I am wondering what it would take to keep a cellular (even is it's 19.2) connection open while moving around. Does anyone here have any experience with anything like this? Any better solutions I've missed since being under a rock or something? :) thanks nick -- ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------ From jstuart at edenpr.k12.mn.us Mon Aug 29 09:22:49 2005 From: jstuart at edenpr.k12.mn.us (Joe Stuart) Date: Mon Aug 29 09:23:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] job posting Message-ID: In case anyone is in need of a job, we have a a couple openings. You can check them out by going to www.epjobs.org then click on Technology. From josh at joshwelch.com Mon Aug 29 11:47:21 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Aug 29 11:51:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection In-Reply-To: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> References: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> Nicholas Thompson wrote: > Hi, > I am wondering what it would take to keep a cellular (even is it's > 19.2) connection open while moving around. Does anyone here have any > experience with anything like this? Any better solutions I've missed > since being under a rock or something? :) > > thanks > > nick Under the category of better solution would be an actual data card from one of the cell providers. My company uses Sprint PCS cards extensively, they work well, even while in a car. Verizon is rolling out EVDO in the TC market, I tested it out and found it to be pretty cool. I don't know if it's officially live in the market yet, but they are working on it. This would of course result in a significant cost downside as it would require a seperate data service contract and another piece of equipment. Josh From cncole at earthlink.net Mon Aug 29 12:23:14 2005 From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole) Date: Mon Aug 29 12:25:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection In-Reply-To: <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Josh Welch > > Nicholas Thompson wrote: > > Hi, > > I am wondering what it would take to keep a cellular (even is it's > > 19.2) connection open while moving around. Does anyone here have any > > experience with anything like this? Any better solutions I've missed > > since being under a rock or something? :) > > > > thanks > > > > nick > > Under the category of better solution would be an actual data card from > one of the cell providers. My company uses Sprint PCS cards extensively, > they work well, even while in a car. Verizon is rolling out EVDO in the > TC market, I tested it out and found it to be pretty cool. I don't know > if it's officially live in the market yet, but they are working on it. > > This would of course result in a significant cost downside as it would > require a seperate data service contract and another piece of equipment. > > Josh Several of the cell providers (Sprint? Verizon? others?) have an unsupported loophole where a 3G cell phone provides the same data connection as the card service, but without any charges at all for a cell phone subscriber. This was discussed here some time back. This method would not be suitable as a business solution, however. What's the best data rate you see with the cards? Chuck From bradyh at bitstream.net Mon Aug 29 14:15:22 2005 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Mon Aug 29 14:17:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] job posting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1125342922.5227.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> One of those jobs looks almost perfect for me...too bad it says they need resumes by August 5th. I sent it anyway, just in case. Oh and BTW, if anyone out there on TCLUG sees any Java developer positions, I'm in the market for a job and I'd be very thankful for any assistance. Brady PS: I suppose this should be on the TCLUG jobs list, if that's still active. > In case anyone is in need of a job, we have a a couple openings. You can check them out by going to www.epjobs.org then click on Technology. > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jstuart at edenpr.k12.mn.us Mon Aug 29 15:40:02 2005 From: jstuart at edenpr.k12.mn.us (Joe Stuart) Date: Mon Aug 29 15:40:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] job posting Message-ID: Sorry that needs to be updated. Resumes are still being taken. >>> Brady Hegberg 8/29/2005 2:15 PM >>> One of those jobs looks almost perfect for me...too bad it says they need resumes by August 5th. I sent it anyway, just in case. Oh and BTW, if anyone out there on TCLUG sees any Java developer positions, I'm in the market for a job and I'd be very thankful for any assistance. Brady PS: I suppose this should be on the TCLUG jobs list, if that's still active. > In case anyone is in need of a job, we have a a couple openings. You can check them out by going to www.epjobs.org then click on Technology. > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From auditodd at comcast.net Mon Aug 29 18:11:23 2005 From: auditodd at comcast.net (Todd Young) Date: Mon Aug 29 18:13:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection In-Reply-To: <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> References: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <4313961B.303@comcast.net> My company is using Sprint PCMCIA cards also and I have been thoroughly UNIMPRESSED with their performance. The connection is only about as good as a good dialup connection. On the other hand, the new Verizon cards are very promising as long as you are in the "broadband" coverage area here in the Twin Cities (2-3Meg download, 1-2Meg upload). Todd Young Josh Welch wrote: > Nicholas Thompson wrote: > >>Hi, >> I am wondering what it would take to keep a cellular (even is it's >>19.2) connection open while moving around. Does anyone here have any >>experience with anything like this? Any better solutions I've missed >>since being under a rock or something? :) >> >>thanks >> >>nick > > > Under the category of better solution would be an actual data card from > one of the cell providers. My company uses Sprint PCS cards extensively, > they work well, even while in a car. Verizon is rolling out EVDO in the > TC market, I tested it out and found it to be pretty cool. I don't know > if it's officially live in the market yet, but they are working on it. > > This would of course result in a significant cost downside as it would > require a seperate data service contract and another piece of equipment. > > Josh > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > -- Todd Young -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.16/83 - Release Date: 8/26/2005 From josh at joshwelch.com Mon Aug 29 19:19:47 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Aug 29 19:21:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection In-Reply-To: <4313961B.303@comcast.net> References: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> <4313961B.303@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4313A623.2060709@joshwelch.com> Todd Young wrote: > My company is using Sprint PCMCIA cards also and I have been thoroughly > UNIMPRESSED with their performance. The connection is only about as good > as a good dialup connection. > > On the other hand, the new Verizon cards are very promising as long as > you are in the "broadband" coverage area here in the Twin Cities (2-3Meg > download, 1-2Meg upload). > > Todd Young > The Sprint cards are not fast, they are designed for mobility more than speed. I typically see a little better than dial-up speeds, in the 60 to 80 kbps range. EVDO is much better. The Verizon EVDO service was cool when I tested it out, if I could just convince my company to shell out the extra few bucks, and Sprint is supposed to be offering EVDO "real soon now". Josh From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Mon Aug 29 20:39:37 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Mon Aug 29 20:41:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection In-Reply-To: <4313A623.2060709@joshwelch.com> References: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> <4313961B.303@comcast.net> <4313A623.2060709@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <4313B8D9.80201@mchsi.com> > > > > The Sprint cards are not fast, they are designed for mobility more than > speed. I typically see a little better than dial-up speeds, in the 60 to > 80 kbps range. EVDO is much better. The Verizon EVDO service was cool > when I tested it out, if I could just convince my company to shell out > the extra few bucks, and Sprint is supposed to be offering EVDO "real > soon now". > > Josh > So this "EVDO" is going to offer 2-3 megabit speeds while mobile? Am I reading that right? Gosh I hope so. Thanks guys, you are always there to help. nick ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------ From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Mon Aug 29 23:32:43 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Mon Aug 29 23:33:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] SATA, SATA II, and PCI (plus PCI SATA controllers that work under linux) Message-ID: <4313E16B.6000607@mchsi.com> Hello tclugers, I am wondering, I ran out of SATA spots on the onboard controller, and I have an extra 160gb sata I wamt to connect. Anyway, I am about to go purchase one for $29.99 at nano tomorrow, but I want to know if the pci bus can handle two sata drives running through it speedwise, i.e. will the drives on the pci controller run as fast or get accessed as fast as the drive on the onboard controller? SATA II Will it work over the PCI bus? Are there linux support controllers? At what point should I worry about not having enough power from the power supply, as far as cramming drives in? p.s. there is an F something brand i/o flex psa150 for $29.99 at nano that has linux support shown on the box. anyone have it? thanks nick -- ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------ From jus at krytosvirus.com Tue Aug 30 06:40:04 2005 From: jus at krytosvirus.com (Justin Krejci) Date: Tue Aug 30 06:42:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] job posting In-Reply-To: <32033207.1125343217455.JavaMail.root@sniper28> References: <32033207.1125343217455.JavaMail.root@sniper28> Message-ID: <200508300640.05076.jus@krytosvirus.com> My present employer has a huge ongoing Java project. I will inquire as to whether they are looking for more developers or not. On Monday 29 August 2005 02:15 pm, Brady Hegberg wrote: > One of those jobs looks almost perfect for me...too bad it says they > need resumes by August 5th. I sent it anyway, just in case. > > Oh and BTW, if anyone out there on TCLUG sees any Java developer > positions, I'm in the market for a job and I'd be very thankful for any > assistance. > > Brady > > PS: I suppose this should be on the TCLUG jobs list, if that's still > active. > > > In case anyone is in need of a job, we have a a couple openings. You can > > check them out by going to www.epjobs.org then click on Technology. > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Tue Aug 30 09:36:56 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Tue Aug 30 09:37:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Slackware 10.2 and thoughts on gnome? Message-ID: <20050830093656.00007060@c16360> Sorry to do this here, but I know there are a couple people that seem to have their fingers on the pulse of Slackware news and development. I saw that 10.2 went beta a little while ago http://linux.softpedia.com/get/System/Operating-Systems/Linux-Distributions/Slackware-425.shtml - any news on a stable release date? I just got a new (well, used technically) laptop and I hate it when I throw Linux on it only to see a new distro released weeks later. I'm not thrilled about the switch to KDE, I've been using dropline gnome for slackware, but I've heard that Freerock Gnome http://gsb.freerock.org/ is probably a better way to go since it doesn't install PAM and replace Xorg. Any thoughts? Josh From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Aug 30 09:54:06 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Tue Aug 30 09:55:09 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Slackware 10.2 and thoughts on gnome? In-Reply-To: <20050830093656.00007060@c16360> References: <20050830093656.00007060@c16360> Message-ID: <67f3084a05083007541f1cb7ac@mail.gmail.com> On 8/30/05, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > > I'm not thrilled about the switch to KDE, I've been using dropline > gnome for slackware, but I've heard that Freerock Gnome > http://gsb.freerock.org/ is probably a better way to go since it > doesn't install PAM and replace Xorg. Any thoughts? > Where are you reading that they've gone to KDE only? I have a hard time believing that Patrick would do that, as IMO it goes against everything that Slackware stands for. As to an official release date, my guess would be October as that seems to be pretty typical release time for Slack. IIRC, it's usually either a March/April release or October if in the fall. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050830/b51b5c76/attachment.htm From obelin23 at gmail.com Tue Aug 30 10:08:17 2005 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Tue Aug 30 10:09:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] re: Slackware 10.2 and thoughts on gnome? Message-ID: <72278d1050830080829cdc2eb@mail.gmail.com> This is from the Slackware changelog, dated March 26 of this year. gnome/*: Removed from -current, and turned over to community support and distribution. I'm not going to rehash all the reasons behind this, but it's been under consideration for more than four years. There are already good projects in place to provide Slackware GNOME for those who want it, and these are more complete than what Slackware has shipped in the past. So, if you're looking for GNOME for Slackware -current, I would recommend looking at these two projects for well-built packages that follow a policy of minimal interference with the base Slackware system: http://gsb.sf.net http://gware.sf.net There is also Dropline, of course, which is quite popular. However, due to their policy of adding PAM and replacing large system packages (like the entire X11 system) with their own versions, I can't give quite the same sort of nod to Dropline. Nevertheless, it remains another choice, and it's _your_ system, so I will also mention their project: http://www.dropline.net/gnome/ Please do not incorrectly interpret any of this as a slight against GNOME itself, which (although it does usually need to be fixed and polished beyond the way it ships from upstream more so than, say, KDE or XFce) is a decent desktop choice. So are a lot of others, but Slackware does not need to ship every choice. GNOME is and always has been a moving target (even the "stable" releases usually aren't quite ready yet) that really does demand a team to keep up on all the changes (many of which are not always well documented). I fully expect that this move will improve the quality of both Slackware itself, and the quality (and quantity) of the GNOME options available for it. Folks, this is how open source is supposed to work. Enjoy. :-) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050830/8ef0107f/attachment.htm From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Aug 30 11:03:31 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Tue Aug 30 11:05:10 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] re: Slackware 10.2 and thoughts on gnome? In-Reply-To: <72278d1050830080829cdc2eb@mail.gmail.com> References: <72278d1050830080829cdc2eb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a05083009034550bbf4@mail.gmail.com> On 8/30/05, Charlie O wrote: > > This is from the Slackware changelog, dated March 26 of this year. > > gnome/*: Removed from -current, and turned over to community support and > distribution. I'm not going to rehash all the reasons behind this, but it's > > been under consideration for more than four years. There are already good > projects in place to provide Slackware GNOME for those who want it, and > these are more complete than what Slackware has shipped in the past. So, if > > you're looking for GNOME for Slackware -current, I would recommend looking at > these two projects for well-built packages that follow a policy of minimal > interference with the base Slackware system: > > > http://gsb.sf.net > http://gware.sf.net > > I fully expect that this move will improve the quality of both > > Slackware itself, and the quality (and quantity) of the GNOME options > available for it. > > Folks, this is how open source is supposed to work. Enjoy. :-) > > Ahh, thanks. I hadn't seen that in the changelog. I personally don't mind that GNOME is being dropped, as I never use it. Nor do I use KDE. fvwm for me! To clarify, I think I misread that he was taking off Xorg which is what I couldn't see him doing. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050830/85b0fe56/attachment.htm From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Tue Aug 30 12:37:34 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Tue Aug 30 12:39:11 2005 Subject: Fw: [tclug-list] Slackware 10.2 and thoughts on gnome? (comments from Chip) Message-ID: <20050830123734.0000618c@c16360> I got into an off-list conversation about dropline / freerock gnome with Chip Currio, one of the developers of the project and on the NORLUG list. Here are his unedited comments (this is a combination of two separate emails) - kind of long but lots of good stuff - thanks Chip! Josh Begin forwarded message: Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 10:36:59 -0500 From: Chip Cuccio To: Josh Trutwin Cc: Jima Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Slackware 10.2 and thoughts on gnome? (off-list reply) > Hey, that's cool - didn't know that. Chip - any thoughts on dropline > vs. GSB? I currently use Dropline but was just pointed to GSB as an > alternative. Unfortunately I hear uninstalling Dropline is a painful > endeavor so I'm hoping to use GSB with Slackware on a new laptop. Hey Josh. I'll be very forthcoming about both projects - and the pros and cons of each; * Dropline has more developers than FRG/GSB. Sometimes this is good, sometimes bad. There are only 2 major developers on FRG/GSB (freerock and myself), so it's always under lots of scrutiny - kind of like Pat's own model. * FRG/GSB does not use PAM...Dropline does (Pat V. *hates* PAM, and many Slack users appreciate FRG/GSB because we adhere to Pat's anti- PAM policy). * Dropline replaces your entire X11 system. FRG/GSB does not. It uses the one Pat gives you. :) * Dropline has been around longer, and its "polish" reflects that. I like to think we're "cleaner and simpler". * FRG/GSB has a policy of being non-intrusive - meaning, it does not replace tons of your "stock" Slackware packages. * Dropline has very cool updater GNOME applet. Ours doesn't...yet (it's in the alpha stages). * Dropline offers one way of (officially) installing/ uninstalling...via its own console-based installer. We offer three (`slapt-get` and GSlapt [like Aptitude] being the most popular). Of course with both projects, you can install/uninstall manually with pkgtools. * I've never tried uninstalling Dropline, but I've heard its a bear, and unclean (because it *is* an intrusive project, simply put). FRG/ GSB is so easy and clean to both install/uninstall, it's uncanny. * Dropline only installs on x686 archs. FRG works on x(4|5|6)86, x86_64, and PPC. * FRG offers GSB (the GNOME.SlackBuild scripts) to build it yourself. GSB is how we produce FRG. So of course I am somewhat biased, which is why I co-founded/work on GSB/FRG in the first place. :-) I noticed lots of folks complaining that Dropline was intrusive as all hell (yet, I think it was/is a nice GNOME distro), a colleague and I started on our own alternative that was seamless and non-intrusive. Ergo, Pat actually recommended FRG/GSB in his pseudo-blog/ChangeLog: "So, if you're looking for GNOME for Slackware -current, I would recommend looking at these two projects for well-built packages that follow a policy of minimal interference with the base Slackware system: http://gsb.sf.net http://gware.sf.net There is also Dropline, of course, which is quite popular. However, due to their policy of adding PAM and replacing large system packages (like the entire X11 system) with their own versions, I can't give quite the same sort of nod to Dropline. Nevertheless, it remains another choice, and it's _your_ system, so I will also mention their project: http://www.dropline.net/gnome/" Cited from (toward the bottom). You'll see Pat also mention GWARE. Those are friends of FRG/GSB, and we contrib. patches, etc. to each other and help each other out quite a bit. It's another decent alternative. Hope that helps a bit. -- Chip Cuccio | NORLUG Sysadmin & Webmaster | Northfield Linux Users' Group | Northfield, Minnesota USA Second message: Begin forwarded message: Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 12:19:01 -0500 From: Chip Cuccio To: Josh Trutwin Cc: Jima Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Slackware 10.2 and thoughts on gnome? (off-list reply) On Aug 30, 2005, at 11:06 AM, Josh Trutwin wrote: > Thanks - do you mind if I copy this to TCLUG? My pleasure! Copy away - but I would appreciate it if you copy TCLUG with all threads inclusive, and verbatim (e.g. no snipping), for the purposes of clarity and completeness. > I have a couple comments inline: Me too :) > On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 > 10:36:59 -0500 Chip Cuccio wrote: > >> Hey Josh. >> >> I'll be very forthcoming about both projects - and the pros and >> cons of each; >> >> * Dropline has more developers than FRG/GSB. Sometimes this is >> good, sometimes bad. There are only 2 major developers on FRG/GSB >> (freerock and myself), so it's always under lots of scrutiny - >> kind of like Pat's own model. >> >> * FRG/GSB does not use PAM...Dropline does (Pat V. *hates* PAM, >> and many Slack users appreciate FRG/GSB because we adhere to Pat's >> anti-PAM policy). > > That's one of the reasons I want to switch to FRG personally. I'm > not a big fan of PAM either. >> * Dropline replaces your entire X11 system. FRG/GSB does not. It >> uses the one Pat gives you. :) > > Supposedly it's "optimized" though? I honestly don't follow Dropline all /that/ much, so I can't answer that definitively. I really don't know why they replace the entire X11 system. Wait...I did find their...umm..."FUQ": >> * Dropline has been around longer, and its "polish" reflects that. >> I like to think we're "cleaner and simpler". >> >> * FRG/GSB has a policy of being non-intrusive - meaning, it does >> not replace tons of your "stock" Slackware packages. >> >> * Dropline has very cool updater GNOME applet. Ours doesn't...yet >> (it's in the alpha stages). >> > > It's not that cool - but it is nice. Checking the website is also > not that hard. :) You can stop the elitism right there. ;) Frankly, the feedback we get from Dropline users (ex and otherwise), is that they like the Dropline applet. That is what prompted us to start working on one as well. It's a handy tool for many folks. Kudos to Dropline project for offering that tool in the first place. >> * Dropline offers one way of (officially) installing/ >> uninstalling...via its own console-based installer. We offer >> three (`slapt-get` and GSlapt [like Aptitude] being the most >> popular). Of course with both projects, you can install/uninstall >> manually with pkgtools and grep. >> >> * I've never tried uninstalling Dropline, but I've heard its a >> bear, and unclean (because it *is* an intrusive project, simply >> put). FRG/GSB is so easy and clean to both install/uninstall, it's >> uncanny. >> >> * Dropline only installs on x686 archs. FRG works on x(4|5|6)86, >> x86_64, and PPC. >> >> * FRG offers GSB (the GNOME.SlackBuild scripts) to build it >> yourself. GSB is how we produce FRG. >> >> So of course I am somewhat biased, which is why I co-founded/work >> on GSB/FRG in the first place. :-) I noticed lots of folks >> complaining that Dropline was intrusive as all hell (yet, I think >> it was/is a nice GNOME distro), a colleague and I started on our >> own alternative that was seamless and non-intrusive. Ergo, Pat >> actually recommended FRG/GSB in his pseudo-blog/ChangeLog: >> > > If you plan on copying TCLUG, include my original citations and their sources. Thanks. >> You'll see Pat also mention GWARE. Those are friends of FRG/GSB, >> and we contrib. patches, etc. to each other and help each other >> out quite a bit. It's another decent alternative. >> > > How would you describe the differences between GWare and FRG? Ever > thought of joining forces? In a nutshell, Gware's offering caters to the minimalist. FRG's offering is very complete. Gware is a fantastic GNOME distro for folks who just want the basic, base GNOME desktop environment. Gware's developers also adhere to a non-intrusive policy. I do believe Gware _requires_ Linux 2.6. FRG will work with Pat's 2.4 *and* 2.6 kernels. BTW: I'm relatively certain that Dropline also requires 2.6 - but please do correct me if I'm mistaken. FRG offers many "extra" GNOME software packages and artwork, etc.. However, there is a "minimal install" feature of FRG if folks don't want all the extra stuff. We have not discussed joining forces. Our goals are quite different, but we do collaborate often. The Gware folks are a fantastic bunch who produce a very solid project. > Do you think the latest FRG would work with Slackware 10.2 PRE? > http://linux.softpedia.com/get/System/Operating-Systems/Linux- > Distributions/Slackware-425.shtml I know FRG works on Slackware-current[1], because I test/dev/use frg- (0.2.2|current) with Slackware-current on a daily basis. Let me just close stating that Dropline deserves lots of plugs. That project set the stage with regard to GNOME distros for Slackware. We do collaborate with the Dropline team on occasion, and I will say, they have very talented developers, and they're damn fine folks. Take care. -- Chip Cuccio | NORLUG Sysadmin & Webmaster | Northfield Linux Users' Group | Northfield, Minnesota USA [1] Let me clarify something (not being pedantic - just clarifying); There is no Slackware "10.2 Pre." Technically, the latest version of Slackware is always "-current". There are no Slackware "pre" versions. Sometimes Pat will call -current a "beta" in his -current ChangeLog, but it's still -current. That site you link to is misleading with their "10.2 pre" ISO. That is an unofficial ISO based on -current snapshots. Just wanted to clarify that, because "10.2 pre" may confuse folks. :) From auditodd at comcast.net Tue Aug 30 13:08:47 2005 From: auditodd at comcast.net (auditodd@comcast.net) Date: Tue Aug 30 13:09:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection Message-ID: <083020051808.29325.4314A0AF0000C8F80000728D22007511500B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> Just needed to clarify something. I've tested the Verizon cards here in the Twin Cities, that was why I posted the download/upload speeds. Those are my actual results with the Verizon cards and that was only with a max of 3 out of 4 signal bars showing, usually I had 1 or 2 bars and was still able to get the 2Meg up/down. The company I work for has a lot of "road warriors" (sic) here in the Twin Cities and these new Verizon cards will most likely replace the Sprint cards when our contract expires in a few months. Especially considering the cost is the same, but the bandwidth bonus is significant. I was expecting a cop to pull up while I was testing, since I had to go to approximate locations where our users would be, but I didn't go into any houses, just sat in my car on the street in the shade. :-) -- ---- ------ Todd Young > > > Todd Young wrote: > > My company is using Sprint PCMCIA cards also and I have been thoroughly > > UNIMPRESSED with their performance. The connection is only about as good > > as a good dialup connection. > > > > On the other hand, the new Verizon cards are very promising as long as > > you are in the "broadband" coverage area here in the Twin Cities (2-3Meg > > download, 1-2Meg upload). > > > > Todd Young > > > > > The Sprint cards are not fast, they are designed for mobility more than > speed. I typically see a little better than dial-up speeds, in the 60 to > 80 kbps range. EVDO is much better. The Verizon EVDO service was cool > when I tested it out, if I could just convince my company to shell out > the extra few bucks, and Sprint is supposed to be offering EVDO "real > soon now". > > Josh From tclug at natecarlson.com Tue Aug 30 13:39:00 2005 From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Tue Aug 30 13:39:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection In-Reply-To: <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> References: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Aug 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > Verizon is rolling out EVDO in the TC market, I tested it out and found > it to be pretty cool. I don't know if it's officially live in the market > yet, but they are working on it. Have you tested it with Linux? I'm curious if it would work or not. I see unlimited access is $60/mo if you have a voice plan.. too bad I have no wishes to switch to Verizon's voice service. :/ I'll have to dig up pricing for a standalone plan at some point. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | nate carlson | natecars@natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com | | depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981 | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rclark at lakesplus.com Tue Aug 30 14:09:10 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Tue Aug 30 14:11:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Handheld use with Evolution calendar Message-ID: <1125428950.11340.23.camel@localhost> Anyone out there had good luck using a handheld device to exchange schedules, tasks, etc. with the Evolution package on Linux? Palms work with them ... anything else? Anyone have good luck with them? I have a Dell Axim ... but from all the searching I could find, I could not find a way to get it to interact with Linux easily. Any suggestions here would be helpful as well. Thanks in advance. Randy From cncole at earthlink.net Tue Aug 30 14:43:37 2005 From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole) Date: Tue Aug 30 14:45:12 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Handheld use with Evolution calendar In-Reply-To: <1125428950.11340.23.camel@localhost> Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Randy Clarksean > Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 2:09 PM > To: tclug > Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Handheld use with Evolution calendar > > > Anyone out there had good luck using a handheld device to exchange > schedules, tasks, etc. with the Evolution package on Linux? Palms work > with them ... anything else? Anyone have good luck with them? Several SDKs are available for the Palm interfaces. I never look at the others, but those may exist also. Chuck From jay-tclug at 3pound.com Tue Aug 30 18:45:46 2005 From: jay-tclug at 3pound.com (Jay J) Date: Tue Aug 30 18:49:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cellular mobile tcp/ip connection In-Reply-To: References: <43131A0E.5040709@mchsi.com> <43133C19.5070103@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <20050830184546.4169ff9a@jthink.zeroink.com> On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 13:39:00 -0500 (CDT) Nate Carlson wrote: > On Mon, 29 Aug 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > > Verizon is rolling out EVDO in the TC market, I tested it out and > > found it to be pretty cool. I don't know if it's officially live in > > the market yet, but they are working on it. > > Have you tested it with Linux? I'm curious if it would work or not. I haven't personally, but this page came to mind and leads me to believe he's using under Linux. FYI, he's in NJ/NY area. http://www.timekiller.org/carpc/ -Jay From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Wed Aug 31 17:26:27 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Wed Aug 31 17:27:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wireless bridge? to tie one network to another Message-ID: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> Hey tclugers, I am wondering if someone can help me with what I assume is an easy problem. I have a network inside, where I am typing right now, and there are cat5 cables carefully hidden so that my parents house doesn't look what my mother would consider "bad looking." Anyway, I have a WRT54G for wireless access, and it also provides DHCP serving for this network. The Cable modem is hooked to this network obviously. Anyway, here's the deal: I want to connect the network I have in my garage (where I can have things look however I like, we don't park cars in the Garage we use it for storage, and also it's my test lab. Basically a whole hell of a lot of 486s, p90s, p100s, p200s, etc. Anyway, I want to connect the networks wirelessly so that the machines in the garage can get an address via DHCP and so that I can be inside in my nice comfy computer spot inside the house and ssh to the test machines without having to go to the garage. I have heard of possibly getting another WRT54G and turning off the dhcp server on that one and doing some sort of bridging mode thing. Any ideas there? I also have been thinking I would just get a pci 802.11g card, stick it and a pci nic into a p100 or so, and then have the g card grab an address and then... plug the cable from the pci nic into my hub in the garage and somehow run traffic that way. Anyway, I apologize if this is a stupid question, I am just really, really ready to connect the networks. Distcc could be a lot more fun if I add all those machines in the garage. :) Anyway, any thoughts out there? I'd really, really appreciate it. Thanks, nick ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------ From jima at beer.tclug.org Wed Aug 31 18:18:40 2005 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Wed Aug 31 18:19:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wireless bridge? to tie one network to another In-Reply-To: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> References: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Aug 2005, Nicholas Thompson wrote: > I have heard of possibly getting another WRT54G and turning off the dhcp > server on that one and doing some sort of bridging mode thing. Any ideas > there? I do remember the WAP11 having a mode called "access point client" -- where it would tie any machines connected to its ethernet port to the access point you, err, pointed it at. I haven't tried doing that with a WRT54G (using them all as routers), but it's something to look for. I don't think bridging is exactly what you want. IIRC, you'd have to disable the access point functionality of the first WRT54G for it to work. Hope that helps. Jima From comradexavier at speakeasy.net Wed Aug 31 18:58:20 2005 From: comradexavier at speakeasy.net (Matthew Xavier) Date: Wed Aug 31 18:57:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wireless bridge? to tie one network to another In-Reply-To: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> References: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> Message-ID: Your latter idea should work. For a while, I used an old K6-2 box to bridge a couple of wired networks (I wanted to connect some newer computers to an old coax network and couldn't find any PCI cards with BNC connectors). I don't see any reason it wouldn't work just as well if one of the interfaces is wireless. At the time I had to patch the kernel, but it's included now, although I'm not sure if your average distro kernel includes it. A Google search for "linux ethernet bridge howto" should turn up information on what you're looking for. Xavier On Aug 31, 2005, at 5:26 PM, Nicholas Thompson wrote: > Hey tclugers, > I am wondering if someone can help me with what I assume is an > easy problem. I have a network inside, where I am typing right now, > and there are cat5 cables carefully hidden so that my parents house > doesn't look what my mother would consider "bad looking." Anyway, I > have a WRT54G for > wireless access, and it also provides DHCP serving for this > network. The > Cable modem is hooked to this network obviously. Anyway, here's the > deal: > > I want to connect the network I have in my garage (where I can have > things look however I like, we don't park cars in the Garage we use > it for storage, and also it's my test lab. Basically a whole hell > of a lot of 486s, p90s, p100s, p200s, etc. Anyway, I want to > connect the networks wirelessly so that the machines in the garage > can get an address via DHCP and so that I can be inside in my nice > comfy computer spot inside the house and ssh to the test machines > without having to go to the garage. > > I have heard of possibly getting another WRT54G and turning off the > dhcp server on that one and doing some sort of bridging mode thing. > Any ideas there? > > I also have been thinking I would just get a pci 802.11g card, > stick it and a pci nic into a p100 or so, and then have the g card > grab an address and then... plug the cable from the pci nic into my > hub in the garage and somehow run traffic that way. Anyway, I > apologize if this is > a stupid question, I am just really, really ready to connect the > networks. Distcc could be a lot more fun if I add all those > machines in the garage. :) > > Anyway, any thoughts out there? I'd really, really appreciate it. > > Thanks, > > nick > > ------------------------------ > nick thompson > > all unix all the time. > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > From poptix at poptix.net Wed Aug 31 22:33:24 2005 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Wed Aug 31 22:33:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wireless bridge? to tie one network to another In-Reply-To: References: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <1125545604.20485.10.camel@littleboy.poptix.net> On Wed, 2005-08-31 at 18:58 -0500, Matthew Xavier wrote: > Your latter idea should work. For a while, I used an old K6-2 box to > bridge a couple of wired networks (I wanted to connect some newer > computers to an old coax network and couldn't find any PCI cards with > BNC connectors). I don't see any reason it wouldn't work just as > well if one of the interfaces is wireless. At the time I had to > patch the kernel, but it's included now, although I'm not sure if > your average distro kernel includes it. > > A Google search for "linux ethernet bridge howto" should turn up > information on what you're looking for. > > Xavier It won't work due to the 802.11 spec, you need two 4-frame capable WDS units to properly bridge between two wireless networks. A pair of wrt54g will do fine in WDS mode. It's complicated, but simply put, an 802.11 clients mac address is attached to the packets that it sends, which means all packets sourced from the client will appear to come from the same MAC. Some wireless client bridges (such as the gaming units for xbox or PS2) will clone the mac of whatever is plugged into it to overcome this, but it only works for one device. In WDS mode the source MAC address of the packet is sent in a seperate part of the packet than the source MAC address of the wireless frame, allowing you to bridge multiple computers behind a single wireless "client". From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Aug 31 22:40:44 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Wed Aug 31 22:41:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wireless bridge? to tie one network to another In-Reply-To: <1125545604.20485.10.camel@littleboy.poptix.net> References: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> <1125545604.20485.10.camel@littleboy.poptix.net> Message-ID: I simply have a Motorola wireless bridge that I picked up for cheap. Ethernet cable into my switch, and all is well. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0; 0 rows returned From thecubic at thecubic.net Wed Aug 31 23:14:09 2005 From: thecubic at thecubic.net (Dave Carlson) Date: Wed Aug 31 23:11:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wireless bridge? to tie one network to another In-Reply-To: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> References: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <200508312314.13273.thecubic@thecubic.net> I bought two Asus wireless bridges (WL-330g) for $50 each to use with a WRT54G; they've worked great. One is connected to a switch (with 'clone mac address' off), it works well as a wireless bridge. It can also work in access point mode. I've tried wireless bridging with WRT54Gs, and it hasn't worked near as well as the Asus bridge. -dave On Wednesday 31 August 2005 17:26, Nicholas Thompson wrote: > Hey tclugers, > I am wondering if someone can help me with what I assume is an easy > problem. I have a network inside, where I am typing right now, and there > are cat5 cables carefully hidden so that my parents house doesn't look > what my mother would consider "bad looking." Anyway, I have a WRT54G for > wireless access, and it also provides DHCP serving for this network. The > Cable modem is hooked to this network obviously. Anyway, here's the deal: > > I want to connect the network I have in my garage (where I can have > things look however I like, we don't park cars in the Garage we use it > for storage, and also it's my test lab. Basically a whole hell of a lot > of 486s, p90s, p100s, p200s, etc. Anyway, I want to connect the networks > wirelessly so that the machines in the garage can get an address via > DHCP and so that I can be inside in my nice comfy computer spot inside > the house and ssh to the test machines without having to go to the garage. > > I have heard of possibly getting another WRT54G and turning off the dhcp > server on that one and doing some sort of bridging mode thing. Any ideas > there? > > I also have been thinking I would just get a pci 802.11g card, stick it > and a pci nic into a p100 or so, and then have the g card grab an > address and then... plug the cable from the pci nic into my hub in the > garage and somehow run traffic that way. Anyway, I apologize if this is > a stupid question, I am just really, really ready to connect the > networks. Distcc could be a lot more fun if I add all those machines in > the garage. :) > > Anyway, any thoughts out there? I'd really, really appreciate it. > > Thanks, > > nick > > ------------------------------ > nick thompson > > all unix all the time. > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20050831/5d2e1583/attachment.pgp From nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com Wed Aug 31 23:56:24 2005 From: nicholas.thompson1 at mchsi.com (Nicholas Thompson) Date: Wed Aug 31 23:57:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] wireless bridge? to tie one network to another In-Reply-To: <200508312314.13273.thecubic@thecubic.net> References: <43162E93.10605@mchsi.com> <200508312314.13273.thecubic@thecubic.net> Message-ID: <431689F8.5050308@mchsi.com> Dave Carlson wrote: > I bought two Asus wireless bridges (WL-330g) for $50 each to use with a > WRT54G; they've worked great. One is connected to a switch (with 'clone mac > address' off), it works well as a wireless bridge. It can also work in > access point mode. > > I've tried wireless bridging with WRT54Gs, and it hasn't worked near as well > as the Asus bridge. > > -dave > dave, so, if I buy one of these, put it in the garage and plug it into my hub/switch for the garage network, it'll just work? thanks nick > On Wednesday 31 August 2005 17:26, Nicholas Thompson wrote: > >>Hey tclugers, >> I am wondering if someone can help me with what I assume is an easy >>problem. I have a network inside, where I am typing right now, and there >>are cat5 cables carefully hidden so that my parents house doesn't look >>what my mother would consider "bad looking." Anyway, I have a WRT54G for >>wireless access, and it also provides DHCP serving for this network. The >>Cable modem is hooked to this network obviously. Anyway, here's the deal: >> >>I want to connect the network I have in my garage (where I can have >>things look however I like, we don't park cars in the Garage we use it >>for storage, and also it's my test lab. Basically a whole hell of a lot >>of 486s, p90s, p100s, p200s, etc. Anyway, I want to connect the networks >>wirelessly so that the machines in the garage can get an address via >>DHCP and so that I can be inside in my nice comfy computer spot inside >>the house and ssh to the test machines without having to go to the garage. >> >>I have heard of possibly getting another WRT54G and turning off the dhcp >>server on that one and doing some sort of bridging mode thing. Any ideas >>there? >> >>I also have been thinking I would just get a pci 802.11g card, stick it >>and a pci nic into a p100 or so, and then have the g card grab an >>address and then... plug the cable from the pci nic into my hub in the >>garage and somehow run traffic that way. Anyway, I apologize if this is >>a stupid question, I am just really, really ready to connect the >>networks. Distcc could be a lot more fun if I add all those machines in >>the garage. :) >> >>Anyway, any thoughts out there? I'd really, really appreciate it. >> >>Thanks, >> >>nick >> >>------------------------------ >>nick thompson >> >>all unix all the time. >>------------------------------ >> >>_______________________________________________ >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >>_______________________________________________ >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- ------------------------------ nick thompson all unix all the time. ------------------------------